You Are Delusional...........

Originally posted by intrptr
reply to post by denver22

 

Caps will not save you.

How did life get here? I asked you that first. Check up top if need be.

Otherwise, I am out.

We are talking about life on another planet(S) if you cannot answer on topic regarding life away
from this planet then give up i guarentee you we have found no intelligent life as of yet

I am not sure if you are in the north pole or in an iglo or what but let me fill you in
we on mother earth have not found any intelligent life on another planet lmao..

Unless you can provide proof that we have ?..

You i or anyone cannot state it as a fact that there is life out there, all you can say is that it is
possible ....

Originally posted by BrokenAngelWings33
reply to post by denver22

 

What difference does it make if I have proof, you wouldn't believe it anyway...stick to your guns there mate, believe what you want to believe...I have proof, unfortunately you are not intelligent enough to understand it...it is a language you would not recognize...that is okay though, I forgive you.

edit on 12/25/2012 by BrokenAngelWings33 because: (no reason given)

Show me you're proof? the world is waiting for you to provide your facts that you have found
intelligent life on another planet?...

You said you have been on another planet it appears you may well be right now if
you think you have proof that you personally found life on another planet lmfao till sunday
Then you are clearly delusional not us ...

One last time do i believe there is life out there "yes of course, would i be inclined to state it
as fact not a chance .....

It's a possabilty only with what we know as of yet ..

Originally posted by BrokenAngelWings33
reply to post by denver22

 

What difference does it make if I have proof, you wouldn't believe it anyway...stick to your guns there mate, believe what you want to believe...I have proof, unfortunately you are not intelligent enough to understand it...it is a language you would not recognize...that is okay though, I forgive you.

edit on 12/25/2012 by BrokenAngelWings33 because: (no reason given)

Well if we're not intelligent enough to comprehend it, why mention it here?
Why not go before the scientific community and present your proof. I would
think it earth shattering.

Originally posted by denver22
One last time do i believe there is life out there "yes of course, would i be inclined to state it
as fact not a chance .....

It's a possabilty only with what we know as of yet ..

While I agree with some of your posts, I think your manners need a little work, not sure about other Brits but us Yanks don't call others "lady", "little woman" etc. unless you are being condescending which is what I think your goal is.
You say you use that language in England but the majority of the members on this board are Americans so you could try to make your point without being so "BLOODY" rude!

This could have been a great thread if not for the ill conceived title and premise of the OP.

It might have been fun to speculate about probability for life and intelligent life in the universe beyond earth. Lord knows there isn't a whole heck of a lot of it to go around here..

But instead all we get is a tit for tat argument based on proof or the lack thereof. Sad.

Originally posted by BrokenAngelWings33
reply to post by denver22

 

What difference does it make if I have proof, you wouldn't believe it anyway...stick to your guns there mate, believe what you want to believe...I have proof, unfortunately you are not intelligent enough to understand it...it is a language you would not recognize...that is okay though, I forgive you.

edit on 12/25/2012 by BrokenAngelWings33 because: (no reason given)

That's the wrong attitude. This isn't the Skunk Works forum, where evidence and sources are not required when making claims.

The majority of the people on here agree that life out there is almost certain.

But that is not good enough for you. You want everyone to admit it as a fact, and ignore the scientific method.

Asking people to believe in something as fact without proof is called "faith".

But now you are claiming you have that "proof" but are unwilling to share it with us.

That just made your credibility drop to zero with that statement up there.

I do personally believe that life exists elsewhere in our universe. But I will not say that it's 100% fact. I can't. Because until actual proof is shown, it will remain a theory only.

Yes, just as how life started here on our planet. If anyone bothers to look, no one out there calls how it happened "fact". Instead we have theories as to how it happened, including the "transplant" theory that life came here from off our planet. They are all good theories, but that is what they are, theories. Most scientist in that field admit just fine that it they are not facts.

reply to post by jra


Thank you!

Will do

Originally posted by wulff

Originally posted by denver22
One last time do i believe there is life out there "yes of course, would i be inclined to state it
as fact not a chance .....

It's a possabilty only with what we know as of yet ..

While I agree with some of your posts, I think your manners need a little work, not sure about other Brits but us Yanks don't call others "lady", "little woman" etc. unless you are being condescending which is what I think your goal is.
You say you use that language in England but the majority of the members on this board are Americans so you could try to make your point without being so "BLOODY" rude!

Mate it is not rude go ask the mods that come from say london or the south of england or have
been there they will tell you that it is not rude.You say lady in american terms you percive it
as rude not in england...

Haven't you seen or heard our meanings and sayings apparently not in england..
when we say love or darlin it is a compliment in this country just go and ask a mod you
have birmingham,manchester,london,west country,liverpoo,yorkshire,scottish,irish,welsh
basically every city they 'talk differently' there is no other place on 'earth' like the uk..


Example: one goes in the shop we say allright love 20 cigarettes please to a the lady That's
good manners and you're american women love it too...

However it seems it's not so for some of you guys, well im not from the usa and you are not
from here so to call me rude is judgmental on you're part sir.I meant no offence whatsoever in fact
the opposite complete, any americans or british who have ever heard someone from the
south of england or been there will completely understand that i were being polite with the love,
little lady remark etc.Watch lock stock and to smoking barrels or snatch you will get me.

Back on topic I am glad you agree with some of my posts im gratefull sir, truth is we
do need proof in order to claim something as a fact i believe there is life but i will not state it
as fact untill the facts are in my your hands...

P.S hope you had a good chrismas mate ...

Of course there is other life out there. I am not sure there are many left on this planet who still feel we are the only rock out there with life on it.

And of course, while it's not a "fact" yet.. it hasn't been officially proven.. yes, it's a fact. Yes, there is life. Argue semantics if you like, but yes, there is life. It would be akin to standing on a shoreline amidst some tidal pools. You see life in every one. Little starfish and crabs and the odd fish or mollusk.. and then you look at the huge ocean in front of you. Grey, leaden.. devoid of life.. and you say.. "there is no proof there is life in there." Looks are deceiving. Of course there is life out there.

I also think since we are relatively young in the universal scheme of things, that civilizations much, MUCH older than ours, would have solved that pesky crossing vast distances problem eons ago. So I think there is life, I think some of it is here, at least watching, if not interfering.

Fascinating question. You can throw biblical arguments into it and scientific and mathematical equations in there as well and what do you get?? One huge headache. Do I believe that we are the only "intelligent" life in the vastness of space?? Well first I guess that depends on how one defines intelligent. I think a vast majority of people fail to understand true intelligence from a relative standpoint. Yes as one poster stated we are are the only species to have put together a radio, but really that's only one form of communication in a vast array used on this planet. Look at ants who lay down chemical highways to food sources for other ants to follow. I don't see humans doing that. Look at Whale Songs that is communication that we simply do not understand. So to say we are the only intelligent forms of life on this planet and to hold that as the grail standard is simply put absurd. I would say we are one species among many intelligent species on this planet. The only real thing that separates us from the other life here is our need to spread out and destroy everything and every other life form around us. we are an arrogant species and a lot of replies in this thread makes it stick out like a sore thumb. As to the question is there other life in the universe I am going to go with a resounding YES.

Look at all the varied forms of life on this planet. Every year science is finding new never before seen species. If we are it in the universe why then do we share this planet with life that outnumbers the human species by the millions if not billions?

There is nothing special about us except for our vanity that could not be replicated across the stars. I know someone will argue about the location of the earth to the sun and the chemical make up of life here and water. Which is all vary much needed for the particular makeup of life on this planet.

However, who's say that is the makeup of life across the stars? The only thing we are half ass certain of part of the time is our own little backyard and its a very little backyard currently.

Originally posted by denver22

Originally posted by wulff

Originally posted by denver22
One last time do i believe there is life out there "yes of course, would i be inclined to state it
as fact not a chance .....

It's a possabilty only with what we know as of yet ..

While I agree with some of your posts, I think your manners need a little work, not sure about other Brits but us Yanks don't call others "lady", "little woman" etc. unless you are being condescending which is what I think your goal is.
You say you use that language in England but the majority of the members on this board are Americans so you could try to make your point without being so "BLOODY" rude!

Mate it is not rude go ask the mods that come from say london or the south of england or have
been there they will tell you that it is not rude.You say lady in american terms you percive it
as rude not in england...

Haven't you seen or heard our meanings and sayings apparently not in england..
when we say love or darlin it is a compliment in this country just go and ask a mod you
have birmingham,manchester,london,west country,liverpoo,yorkshire,scottish,irish,welsh
basically every city they 'talk differently' there is no other place on 'earth' like the uk..


Example: one goes in the shop we say allright love 20 cigarettes please to a the lady That's
good manners and you're american women love it too...

However it seems it's not so for some of you guys, well im not from the usa and you are not
from here so to call me rude is judgmental on you're part sir.I meant no offence whatsoever in fact
the opposite complete, any americans or british who have ever heard someone from the
south of england or been there will completely understand that i were being polite with the love,
little lady remark etc.Watch lock stock and to smoking barrels or snatch you will get me.

Back on topic I am glad you agree with some of my posts im gratefull sir, truth is we
do need proof in order to claim something as a fact i believe there is life but i will not state it
as fact untill the facts are in my your hands...

P.S hope you had a good chrismas mate ...

edit on 26-12-2012 by denver22 because: Spelling and such

edit on 26-12-2012 by denver22 because: (no reason given)

Okay, no offense taken.
My take on the whole 'life out there' issue.
I would love to think, yes without a doubt there HAS to be life out there when viewing the photos of the universe. But, the skeptic in me can't say I whole-heartily believe that without a shred of doubt, as much as I would like to, I cannot.
I have seen, heard and witnessed amazing paranormal activities (ghosts?) but still refuse to accept what I have witnessed as I always need more 'proof' before I can accept it as fact.
We have had radio for over 100 years and in the broad spectrum of RF I would think we would have picked up noise from 'something' out there... sure, there have been isolated cases where they claim the signals were from some intelligent source but there are a LOT of RF signals coming from space, super nova's stars, etc. in all this why aren't we picking up interference from their cities, craft, etc.? I am a ham radio operator and I there was a 'leaky' insulator on a powerline about 2 miles from me, when my "beams" were pointing in that direction the noise made 10 meters unusable, so all I'm saying is it takes very little 'man-made' stuff to transmit RFI great distances so why aren't our radio telescopes filled with noise (other than natural noises?).
Do I think we are alone? Maybe, as I haven't had proof otherwise. Sure, UFO's are seen all the time but as a AF pilot I have to think they are from Earth.
I have to wonder why some of our Apollo pictures taken on the moon remain "classified" but maybe in the distant past there was something from Earth that traveled there and left 'something' I would NOT even be inclined to believe that but for the fact that there is no logical reason to censor some Lunar images unless Uncle Sam is hiding 'something'.
Bottom line, I have been in the scientific community all my working life and was involved with the Space Shuttles hands on and as much as I would like to believe I will, just as soon as I am given 100% undeniable proof, until then I can only look out at the stars and feel we are alone.

Does anybody know a mathematical probability for life spontaneously forming?

If so, it would help determine the entire validity of the OPs position.

If not, then it's just speculation not to be muddied or justified by the term "mathematical certainty" just because the numbers are big.

Originally posted by BrokenAngelWings33

WE ARE NOT ALONE

If anyone can look at this picture and tell me that we are alone in the vastness of infinity...you are severely delusional.

Seriously. We live on a planet that revolves with 7 other planets and one so called dwarf planet around a single star and maybe 2 (we don't know) because we might be a binary star system.

Do the math.

It has been said that our galaxy alone has over a billion stars (1,000,000,000) and there is really no way to quantify that. Lets just stick with a billion for the hell of it.

If our star has 9 planets, that means we can assume other stars have planets too, right? Lets assume that every star out of a billion has at least 3 planets. That is 3,000,000,000 planets in our galaxy.

Then it has been suggested, also, no way to quantify, that there is well over a trillion galaxies in our Universe.
1,000,000,000,000 x 3,000,000,000 = 3.e+21 is the answer my calculator just gave me.

That is a ridiculous amount of planets and this is a conservative number. Let's try the maximum for the hell of it using our solar system as the model.

1,000,000,000,000 x 9,000,000,000 = 9.e+21.

No matter how you do it lets take 1% of either total and you get somewhere in between 1,000,000,000 and 1,000,000,000,000 planets roaming around out there.

1% of them may have life of an intelligent kind...so...that would be somewhere between 1,000,000 and 1,000,000,000.

Doesn't really matter how you do the math, there is NO WAY in any way shape or form a common sense view that can tell me or any of you that we are alone in this Universe.

I am sure I screwed up the math and some scientist will come in here and correct me...that is ok...I'm not a mathematician...I simply find it ridiculous that anyone can think we are the only form of intelligent life.

BAW33

You do know that mainstream science acknowledged that there is almost certainly life out there right?

So you're not presenting anything new, alternative or controversial.

Originally posted by sconner755
Does anybody know a mathematical probability for life spontaneously forming?

If so, it would help determine the entire validity of the OPs position.

If not, then it's just speculation not to be muddied or justified by the term "mathematical certainty" just because the numbers are big.

I don't think anyone has any sort of accurate mathematical probability. We only know of it happening once, although it could have happened many places many times -- we just don't know.

So yes, I agree with you -- it is speculation even though the numbers are big.

reply to post by michael1983l


Why would religous people not believe in other life forms? I think you are more intellectually challenged than those you insult. I am religous and the Bible clearly states the following.

God created the universe
They made man in their image (yes, they)

What would make you think that the Bible limits life to just earth? Perhaps you might enlighten yourself and read it before you make such childish statements.

reply to post by BrokenAngelWings33


how do you know the odds of intelligent life arising are not "number of stars in the universe" to 1 and we are that 1?

the odds could be even bigger we might be extremely lucky to be here. What if the multiverse is true and to find another tech intelligence we would need to search another million or billion universes to find one?

if thats true it makes your statement "we are not alone" (in this universe) completely wrong. so don't go stating your imgination as fact its unscientific

Originally posted by BrokenAngelWings33
reply to post by ItDepends

 

No not beaten to death, maybe the sense has already been depleted...arrogance comes to mind. Tell me do you believe in anything without verifiable proof? 3 quadrillion galaxies? The mathematics are mind boggling...seriously anyone that doesn't believe we have other intelligent life on millions of other planets is in denial.

edit on 12/24/2012 by BrokenAngelWings33 because: Edit

Well then, miss know-it-all. Your intellectual dwarfness is only surpassed by your incredibly close-mindedness in appreciating altering point of views. You O Holy One with All the answers, go ahead, show me, or get anyone to demonstrate mathematically that intelligent life exists somewhere else other than earth!! Can't...I said CAN NOT be done. Your arrogance and denial of the facts depict just how small minded and delusional YOU ARE!!! You wanna be so ugly with your responses, then eat some of your own crow right back in your face....no wonder your wings are broken.....you ain't goin' nowhere!!!

i happen to agree you. it would be delusional to think we are the only planet with life on it. i think proof would be difficult for most to accept. i think there are those that would tell you something is black when it is gray. perception. there are those that accept stories as fact, when they are just fictional accounts. anyway nice picture. maybe a different approach like someone suggested would have gotten a better response to the question. thanks for the thread topic just the same.

Wow, this topic morphed into a very heated argument at times since I last read it, and has begun encompassing a lot more than simply, "are we alone?" I think people are debating two different things. 1) The possibility or even reality of life elsewhere, which I don't think many people doubt. And 2) the conclusion that, based on that, UFOs and abductions must therefore be the result of extraterrestrial visitation. It's the second issue that people disagree so fervently on.

In an attempt to cool the rhetoric, I want to try to share my own opinion on the latter point in a more comprehensive way than my earlier post. My opinion - and mind you, this is only an opinion - is divided between UFO phenomena and the abduction phenomenon.

In the case of UFOs, it is that there is sufficient evidence for the extraterrestrial hypothesis to be feasible. But I have yet to see compelling proof of that reality. We have to look at what we know with certainty, and what we know with certainty - even without outright proof of an ET origin - is compelling on its own.

We know that credible military and commercial pilots have made good sightings that are corroborated with radar in many instances. We know that in a significant number of those sightings, the objects seen were estimated by the pilots (and confirmed by radar) to be traveling well in excess of any aircraft publicly known about anywhere on Earth at the time of the sighting, yet much slower than the slowest meteors recorded. We know that various countries' air forces have attempted interception of these objects on numerous occasions. We know that pilots attempting to intercept or evade them have described them as following their aircraft, and appearing to be intelligently controlled. And we know that the USAF and CIA both took an extremely keen interest in UFOs, and engaged (admittedly if you read the relevant memos and other documents that we can confirm are real and not potentially fraudulent) in a public campaign of debunking sightings while at the same time carrying out their own, more intensive investigation, and stifled public knowledge thereof.

Now, while none of that proves the extraterrestrial hypothesis, it does give people room to speculate. For instance, if they are experimental terrestrial aircraft, then why have the few countries who might - speculatively - have been secretly capable of such feats at the times of the sightings in question attempted to intercept their own (or their allies') secret projects?

One might presume based on this that they were an external and unknown threat, and that this leaves only an extraterrestrial intelligence as the source. However, I would say that we need to keep compartmentalization in mind. Is it possible at all that there could have been a project so secret, with so few people knowing of it, that the USAF and other air forces wouldn't know about it, to the extent that they would attempt interception? I would say that it is conceivable, yes. Especially in the early and middle days of the Cold War. It would also explain the continued secrecy surrounding UFOs despite a clear public thirst for and ready acceptance of the phenomenon (and the possibility of the ET hypothesis, incidentally.) People are ready to hear the truth, and yet secrecy remains. Perhaps this is because it is in fact a secret terrestrial project, the exposure of which might compromise a secret advantage.

On the other hand, there is little indication of such technology ever being deployed in a military context. If it is a terrestrial project, why isn't it being used? Perhaps it only has intelligence gathering applications. Or perhaps it's one of many developmental test platforms that has yet to come to applications fruition. Or, yes, perhaps they're extraterrestrial in origin. Herein lies the problem. We reach a point where the evidence suggests several distinct possibilities, but then gives up no further secrets, and offers no certain proof of any of those possibilities. Which is why I remain undecided and skeptical.

In the case of abductions, I have an even more skeptical opinion. On the one hand, I fully concede that even if you exclude known mental illness and other sketchy factors, and even if you restrict yourself to the few investigations conducted by credible scientists or psychologists (and you do, in my view, have to winnow your sample down to those cases, because of the high number of times that abductee groups have morphed into quasi-cults and channeling, the number of times implants have been claimed recovered and analyzed by labs, but those labs and data are never disclosed, etc.) and even when you attempt to control for experiences happening during sleep or in bed (which, again, I do believe you must exclude if you're serious about it, because as much as believers detest this explanation, sleep paralysis and hypnagogic experiences are a possible explanation,) you are still left with a surprising number of people having remarkably similar experiences.

(Continued...)