E-cigarettes around 95% less harmful than tobacco estimates landmark review

originally posted by: and14263
a reply to: BanTv

Nothing against nicotine. Nothing against stimulants.

Lots against media and government driven bandwagons and propaganda.

I find it hard to digest when I see humans blindly jumping on a bandwagon and using the answers the addiction has provided for them to make it ok.

I find it hard to digest humans making poor decisions but the media propaganda and their addiction makes them believe it's ok.

On this subject I'm not a hypocrite - I'd never put an ecig in my mouth and I am better than most on here as I don't need a substitute to quit smoking

Or in many cases on here - an excuse to carry on inhaling.

I don't think my comments are nasty - I honestly see a correlation between stupidity and vaping. Also a correlation between weak will power and vaping.

So basically you think everyone else is stupid because they're not irrationally paranoid and suspicious of everything around them, even when all evidence available leads to a specific conclusion?

Right, gotcha.

The basic premise here is "I'm so paranoid I think absolutely everything is a sinister plot, and if you don't agree then you're stupid".

originally posted by: Domo1
a reply to: and14263

And there are many people out there that had a stronger will than you and never started. You're making an ass of yourself. You're ridiculing people that are having a hard time with smoking cessation to boost your inflated ego.

Not to boost my ego - I already know I'm ahead of the curve compared to most members on here.

You've got to be cruel to be kind - The more times people hear "It's hard to stop smoking, use a substitute..." the more they will believe it is hard to stop.

It's terrible that so many people have jumped on this brand new bandwagon, this new method which does have serious problems attached to it ( I'll do a thread when I get time), without questioning, without looking deeper and using their brains. And that is explained through the addiction making the decisions for them.

There are some pathetics who actually say stopping smoking is harder than stopping heroin. God help this world of wet wimps who jump on bandwagons and trust the propaganda they are fed.

Who do you think is paying for all this positive research?

Phillip MOrris perhaps?

a reply to: and14263

But it is stupid reasoning to believe Ecigs are the next best thing to sliced bread.

Not if that belief is based on the evidence available , e-cigs became popular just a few years ago but they date back to the late 70s , studies have been conducted on the ingredients for years as they've been used in many products that are either inhaled or ingested.

It is naive to accuse people of stupidity when they know more about the subject than you do.

Ok do half of the people really believe vaping isn't safe? If so people are dumb as a rock. It's as stupid as the DJ's that said their towns water was contaminated with dihydrogen monoxide and causing ill educated people from starting a city wide panic. Water plus pure nicotine is obviously safer than the hundred plus chemicals added to cigarettes. I swear people are taking crazy pills that block out common sense. I thought simple science was common knowledge.

originally posted by: daskakik

originally posted by: OpinionatedB
I think the key is getting totally away from the cigarettes long enough that you get your taste buds back in the first place.. then you really know how good vaping tastes in comparison.

I disagree. Flavors don't make up for the lack of "buzz" that keeps me sneaking analogs.

I just saw your reply to me I apologize.. missed it somehow.

So okay, I know what you are talking about. You will still go through withdrawals when you first start vaping.. it does NOT make the withdrawals simply disappear, but they HELP you get through them. You still have to want the change for yourself though.

I found I couldn't have analogs near me at all. Not in the house not anywhere .. even hubby had to stop smoking cigarettes and chew for a week so that temptation wasn't there for me.. And in the very beginning I vaped more often to help get me through. It took about 3 days to 5 days to get through the withdrawal aspect where I wanted an analog. I had to keep the e-cig near me and vape when I needed to as I felt the urge to light up. That was the first day.

I went from that, to using the e-cig the same as a cigarette.. I started going outside when I wanted to smoke, and used it in exactly the same manner as I smoked.. and then after a couple days, I stopped wanting the analog and having one in the house was no longer the same temptation. (ie: I could have them around again and still not light up) After about two weeks, I no longer felt a temptation to light up an analog at all..

For me, it seemed to help to keep the habits exactly the same as the habits of an analog. That of going outside ect.

Everyone is different, but cigarettes are addictive for a lot more reasons than nicotine (although it helps to tell yourself that you are replacing an addictive quality probably) and vaping doesn't give you most of the chemicals which are addictive about cigarettes.

What they do is keep long term habits satisfied, going out and taking a few puffs, inhaling and exhaling 'smoke', and they give you nicotine... but it doesn't replace some god only knows how many additives that are in cigarettes that you are addicted to as well..

But that is how I quit... everyone will have their own way that works best for them, that was what worked best for me. keep all your habits the same as with the analogs, and keep analogs away for a time if possible. Your time table wont be the same as mine as you are not me, so however long it takes you at any given stage is fine, its a process.

But most of all, want it for yourself.

If you are a Marlboro smoker, the withdrawals will be worse. There is something about Marlboro (I don't know what it is, just know its there)... but you know that if you ever tried to switch brands even.. I was a Marlboro smoker but I had switched brands prior to vaping.. and switching brands for me was hard.

a reply to: gortex

Like I always say Gortex - keep trusting the evidence provided to you. After all - we can of course trust those who provide the evidence when it suits our needs.

A research group from the EU Joint Research Centre just published an extensive chamber stuyd analysis of e-cigarette aerosol from several brands that adds to the evidence that e-cigarettes are a substantial source of exposure to nicotine, ultrafine particles, and other chemicals. While the results are similar to earlier work, it adds to the evidence base, particularly that e-cigarette particles are very small.

What happens when small particles enter our bodies?

Additional additives, such as coumarin and acetamide, that raise concerns for human health were detected in certain samples. Ten out of 28 products had been declared “free-of-nicotine” by the manufacturer. Among these ten, seven liquids were identified containing nicotine in the range of 0.1–15 µg/ml. This suggests that “carry over” of ingredients may occur during the production of cartridges.

Source

Other studies have focused on safety and quality aspects of refill liquids. They reported inconsistent levels of nicotine (Goniewicz et al., 2013) and nicotine impurities (Trehy et al., 2011, Etter et al., 2013 and Hutzler et al., 2014) among batches/brands. Williams et al. (2013) described the possibility of metals, or chemicals from plastics in the delivery system, leaching into the vapour before inhalation. Behar et al. (2014) identified toxicants in cinnamon-flavoured e-cigarette refill liquids.

Source

Conclusions: Vapors from EC contain toxic and carcinogenic carbonyl compounds. Both solvent and battery output voltage significantly affect levels of carbonyl compounds in EC vapors. High-voltage EC may expose users to high levels of carbonyl compounds.

Source

a reply to: and14263

This study is unlike any other study done so far but it is very interesting to say the least. This is an Italian study done on 300 participants who did not want to quit smoking and who did not want to take part in a smoking cessation program, but who agreed to follow the study protocol.

Out of those 300 (don't even want to quit) people, 57 quit smoking with electronic cigarettes. Out of those 57 people, after one year 41 people did not use the electronic cigarette anymore. They were completely done with all of it.

This to my knowledge is the only study ever done on people who didn't even want to quit. In studies with people who wanted to quit, the quit rates are much higher. Even in this study, many participants reported a reduction in the amount of cigarettes they smoked.

Side effects ranged from minimal to non-existent. Link to Study

This is about harm reduction, everyone knows nothing is better, but if you eat a Twinkie or any processed foods, or drink alcohol, or drive a car, or talk on a cell phone in a storm, or are exposed to the lead in a battery.. you are taking risks to your health.. we are exposed in this day and age to more carcinogens than any other generation, more things can kill us than ever before as we now have cars and planes, chemicals etc that other generations were never exposed to on a daily basis.

I am just fine taking my chances with something proven to be much much less harmful than the one thing I could not quit on my own nor with the help of any drug or patch. Is that a defect in me somehow? Maybe, but it is what it is and I am what I am and at least I am not ashamed of it nor am I willing to hide it from anyone.. facing that honestly is the one thing I can do to help myself get over that hurdle - and finally quit.

I recommend it to others, and it was my Doctor who recommended that I try it.

a reply to: Domo1

Embrace your vapes everyone!

Now you can sit astride your high horse and look down upon the smokers, because vaping is the new smoking.

That's right-we know what you are-you vape, you love Ed Sherran and you love a five pound coffee-because that's what cool kids do nowadays.

Either smoke or you don't. Don't pretend to be both. I'm cake.

a reply to: and14263

You know what, I'm going to take my own advice and humble myself instead of getting offended.

You are absolutely right, you are a god among men. Most people can't quit cold turkey but you did. You are special. I wish my father could have been as cool as you, instead of dying from a heart attack at 40.

At the end of the day, you are no one and your opinion means nothing. I did what I had to, in order to stick around for my son. Looks like the moron here is you, because there is nothing wrong with a bit of nicotine. Nicotine is not what causes smoking related illnesses. Oh and you think the gov and media and pushing propaganda for people TO VAPE? Do you live in a cave? Everything from their mouth says how ecigs are even worse than smoking. If everyone easily quit smoking (lol weak weak weak) then that's billions the gov doesn't get, big pharma doesn't get, etc. You are very misinformed. You have no idea what you're talking about.

Congrats on quitting though my lord.

a reply to: and14263

Ecigs can eliminate smoking related deaths. How is that not a public health MIRACLE? I'll say again too, who cares what you think. We are doing what we have to do for our health. I'm trying to live longer for my young son. When the solution is 'quit or die', most smokers die. You know, because it's an extremely addictive habit that rewires your brain and puts having a smoke on par with needing to eat. So you think it would be better that all the "weak" addicted folks just die huh? You're really special.

Anyways I'm done with you for now. You're just butthurt you did it the hard way. Sounds like you need some nicotine, because you're a miserable human being. Oh but you're really smart, you knew that quitting smoking lowers your dopamine levels.

a reply to: and14263

Yeah make sure you waste your time posting useless studies that we can debunk. You think big tobacco has anything to do with this? Big tobacco HATES us. They had nothing to do with the vaping industry until they bought blu because they realized 'if we can't beat them join them, and then try to take over the market'. Big pharma and big tobacco spent years trying to get ecigs banned. You have no idea what you're talking about so you really shouldn't have an opinion.

a reply to: BanTv

Don't get angry, it's unhealthy and causes you to elevate my status to Godlike status - even though we're only referring to quitting smoking.

Well done for putting that bit about your old man in there though, that really taught me a lesson.

Oh and whilst in my cave I spotted this:

Gov. funded report on prescribing Ecigs through NHS.


And I also saw this in my cave too:

Make Ecigarettes available on the NHS say Government health officials

OK - so from here in my cave do I need to explain to you how the government can make billions off this new miracle cure for cigarette addicts?

a reply to: Thecakeisalie
No one is looking down on smokers, friend.

Also, smoking is just one delivery method for nicotine. You're right though, there is smoking and there's not smoking. We aren't smoking.

a reply to: Thecakeisalie

They have big beards and waxed mustaches too. Hip though innit.

(Sorry, couldn't resist).

a reply to: Thecakeisalie

Embrace your vapes everyone!
Now you can sit astride your high horse and look down upon the smokers, because vaping is the new smoking.

Cool , embrace your ignorance cake.

a reply to: OpinionatedB

I am just fine taking my chances with something proven to be much much less harmful than the one thing I could not quit on my own nor with the help of any drug or patch. Is that a defect in me somehow?

No, no defect whatsoever - and the study is really good. (ETA: It could easily be picked apart - as all studies).

But can you see that when you say something is 'proven' it actually isn't 'proven'.... that's your mind making you think it is.

You are correct 100% - You are taking chances.

a reply to: and14263

PG inhalation has been studied for 50+ years
VG is known to be safe
Nicotine is a stimulant on par with caffeine

Literally the only unknown with ecigs is some of the flavorings. I'm sure you knew that though, since you know what you're talking about.

Who's a sucker here and falling for media propaganda? "We don't even know what's in them!!!" Lol we do though.

And yes, they are PROVEN to be safer than smoking.
list of studies

a reply to: BanTv

Haha - classic internet anger! Love it.

You assume Ecigs make you live longer. Assumption.

You assume tabacco companies (one of the richest groups of countries in the universe) are not in on the game? Come back in a year when the tabacco companies have the monopoly and they're (once again) helping governments earn billions from hipsters and easily led bandwagon jumpers through taxes, import duties etc

Seriously, calm down, I'm not worth it.

a reply to: BanTv

OK, lap it up. That's what they want.

Watch the insults though brother, you'll get banned.

Have a good weekend friend. xxxx