The Mandela Effect Can No Longer Be Denied: Berenstein Was The Tip of The Iceberg

a reply to: rothanwalker

Mother T was called a "living saint" by the media but she was not canonized until after her death. There are several other Saint[e] Theresas (Therés, Teresa, etc) usually distinguished by the name of the place where they did their saintly thing.

originally posted by: rothanwalker
One last note... I thought I might have a "gotcha" type moment with pacemakers... Because pacemakers are up on the left where the heart used to be, right? But now the pacemaker is still in the same spot but the wires go through a vein for a pretty long way to get into the right atrium/ventricle... I am not 100% sure on how pacemakers worked not even close to a pacemaker expert... I know they went to the sinoatrial node to trigger the heartbeat... I'm thinking maybe just the wires going through the vein so far makes it look very off to me but I would love to hear from anyone who has more experience with pacemakers who remembers it differently (and maybe the pacemaker thing isn't an effect in itself just the wires to get from the old location to where the heart actually is in this reality make it look off).

Pacemakers can be inserted on either side actually. I don't work in cardiology and I also used to assume all pacemakers were on the left, until I met a patient who had it on the right. The cardiology consultant on duty explained that the left side is usually preferred as it's closer to the heart (not because the heart was ever on the left but because the heart is in the centre but slightly offset to the left, as it's always been).

The optimal side for some pacemakers, VDD for example, is the right side.

You say that, despite your biological knowledge, your anatomy is different. Did you suddenly realize that? Did you feel the movement of organs and bones readjusting inside your body?

Isn't it funny that we are yet to hear of emergency staff not knowing how to perform life saving procedures because the ribcage is wrong? Or that we are yet to hear from a doctor who couldn't find the organ he had to operate on because it was in the wrong place?

a reply to: Agartha

Yes, Agartha,I just looked at that and like I said this one isn't for sure for me, but I don't ever recall seeing a pacemaker on the right side before now. Could just be me not remembering the pacemaker thing.

Yes, I suddenly realized two days ago that my anatomy was different. These changes aren't something that are noticeable day to day unless you actually look for them, so I am not 100% sure when this happened for me. I didn't feel any shift. I just felt where it used to be in my memory and where it is now according to diagrams and my anatomy (at least heart, kidneys, and scapulae, the ones I physically feel... or not anymore ha) definitely matches up with what the current diagrams show.

As for a doctor or medical professional I would be shocked if we don't ever hear from a doctor also having these memories. So far almost everyone I have asked "Can you tell me where your heart is located in your body?" they point to the spot that is correct in my memory, so at least in my very very small sample size the heart location seems to be pretty common "incorrect" memory where people are very certain about it being on the left and higher. Even my sisters boyfriend who is very detail oriented and who is one of the few who immediately recalled BerenSTAIN when he overheard me asking my sister the question about the family of bears said left side like above the left nipple. My brother and a coworker so far have been 2 our of 11 that told me in the center.

Another of my sisters is a nurse and also recalled the heart location similar to how I remember. She knew that the location for listening to a heartbeat is in the "old" location but it doesn't work there now. She even went back into textbooks and thinks the diagrams in her physical textbooks are different than she remembers. She was going to look through to see if she could find handwritten notes. So I am not sure if that qualifies for your "request." She said she was going to ask a couple people at work that she trusted... after reading a couple of threads I made sure to tell her to be very careful about talking about this at work to make sure she doesn't get fired or viewed as incompetent by her coworkers (this could also be a reason maybe why none have come forward). So she hasn't been on a shift or gotten the opportunity yet to ask the people that she wanted to yet but I will let you know. I also have been thinking about getting in touch with some of my college peers, many of whom are doctors, to see if they have any of these memories as well. Like I said I am fairly confident that if a doctor hasn't come forward with similar experiences that one will at some point.

a reply to: Agartha

And I get all of the arguments against this.. even when I felt like it was Berenstein i was still sort of skeptical of a lot of the mistquotes and misspellings. I get the arguments against what I am saying- that I might just be mistaken somehow... taught incorrectly, bad diagrams, pledge of allegiance, pop culture/cartoons, etc.

I understand Occam's razor, human's having faulty memory, can't rely on eyewitness testimony, brain fill in blanks to "autocomplete" and try to make sense of things. I get all that.

So lets do a little thought experiment taking this faulty human memory idea and bad diagrams or incorrect education, etc... and lets amplify that. But let's suspend Occam's razor, which doesn't deal with definites anyways, but merely with likelihood... lets assume that the most complicated answer is correct. Without even thinking about the how or why... lets just assume that EVERY mandela effect is true and that these "false" memories were not only true for the person who remembers but were also true for the people that don't.

I'm not saying that this is actually the case, just a thought experiment... so is it possible that using the logic of how these effects can be explained or debunked or whatever (and simply doing the reverse of Occams razor) that everyone HAD these memories and that most people just can't remember. They see the new way and their brain just washes over it and they adopt the new way after seeing a diagram or whatever to help make sense of their reality. Because our brains would have a really hard time accepting the idea that reality had in fact changed, maybe people just adopt the new "correct" and it takes over their own memories and they think they always remembered it that way. Again, not saying that is the case nor do I think it is... just the opposite extreme (reverse Occams) of the argument from "skeptics."

I know this is a big assumption... because its impossible lol... but assuming (pretending) reality has in fact changed is what I am saying possible?

a reply to: TombEscaper

Maybe this has something to do with what Astr0 said about dreams n such.... i dunno, just a shot in the dark!

Forgive me for not checking all 197 pages to see if it has been mentioned yet
but this one is pretty neat. You would assume Hallmark would get the quote from the movie right.

originally posted by: Agartha

Pacemakers can be inserted on either side actually. I don't work in cardiology and I also used to assume all pacemakers were on the left, until I met a patient who had it on the right. The cardiology consultant on duty explained that the left side is usually preferred as it's closer to the heart (not because the heart was ever on the left but because the heart is in the centre but slightly offset to the left, as it's always been).

Actually that doesn't really make sense. The wires go through the left subclavian vein and into vena cava and the RIGHT atrium. So while the heart in this reality may be slightly offset left, the actual right atrium to which the electrodes attach at the SA node is on the right side, as is the superior vena cava. So if it is based on proximity the usually preferred pacemaker location should be on the right side.

a reply to: Jeroenske

Already been discussed. Merchandise says it regularly as the clip is out of context. Merchandise is what caused the Mandela effect.

originally posted by: rothanwalker
Actually that doesn't really make sense. The wires go through the left subclavian vein and into vena cava and the RIGHT atrium. So while the heart in this reality may be slightly offset left, the actual right atrium to which the electrodes attach at the SA node is on the right side, as is the superior vena cava. So if it is based on proximity the usually preferred pacemaker location should be on the right side.

What I said is confirmed with the British Heart Foundation, page 23/24. You need to download the leaflet, you can do so HERE , it's the one on the bottom left called Pacemakers.

I know the left subclavian is preferred for central venous cannulation with catheters (for dialysis for example) as it carries less risk of twisting or curling of the sheaths (that protects the catheters or the pacemaker cables). I think this is also one of the reasons they prefer the left side (I can ask our cardiology department when I'm back on day shifts if you want). If you are interested here is a good article that explains well: - LINK-

i posted this on another thread.
but i always typed in

getAhuman .com

but it has been changed to

getHuman .com

gethuman? getAhuman is logical.
no one says, 'get human'
you say, 'get a human'

thats the one i discovered lol.

a reply to: Agartha

Thanks for those links, Agartha! I see where that leaflet says that the left side is more favorable based on proximity to the heart, but just looking at the diagrams that logic doesn't quite make sense to me as the leads feed into the vena cave and into the right atrium, which would make the right side actually closer to that location.

I did find in that second article about the catheters something that might provide an answer:

From the right internal jugular and left subclavian approaches, the veins respectively take straight and gently curving trajectories to the superior vena cava (Figure 2). However, the right subclavian vein takes a near-right angle turn into the superior vena cava (Figure 3), and the left internal jugular approach incorporates two turns, one into the brachiocephalic vein and a second into the superior vena cava (Figure 2).

So the right side has a near right angle turn vs the left side being a more smooth turn. That could be the answer, though this reference was specifically about stiff, wide-bore dilators which could cause injury by puncturing blood vessels. I wouldn't think the same risk of damage would be present with the leads for a pacemaker, but the easier navigation via the more gentle curve could still be a "tie-breaker" type of reason I suppose.

In the pacemaker leaflet I did see the alternate, less common epicardial implantation. This is how it was done regularly in my memory. That was the usual. The current pacemaker location for the transvenous / endocardial implantation is just above where I remember the heart being, so that same location was used only instead of running through the subclavian it just connects directly to the tissue on the outside of the heart. This method was much less invasive with the different location of the heart than it is now, which I suppose is why the method that is, in my memory, the "usual" is now only used if the patient is already having surgery.

Thanks again for the links! Very useful.

This is a new ME for me, but not in the sense that something changed but rather an event now no longer exists in history. Does anyone else remember a relatively recent apparition of the Virgin Mary that was spotted on a touristy scenic walkway somewhere in Europe? I think it was around 2010 or 2011. It really did look like what people often imagine as Mary, with her head down and hands together in prayer, regular person-sized too. I think it might have been an optical illusion due to mist and lighting, but I remember there were a few good videos taken of the apparition by the media and bystanders. 'She' appeared to be standing right in front of the walkway banister, semi-transparent, ghostly.

I've done some Googling and looked on LiveLeak etc. for any reports on the event or videos, but I've found nothing that matches my memory. Some recent apparitions but they're all quite different to the incident that I remember.

originally posted by: rothanwalker
a reply to: Lisarenee

Didn't have time to read through the whole thread... looks like mostly flames anyways haha but I wanted to post... just discovered this three days ago and I need some company!

The initial thing for me was Berenstein... I just thought yeah that's not right and started checking out the others. I was aout 95% on Berenstein... some/most of the off movie quotes and misspellings rang true to me but I wasn't sure... could just be a mistake... but Chick-fil-A when I saw that I was 100%.

We go there every week on Tues with the kids (who eat free on Tues)... almost every week texted either my brother or cousin or both who often join us and autocomplete ALWAYS filled it as "Chic-fil-A". Remember it VERY clearly- vivid- plain as day. So when I saw chick-fil-A I was like whaaaaaat? the red cursive writing looks totally wrong like I've never seen it before. Went to type it in for autocomplete... "chick-fil-A." Well they must've change autocomplete... surely my old texts will say chic-fil-A. Nope. So I dug deeper...

I was born in 1986, so many of them I don't remember. But the JFK footage is totally different for me. It was in black and white (now in technicolor), it was a regular 4 person light colored convertible (rather than a 6 person black limousine convertible with a glass partition between the driver and the passengers like it is now)... different angle, different things even happen with how he got shot but I was never THAT into JFK stuff so I can't 100% recall everything. But even the conspiracy theories now are different even if they have the same name (magic bullet/one bullet theory are now very different even though they have the same name... weird).

Village people having 6 (solider guy was never in it). And then I stumbled onto something that broke me...

Human anatomy. I graduated in 2008 with a Natural Sciences / Biology degree. Pretty familiar with human anatomy... dissected cadavers, etc. and when I saw the diagram at first I just started laughing because everything was so different and off and foreign to what I remembered. Heart was always on the left and higher (now in the CENTER and lower?!), kidney's were always on the lower back just above the pelvic bones basically and now they are way up protected by the rib cage... so how is a kidney shot even a thing now? Lungs are way too high and a weird shape when they used to be oval shaped. stomach is higher and a little off to the left than it used to be. Intestines... too jumbled and messy and takes up WAY more room. Liver is HUGE.

Then the skeleton... I am not 100% on the ribcage... but it looks strange. The scapulae (shoulder blades) are wayyyy wrong. They are so small and much more to the outside of the rib cage... and I remember them being much larger and as a result came closer together. Then I thought about my own personal experiences with this anatomy... I could remember very recently being able to bring my shoulder blades together and "grab" my fingers at my spine... can't do that anymore. I can also remember recently rubbing my wife's back and her rubbing mine trying to get an knot out that was just off of my and her spine right near the shoulder blade... I can remember rubbing along the shoulder blade and almost kind of under it trying to massage out the knot.. same with her massaging me. That wouldn't be possible with where my shoulder blades are now. So now I was starting to kind of freak out because I realized that my body had changed from what I remembered... not just some diagram that I looked at, or an event that I knew, or a misspelling or misquote or whatever... my actually body was not my body now...

Then I thought to check my heart as one of the organs I could check as I could feel the heartbeat. But my hand above my left nipple where I could always feel my heartbeat... I could even SEE my heartbeat very clearly. It always used to move my pectoral muscle very visibly even while I was at rest... to the point where I wondered if my heart was situated differently or larger than most. I can remember pointing it out to people saying look at my heart beating moving my chest like that. VERY vivid memories of these experiences. And now I can't feel it there, can't see it there. Now I have to put my hand down on the tip of my sternum slightly to the left right at the bottom edge of my pecs to feel my heartbeat. When I lie on my belly now which used to be a fairly common way that I slept my heartbeat now bothers me because I feel it in my belly. I don't know when these changes happened but my body (at least for sure my shoulder blades and my heart location) is very different than it used to be with 100% certainty...

So on my way home from work after seeing that and feeling around to figure stuff out... couldn't help but to cry. And couldn't keep it together when I tried to talk to my wife - shes trying to understand... she seems to be remembering a lot of things like me but doesn't quite get the certainty I have so she kinda thinks I'm a little crazy. I'm trying to find a 100% for her so she can get it. I think I may have found one with I love Lucy (I've seen no "'Lucy you got some splainin to do" and no big ricky ricardo laugh anymore) but need to go through some episodes to see.

One last note... I thought I might have a "gotcha" type moment with pacemakers... Because pacemakers are up on the left where the heart used to be, right? But now the pacemaker is still in the same spot but the wires go through a vein for a pretty long way to get into the right atrium/ventricle... I am not 100% sure on how pacemakers worked not even close to a pacemaker expert... I know they went to the sinoatrial node to trigger the heartbeat... I'm thinking maybe just the wires going through the vein so far makes it look very off to me but I would love to hear from anyone who has more experience with pacemakers who remembers it differently (and maybe the pacemaker thing isn't an effect in itself just the wires to get from the old location to where the heart actually is in this reality make it look off).

Anyways that's my experience after first seeing this three days ago. Glad that I am not alone as this would be very very scary to be alone with memories that you are sure about and no one is with you.

Hi, will have to respond more in depth when at computer and not on phone BUT thank you. Because the JFK thing was brought to my attention. I goggled, saw the pictures and I was STUNNED. I was born in 67. So this was the conspiracy I grew up with. I distinctly remember the film footage as black and white but I mostly recall it as a WHITE convertible that had the driver, a secret service guy in the front and the president with his wife in the back.

Also I am a nurse and some of the anatomy is off, but I attribute it to the fact that we can do colored ultrasound now that may show a difference in anatomy when we are alive vs autopsy which is how various medical artist depicted their work from. IDK. This is a new area of me to me, I'd have to see exactly what people are saying about it before I could confirm or deny.

originally posted by: Lisarenee
This is a new area of me to me, I'd have to see exactly what people are saying about it before I could confirm or deny.

Do yourself a favor and try to recall how you remember things before reading about how others remember it if you can, that way you won't get led to something that isn't really a memory for you. At least that's how I try do it. I see a general topic and I look it up on my own without reading anything about ME and see if there are any differences for me and write them down. THEN I'll read about the ME.

Seems that almost everyone I talk to has a different version of JFK and about half have different memories of anatomy, but they aren't as certain on anatomy usually. One thing I have learned is that most people are much less attentive to detail than I haha.

a reply to: Lisarenee

You remember a presidential Lincoln that was white? Are you sure you aren't confusing dukes of hazard? Boss Hogg drove a white convertible and his brothers name was Abraham Lincoln Hogg.

audio evidence

In the video he shows the Mama's and the papas lyric changes as he plays it back.

This should blow your mind.

a reply to: anotherside

It doesn't. Excellent job using an obviously high millennial on YouTube as your scientific source...

None of this stuff rings true with me I just think it's peoples memories. It's like all the flat Earth crap recently... People will buy into anything.

originally posted by: raymundoko
a reply to: anotherside

It doesn't. Excellent job using an obviously high millennial on YouTube as your scientific source...

OK, whatever. There's nothing wrong with being high or a millennial. And I think it shows that possibly a technology could be the culprit behind all these changes, possibly even mass scale collusion to create mass confusion. But that's why I'm here. It is a conspiracy site, and btw, I despise ignorance and fascism.