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We Masons are not Illuminati!!!

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posted on Jul, 13 2009 @ 08:01 PM
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reply to post by suzque66
 

So innocent until proven guilty means nothing to you? I could accuse anyone of anything, doesn't mean it's true.

The Web has allowed the malnourishment of not only information, but lies and the crazy rumors/allegations.




posted on Jul, 13 2009 @ 08:19 PM
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So innocent until proven guilty means nothing to you? I could accuse anyone of anything, doesn't mean it's true.


I could type in search: 'all men are cheater pigs' and no doubt there are over a million websites on the subject. Some people believe so, some don't. I am not a man so I am not going to go defending one on such a site. If it bothers a man, then he can go take the trouble to defend his gender against the (we assume) women that are writing it. But, if a specific man is accused by many of being a pig-cheater by ex girlfriends, then I'd suspect he more than likely is/was.



posted on Jul, 13 2009 @ 09:10 PM
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reply to post by suzque66
 


Google says

No results found for "all men are cheater pigs"

Go figure



posted on Jul, 14 2009 @ 08:20 PM
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Originally posted by suzque66
reply to post by Mintwithahole.
 


I didn't think I would have to give examples of the thousands of pages on the subject. How could this be news to you? It is too nice outside (finally) to be searching for articles which you could have found easily. I didn't invtent the accusations of child abuse in reference to masons. The rumors have been around since before I was even born.

www.mindcontrolforums.com...

www.freemasonrywatch.org...

www.youtube.com...

freemasonrytoday.com...

***www.amazon.com...
e-torrent available.


Suz, first of all thanks for posting this. I've spent a while reading through the posts, some of which were quite harrowing, and now feel I can comment on it. What I've found is that the cases of abuse cited are terrible and disgusting but try as I might the links to masonry are tenuous to say the least. Basically it follows what I've been saying on this thread for some time. That if you're a mason you will get favourable treatment from the masonic judges and police, etc, and will ultimately get away scot free. I was thinking more along the lines of petty traffic crimes but I take your point that if masons were involved in this then the fact they are made up from police, judges and social workers, etc, would mean that they could never be brought to justice as they were, in essence, investigating themselves. . !
I don't need convincing that the freemasons are a law unto themselves and are, it seems, above the law, but I don't see what part child abuse has in either their rituals or their beliefs. . . But thank you, you have made me pause for thought even if, at first glance, I'm not sure you're entirely right in your accusations.



posted on Jul, 14 2009 @ 09:49 PM
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reply to post by Mintwithahole.
 


I, nor you saw the holocaust either, but apparently it happened.

It was written into our history books--out of necessity. Why else teach little children about horrible things such as this if you don't want them to remember a specific event and a specific enemy?

*btw, using this as a comparative example, don't make this about masons are Nazis now or that I am denying the holocaust. eeeesh.

So, horrible things happened right?

Why? because a plan was in place. A plan initially to draw in the general (good) public into seeing a percieved enemy. It didn't begin with day one roundups of Jews and other systematicly chosen undesirables. It starts out slow, methodically. Different specialized positions doing specialized occupations blanketed as 'industry or community service'.

After the fact the actual scheme was unfolded--not during or before--AFTER. If so, would more effort had gone into the war on behalf of the Alied forces? who knows, maybe, maybe not.

So, in this case...maybe (give or take) 10,000 world citizens (civilians, us, mainstream) even know about the suspicions within entire subject (child abuse, done at the hands of governement/affiliated sponsored groups).

To those that even suspect believe it unfathomable, imagine those that assume that any child welfare acts are for the betterment of society because we (society) are just incapable of taking care of our own would feel. There are millions in the world that actually believe that when a governenment adapts a policy that it is a 'cure', a shriek of responsibility from community to big business (government). A masking of problems, bigger problems as a whole that cause waves that crash into another problem (drugs, alcohol, domestic abuse, violence etc). Lets not fix it, lets not change and realize the pyramid of capitalism itself at base cause, lets keep the status quo and give the power of thought, trust and liability to officials.

It is hard then to forget, that the very system we build blinds the average Jane and Joe into believing such monstrosities could never, ever occur. That our safety net is actually akin to a faraday cage that keeps us compartmentalized into not associating one group with another. If you come close to seeking knowledge or witness accusations/suspicions ...we seem to get 'zapped' don't we? While the insiders sit comfortable without any shocks. The system was designed that way.

This isn't about saying 'Nascar drivers as a whole' are into kiddy porn. Nascar drivers don't set up systems designed to 'help' children therefore the having access to children (alone) in large groups is preposterous. Organizations/people that do (teachers, clergy, foster parents, whathaveyou) are oftentime IN that chosen occupancy in order to have such access to the vulnerable. We see that daily in the newspapers.

So until that day comes when one or a group of (not just Masons) people who have somewhat of a grab on power is caught with their hand in the cookie jar and as long as I am free to point fingers of suspicion because the masons haven't sent anyone over to break 'em yet, I will and I can decide for myself that 1. I believe them to be an organized group with power and influence 2. this group is likely to be involved in the numerous nefarious deeds they are accused of and 3. eventually they (one, two, many, few) will get caught.

(even the CIA itself got caught within reacent years of creating and proctoring the illegal drug trade, no??)

[edit on 14-7-2009 by suzque66]



posted on Jul, 15 2009 @ 06:58 AM
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reply to post by suzque66
 


so because ti might be true, you are going to spread the lies as if they were true, just in case. That might be the most ignorant thing I have even heard.



posted on Jul, 16 2009 @ 12:30 AM
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Haven't gotten my manual yet? Been a mason for about a year...must be in the mail...



posted on Jul, 16 2009 @ 06:04 AM
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mason are copy cats?

Knights Templar is an international philanthropic Masonic order affiliated with Freemasonry. In some countries it forms part of the York Rite, while in others it is a separate order on its own. In the mid 1700s the Freemasons began to incorporate symbols and traditions of the medieval Knights Templar. The original medieval Order of Knights Templar was established after the First Crusade, and existed from approximately 1118 to 1312. There is no known historical evidence to link the medieval Knights Templar and Masonic Templarism, nor do the Masonic Knights Templar organizations claim any such direct link to the original medieval Templar organization.

So Knights Templar where Devil Worshipers Right?

Baphomet is a name of unestablished origin. It first appeared in a late twelfth century Provençal poem by in reference to Muhammad, but later it appeared as a term for a pagan idol in trial transcripts of the Inquisition of the Knights Templar in the early 1300s. However, in the 19th century the name came into popular English-speaking consciousness with the publication of various pseudo-history works that tried to link the Knights Templar with conspiracy theories elaborating on their suppression. The name Baphomet then became associated with a "Sabbatic Goat" .

I dont know but to me Masonic Temples are a front like a bodega is to drug dealer except in the temples they dont sell drugs they do rituals. Back in the 1930's durring the depression there where hundreds of kids missing some say they where for Masonic ritual sacrifices.

[edit on 16-7-2009 by Kim Jong-il]



posted on Jul, 16 2009 @ 09:42 AM
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Originally posted by Kim Jong-il
Back in the 1930's durring the depression there where hundreds of kids missing some say they where for Masonic ritual sacrifices.
Got a link or source you can cite? Primarily one that shows there were more missing kids in the 1930s than the decades surrounding that period, and secondarily who these "some say" folks are that put out such allegations?



posted on Jul, 16 2009 @ 09:50 AM
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Originally posted by JoshNorton
and secondarily who these "some say" folks are that put out such allegations?


If I were him, I'd be much more concerned with the real life crimes of his namesake than the imaginary ones of the Masons.



posted on Jul, 16 2009 @ 11:59 AM
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Originally posted by network dude
reply to post by suzque66
 


so because ti might be true, you are going to spread the lies as if they were true, just in case. That might be the most ignorant thing I have even heard.


I've spent some time now looking into this link between child abuse and freemasonry and have to admit I'm shocked. It seems to me that all the aspects of freemasonry which I was weary of such as Pike, the racism, the rituals and the confusion whether the fraternity are a religion or not and what part catholicism plays in the lives of the members, all pale in comparison with the amount of anti masonic material which links freemasonry with child abduction and abuse. Some of it is worthy of more in depth investigation while some is nuttier than my Aunties fruitcake! Please read this for instance;

nigelnessling.wordpress.com...

Madeleine McCann was abducted because she had the same defect in her eye as the all seeing eye on the dollar bill. . ! "WHAT!!?"

As far as I'm concerned freemasonry is corrupt, elitist, elements of it are racist and in history it has attracted some very nefarious characters. But the network of paedophile freemasons and the systematic child abuse carried out by this cult is, for me, unproven. Their are questions to be asked, and more digging to be done, but as of yet I see no clear evidence of this.



posted on Jul, 16 2009 @ 03:40 PM
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reply to post by Mintwithahole.
 


while I am sure this will come across as just more words, unless things in the UK are completely different than the US, there is no way in hell there was EVER any truth to those rumors. The very idea of masonry is to help people, not kidnap them. Here is the quickest way to squash those storries. Find out when and where they claim these horrible acts took place. Then find out if there was any official record of said missing persons. See if there was ever a resolution to the issue. Finding out those simple things alone should put the cover on the BS. And before anyone starts with the "all the cops and judges were masons!!" how about the parents of these abductees. Do you think they just scampered off into the shadows? If my kid was taken, I would be spraying bullets until I got an answer or a bullet back. I would think most parents are the same. Think about it logically. I don't know any mason alive that would tolerate the thought of that behavior.



posted on Jul, 16 2009 @ 04:13 PM
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reply to post by network dude
 


ND,

There'll never be the proof provided that you ask for for the simple reason that it's too much work. That and this isn't about proof; this is about unfounded accusation.

Proof's old school. So much easier and more fun to repeatedly create unsupportable accusations and watch as Masons rise to the bait.

DNFTT



posted on Jul, 16 2009 @ 05:04 PM
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Doesn't mason mean "Son"? Like Chief Builder of the house? "FAMILY men"...the ones blessed with life?

Is it a true Priest hood to the preservation of the host and not to that of the false image of God, but rather the host and it's body?

I always hear....Gimal, Ayen and Vav spoken in my ear.

It is funny because this is "the camel through the eye of the needle"...Gimal, ayen vav, but it is also the G surrounded by the A and V.

Both sides of my family were Masons. I just found this out about a year ago. My Father was not one nor his father or my mothers father, but both sides, my great grandparents back were Masons.

It makes me very curious about them. I know my Ancestors were very hard working folks. They were of the first twelve settlers of Orange County, California. I've always been fascinated by Egypt and Masonic things seem very Egyptian to me.

Anyways, thanks, I think you guys build the house and the only secrets you keep are the ones people are unwilling to see for themselves...nothing is hidden.



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 09:48 PM
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Originally posted by network dude
reply to post by Mintwithahole.
 


while I am sure this will come across as just more words, unless things in the UK are completely different than the US, there is no way in hell there was EVER any truth to those rumors. The very idea of masonry is to help people, not kidnap them. Here is the quickest way to squash those storries. Find out when and where they claim these horrible acts took place. Then find out if there was any official record of said missing persons. See if there was ever a resolution to the issue. Finding out those simple things alone should put the cover on the BS. And before anyone starts with the "all the cops and judges were masons!!" how about the parents of these abductees. Do you think they just scampered off into the shadows? If my kid was taken, I would be spraying bullets until I got an answer or a bullet back. I would think most parents are the same. Think about it logically. I don't know any mason alive that would tolerate the thought of that behavior.


Yes, I hear what you're saying my friend but in the case of Madeliene McCann they are trying to make out that her father, Gerry, was in on it as he was a Scottish mason. It even goes as far as saying that he was in contact with Prime Minister Gordon Brown!
I've voiced my concerns about freemasonry but in this case I think the whole paedophile/mason connection is bulls*it. I thought I had made that clear. Thats not to say that I wouldn't look at new evidence implicating the brotherhood with child abuse but it would have to be far more compelling than what I've recently read.



posted on Jul, 18 2009 @ 01:32 AM
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I hadn't heard of the McCann accusations., news to me.

When did that get brought up? I must have missed something.

But on that subject, here is an interesting article (again) on a similar theory that I had heard about either:

www.whale.to...



posted on Jul, 18 2009 @ 07:34 AM
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So still no Masons have even attempted to answer my question.

Perhaps its time for the Masons on here to admit they havent a clue as to wheter the Masons are directly linked to the secret government or not.

Claiming ignorance on the question is not a defence or rebuttal. If you have no idea about the basics of sacred geometry you have no place claiming catagorically the motives and actions of the Masons are benevolant.



posted on Jul, 18 2009 @ 07:57 AM
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Originally posted by Majestic23
So still no Masons have even attempted to answer my question.
Which one? Could you repeat the question before flying off the handle? There's been some crap in this thread that I've glossed over because I actually DO have better things to do with my time than read ATS all day...


Perhaps its time for the Masons on here to admit they havent a clue as to wheter the Masons are directly linked to the secret government or not.
You're ignorant if you think there's only one secret government. And yes, there might be members any any of them who are also Masons. Doesn't make said governments part of any Masonic plot, nor does it make Masons the tools of said governments. There are members of said governments who are Baptist or Jewish too. And likely some males and some females, and probably some whites and some blacks and some chinese and... well you see how it would be difficult to make assumptions or jump to conclusions based on non-existent evidence.


Claiming ignorance on the question is not a defence or rebuttal. If you have no idea about the basics of sacred geometry you have no place claiming catagorically the motives and actions of the Masons are benevolant.
So school us, oh wise one.



posted on Jul, 18 2009 @ 12:51 PM
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i]reply to post by JoshNorton
 




I actually DO have better things to do with my time than read ATS all day...
[

like sending suz a recipe for p-buttah n jellay sammiches?



posted on Jul, 18 2009 @ 02:58 PM
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Originally posted by suzque66


I actually DO have better things to do with my time than read ATS all day...


like sending suz a recipe for p-buttah n jellay sammiches?
That was on my day off.



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