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Sun worship or Son worship?

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posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 03:01 PM
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alexander hislops book the two babylons explains that the truth of there needing to be a Messiah to undo the death penalty that adam and eve brought on all humanity was well known to the people of the pre-flood world.the companion bible by dr. bullinger tells the same story in his notes.

this same knowledge was passed on thru noah and shem on down thru to abraham isaac and jacob/israel and the 13 tribes. judah is just 1 of those 13 tribes.

shortly after the flood a man by name of nimrod and his wife semiramis took the ancient true knowledge of G-D and twisted and perverted it into their sex worship "religion" to empower themselves over the ignorent people and it is their teaching of sun worship which became the religion of babylon/chaldea.this is the religion G-D wanted israel to destroy out of the holy land when they were freed from egypt and which they failed to complete in their rebellion and the reason they went into captivity and the diaspora----part of the teaching of that same religion which is found here in this thread and also in some churches that makes the truth of G-D and Messiah found in the holy scriptures look bad.

the same member of the G-D family that did the actual physical creative works is the One that poured Himself out of His Divinity to become the sacrifice/the Lamb to take away the sins of the world.(john 1:1-14)

those that accept Him as Savior/Messiah will live forever at His return---those that reject Him will die in their sins.




posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 03:21 PM
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reply to post by ahuman
 



That is the question isn't it? At one time I thought YHWH was the ONLY God, after some research, I found out that Abraham choose YHWH from a host of equal GODS, (many GODS are hard to answer to) , so they choose just one to answer to, YHWH. YHWH approached other "peoples" before the "Abrahamic" group, ancient and modern jewish scholars acknowledge this as a fact. How can they say it is fact? The Torah says so. This is known as Henotheistic, the Jewish tradition is NOT monotheistic, the choose one GOD from a host of equals. Thats what the Jewish tradition says anyway, I wasn't actually there just repeating what the tradition says.


edit to note 420 points now


[edit on 1-2-2008 by KanehBosm]



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 03:24 PM
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reply to post by AshleyD
 


Fact is, no one here knows for sure. I believe you asked for concrete evidence earlier ... not a "source of a source of a source."

The same could be asked of you. Frankly there was nothing written about Jesus until well after his death (approximately 40 years) and anything that we've been told of him has been passed down for 2,000 years through translation after translation. Thus, a source of a source of a source.

You can refute all you want, but like you, many of us will choose to believe in what makes the most sense to us.



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 03:25 PM
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[edit on 1-2-2008 by Chaos Lord]



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 03:30 PM
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Thank you Kan.
I truly appreciate it.
I am what some people would call Agnostic. But its more like lazy. I really dont want to pick a side in the whole religion. I really enjoy hearing about the "connections" but feel some are a stretch yet i also really like to hear the "debunking". This religious "Cold War" is really entertaining to watch.

In my opinion searching for these "connections" is similar to the 2012:EOD situation. There are a couple sources that raise red flags.(Mayan Calendar, I Ching) and then those red flags cause "paranoid" research. If you really want to find something you will, whether you found it or not... you get my drift. thats just how i personally feel.

I personally dont mind people trying to change my opinion because if their way of thinking is better than mine there is no reason not to change.

But this is great!!! The Freedom of speech is a great thing when used responsibly. KaneBosm and AshleyD have made this a great thread. (not that others havent) Keep it real.



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 03:37 PM
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Zeitgeist explains this post in entirety. HAHAHA this will make you Christians *SNIP* MAD!

Google Video Link
sorry I just realize this was double posted.... But ahh well!

[edit on 1-2-2008 by Chaos Lord]

Courtesy Is Mandatory.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Edited by NGC2736
Forum Moderator


[edit on 1-2-2008 by NGC2736]



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 03:41 PM
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Thanks, I agree Ashley has, as well as others kept it real, without to much anger or sarcasm, although I was sarcastic and regret being that way.

I see now in hindsight my very first post, was disconnected in many ways, and resembled many of the "movies" and info one can find on youtube. Ashleys arguments are the ones I used until 36 weeks ago when I met the creator (not GOD, YHWH, ELOHIM, ALLAH or any other GOD).

I never want to change opinion, rather offer information and ideas and discuss. Plato believed the purpose of man was to think and discuss.

The Creator does not require or WANT anything from us. GOD does?, and has requirements? Thats right, they are not the same.



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 03:43 PM
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reply to post by tyranny22
 


Which is exactly why I haven't made a thread saying "JESUS IS HISTORICAL!" Because I cannot provide proof but indeed some pretty interesting evidence. But the claim Jesus' life was actually taken from pagan myths could be backed up by some hardcore evidence.

People keep tossing out claims like Krishna was born of a virgin, was crucified, came back after three days, had twelve apostles, and was born on December 25th. All of those could easily be proven if they existed in the Hindu texts. But when I ask to be shown where this is written about Krishna it's like a fart in church- there's a moment of silence and no one wants to talk about it. So, I will quote from the Hindu texts that directly refutes these allegations and then the only thing they are left with are silly similarities like, "Well, both Hinduism and Christianity believe in an afterlife."



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 03:45 PM
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reply to post by Chaos Lord
 


yeah bud, this is the "head popping" that would happen if truth was accepted. It would be an interesting scene to watch in 3rd person when everyone is actually forced to see who our God is. The Sumerians knew who created us.



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 03:48 PM
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Originally posted by Chaos Lord
Zeitgeist explains this post in entirety. HAHAHA this will make you Christian freaks MAD!


Have you been listening to anything that has been explained on this thread and hundreds of others on ATS? Zeitgeist is a stretched fraud that preys on the ignorance of people such as yourself that haven't studied these other religions and are only believing what they are told.

Us Christian "freaks" aren't remotely mad about it. Surprised due to the fact that just about everything Zeitgeist claims was debunked over a century ago and that it keeps popping up again. But not remotely mad.

If you think a single video from the internet "proves" something, then can I submit a couple dozen videos about Christianity to "prove" it? No.

[edit on 2/1/2008 by AshleyD]



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 03:48 PM
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Virgin in the ancient text is in regards to an emmaculate or divinely inpregnated, not in the sense we think today, never having sex.


Virgin = seeded by the divine



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 03:54 PM
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Originally posted by KanehBosm
Virgin in the ancient text is in regards to an emmaculate or divinely inpregnated, not in the sense we think today, never having sex.


Virgin = seeded by the divine


Egads! So now we can use more word games to make a fit? It like when you described the setting sun as "crucified."

If we want to make things as loose as humanly possible we can see Christianity has a lot of things in common with dozens of other religions:

An afterlife.
A heaven and hell.
A God.
A conflict between good and evil.
A holy book.
Prophets.
A son of God.
A communal meal.
A creator.

Etc.

Nothing 'nail on the head.'



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 03:54 PM
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Zeitgeist should not become the Anti-Bible. If it based on false information it explains nothing.

The delivery of a great message shouldnt be made on a foundation of lies.

Nothing is absolute. This world would be better off without religion, though religion has helped a staggering amount of people. I really wish those people would say that religion is the root of all evil. Whether humans made it that way or not i do not know mostly because i didnt see what religion was like before.

Wooooh!



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 03:59 PM
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Originally posted by AshleyD

Originally posted by KanehBosm
Virgin in the ancient text is in regards to an emmaculate or divinely inpregnated, not in the sense we think today, never having sex.


Virgin = seeded by the divine


Egads! So now we can use more word games to make a fit? It like when you described the setting sun as "crucified."

If we want to make things as loose as humanly possible we can see Christianity has a lot of things in common with dozens of other religions:

An afterlife.
A heaven and hell.
A God.
A conflict between good and evil.
A holy book.
Prophets.
A son of God.
A communal meal.
A creator.

Etc.

Nothing 'nail on the head.'



So you are saying that Christianity looks like the others, smells like the others, kinda tastes like the others, but is not the same as the others?

looks like crap, sounds like crap and tastes like crap but isnt crap?
WOOH!! don't invite me for dinner!!



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 04:05 PM
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I did not previously see the Christian Freaks Part. I apologize for not commenting.

That is a terribly rude thing to say. If you really cared about the message you would act as a representative of the movie and not limit the audience by calling some of them freaks. You act like you are a "militant" zeitgeist fan. Apparently you dont see that the reason you are calling christians freaks is because some of them are extremists and they persecute you or others because you dont follow them. Persecution is wrong. Period. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. Some know how to get theirs across without attacking others.

Good game.



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 04:08 PM
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reply to post by KanehBosm
 


You're missing the point again. Did you see my God-Zod analogy? We can find similarities between a shoelace and a gorilla if we look hard enough.

One thing everyone seems to forget is that the coming of Jesus in the first century had been predicted over 1,000 years in advance by the Jews. It wasn't a case of 1st century Christians saying, "Hey! Let's invent a new movement and this is what this new God will be like." Almost everything Jesus was supposed to be and was had been mentioned centuries before His life.

Christianity was not originally meant to be a whole new religion. We weren't even called Christians at first. We were called Jews because all Christianity was supposed to consist of were those who believed the Jewish Messiah had come.

The scholars who are smart enough to realize this shift their focus from disproving Jesus to disproving Judaism by more odd allegations like the Jews stole their religion from Egypt and Babylon or that they were really polytheistic. It's funny because I never see any hardcore critical analysis of any other religions besides the Judeo-Christian faith.

[edit on 2/1/2008 by AshleyD]



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 04:25 PM
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hey guys i was just gonna let you know i will probably respond a little later but i have to leave.

you see before this thread i was an ATS virgin and seeing all these posts makes me feel born again. i am at work and if i dont get this proposal done by the 25th my boss will crucify me.


-lame. but anyway i really must bow out as self appointed referee. thanks a lot guys both of you are the reason this site works.

Peace.



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 04:25 PM
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reply to post by KanehBosm
 


Great point and I am glad you posted this because it's how I feel.

I think Albert Einstein who said "It is in a poor way that man has to be restrained by fear of punishment or reward after death."


So, for me I would say the we are really taking about the SUN.

Having said that, I am sure I upset all the Jesus Fans.

Good post and thanks for having the courage to post it.



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 04:25 PM
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Originally posted by SKUNK2
reply to post by KanehBosm
 


I agree with every thing you say!!!
But you might as well just give up telling the religous zealots!!!


man I disagree, I was one until 9 months ago. So I must try!! Being awake is a beautiful thing isnt it.



posted on Feb, 1 2008 @ 04:31 PM
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Ashley, please read my post about the Hebrews being Henotheistic, not mono, YHWH according the the Torah, was a god among a host of equal gods. The Hebrews decided and now Christians to worship only one of the many equal gods. As Christians, we then worship YAHWEH, ELOHIM, GOD, one god from a host of gods. The Hebrew God.





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