Service to Self is better than Service to Others (Please read before judging!)

Originally posted by tgidkp
reply to post by jiggerj

 

in my personal experience, we are ALWAYS "allotted " the requisite amount of emotional currency which we choose to expend.

you are drawing upon an account which will never expire.

many people use your reasoning to issue themselves a "license " to behave selfishly.... or to condemn the selfish nature of others in order to satisfy their own sefish desire.

no such licence is necessary, selfishness is a virtue. your anxiety is a fallacy.

Try living in a family that takes from you everyday and returns nothing. Trust me, you either get out, or you fall apart.

Well, to a certain point you are right. Help others to help themselves is a good thing. In some cases people cannot help themselves or need a little help. Then there are your parents. When they age they may need your help also. Same with the old lady next door trying to shovel the snow from her path after her husband died. Some people need our help. Others think they need our help and often get too dependent on others doing things for them. I can't say your right or wrong, somewhere between. Someday you may be needing some help with something and will appreciate someones helping hand.

Service to others always provides service to the self, no matter what. So, one can claim that any thing you do will always be of self-interests but some things can be self-interests and benefit others. Usually, you will bear more fruit if you service others. That is just my experience. Helping others helps yourself.

Originally posted by doobydoll
reply to post by arpgme

 

If you are not willing to TAKE, do you really have anything to give? How can the moon shine in the night if it doesn't absorb the sun's light? The moon is not shining for "US". It shines because it ABSORBS the light, and as a result it SPREADS.

Forgive me if I am wrong, but I thought the moon REFLECTED light?

Be wary the man who claims wisdom while at the same time proves himself the fool.

The self can be defined in various ways, and therefore so can selfishness.

I think nearly any ideology can result in progress, selfishness or egoism not excluded. It's probably beneficial to consider contrary view points to what we live by, and this post should come as a nice change of pace to those who live by the creed of completely dissolving the ego.

Commonly, I hear ideas about higher philosophical states resulting in an environmentally beneficial energy output. If this is true, then shouldn't we seek to find the best state in order to improve the environment? Maybe this state is pure selflessness, maybe not, but either way attaining the highest level is a selfish pursuit.

As a former baseball player, it's similar to how a hitter can best contribute to the team by being the best individual player possible. In order to best serve the world, we must become the best individual possible.

I'm mostly in line with your thinking, but I'd qualify that as I see it selfishness at it's highest level isn't much different than pure service at it's highest level. And also, either path is viable to developing.

The definition of enlightenment is sometimes too narrow. For example, peace is not necessarily required and I would propose that Muhammad had a relationship with God matched by very few in history.

I think a characteristic of high enlightenment may be the ability to see that one's ideology/lifestyle is not the only way.

Originally posted by violet
Is this some Ayn rand phlosophy?
Well it's just plain selfish.

Spare me the I helped them learn justifications.

One day you may need others to help you and they won't because you never helped them.

I'm disabled and require assistance every day of my life. I wasn't born this way and I didn't like my new life of always needing help. I had to get lessons on how to ask for help because i couldnt do it. I'm not a taker, never had been.

Lots of times complete strangers will offer to give me a hand as they pass by and do you know how nice that is? So glad everybody isn't like you.

I'm very insulted by your post.

edit on 27-8-2012 by violet because: (no reason given)

I wanted to finish reading down the page before I chimed in, but your claim to insult prompted me to respond now. You're response to this person's statement shows that you have next to no understanding of what he just said, and at the same time probably understand what he said more than you know.

This man tried to say in the best way he could have that we can't help others without our own inner strength. That strength must be built up before you can even think about helping others. Ex: if you don't build up your muscles, you can't carry your friend to his car.

I get sick and tired of people taking the high moral position on the wrong side of an argument. You, someone who's handicapped, wants to tell someone you are offended at his thought process, assuming he's a dumb@$$ for saying such. No one would say that without thinking about it and because you've probably never had someone tell you their opinion to your face, you don't know otherwise.

Of course he would help obvious handicaps. The problem is wasting energy on helping people who could otherwise help themselves if they only understood that it was in their power to do so. I'm tired of all this PC BS!

You guys are hammering down on him for telling the absolute truth and you have no idea that this is what is leading to the downfall of natural law.

I'd go on, but I might say something I'd regret. Nothing personal so if I hurt yours or anyone else's feelings it was because I want to shed some well needed light.

Originally posted by jiggerj

Originally posted by tgidkp
reply to post by jiggerj

 

in my personal experience, we are ALWAYS "allotted " the requisite amount of emotional currency which we choose to expend.

you are drawing upon an account which will never expire.

many people use your reasoning to issue themselves a "license " to behave selfishly.... or to condemn the selfish nature of others in order to satisfy their own sefish desire.

no such licence is necessary, selfishness is a virtue. your anxiety is a fallacy.

Try living in a family that takes from you everyday and returns nothing. Trust me, you either get out, or you fall apart.

I feel for you man. Learn to start closing the doors and windows of your mind, the ones that people get into without your permission and only open them when you feel like it.

I got that from Mind OS written by a Psychologist promoted by David Deangelo.

reply to post by arpgme



Originally posted by AthlonSavage
When have you evever taught someone to be strong? What have you done in that space? Its easy to talk on here but where is your track record??

Ah. That was very clever of you - try to discredit the idea by attacking me personally (ad hominem fallacy)

yes it was clever. I wasnt attacking you i was challenging you!!!! Whoops the goes the exclamabtion marks.
Your striding a high horse so i have placed some jumps in front of you to see how well you clear them. I want you to clear them not for me as im a complete nothing. I want you to clear them for yourself.



Originally posted by AthlonSavage
Your post doesnt come across happy it comes across angry. Are you genuinely a happier person?

If my word don't "come across happy', that is YOUR judgment. It is YOUR mind filtering the text.

Or mabey the power of words. Some people are very good with words to produce a certain emotional effect!

A person can type anything, you do not know how they feel in reality...

I was using my psyic ability and it told ne how you feel! If its wrong then it needs a recalibation service.

All things considered Symbiosis is inherent in nature and very relevant to survival. Had cooperation not been inherent in nature fundamentally it is possible man would not exist.

Any thoughts?

If you try and find happiness for yourself generally you won't find it, but if you try and find happiness for others, you'll find it in helping them get it. ie: Next time you pass a stranger Smile really big and say "beautiful day out isn't it?" and see what they do, and see how what they do makes you feel. And that's gonna be one small example.

Give and you shall receive, pressed down, shaken together, and runneth over, an abundance of good things poured into your lap.

But I think you can do both. And I don't think your being greedy by doing stuff for yourself. And I don't think your being a slave by doing stuff for others.

But generally in life, "To get what you want, you simply have to do one thing, help enough other people get what they want". --- Zig ziggler

Man is not an island.

How about symbiosis? Service to self and service to others, simultaneously. Give too much and you'll risk resenting others. Take too much and you'll risk others resenting you. I tend to prefer balance over polarity.

reply to post by arpgme


No and I disagree with your posting statement.

Selfish.

Service to self, the satanic ethics has what has gotten our planet into this mess.

Immature, selfish, lack of foresight.

reply to post by arpgme


Service to self is survival of the fittest, which is what civilized society has generally been trying to move away from for the past couple ten thousands of years. Cooperation requires some kind of help from others, regardless of what the terms are; without this we wouldn't have got past the stone age.

So, I sort of disagree with you.

What if your service to yourself IS service to others, and they are one and the same?

What then?

reply to post by ofhumandescent
I agree with your assessment of being selfish not being good for humanity, but the original poster did not mean that. At least that is what I feel, try and understand what is being said throughout the thread from another point of view. Leave aside the mind games and come to the heart of the matter. Simply put, if I was so poor and starving , I would generally be unable to offer any help because of my own situation.But if after some time and effort I managed to look after myself well and was plentiful and rich = meaning healthy, full of energy, with less material restrictions and take it one step further. So much so that I was not in the least worried ,concerned about my own situation, my apparent circumstances and ready to do whatever needs to be done in the now. Would I not be a great carer, lover, helper or whatever action you may see as beneficial to any given situation?
Add to that the reality of the thoughts of that person, not thinking to himself. Hey I am great, I am helping this lost soul, if it wasn't for me this person wouldn't be worth a pinto bean. If those where the apparent conditions, wouldn't that be beneficial.?

I agree with your assessment of being selfish not being good for humanity, but the original poster did not mean that.

How can you be certain.The original poster not being very actively involved in the debate we can only assume their thoughts. An explanation by words isnt good enough in my opinion. I have asked the original poster - When have you evever taught someone to be strong? What have you done in that space? Its easy to talk on here but where is your track record?? And the reply i got back was

Ah. That was very clever of you - try to discredit the idea by attacking me personally (ad hominem fallacy)

Oh please what kind of excuse is that. If someone creates a thread which says i believe this or that, or i am this or that....then please be ready with information that substantiates and defends the claims. I threw down the gaunlet ever so genttly i must say and the dust was kicked in my eyes.

but the original poster did not mean that. At least that is what I feel,

reply to post by AthlonSavage

If you see above is my original quote, its not something I know its something I feel. That doesn't mean I am right or wrong and frankly its not about that. From what you say , you sound like your hunting for the truth. You want to know if what the op says is backed up by experience. If she/he lives by those words. That I cannot tell you, nor is my reason for being here. On the other hand I feel that for you it is important and I am sure you have plenty of reasons for entering this thread with the intention to see if a person really stands by their word.I see your stance which you hold with pride and rather fearlessly. Now do you know what I would say about that? If you were face to face. I would say that is a good message you are sending out, which one ? the one of pride in standing behind your words.
On the other hand, I would say to the op, I would say thanks for putting out a message that has "HELPED" many of those who have entered or read this thread, to look deeper in to what real help is all about. How it looks easy and then all of a sudden its not at all. How some of us are helpless, others are helpful, useful or beyond help. All in all, that is our human condition. We all need to help or be helped at sometime in our lives and help has so many levels its unfathomable. Is it not?

oh please please only use that pride argument on someone who will fall for it because i dont.

Of course i want to see the thread author stand by their argument words. To do that yes of course i want to hear the author of thread to back up his/her statements, by telling us in this/her own words their real life experiences which shows what they have done, or are actively doing presently to lead by example. Authoring this thread will not get him/her a pass grade.

If the person is unwilling to tell me it indicates they are not confident in their own success. If that is the case then the whole premise of his/her argument is in doubt. This has absolutely nothing to do with pride so please take that debunking strategy another blog. This is about championing the truth.

From what you say , you sound like your hunting for the truth. You want to know if what the op says is backed up by experience. If she/he lives by those words.

reply to post by AthlonSavage

pride argument

who said anything about an argument, where I come from,to have some pride means to stand behind your word, to stand behind your tribe is a form of pride.To have pride in your stance in life, not ego pride which is only is based on a false idea. But on real human pride. The pride of a mothers face as she sees her children fill their stomach with the food she has prepared. It is known as real healthy pride.

reply to post by ancientthunder


Ok point taken. Now all we have to do now is wait and see if the thread author has enough pride in his/her experiences to share them with us. After all us slaves of the system are seeking his/her wisdom and no one learns quicker than thru sharing direct experiences.