Did North Korea just test a Nuke? YES they did!

I find it interesting that so many people find comfort in saying that "no one would ever use a nuclear weapon because of the instant and awful retaliation." That makes sense if the weapon in question came gift wrapped with a nice return address on it. But what happens when a bad actor like Iran or North Korea smuggles a weapon to Al Qaida or the Taliban or Hamas or some other terrorist group? What do you do when a nuclear weapon is detonated on a container ship in New York harbor? Where do you send the response?

That is the danger. I think too many people are stuck in the "cold war" mentality where "Mutual Assured Destruction" was an accepted doctrine. It worked in the case of two superpowers in a standoff. It does not work in a world of terrorist attacks and suicide bombers.

If we continue to stand by and do nothing while rogue nations acquire nuclear weapons we will absolutely, certainly be on the receiving end of one some day in the near future. We will lose hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians and our economy will be devastated. And what will our government do? They will have to do something so they will have no choice but to hit everybody.

Sometimes the choice is not between war or no war. It is a choice between a smaller war sooner or a bigger war later. We already made the wrong choice several times in the past. Do you think we will choose any differently this time?

In a word - Nope.

Originally posted by Electro38
Yes, well done N. Korea for thoroughly starving and oppressing your people all for the cause of making nukes and remaining in the stone age. Those people aren't enslaved by their own government, no. They chose to live like cave people.

Very well done.

I suggest you go and cure yourself by getting informed. The central banking elites are enforcing sanctions on Nth Korea because it won't play ball and let them in. It is also intent on arming itself to keep them out.

The cost of a few nukes won't send a country broke - but telling the central banks to go to hell will. North Korea isn't even allowed to sell its gold - its sanctions are almost complete - and for what? Because it doesn't want enslavement by the elites.

Get more knowledge - understand the history and what is really happening - if your listening to your own media, then your opinion will always be the one your given - not the one you would arrive at if you had a real understanding.

Originally posted by eaglehawk
The solution: Since we have such a strong military presence in that region wouldn't it be prudent for the United States military to eliminate these weapons once and for all? All diplomatic attempts to resolve this problem have failed; all "AID" (bribery) has failed. Use several Tomahawk missles fired at their command and control facilities to cripple them. Then at the same time launch a couple of nuclear tipped Tomahawk missles at their nuclear facilities that are located in isolated areas (which reduces the possibility of civilian casualties) and destroy those facilities. This would give the North Koreans an excellent demonstration as to what these terrible weapons REALLY do. Then we (USA, Russia, China, South Korea, Japan) could sit down with them and spell out how we can help them move forward with their country hopefully with new leadership.

Boy, am I glad you aren't the one making the military decisions for the U.S. (or any other) country. Destruction and killing are not deterrents. This is a no-brainer.

Originally posted by mrmonsoon


Well, what news source do you like/believe???

Irans terrorst times???

Al jihad news????

For what it may be worth to you, this same new has been posted by all major news agencies across the world.

Since when was it the task of media to give you an opinion? Their job is supposed to be to inform you and give you a balanced view - but the western govts and western media all have the same view - and its controlled by a very small number of people.

The world media is basically owned by about 6 corps - promoting the point of view of a small group, who all agree.

The media no longer report - they give you an opinion. Most people simply parrot the media's opinion as their own.

Iran is bad, North Korea is bad - Saddam is bad, Iraq is bad, the CIA are honest and would never lie, Israel is America's friend, Palestine uses terrorist attacks against a peaceful Israel, Somalia is full of dangerous pirates, the Banks are critical and HAVE to be bailed out to help the economy .. and so on and on ..

[edit on 25-5-2009 by Amagnon]

Do you have any proof the North koreans give nukes away? Otherwise it's all conjecture. We've got people saying Jong-Il is a madman in this thread. Really do you have any proof beyond what your government and the MSM tell you? To those who mention sex slavery. Guess what South Korea does it to. I can introduce you to several former South Korean sex slaves living in my town.

I can't believe how many people are just screaming "bomb em!" Let's look at this from their point of view. They have been sanctioned for as long as i've been alive. Well over thirty years. The USA has it's artillery in south korea. We've had our forces there for almost 50 years. You don't think we intimidate them? My father (who has been stationed in SK) told me once anyone over six feet goes to the DMZ automatically because the presence of very tall people is intimidating for those on the other side of the DMZ. You've got Bush who harped on for years about how "they are in the axis of evil". Of course these people would be frightened of us. These people think they are going to be bombed by us.

I suggest a new course of action. Let's lift the sanctions and trade with them. Maybe they won't be so frightened of us.


[edit on 25-5-2009 by antonia]

Originally posted by ANNED
Yes this looks like a nuclear test. and the size is right for a early test.
wikimapia.org...=41.2839663&lon=129.0003061&z=16&l=0&m=h&v=2

It was about 10 miles from there first nuclear test.and the size was right for about a 11 kt test on the Kelly Kiloton Index.
www.english.ucla.edu...

[edit on 24-5-2009 by ANNED]

My true belief is that the only way this world is going to avoid nuclear war is from outside intervention.
TPTP prob would risk nuclear war just to keep their secret going.....That is how bad it is.

Originally posted by itguysrule
If we continue to stand by and do nothing while rogue nations acquire nuclear weapons we will absolutely, certainly be on the receiving end of one some day in the near future. We will lose hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians and our economy will be devastated. And what will our government do? They will have to do something so they will have no choice but to hit everybody.

No, they won't hit everybody. They'll do what they did last time and decide which country they can invade and gain the most from financially. Then they'll cook up a nice little story to link that country with the attack.

The idea that ww3 would come about through a nuclear event, where one country attacks and others jump in pressing their buttons too, is not accurate.

In the Cold War there were two nations facing off.
In a modern scenario it would all be far too complex.

If another country fired a nuclear weapon at the US or UK tomorrow, what would happen?
There wouldn't be an immediate attack on the launching nation, there would be emergency meetings and defence discussions. There would be forming of allegiances and a rallying of allies. But most importantly, most nations would probably refrain from returning nuclear fire because of the fear of exacerbating the conflict into a true Armageddon, with several nations all jumping in to defend their interests.

Even during the cold war there was an incident where the Russians thought that the US had launched a nuclear missile. It was only the delaying and uncertainty of the operators in charge of the response that prevented them from retaliating But they did wait, they risked it, and they found out that it was a glitch in their system.
At that point both sides were just seconds away from being involved in an all-out nuclear war. The Russians were being told by their equipment that they were under attack from the US, and they still held off.

None of us really knows what would happen, but I am certain of one thing... This will lead to a lot of posturing and "strong statements" from the international community, and probably nothing more.

Originally posted by antonia

Do you have any proof the North koreans give nukes away? Otherwise it's all conjecture. We've got people saying Jong-Il is a madman in this thread. Really do you have any proof beyond what your government and the MSM tell you? To those who mention sex slavery. Guess what South Korea does it to. I can introduce you to several former South Korean sex slaves living in my town.

I can't believe how many people are just screaming "bomb em!" Let's look at this from their point of view. They have been sanctioned for as long as i've been alive. Well over thirty years. The USA has it's artillery in south korea. We've had out forces there for almost 50 years. You don't think we intimidate them? My father told me once anyone over six feet goes to the DMZ automatically because the presence of very tall people is intimidating for those on the other side of the DMZ. You've got Bush who harped on for years about how "they are in the axis of evil". Of course these people would be frightened of us. These people think they are going to be bombed by us.

I suggest a new course of action. Let's lift the sanctions and trade with them. Maybe they would be so frightened of us.

[edit on 25-5-2009 by antonia]

God I love you - haha - thank you for saying it the way it is.

Trade, diplomacy and let them defend themselves how they see fit - take away all the external threats and sanctions and North Korea will suddenly look a lot friendlier.

Originally posted by mrmonsoon
reply to post by mikesingh

 

I "AM" concerned about N.K. giving nuclear weapons to terrorist groups who would happily bring it to the US or it's allies and explode it.

Also, giving it to a muslium terrorist group to use on Israel which "would" respond back with nuclear weapons.

The Democratic People's Republic of Korea (DPRK) is not known to have sponsored any terrorist acts/groups since the bombing of a Korean Airlines flight in 1987. It is certainly no breeding ground for the likes of al-Qaida or Hezbollah, though there have been unconfirmed reports of it selling some small arms to inconsequential separatist groups. Philippines publicly alleged that North Korea did an arms deal with the Moro Islamic Liberation Front. Such sales are believed to be one of North Korea's few sources of hard currency, along with counterfeiting and other criminal activities.

In no way can this translate to a nuclear threat to the US by terrorists that would have been sold nuclear weapons by North Korea sometime in the future. This is a hypothetical situation and doesn't form part of the threat analysis.

They could however create problems by selling missile technology to the likes of Libya and Syria, two other members of the ominous list of state sponsors of terror. Again, this does not constitute a direct threat.

reply to post by komp_uk


So this was the happening in day of unknown...

9+1+1+2+1 = 1+4 = 5

5+2+5+2+9 = 2+3 = 5

Its all about the nukes...

Originally posted by Amagnon

Originally posted by mrmonsoon


Well, what news source do you like/believe???

Irans terrorst times???

Al jihad news????

For what it may be worth to you, this same new has been posted by all major news agencies across the world.

Since when was it the task of media to give you an opinion? Their job is supposed to be to inform you and give you a balanced view - but the western govts and western media all have the same view - and its controlled by a very small number of people.

The world media is basically owned by about 6 corps - promoting the point of view of a small group, who all agree.

The media no longer report - they give you an opinion. Most people simply parrot the media's opinion as their own.

Iran is bad, North Korea is bad - Saddam is bad, Iraq is bad, the CIA are honest and would never lie, Israel is America's friend, Palestine uses terrorist attacks against a peaceful Israel, Somalia is full of dangerous pirates, the Banks are critical and HAVE to be bailed out to help the economy .. and so on and on ..

[edit on 25-5-2009 by Amagnon]

Perhaps you misunderstood,

News sources should not be giving you your opinion-it shows an excessively weak mind if you do.

That said, an educated person, takes the facts at hand and makes their own opinion.

News agencies are "ONLY" for getting facts so everyone can make an informed opinion.

reply to post by mikesingh


Mike,

You must be aware that Iran scientists were present and helping N.K. with it's rocket as well as nuclear weapon tests.

You are not ignorant enough to believe that N.K has not and will not continue to assist Iran with it's long range missiles as well as nuclear technology.

Also, I don't agree with you, I do believe N.K. would be more than happy to give a nuke to a terrorist group.

Further, I am sure Iran would be tickled to give one of their lapdog terrorist groups a nuke to use, as Iran is FAR to cowardly to do their own dirty work.

Originally posted by JanusFIN
reply to post by komp_uk

 

So this was the happening in day of unknown...

9+1+1+2+1 = 1+4 = 5

5+2+5+2+9 = 2+3 = 5

Its all about the nukes...

Janus, your number make less sence than you normally make.

Ok, I see 9+1+1=911 where does the 2+1 come in? how does 14=1+4?

Where do you get the 5+2+5+2+9 from?

What does all of that have to do with little kimmy exploding a nuclear weapon?

reply to post by mrmonsoon


I was stumped by this for a moment, as well. then I realized 2 was the millenium. 9/11/2001 -> 9+1+1+2+0+0+1

He just removed the zeros.

nuclear tomahawks were taken out of service in the 90s man.


the north wants a united korea and thanks the the nukes now the north can invade the south rape it,plunder it and pillage and there is nothing to stop kim jun il now.-not a damn thing.

who will do anything to help because the result is nuclear retalation.

reply to post by Deus Ex Machina 42


Yeah, I'm not truley worried. They just reached the capacity that we reached easily 50 years ago. One of our own (Maybe a couple, not certain on the size of North Korea) could easily destroy almost all their country.


I'll probably get flak for this; But I don't see the problem. We have nukes, and we've actually used them in war, so why can't another country have them?

Originally posted by rogerstigers
reply to post by mrmonsoon

 

I was stumped by this for a moment, as well. then I realized 2 was the millenium. 9/11/2001 -> 9+1+1+2+0+0+1

He just removed the zeros.

Nice and fair enough for the first set of numbers.

What about the second set???

A star for you and your explanation.

reply to post by neo67


The US still guards the border of South Korea I believe.. It will be difficult for a full fledged invasion (If they have the capability!) to get through. South Korea is not a weak country like they were during the Korean war. They have US aid now, and they are far more prosperous and likely well armed than North Korea could hope to be, since North Korea is a poor country. The only thing they have over the South Koreans is the ability to force any citizen into combat that they want.

reply to post by mrmonsoon


I was stumped for a couple minutes too, then realized what the above poster said. Then the second said number I saw was the date of the launch and the year of
5+2+5+2+9 = 2+3 = 5
05/25/2009

still...I don't see what it had to do with the event, or what those 5's are.



[edit on 25-5-2009 by Sekter]

Originally posted by Miraj
reply to post by neo67

 

The US still guards the border of South Korea I believe.. It will be difficult for a full fledged invasion (If they have the capability!) to get through. South Korea is not a weak country like they were during the Korean war. They have US aid now, and they are far more prosperous and likely well armed than North Korea could hope to be, since North Korea is a poor country. The only thing they have over the South Koreans is the ability to force any citizen into combat that they want.

be clear, if all N.K's artillery and million man army attacked, invaded S.K., S.K. and the 30K us troops would be run right over.

That said, killing 30K us troops and attack an allies would get a response and I would not surprise me if it were a nuclear one.