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The "up-to-the-minute Market Data" thread

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posted on Nov, 28 2011 @ 04:43 PM
reply to post by AuntB

Why do I keep reading that investors are "optimistic" over reports coming out of Europe?

Because they are all insane. And saying that you are being ``optimistic`` means that the machines that trade most of the stock market can make the market rise, even if it goes against logic.

La Tribune Reports S&P May Put France On ‘Negative’ Outlook Within Ten Days

Awwwwww... Finally.

Fitch Revises US Outlook To Negative

War between the rating agencies... Fitch (french) puts the US on negative outlook while SP (american) put France on negative outlook...

Begun the rating war has.

edit on 28-11-2011 by Vitchilo because: (no reason given)

posted on Nov, 28 2011 @ 04:44 PM
reply to post by TiM3LoRd

Bonds are not like shares at all. Shares = ownership an thus an opinion or vote in the running of the company (one share = one vote)

Bonds are usually more secure than stock options, but you get no say in the running of the company (or state) but you get the interest paid, and that's fixed unlike dividends.

In Government bonds are only restricted by the Treasury(s) of the State(s) .. Some Unions place restriction, ie, European Union has a debt to GDP requirement of 3%. No one has listened to that of course. The United States and most other nations have no cap.

The "Price" of Government debt is based on buyers... if there is demand, interest drops, if there is no demand then interest rises to entice buyer for more lucrative deals.

Quanitive Easing (Also called Debt Monetization) is when the Central Bank(s) print money to buy government debt, thus lowering interest rates.

posted on Nov, 28 2011 @ 04:46 PM
reply to post by Vitchilo

I think we should take it to another level again .. lets re-ban French Fries and French wine!

posted on Nov, 28 2011 @ 04:49 PM

Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by Vitchilo

I think we should take it to another level again .. lets re-ban French Fries and French wine!

Anyway, lots of countries are making good wine... Chile, Australia, USA, Spain, Italy...

Banning french fries.... no! You won't be able to make yourself a good old made-in-Quebec poutine! You need french fries for that!

Ok now I'm hungry!

edit on 28-11-2011 by Vitchilo because: (no reason given)

posted on Nov, 28 2011 @ 04:54 PM
reply to post by Vitchilo

I live in the heart of Wine Country, I wouldn't drink French wine if it was offered to me. No no .. just joking, I'd drink it but feel really guilty!

As for French Fries, we call them Freedom Fries. You can almost taste the arrogance, and it's a sweet sweet treat!

(ps .. adding popcorn and barbeque sauce to your french fries is a perfect example of why Americans consider Canadians to be weird)
edit on 11/28/2011 by Rockpuck because: (no reason given)

posted on Nov, 28 2011 @ 04:57 PM
Already on the French boycott- actually haven't bought a French product since 2003. I don't miss French products at all. Now regarding those french fries above, WTH is on them??

posted on Nov, 28 2011 @ 05:02 PM
reply to post by Rockpuck

It's not popcorn, it's cheese...

You can put lots of other stuff in there... bacon, ketchup, etc... there's unlimited choices. Some restaurant near my house sells 100+ variations of poutines.
Sometimes there's weird stuff added...

And about Black Friday numbers... all those numbers that did ``better than expected`` might be complete bull... personally, I'll wait for cold hard data... last year they said the sales were amazing too... and it ended up only +0.6% in sales...

Originally posted by AuntB
Already on the French boycott- actually haven't bought a French product since 2003. I don't miss French products at all. Now regarding those french fries above, WTH is on them??

Cheese and barbecue sauce?
It's delicious.
edit on 28-11-2011 by Vitchilo because: (no reason given)

posted on Nov, 28 2011 @ 05:09 PM
reply to post by Vitchilo

Yeah, until we get 4Q results there is no reason to despair or celebrate. For anyone to say they compiled data in 3 days is a lying sack'o'crap .. personally I'd assume anything below the inflation level to be a decline .. 3% gain? With 5% "official" inflation? Sorry, decline.

Obviously stock gains after a long hard decline are not unusual, especially being back in the 11,500 range on the DOW, but to say it was because of black Friday sales is garbage.

posted on Nov, 28 2011 @ 05:19 PM
Next time you kiss your lover, keep your tongue in your mouth.
That will teach those French.

On the serious side, you are hurting the store clerk for something the management did.
Banning simple commerce is stupid, just like the kiss joke.

posted on Nov, 28 2011 @ 05:27 PM
reply to post by charlyv

It's ok though if the clerk is French too.

posted on Nov, 28 2011 @ 09:46 PM
Ok, people I say lets all "bond" together against the "bond market"

Well it seems that CNBC, the weather channel and others were telling the viewerstoday that is going to be a shortage of coffee in the US due to weather conditions and "specifically the global warming", been blamed for it.

It comes to the truth that is nothing but a hoax as is not shortage of any coffee, and while Brazil and Colombia had problems with drought and torrential rains actually the output of the brown gold is very much safe.

Well I did some digging so people if your cup of Joe is costing more next year believe me is a lie that is due to shortage.

Look at the crops commodities news and learn the deception behind the so call coffee shortage, is not any coffee shortage

I wonder how the news media can even believe that Americans are that dumb and stupid.

posted on Nov, 29 2011 @ 04:16 AM
I have been looking inot some things, and reviewing the debates.

I think there will be a real problem. The chinese own enough of the US to really damage the economy, if they chose too. If multiple countries work together they can cause extreme hardship for the american market.

The american government is taking a "strong" stance on china, but they don't have any legs to stand on. How can they even think they can threaten the chinese government right now.


Okay so the spread is from 2010, we don't hav the full numbers from this year yet.

up to 2011 sep

I mean, by letting one country own so much debt, is like having one company insure the entire derivatives market (AIG).

It is big, okay now. *also note, that america owe alot in debt to foreign countries, but owe almost double that to america itself.

But wait, there is more. The way the system works, they can't really just dump a bunch of stocks without messing up their own market.

If they did decide to start dumping, they would have to purchase something else with the money. Where would they go, the only area really is europe, and no one wants to touch that. Or do they?

china interst in european bonds
china buys more european bonds
Bloomberg-china is longterm investor in euro debt

Okay fun huh.
Anyways, i gotta look some more stuff up. Just sharing for now.

*add* Poutine is cheese and gravy, on top of fries. It is quite good.
edit on 29-11-2011 by KingAtlas because: add

posted on Nov, 29 2011 @ 04:19 AM

Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by Vitchilo

I think we should take it to another level again .. lets re-ban French Fries and French wine!

Ah, if only people who say things like that knew how it makes them look ignorant to other parts of the world!

What you call french fries does not come from France, but Belgium.
(as an added note, no french person would touch the horror Americans call French dressing either)

posted on Nov, 29 2011 @ 04:47 AM
Italy Auction Yields Hit New Euro Era Highs

Italy paid more than 7 percent to sell three and 10-year paper on Tuesday in an auction that saw decent demand for the shorter-maturity debt, but analysts said the cover was disappointing overall.

The 3-year yield jumped to 7.89 percent while the 10-year yield rose to 7.56 percent, setting a new euro lifetime high.

posted on Nov, 29 2011 @ 07:03 AM
reply to post by KingAtlas

Actually while the US is up to its neck on debt to China, Japan and UK among others, no forget that US Federa Reserve runs the IMF, (international monetary bank) and through that bank most of the EU and south America are in debt to the US also.

Learn who are the real power pushing behind the NWO.

posted on Nov, 29 2011 @ 10:47 AM


Well, waht i was getting at on my previous post is that the US is trying to act strong on China and them keeping their Yuan artificially low. I menat they can't be declaring such things, and threatning them, when China is in a position to flood the market with US bonds. Because they are buying up European debt, they can do it without destroying their own market.

As for owning debt itself, it isn't such a huge deal. The insuring of it is though, because of all the turmoil.
The US is going to have alot more problems with that side of it. I mean they are trying to spread it out so no one company has too much, but there isn't enough.

The real crux is that they all want a piece of insuring it, as long as they don't have to pay out on the defaults.
That is why they are pushing back the Greek default, so they can make more money on the debt (with insurance fees) before it goes all sideways.

They also have to structure the financial institutes so that they can float the economy.

I find it funny though that they want to nationalise the banks, but no one has brought up.... Will the Greek people even use nationalised banks. I think that is a serious question.

As for the fed, they don't really control the IMF, not on paper anyways, but they do has influence. I don't think bernake could do anything if he wanted to. It has gotten way to big, and they banks don't learn from their mistakes.

It's a game of hot potato, whoever gets stuck with all the CD's when the music stops gets burned. Whoever throws the potato away, makes tonnes of cash. And no one can get out of the game, it is almost impossible now.

Bric might be the best way to help the situation, but if they do that they are putting themselves in a tough spot. Why would they even risk it. It is exactly like in 2008, except instead of financial investment companies, it's whole countries. And the US is playing AIG.

It's not the debt that is going to take down the house, its the insurance.

posted on Nov, 29 2011 @ 11:40 AM
The Force

Money is debt.
Those who produce most debt are the richest.
There is a Force that makes it So.

posted on Nov, 29 2011 @ 02:24 PM
Well Citi is up again a little.
BoA and JP are down.

Nothing too crazy today.

posted on Nov, 29 2011 @ 07:47 PM

Standard And Poors Reviews 37 Global Banks, Downgrades Bulk - Full List Attached

Included, Bank of America, Goldman Sachs, JPMorgan, Wells Fargo, Societe General, Bank Of China, Citigroup, Barclays, BNP Paribas, China Construction Bank, Commerzbank, Deustche Bank, Rabobank australia, HSBC, Credit Agricole, Credit Suisse, ING, LLoyd Banking Group, Mitsubishi, Mizuho, Morgan Stanley, RBS, UBS, Unicredit.

Goldman's Sigma X Spot On Once Again: Predicts Imminent UK Contagion

And the punchline: "the capacity of UK public finances to absorb adverse economic and financial shocks that would result in yet higher public debt while retaining its 'AAA' status has largely been exhausted"

Surprise surprise. NOT.

InTrade Odds On Euro Collapse By End Of 2012 Now At 50%

For those who opt for the latter, they should head over to Intrade where the contract pricing the possibility of "Any country currently using the Euro to announce their intention to drop it midnight ET 31 Dec 2012" is now trading at perfectly even odds or 50%.

Hank Paulson Tipped Off The Goldman-Led "Plunge Protection Team" About Fannie Bankruptcy 7 Weeks In Advance

Surprised? This guy should be hanging high. Tanks-in-the-streets-if-you-don't-bailout-the-banks Paulson...

Consumer Confidence Jumps Most In Eight Years, More Than 4 Standard Deviations

Consumers high on drugs...
edit on 29-11-2011 by Vitchilo because: (no reason given)

posted on Nov, 30 2011 @ 08:21 AM
Watching this Lunacy from the Sidelines for now...

Here Comes The Global, US-Funded Liquidity Bail Out

This means that the global situation is far, far more dire than the talking heads have said. Luckily, when this step fails, which it will, Mars can always come and bail us out.


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