Does Anyone Actually hate Christians??

originally posted by: smurfy
I hate rhetoric more than anything else, and we know who uses rhetoric more than any other, and from there all else stems, when 'duty' calls. Truth is always the first casualty, you can often know a thief, you can't always know a liar, those who are both use rhetoric.

If you hate rhetoric, why do you use it?

RHETORIC
the art of effective or persuasive speaking or writing, especially the use of figures of speech and other compositional techniques.
synonyms: oratory, eloquence, command of language, way with words
"a form of rhetoric"

language designed to have a persuasive or impressive effect


If you are on ATS you use rhetoric.

Clarify please, and how it relates to the OP

a reply to: grandmakdw

Are you kidding me?

en.wikipedia.org...

Hell, Alabama even named their amendment "Sanctity of Marriage Amendment". If that doesn't prove it was a law trying to force Christianity on its population, I don't know what would.

originally posted by: NthOther

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

You can pretend like you are fighting for the underdogs all you want here, but the facts are that Christians are the most numerous religion in the world. Plus they have been running the 1st world for the better part of a millennium. They aren't underdogs by any stretch of the imagination.

Who said anything about "fighting for the underdog"? I'm not defending Christendom at all. I'm simply pointing out that even the most visceral attackers of it, indeed especially those, will never admit to anyone (probably least of all themselves) that many of their actions are motivated by hate (or some variation of it--spite, conceit, etc.).

My actions are motivated for discussion. Christianity is something I happen to be knowledgeable about because I was raised Catholic. My entire presence here is for fun. I don't take much of any of these discussions seriously since none will go on to effect the greater world. I get some interesting news here, but for the most part I just use this site to increase my debate ability.

Their actions betray them but, for one reason or another, they will not even entertain the idea that these actions arise from the cultivation of negative emotions. Hence, the OP is looking for people who refuse to explicitly reveal themselves. Makes me wonder what the point really was, other than to open a forum for self-vindication of the non-believer.

I've said before on these forums and I'll say it again here. I despise the Christian religion. I think it is one of the most awful institutions to ever grace humanity. I also feel the same for the other Abrahamic religions, but I do not know as much about them. I plan on learning though since I've had requests from Muslims on these boards to debate their religion.

That being said. I don't dislike anyone who actually worships the religions as long as they leave me alone for my beliefs. I can't control your beliefs and I won't think less of you for them. I got over that phase back in high school. I won't hold back any punches if I think your beliefs are dumb though.

What, because I don't piss all over every religious thing I see makes me a Crusader for Christ? Are we supposed to hate Christians because now they're in the majority and it's cool to be a rebel or something?

No I never meant that at all. My point is that Christians PRETEND they are being persecuted on the regular. They whine and complain because people question their faith all the time and try to get others (like you) to sympathize with them. The only Christians that deserve to complain about persecution are the ones suffering in the Middle East. Any Christian in the west has no right to complain about persecution, because they aren't being persecuted against to really matter. Sure a few lone people may hate them indiscriminately, but that is a small number. Most just want religious equality and for Christians to cede over all the institutionalized Christianity in the government (which again Christians take as persecution against them).

Anyway, as I alluded to earlier, just because people say they're Christians doesn't mean jack squat. My alcoholic, kleptomaniac neighbor who cheats on his wife and hasn't been to church in twenty years calls himself a Christian.

Are those numbers inflated? You tell me. But we digress...

If the person says they are Christian, then I believe them. The collection of beliefs in Christianity are so up for debate that to me as long as you say you are a Christian then that's good enough. All you have to do is ask for forgiveness for your sins right?

a reply to: kaylaluv
Did you know that ALL laws in this country are based on the Laws given to Moses ? Bet you didn't . (and no , not necessarily the 10 Commandments) . The Laws were to guide in the governance of Israel.

originally posted by: Irishhaf
a reply to: gottaknow

Where in the deep south were you looking, I'm curious because as a Catholic (not practicing) married to a pagan, that has lived in Florida, Louisiana, and oklahoma we have never been shunned for not going to church, or for our belifs.

Heck living in germany right now we have a couple old ladies from jehova's witness that come by on a regular basis to talk. They know we aren't converting but it's a cup of tea, they can practice English we can practice German. (by the way this part of germany would fit in easily in oklahoma)

My thoughts were more along the Southern Missouri through like Tennessee, Alabama (Mississippi is right out) areas. The thumpers.
And I know Southern people can be very hospitable and kind as well. I lived in S.C. for a time and while I met some very kind people, I did get to see some shockingly close-minded ideas regarding religion and race. There's just a lot I've seen/read/noticed about people in those areas that indicates how over-the-top they can be when it comes to that topic. There are plenty up North here as well. But, I'm sorry to say, I remain a little terrified of the entire communities steeped in the cult that act out due to the common peer opinion down there.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t



Yes. I am constantly told that I hate Christians for questioning their beliefs. I don't get told I hate ghost hunters and mediums though when I question ghosts or that I hate ufologists when I question UFO sightings.

That being the case, I just goes to show the real differences in our cultures. I question Christian beliefs all the time with Christians, and it's always up for debate, and that includes the clergy. If your lot only show intolerance, then they ain't proper Christians, more like the Bible thumping type.

originally posted by: DeadSeraph
You people are hilarious. Replace "Christians" with any other group, and see how ridiculous you sound.

"I don't HATE gay people, I just don't think they should be allowed to be gay."

"I don't HATE black people, I just think they shouldn't be allowed to vote."

Replace Christian with any other demographic, and see what your statements sound like. Does it seem like you would be a bigot? Guess what: You are.

Edit to add:

The further you are willing to go to deny someone else their rights because you don't agree with them, the more of a hypocrite you are. I've seen people suggest that Christians should have their children taken away from them by the government on this very forum. I've also seen it suggested that Christians should be exterminated, because the world would be a better place without them. If that isn't hate, what is?

true that, after what I read through the years, there is great hatred for Christians on this forum, by some.

a reply to: smurfy

Bible thumpers should be debated too though. How else can we educate people to stop being so stupidly fundamental if we don't expose them to better education? The problem with fundamentalists is that they isolate themselves in a religious bubble. They only deal with other fundamentalists, send their kids to fundamentalist schools, they live in fundamentalist communities etc. It is just a bubble of unreality and really leaves any kid wanting to leave that bubble with a HUGE disadvantage when entering the real world.

Some people certainly hate Christians. I'd say most atheists are "meh whatever", but many of us hate Christians with a fanaticism that is just as bad as some Christians hate them. I guess every group has its jerks. IMHO the vast majority of people just want to do their thing and be left alone.

a reply to: gottaknow

I would experience it before judging it, my wife was raised in back woods heavily Christian Arkansas... And grew up a pagan.

We have been offered some land in that area, took just a couple visits and folks realized we were good people.

The most close minded people (and I include some of my family in Pennsylvania) I've encountered are from the north.. Soon as they hear southern twang in my voice how people act with me changes in a bad way.

Yet I won't pass judgement on the entire north because of a few bad experiences.

Though lots of folks here like to pass judgement on Christians, I've seen the right part of religion to many times after tornadoes mostly.

Churches using connections to get needed goods to the disaster areas a good week ahead of fema.

Sorry wandered off on a tangent, even though so many horror stories have been written about the bible belt, most of it is over blown nonsense.

Stupid stuff still happens in the name of religion but not nearly as bad as some like to try and paint it.

originally posted by: here4this
a reply to: kaylaluv
Did you know that ALL laws in this country are based on the Laws given to Moses ? Bet you didn't . (and no , not necessarily the 10 Commandments) . The Laws were to guide in the governance of Israel.

Did you know that this is completely untrue? For one, the Ten Commandments are just a rehash of the Code of Hammurabi. For two, the laws in this country are based on Roman rule. For three, have you READ the laws of Israel outside the Ten Commandments? Things like stoning adulterers, stoning disobedient children, gender inequality, slavery, can't eat pork etc. Last I checked, none of those things are laws in this country.

The only similarity between US law and Biblical law is that fact that they are both sets of laws and some of the laws may be similar.

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: Entreri06

So I was wondering how many people on here actually hate Christians??? And how many don't?

I don't hate them. I think they are dangerous, they have always been dangerous.

Anyone that believes God is "on their side" is capable of anything.

What evidence do you have that within the last 10 years that Christians have been dangerous in the US?

I;m not talking about something that happened more than 100 years ago, that no longer represents who Christians have become. I am talking about recently. Something concrete in the US within the past 10 years that makes you think Christians are a personal danger to you personally or to your family personally?
Not something you heard about that could be mythical, but a real concrete, personal danger to you and or your family coming from Christians you personally know and interact with regularly?

originally posted by: here4this
a reply to: kaylaluv
Did you know that ALL laws in this country are based on the Laws given to Moses ? Bet you didn't . (and no , not necessarily the 10 Commandments) . The Laws were to guide in the governance of Israel.

But you can apply logic to many of those laws. Discount the whole "burning in hell for sinning" meme, and you could logically see how chaos would reign if people were murdering everyone right and left, and stealing from everyone. Any society needs a certain amount of order to contain the chaos - even a society of atheists.

And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake:

Of course many hate Christians,

"The world's most ancient Christian communities are being destroyed — and no one cares."

And when, not if, when it starts happening here, you will not care.

I would be ashamed to trash people who are being hung raped stoned and crucified throughout the ME

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Please read the entire post...did I not say not necessarily the Ten Commandments? Do you know that the very thing you stated backed me up ? There is more to it than that . There is guidance in law suits and what to do in case of damages to property and possessions ? The first thing you used to learn when entering law school in this country was the very fact of what I stated.

a reply to: Stormdancer777

Ah yes. When in doubt fall back on the bible to substantiate your persecution complex.

"See! The bible says that people will hate us! It must be true!"

a reply to: grandmakdw

but someone in your actual circle who has spoken to you that
is a Christian
that quite clearly said you are not Christian enough or you are no good because you aren't a Christian?

You can't be serious?

One person that gave me a serious (and ongoing) amount of grief for not being baptized

Another that stole and destroyed several pieces of my 'satanic' artwork. Also - repeatedly told me I was going to hell

Several that decided we can't be friends, because - well - you know how it is. Part of the you know how it is was them proselytizing and me not coming around. Apparently you can't be friends with people who aren't saved

Several people who did a bit of suggesting here and there that my mother was not really a nice person because she was divorced

A man that denied his own brother's possible future happiness an essentially closed him out of his life because he was gay

A man that couldn't have a real relationship with me unless I accepted Christ. He was, however - perfectly capable of having a not real relationship with me - you know - on the down low. Like Jesus wouldn't know...

Here's the one that really brings all this home: Several Christians snuck into my fathers room while he was on his deathbed, delirious, in pain and essentially gone - trying to coax the words out of his mouth...do you accept Jesus as your lord and savior?

Or something to that effect - I walked in on them and they acted as if they'd been caught molesting a child

Do you want more?

And still I don't hate Christians - because real Christians have done none of those things. The real Christians I know are family and friends and they are Christlike

Your question is an insult to everyone's intelligence

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: grandmakdw
Do you know a Christian personally, one on one, who is trying to force you to abide by the "rules of their meme"?

I know several Christians personally who vote against marriage equality and abortion every chance they get, for religious reasons. They are trying (and succeeding) to legally force other people to behave with "Christian values". It doesn't force ME to abide by their meme (I'm not gay or of abortion age), but it most definitely affects friends and family.

How have they succeeding in legally forcing people in the US in the past 5-10 years?
Can you give me an example other than they voted, that's not succeeding.

originally posted by: grandmakdw
Has a Christian, one on one, tried to indoctrinate you personally?

Two on one. My parents. And they succeeded until I grew up and started thinking for myself. Does everything have to be a personal experience? I see Christians taking action all around me and it may not affect me directly, but eventually, I am affected. You do understand the idea of "speaking out for the oppressed", even though I may not be one of them, right?

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

originally posted by: grandmakdw
Do you have an example you care to share
of Christians successfully using political power
to deny rights
or to control others
within the past 5 years or so?

SERIOUSLY???? How about within the past month? Have you heard of the various states' Religious Freedom Restoration Acts, that allow ANY business to deny service because they think someone is gay? And States are Passing Extreme Anti-Abortion Laws.

You don't have to go far at all to find that the underlying motivation in all these laws comes from Christianity and people pushing their religion onto others.

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis
Your question is an insult to everyone intelligence

a reply to: grandmakdw

Someone isn't reading their own signature.