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The "up-to-the-minute Market Data" thread

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posted on Nov, 24 2011 @ 10:35 AM
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Worldly powers obviously have a problem since they have united. They need vary badly a strong opponent, and the pressure they put on Iran is only strengthening dictatorship of those donkeys there. It will destroy people on all sides. As those cretins in Egypt, first they gas people with battle poisons, then they apologize and think they will get away with that


And Europe today, they were grazing green, then suddenly plunged.


edit on 24-11-2011 by DangerDeath because: (no reason given)




posted on Nov, 24 2011 @ 10:52 AM
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There will be carnage.

France and Germany plan changes to EU treaties



www.bbc.co.uk...


Germany's Angela Merkel and France's Nicolas Sarkozy are to propose modifications to EU treaties to improve governance of the eurozone.



The modifications are to be proposed over the next few days, but no details have yet been released.

France and Germany disagree about whether the ECB should act as lender of last resort and whether bonds should be issued by the whole of the eurozone instead of individual countries.


Weak growth is the main culprit for Italian bad


blah blah blah...


The news came as a 24-hour general strike in Portugal brought the country to a halt in protest against austerity measures.


Restructuring EU will not resolve the problem. The system created lots of vacuum, and besides, Europe is not independent, no way. Europe is just Greece to bigger power. The bigger power will starve Europe like Leningrad.

The unrolling of events next weeks is going to be very interesting to watch. I think some of the top players are going to fall spectacularly.

Sarkozy and Merkel, like their colleagues in supercommitee, are robots without orders.


edit on 24-11-2011 by DangerDeath because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 24 2011 @ 11:19 AM
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reply to post by DangerDeath
 


Time to give up more sovereignty to the elite!


German budget committee says to discuss new EFSF guidelines on Monday


German government expects EFSF leveraging to be issue at EcoFin next week

Disgusting. The German government needs to hang high.



posted on Nov, 24 2011 @ 11:25 AM
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Originally posted by Vitchilo
reply to post by DangerDeath
 


Time to give up more sovereignty to the elite!


German budget committee says to discuss new EFSF guidelines on Monday


German government expects EFSF leveraging to be issue at EcoFin next week

Disgusting. The German government needs to hang high.


Yeah, they are going with that. Any doubt that they are going to try something mindful is unrealistic. They are just following inertia, to the bitter end. And typically, people have no idea what is going on because it is too busy watching We have talents



posted on Nov, 24 2011 @ 12:11 PM
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The lack of a coherent solution to the predicament is making investors nervous and throttling growth in the markets. It’s a complicated situation, made more difficult by the unique nature of the agreement that binds the Eurozone together.

But what investors want is really simple:

1. Some form of quantitative easing strategy to purchase the bonds of Italy, Spain, Greece and even France to keep interest rates low.

2. A form of serious austerity and budget cuts to cut debt and deficits before rates seriously spike.

3. A backstop, basically a U.S. style Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP) that will back up the banks.

If these three things do happen, you’ll see a huge rally in equity markets, including gold stocks.

Of course, those across the pond from Europe can’t exactly point fingers. In the U.S., the Congressional “Supercommittee” (a misnomer if we’ve ever heard one) announced on Monday that they had failed to come up with a plan for future budget cuts.

Considering the strident political posturing that has taken the place of real negotiation in Washington, D.C., the lack of progress should have come as no surprise.

Of course, the underlying fact of the matter is neither side is looking to truly cut spending — what they are doing instead is slowing the rate of expansion of a program. Say a program they now spend $1 billion on is expected to be a $2 billion expenditure in 10 years.

So they say, “Hey, we’ll just spend $1.5 billion on that in the future,” and they call that a $500 million cut! Nice math if you can get away with it.

The parties are talking slowing spending overall in the range of $1 trillion to $4 trillion. That’s a lot of money, sure, but it’s almost inconsequential when you look at the unfunded liabilities Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security, which are expected to increase in cost by tens of trillions of dollars in the coming years.

In other words, all the wrangling and hand wringing going on right now is doing nothing but sidestepping the hard decisions that will ultimately need to be made. The Congress and Obama Administration won’t do it unless forced.

What will force them? Quickly rising interest rates on government debt, like what has occurred in Europe. Until then, low rates will continue to subsidize the political recklessness that puts the U.S.’s financial future at risk.

That’s the overhang holding the world economy back. Although it would only take some valor in political circles to rectify, the truth is, such brave thinking is in very short supply, so this is a problem that will continue on into 2012.



posted on Nov, 24 2011 @ 12:59 PM
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reply to post by DangerDeath
 


I honestly cannot see many countries agreeing to those changes.. it would probably have to be put to a vote, and while the majority of people don't understand Centralized Banking, I think they will understand losing Sovereignty. It's a very serious change they are proposing, it will alter the political landscape of Europe and concentrate the most powerful aspects of sovereign governments into one central bank .. they already have no control over their currency, now they will lose their rights to debt management.. We are witnessing the Federalization of Europe. So if I could say anything to our Euro friends it would be: Riot in the streets, at all costs you have to prevent the powers of the ECB from expanding.



posted on Nov, 24 2011 @ 02:12 PM
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Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by DangerDeath
 


I honestly cannot see many countries agreeing to those changes.. it would probably have to be put to a vote, and while the majority of people don't understand Centralized Banking, I think they will understand losing Sovereignty. It's a very serious change they are proposing, it will alter the political landscape of Europe and concentrate the most powerful aspects of sovereign governments into one central bank .. they already have no control over their currency, now they will lose their rights to debt management.. We are witnessing the Federalization of Europe. So if I could say anything to our Euro friends it would be: Riot in the streets, at all costs you have to prevent the powers of the ECB from expanding.


I know what you are talking about, but once parties are in parliament, they will do as told, and ignore people. Riots may happen, however, I don't think will change something. Police state is growing steadily. It may not be nice, but bastards will push their agenda of avoiding responsibility very much like in Egypt. We shall see how it goes on in Greece, which is already run over, then Italy, then Spain. We shall see, but I am skeptical.



posted on Nov, 25 2011 @ 04:45 AM
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Italy sells 6-month bills as yield soars


Italy sold 8 billion euros ($10.7 billion) of six-month bills, but saw the yield soar to a euro-era high, news reports said Friday. The auction produced a yield of 6.504%, up from around 3.52% in October, according to Bloomberg. Demand weakened, with the total bids exceeding supply 1.47 times, down from a bid-to-cover ratio of 1.57 in October, the report said. The government also sold 2 billion euros of two-year debt at a yield of 7.81%, reports said.



posted on Nov, 25 2011 @ 04:49 AM
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Stocks Extend Longest Drop Since 2008 on Debt


Stocks fell for a 10th day, the longest losing streak since July 2008, and the euro extended losses as the burden of government debt grew around the world. The cost of insuring European sovereign bonds against default rose to a record.



posted on Nov, 25 2011 @ 12:26 PM
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Dow, S&P Log Worst Thanksgiving Week Since 1932

Stocks closed in negative territory in thin, shortened trading Friday as investors were reluctant to go long ahead of the weekend and amid ongoing worries over the euro zone. The Dow and S&P posted their worst Thanksgiving week since the Great Depression on a percentage basis.
~
"Again, we're trading on very thin volume—You're going to have continued downward pressure over the next 30 days," said Todd Schoenberger, managing director at LandColt Trading. "It's very difficult to be long this market because you have so many issues—there's more potential for negative headlines than positive ones."



posted on Nov, 25 2011 @ 12:45 PM
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reply to post by surrealist
 


The biggest problem with the Euro-trash debt deals is that in October they advised the World that you risk a 50%+ reduction in principle on the outstanding debt. Why would I risk a 50%+ loss for a 6.5% gain? Under any normal circumstances 6.5% on a 6 month Bond is extremely tempting.. very safe, very lucrative. But knowing that not only would the government "orderly default" with a 50% principle shaving, but also void any contract taken to hedge against possible losses.

European countries, all of them, will have a very hard time selling their junk bonds when we all know they'd push us infront of a moving train without hesitation for the sake of "orderly economic collapse". Their arrogance will be their undoing. Unfortunately for the Euros out there, this will mean they need to rely on the ECB to monetize the struggling Euro countries, but also intervene in other markets such as France and Germany to control bond yields there too. This means the ECB needs the power to monetize directly without collection, meaning a change to the EU constitution.. inevitably the discussion will turn to Federalization .. you cannot have a union with so many economic philosophies out there, you need a strong centralized decision maker, an all-powerful pan-European Federal Government.

Or..

The World economy collapses in a spectacular fire show.



posted on Nov, 25 2011 @ 12:47 PM
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Another Late Day Dumpfest Ends Worst Thanksgiving Week Ever For Stocks

Stocks plunged at the close for the third day in a row to cap the worst Thanksgiving week ever.

US equities seemed in a world of their own for much of the day - especially financials - as all the hope and rumors faded and clearly a large number wanted to be flat or short into the weekend. Across a broad basket of risk assets (CONTEXT), today's equity rally and selloff was pure emotional overshoot and correction as we closed back at reality. HYG once again led the derisking way and credit underperformed equity until the late-day equity sell-off converged them once again.

What has been most notable this week - particularly the last day or so, has been the sell-off in Treasuries. The concerns that European entities are repatriating anything and everything should be very worrisome and the volume into the ES close suggests that fear is growing.



posted on Nov, 25 2011 @ 02:46 PM
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Holy ATS reunion, Batman, the Borg has returned — on a wave of negative sentiment! Does this mean we go short?





No, Robin. You are merely scratching the surface. This can mean only one thing.





Yes, the dastardly criminal geniuses once held in check by sovereign government, law and its accompanying institutions, are now on the verge of their greatest triumph: the removal of the very laws and institutions that kept them at bay.

[smashing fist into palm] Then, Batman, we have failed. All mankind stands on the brink of ruin.

...

Wait. There is yet one ray of hope, still beaming amid the gloom which even now enfolds us.

[staring in disbelief] Can the united efforts of these villains be truly overcome?

Yes, Robin! But first we must inform the populace to forewarn them, and enable them to prepare.

Gadzooks, Batman. You mean we must find a way to inform the masses?

Yes. Quick. We have not a moment to lose. Into the Batmobile...





posted on Nov, 26 2011 @ 07:03 PM
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We all keep going on about the signs of immenent ecconomic collaps, and I was
trying to put myself in the possision of a contingency planner what would I do.
And the fist thing I would do is to take down the World wide communications grid.
or as mutch as i possibly could and restict those who can access it in future
. so why sould i do that.
1) Increase the time which they have to respond to international bank runs.
2) decrease the populases ability to organise.
3) Create a closed system in which to re-establish order
4) Decrease the possibility of outside interferance.
The Informations system which we are all attached to is the system which I personally
would take down. Then the press/ newspapers would be the only outside source of information
.The Arib Spring has shown the people but also governments what these tools are capible
of making. so If the comms go down good luck to all



posted on Nov, 27 2011 @ 07:09 AM
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seeing as im an idiot when it comes to finance i was wondering if someone could explain what selling of bonds means? In very basic terms.. i cant understand any of it. please?



posted on Nov, 27 2011 @ 07:53 AM
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Originally posted by TiM3LoRd
seeing as im an idiot when it comes to finance i was wondering if someone could explain what selling of bonds means? In very basic terms.. i cant understand any of it. please?

It means if your government is spending more than it takes in, it has a deficit, therefore, it needs to sell treasury bonds so they can finance that deficit.

If they can't, they have to print money and that creates massive inflation. Or they have to cut the budget or raise taxes to not have a deficit.

IMF Readying Loan of as Much as $794 Billion for Italy, La Stampa Reports

The International Monetary Fund is preparing a 600-billion euro ($794 billion) loan for Italy in case the country’s debt crisis worsens, La Stampa said.

The money would give Italy’s Prime Minister Mario Monti 12 to 18 months to implement his reforms without having to refinance the country’s existing debt, the Italian daily reported, without saying where it got the information. Monti could draw on the money if his planned austerity measures fail to stop speculation on Italian debt, La Stampa said.

And of course the US are gonna pay this, 17% total to be exact. Japan and Germany will pay 6%. France and the UK, 5%. China will pay around 3.8%... Italy will pay 3% to itself and Saudi Arabia will also pay 3%. Canada will pay 2.8%. How fun. And not that is matters since Monti runs Italy, but if you accept any money from the IMF, the IMF controls your economy.

Euro zone looks to IMF as Belgium is downgraded

Gee another country that will come under the thumb of the unelected scum at the IMF.... We are the IMF, YOU pay US to enslave YOU. Isn't globalism wonderful?

edit on 27-11-2011 by Vitchilo because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 27 2011 @ 08:17 AM
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Bonds are papers issued by government and sold for money. After a given time, which could be anything, determined by the concrete bond, 1 or 5 or 10 years, the state returns the money plus interest. Now, there are many factors in play here. Inflation - the value of returned money will be lesser than it was worth when you bought such bond - this should be covered by interest on the bond. However, you can sell your bonds before they are due, in the market. Demand for these bonds will decide their real market value. Interest rate is adaptable, so when interest rate on bonds grows, it means the state is in trouble because it will have to sell more bonds in order to pay for those earlier issued bonds which are due to be repaid. Which means the real value of bonds is dropping, nobody wants to buy them any more and state must find a way to get money... a vicious circle. Thus, austerity measures, more loans, more taxes, etc.

Basically, state takes loan from you or any investor who wishes to put his money into a Time Machine


As Vitchilo said, the one who eventually covers the losses caused by this Ponzi scheme, will have everything in control. IMF as an instrument of infinite printing money has won in advance because the game is fixed.
edit on 27-11-2011 by DangerDeath because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 27 2011 @ 03:29 PM
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[ www.reuters.com...]http://www.reuters.com/article/email/idUSTRE7AO1NO20111127[/url]

Australia's is expecting their market to open flat. And the above article in Reuters sounds like it will be a roller coaster week. Currently the sales figures from Black Friday are saying sales are up, this could result in a good day on Wall Street tomorrow but I think things will start sinking quickly.
edit on 27-11-2011 by AuntB because: (no reason given)

edit on 27-11-2011 by AuntB because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 27 2011 @ 08:35 PM
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reply to post by TiM3LoRd
 


While everybody has been so nice to explain in very well put up words about what bonds are, my more favorite and exclusive opinion goes this way, Bonds are the promise of enslavement of the working and productive part of the nations populations that will extend to generations to come in order for the ruling elites of the nations that cater to the ruling elites of the global economy to have a source of future fund so they can keep gambling with the wealth of the citizens of the nations, that has not been created yet.

Bonds are crap and worth only as long as the citizens are used as collateral.


Could not hold myself on this one, sorry.



posted on Nov, 27 2011 @ 08:38 PM
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reply to post by AuntB
 


The markets will boom tomorrow as the sheeple in the US show in great force like automatons to purchase their Chinese crap on credit during black Friday.

Then the promise of the IMF to keep enslaving nations, ( I mean to the rescue of nations,) is coming to fruition also so yes this two great news will be enough to create a rally.



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