It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Chinese Security Forces Swarm Tibet

page: 24
20
<< 21  22  23    25  26  27 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 01:52 AM
link   
More suppression of the media and free press in China:

China orders video Web sites to close


China will shut down or punish dozens of video-sharing Web sites for carrying content deemed pornographic, violent or a threat to national security under rules that tighten Internet controls, a regulator said Friday.



This part isn't as striking as this part below:



The announcement came as Chinese Web surfers were blocked from seeing foreign sites with video about protests in Tibet. The new order did not mention the anti-government demonstrations or China's resulting crackdown.



It seems the Chinese are only "protecting" themselves in wake of the Olympics:


Communist authorities have also tightened controls on Chinese media ahead of this summer's Beijing Olympics in hopes of stopping content that might tarnish a national prestige event.




posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 02:06 AM
link   

Originally posted by wwssii
so you mean it is only right that all chinese should stay in the chinese forum?


Not at all. If you're coming here as an individual, and not on a payroll, you're more than welcome in any thread.



as for the internet brigade, i am really tired of replying such stupid imagination.


You come to a UFO website, and expect lack of imagination?


Anyway, let me direct you to the link, again...

en.wikipedia.org...

k, i trust you've read it...now go back and read through these threads and tell me that's not exactly what appears to be going on here, you'd be lying. And again, it's a conspiracy site, lol.



dont take ATS so seriously.


Why are you?



now, i have the interest to defend my country and let you know the other side of things.


Defend it from what?



american want to police the world, i can understand.


Of course, that's just to be expected. Somebody has to right?



but what makes me disappointed is the whole ATS full of China-bashing post.


Yeah and the US gets a free pass, right? Gime a break, I bash my own government WAY more than I bash yours.



i want to ask you to speak something positive on China, can you? of course, no. that is the case.


I have no problem with the people of China my friend. The Chinese folks that live here are very polite, I love your food, I loved all the kung-fu movies you guys made, Bruce Lee was a childhood hero of mine, etc. It's your oppressive government I don't care for. But that's for you guys to fix, this American is tired of policing the world.



you just like attacking China. why?


Why are you guys so fragile emotionally?


Toughin up a bit, every country's government gets attacked here, again, because it's a conspiracy site.

[edit on 22-3-2008 by 27jd]



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 02:12 AM
link   
You must not have read all my earlier posts wwssii.

Some of my best friends are currently Chinese citizens. I have explained before that I do not hate Chinese people and I do not hate China.

I do hate how China has treated Tibet and still treats Tibetans.

When I was 17 years old, a long time ago now I was very interested in Tibetan history. I studied books by pro Tibetan and pro Chinese writers about Tibet (like Han Suyin). I read about Tibet before the internet even existed.

The Dalai Lama is not perfect, but he is not evil. A lot of Tibetans over the years have expressed frustration that the Dalai Lama will not support armed opposition in Tibet.

That's why I don't buy China's attack on the Dalai Lama because I have heard things the Dalai Lama has been saying for the last 30 years and none of it tallies with the crap you guys say about him.

Yes the uprising in Lhasa was violent against Chinese. On the other hand after what China does I do not blame them much. I am sure thousands of Tibetans will be paying for it with their lives as we talk.

Now to responding to your question (I think I already have above)


american want to police the world, i can understand. but people from other nations such as new zealand and finland also join the debate bashing china. what is the things to do with you?. history is not written by you but by Chinese


Because people who live in democracies believe at a personal level in fairness and that means fairness for Tibetans. It's not an American thing. I am often very critical of America especially in Iraq, but you don't see that because you don't want to.

In that you don't understand western people at all. we criticise our own Governments. we criticise each other's governments, but we all share a common understanding that justice and fairness are human rights for everyone (including Chinese)

If you want the outside world to stop attacking Chinese conduct wwssii then start being fair to Tibetans. give them some freedom in their own country and stop using them like puppets.


history is not written by you but by Chinese


China is not the only witness to Tibetan history. China was not witness to or even involved with Tibet's relationships with other countries like Kashmir, Nepal and Ladekh. In the 1918 treaty between Britain, China and Tibet, then China was not the only witness to history.

China's version of history about Tibet does not agree with other records by other countries so you cannot say that China's version is the only truth.







[edit on 22-3-2008 by sy.gunson]



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 02:14 AM
link   
reply to post by 27jd
 


i think it hurts when i see lies about China. especially in terms of the sovereignty integrity.

if you said something corruption or pollution about China, i will never fight back. truth is the truth.



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 02:32 AM
link   


i think it hurts when i see lies about China. especially in terms of the sovereignty integrity.

if you said something corruption or pollution about China, i will never fight back. truth is the truth.


I am sorry wwssii. We are not doing this to hurt you or China.
We are doing this because we want to protect the people in Tibet.

I can understand why you must feel hurt. You have always been raised to believe one version of the history between Tibet and China.

I have read China's version and I hear the justifications like bringing prosperity and development to Tibet, but that is not what the Tibetans want. the Tibetans want to be Tibetans.

The Tibetans want Chinese to come to their country as respectful guests. Not as soldiers with guns.

I have not lied to you wwssii.

These treaties I have told you about are real documents. They contradict what the government in China says.

I don't expect you have ever heard of them. I know it must seem to you we are lying or quoting from lies but just because our records of history are different from your that ours are lying.

I am sad that you feel hurt, but I am glad you are telling us because now I hear you like another human being.

In my country white people also say shouldn't the Maori be happy because of what we did for them, but we westerners developed New Zealand for ourselves and allowed Maori to share with us.

The Maori however want more than that. they want to be respected as the people who truely belong here. they want to be treated seriously and not as puppets.

The Dalai Lama offered to settle for real autonomy rather than full independence. he did that because he hoped China would meet him half way.

That was not because he accepted China owns Tibet. he was trying to make a concession hoping that China would be fair.





posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 02:34 AM
link   

Originally posted by wwssii
i think it hurts when i see lies about China. especially in terms of the sovereignty integrity.


I'm an American, there is no other country besides Nazi Germany that has been bashed on here as much as mine. But I really don't care, and neither should you. I'm an individual, not a country. I live here and I am proud of alot of things my country has done, and ashamed of alot of things.



if you said something corruption or pollution about China, i will never fight back. truth is the truth.


We have our share of both here too, hopefully one day all us little people will realize we're all bieng used and put a stop to all the fighting over manufactured divisions. Peace on earth would be nice, but only if it meant for everybody. Anyway, it's late here....good night all.



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 02:35 AM
link   
reply to post by sy.gunson
 


China's history is very complicated and complex. there are numerous kingdoms in china's history. so do you think china should go back to the situation thousands years before?...why Hongkong and Macow should return, that is just because those are traitor treaties in Qing dynasty that seperate Hongkong and Macow from China. what China means? never be the Qing emperor, but the people living in the land. both Hongkong and Macow are our compatriots. Tibetan is also.

you should know language and culture are not the basic points of a country. in China, there are 56 different ethnic groups with diversified language and culture, but this doesnt affect the reality that we both are Chinese and we share the same motherland.

even Han ppl also attack (or invade) other Han groups in history, but from the points of view today, they are all civil wars and civil issues..

in china , police call the thieves also enemy, this doesnt mean the stealers are foreigner...



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 02:54 AM
link   

Originally posted by sy.gunson
I have read China's version and I hear the justifications like bringing prosperity and development to Tibet, but that is not what the Tibetans want. the Tibetans want to be Tibetans.

The Tibetans want Chinese to come to their country as respectful guests. Not as soldiers with guns.


no matter what the real history is, now the key point is that if all the tibetans want independence. the answer obviously is no!

Dalai will never get support from the general pulic in Tibet, that is why in tens of years he never got any win in this field..Dalai represents the nobles and ppl want to own their own land for farm and never be slaves again.

dont worry about the freedom the tibetans should enjoy, they live quite well. to set the history aside, look upon the nowdays life in tibet, you will find tibetans lives are the same as Han ppl. i dont mean they are very rich, but Han ppl are also living a not so good life in general...i find no difference in the life between Tibetans and han. the freedom is the same thing for all the chinese, no predominant ones. if there are, there are must be Tibetan who prevail Han ppl.

we also set the things before 1960 aside first, after that time , tibetans have got a better and better life. no any culture genocide. you can find that by going to tibet on the ground.

ps.. some rioter have told the police that they were hired by someone esle and can get hundreds of yuan one day. and the more they destroy, the more they can get... such a news, believe it or not...i just write it here.

[edit on 22-3-2008 by wwssii]



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 03:35 AM
link   


China's history is very complicated and complex. there are numerous kingdoms in china's history. so do you think china should go back to the situation thousands years before?...why Hongkong and Macow should return, that is just because those are traitor treaties in Qing dynasty that seperate Hongkong and Macow from China. what China means? never be the Qing emperor, but the people living in the land. both Hongkong and Macow are our compatriots. Tibetan is also.


No wwssii, nobody says that about Hong Kong or Macau.

Tibet is different though. they had their own culture and Government. It would not be fair if the Japanese came and conquered China. Then called China part of the Japanese Empire.

You ask me what i think so I aswer you sensibly as a human being to another human being.

I think if China has all these concerns about it's security and protecting it's water supply then China's leaders should go and talk with the Dalai Lama.

In return for real freedom I am certain he will agree to reasonable demands by China.

If China wants a promise from the Dalai Lama that he will not let any foreign nation build millitary bases in Tibet then he will agree. I know he will.

If China wants to keep some military bases in Tibet, then I am sure he will agree provided the Chinese do not use them to interfere in Tibetan politics.

I even suspect India would agree to respect such a treaty because India wants stability in the region too.

If China wants guarantee of supply of Tibetan minerals then provided China will pay a fair price I see no reason why the Dalai Lama would not agree.

If China wants guarantees of safety for those Chinese already settled there then the Dalai Lama would probably agree to that too.

There is no reason why the Dalai Lama would not agree to such things.

Would you rather wait for a humanitarian disaster in Tibet to force the world to act against China (with trade boycotts) and then lose Tibet in an outcome forced by uprisings and UN intervention without a say in the outcome ?

Nobody expects China to accept a negative outcome. China has the chance now to obtain a positive result by simply talking with the Dalai Lama.

If China's leaders go to meet the Dalai Lama it will give him greater authority with Tibetan people and they will listen to his calls for calm in Tibet.

Don't be afraid of change. Tibet will be free again one day.

Do you want the change to happen in a positive way that benefits China or a negative way that makes China enemies all around the world ?

Nobody in the west wants to destroy or humiliate China.

We just want China to give Tibetans their freedom back. That's all.

If it would help I would even volunteer to negotiate between the two leaders.

I say this all from the heart wwssii.




posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 03:44 AM
link   


dont worry about the freedom the tibetans should enjoy, they live quite well. to set the history aside, look upon the nowdays life in tibet, you will find tibetans lives are the same as Han ppl. i dont mean they are very rich, but Han ppl are also living a not so good life in general...i find no difference in the life between Tibetans and han. the freedom is the same thing for all the chinese, no predominant ones. if there are, there are must be Tibetan who prevail Han ppl.

we also set the things before 1960 aside first, after that time , tibetans have got a better and better life. no any culture genocide. you can find that by going to tibet on the ground.


The Tibetans will not forget. You can't just steal someone's freedom and tell them to forget about it.





posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 04:05 AM
link   
reply to post by sy.gunson
 


i can feel your sincerity.. but there are many evil things behind the politics...China's top leaders always welcome the dialogue with Dalai and also have negotiated with him several times covertly according to western media...i dont know why no positive result coming out..

as for invasion, it would be more proper to say that Communist Party invaded kuomintung party's control and invaded feudal governor's evil power in tibet....you should know that history in china was not invasions between different ethnic groups but the wars between different political groups....in ordinary ppl's opinion, those wars were just political groups' fighting for top power, while in the hearts of gerneral pulic, all ethnic groups share the same motherland. we belong to the same country...

tibet is part of the country no matter what her name is. not a part of any political party..just like taiwan and mainland, we both belong to the same country no matter what it is called or who is controlling.

even tibet is a whole desert, it is also a property of all the ppl living in the 9600 thousands square kilometres...we need tibet just because our ancestors told us gerneration by gerneration that is our land. this big family cant be split...

that is the case.



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 04:08 AM
link   

Originally posted by Witness2008
I think we need to step up our efforts encouraging boycott of products an the Olympics.


What we need is a list of Western sponsors and hit them directly... Do you think American sponsors would not pay attention if we stopped buying their products?



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 04:17 AM
link   

Originally posted by wwssii rioters attacked not only the Han ppl but also those tibetan doctors, firefighters and polices.


How many Chinese did the Tibetans kill in their riot? It must have been a lot for the Chinese to use deadly force against the Tibetans...

Please be so kind as to show me those deaths of Hans so I might believe the Chinese action is justified

[edit on 22-3-2008 by zorgon]



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 04:19 AM
link   

Originally posted by sy.gunson

The Tibetans will not forget. You can't just steal someone's freedom and tell them to forget about it.


let's simplize the issue in this way..
i was a villein working for a landlord, while another tibetan was a slave belonging to a noble. we are both belong to a same village. the landlord and the noble obeyed the rule of Qing empor, then the kuomintung's control. years passed, one day, another giant named communist party came and toppled the governor then set up his regime and liberate me as a villein and the tibetan serf. so now, can you say any invasion occured in this process?
we still work in the village one as a worker and another as a shopowner...so now, can you say that we belong different country now?



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 04:25 AM
link   
reply to post by zorgon
 


what is your logic? Han ppl died of takeing action first, while tibetan ppl died of han ppl's attacking....why not tibetan hooligans kill Han ppl to death intentionally?....yes, always han ppl's fault, but the han ppl are just some small shopowners and workers, they are also labors!

how can i show you the evidence since all the things in chinese web are regarded by you as propaganda....



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 04:30 AM
link   
Oops

[edit on 22-3-2008 by zorgon]



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 04:31 AM
link   

Originally posted by wwssii
how can i show you the evidence since all the things in chinese web are regarded by you as propaganda....


You have no idea what I may or may not consider propaganda from China... I am probably one of the least biased people in here

I simply asked you how many Chinese the rioters killed...

Do you think you could just give a straight answer?



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 04:37 AM
link   
reply to post by zorgon
 


The Chinese are being very transparent in their domestic meida coverage of these incidents.

Here is an example of how the Han are being attacked:

www.whatsonxiamen.com...

You can also check out:

www.whatsonxiamen.com The main page has many stories from the Xinhua News agency. Including reports about how the Chinese have shot protestors in self-defense, riot survivor reports, and first hand accounts of Han and other minorities being attacked.



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 04:44 AM
link   
This is good too:

news.xinhuanet.com...

Shows how peaceful those Tibetans are. Hahaha



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 04:47 AM
link   

Originally posted by ikaruga
The Chinese are being very transparent in their domestic meida coverage of these incidents.


Far from it. Western reporters are being sent out of Tibet en masse. Chinese media is censoring pretty much all negative news in general, not just about Tibet.

If you take a look through just this thread you will find multiple sources indicating censorship from the Chinese media. I've already done the homework for you, all you have to do now is look through this thread to find it.

Your media is more biased than the US media. I didn't think it was possible, but when the state controls the information, well you know how that goes...Monopoly.


For now, Beijing's hard line on Tibet is only likely to get harder. Military police officers are pouring into Tibetan regions to stifle new protests. Nor are the demonstrations winning sympathy in a nation that is 94 percent Han Chinese. State media have tightly controlled coverage to focus on Tibetans burning Chinese businesses or attacking and killing Chinese merchants. No mention is made of Tibetan grievances or reports that 80 or more Tibetans have died.


China's tough line on Tibet

Care to respond to these claims?

[edit on 3/22/2008 by biggie smalls]



new topics

top topics



 
20
<< 21  22  23    25  26  27 >>

log in

join