The Truth About Rape

reply to post by zazzafrazz


Why do you have to twist their words around so much like that? It's called a strawman argument when you are arguing against something the other person never said.

All they said was that people can take certain precautions to protect themselves, which is true. It's not EVER the victim's fault, but that doesn't mean that people are helpless and completely at the mercy of everyone around them.

Say you own a home, and you are worried about getting broken into. You lock the doors, lock the windows, get an alarm system and display the sign in the yard, make sure you have good sturdy doors and deadbolt, perhaps even bars over the windows, and get a few big dogs. These are good precautions to take to prevent a break-in.

If someone DOESN'T take these precautions, and gets broken into, is it their fault? Absolutely not. The fault is on the shoulders of the person that committed the crime. But that person that got broken into will most likely put a lot more effort into avoiding such a thing from happening again in the future.

Which would you prefer, Zazz, that everyone say women are completely helpless, totally at the mercy and will of men, and can't do ANYTHING to lower their chances of getting rapped, and have more women get raped.

OR, would you prefer people be honest and say that there are things you can do to lower the chance that you'll be raped. Precautions and preventative measures to take in order to protect yourself, and as a result more women do these things, and less women get raped.

Which would you rather have happen?

Simply saying that a woman has options and it's possible to protect herself doesn't in ANY way blame the victim.

I wonder what percentage of rape cases go like this.

Woman goes out drinking and meets a good looking guy. Some bad decisions happen on both their parts and they have sex. The next day the man brags to all his buddies about his one night stand while the woman feels terrible about what happened. In order for her to reconsile her emotions, she forces herself to believe she had no part in it. She's the victim now.

I know this sounds crazy but it happened to a friend of mine. Him and his girl broke up and she wanted him back really bad. He took her out to eat and they went out drinking. They ended up having sex that night. The next day he told her it was a bad decision and he regretted it.

Once she found out her little "tactic" to get him back didn't work, she screamed rape. I got so sick and tired of her accusing him of rape I documented all of our conversations in case she tried pressing charges. She never did.

Not saying this is common. The reality is tho, if that statistic about 70% of all rapes happen between people that know each other is true, I think it's more common than we want to admit.

reply to post by James1982


I believe I quoted CHarmed,

When quoting ones text one isn't twisting anything.
Look back <

Originally posted by Charmed707

Originally posted by paxnatus

Tell me something, In may case, where I awoke to find the attacker crouched at the foot of my bed, what could I have done.

I mentioned AVOIDING certain situations. This involves logical decision making. Obviously you can't consciously avoid a stranger breaking in while you're sleeping. I guess it's too much to expect people to be able to tell the difference between being aggressively victimized and walking into a situation.

Being the victim of rape most certainly is glamorized...and it's sickening. There are T-shirts that say something along the lines of 'I was raped'. You always hear the term 'rape survivor', when no one has ever died from being raped. Rape is a violent act that often puts one in a dangerous, life-threatening position- but I rarely hear the term 'assault survivor' or 'robbery survivor'. 'Rape survivor' is used so often that it has become a cliche. Victims of rape are emphasized much more than victims of other crimes. Being a 'rape survivor' certainly seems the en vogue thing to be in these current times.

I'm sorry, but I felt I had to step in here and voice my opinion.

Situational awareness and all, putting yourself in *any* position is NOT silent nor tacit approval to permit a rape. Certainly "common sense" can be used to berate or fault, or partially blame a "victim" for being in a bad place at a bad time. Since the person is in the wrong place at the wrong time, this somehow makes it ok for them to be violated? Really?

Perhaps a nearly empty parking lot after the mall has closed and you lingered to long to talk to a friend? A long, lonely walk to your car, and you haplessly become a "victim".

The reason I used "victim" in quotes is for a purpose.

"Victimization" is a word that a "survivor" of a life changing event CHOOSES to not use. The word SURVIVOR denotes the mental and psychological position the woman, man, or child has chosen to take a stand about their personal convitiction on the matter.

Do you really not understand this?

Choosing to not be a "victim", but to be a "survivor" is for the person affected, not you and your high and mighty opinion of how they should act or behave, and if they placed themselves in a bad position or not. That is not now, not ever, your decision. Only your opinion, and you can see how popular that is. It's good though, that you have never been a "victim". This much is obvious, else you would not have this attitude.

Because, regardless of where that person was, the circumstances that surrounded the event were deeply personal, and choosing the outcome of surviving and moving forward to be a stronger person in SPITE of it is what matters.

Choosing to be a victim means allowing yourself to continuously feel berated and undervalued, to re-live and suffer, to be re-victimized every time you have to walk a dark parking lot alone again.

Strong women, men, and children choose to not be a victim over and over, and there is NO glory in being a rape victim. There is strength and courage and conviction, however, in be a rape survivor. Again, this is for the person living through it, not for YOU. This is what you seem to not be able to comprehend.

I was raped at gunpoint. I did what I could to save my life. I will not *ever* stand for anyone to even hint it was my fault, that I was in the wrong place at the wrong time, and I am not a victim. I survived. No thanks to you or your opinions. But it is in spite of people like that, that wish to taunt victims, that I will *NEVER* wear that label.

I too, am a rape SURVIVOR. I am also a burn survivor.

I am also a rape counselor.

Originally posted by Evil_Santa

Rape (specifically rape against women) is a cause that leftists, especially feminists have taken up, as if victims of other crimes don't matter, not even the child victims of rape. Look at the sensationalized Duke rape case, which turned out to be false. It also got extra attention because of the racial angle.

Protip: PEOPLE MAKE STUPID CHOICES. Everyone. You, me, the other readers here, Every single adult has made a bad choice at some point in their life. YOU ARE NOT SPECIAL. If you believe that you haven't ever made some kind of bad choice, then you're delusional.

Children get a pass on making blatantly stupid choices. Adults don't. They shouldn't be coddled and told they were helpless whenever they are facing the direct consequences of their actions. The world would be a better place if people would drop the childish mentality that people like yourself possess. Going by your logic, the rapist or even a murderer can just say 'I made a stupid choice' and be justified in that.

People know the dangers, but even at that - until you can accurately predict the future, you can't avoid the dangers by "making choices".

You most certainly can- to an extent. You are NOT helping anyone by pretending otherwise.

Sounds like you're a bit jealous of the attention victims get.

So you're saying that being a rape victim is something to envy? That says a lot about your sick mind.

Besides, if someone actually wants to become a victim for attention, it can be easily done....by making risky decisions.

reply to post by James1982


Except that Charm is arguing that if a person is raped - they made a bad decision somewhere and therefor are to be blamed.

Planning, preparation and educating one's self about the patterns of sexual predators, and how-to avoid them, is not a 100% fool-proof system of defense, because predators can - and do - slip past these defense mechanisms to get to their prey. There's no way to 100% predict what a irrational person is capable of doing, and as i've stated before - unless a person can foresee the future, then not all attacks can be avoided.

reply to post by James1982


Yes of course sex takes place in a rape, but the rape itself is not about having sex with someone!!

This was the kind of rape I experienced...I think I am more qualified to speak to what drives rape having
been in the situation myself than you are!! You are so wrong about this!!

Anger rape
The aim of this rapist is to humiliate, debase and hurt their victim; they express their contempt for their victim through physical violence and profane language. For these rapists, sex is a weapon to defile and degrade the victim, rape constitutes the ultimate expression of their anger. This rapist considers rape the ultimate offense they can commit against the victim.

Anger rape is characterized by physical brutality, much more physical force is used during the assault than would be necessary if the intent were simply to overpower the victim and achieve penetration. This type of offender attacks their victim by grabbing, striking and knocking the victim to the ground, beating them, tearing their clothes, and raping them.

The experience for the offender is one that is of conscious anger and rage. [1]

wikipedia

reply to post by smyleegrl


It is funny how that website gives you all the figures in their conclusions yet they don't site their sources or research methods to get to those numbers.

Where are the evidence and sources? Not credible enough for me though logically it would make sense. But the numbers need to be cited, sorry.

BTW ...THOSE ARE 2005 FIGURES...they are like almost 8 YEARS old numbers. Just sayin

reply to post by zazzafrazz

After all it appears from reading here, it is a womans' responsibility to not make herself attractive to rape. Rather than educating people on the rights of others.

100% in agreement with this. This is the truth, and anything else is a massively unequal and corrupt society.

Originally posted by James1982
reply to post by zazzafrazz

 

Simply saying that a woman has options and it's possible to protect herself doesn't in ANY way blame the victim.

Agreed

reply to post by Libertygal


Do you really not understand the difference in being aggressively pursued and victimized versus pursuing the danger yourself i.e getting drunk in a bar/party or going home with a stranger?

Originally posted by Evil_Santa
reply to post by James1982

 

Except that Charm is arguing that if a person is raped - they made a bad decision somewhere and therefor are to be blamed.

Planning, preparation and educating one's self about the patterns of sexual predators, and how-to avoid them, is not a 100% fool-proof system of defense, because predators can - and do - slip past these defense mechanisms to get to their prey. There's no way to 100% predict what a irrational person is capable of doing, and as i've stated before - unless a person can foresee the future, then not all attacks can be avoided.

As well as considering the stats that someone posted earlier that most rapes are committed by people we know and to some degree trust. This is how they gain the closeness needed to commit the crime.

So by that reasoning, we should not allow ourselves to be close to anyone, lest we become a victim and allow ourselves to be raped. Since we do seem to be the blame. AGAIN.

Originally posted by Evil_Santa

Except that Charm is arguing that if a person is raped - they made a bad decision somewhere and therefor are to be blamed.

Are you THAT lacking in reading comprehension skills?!

No doesn't always mean no.

it's all in the inflection of the voice.

I once overheard a guy asking this one woman if she wanted to spend the night with him again. This was in a food court in a mall.

She repeated the word "no" many different times, each with a different inflection in her voice. One inflection indicated confusion, and the next she'd be certain then recanted and repeated her confusion.

I don't know what the outcome was, but I think she went with him. Even though she said no.

So the saying "no means no" is a generalization.

And some people like to say the word just to say the word. Some people are very facetious.

But make no mistake, if she does really mean no, you should back off. Guys and dolls alike.

reply to post by smyleegrl


I am glad to hear that your staying strong. Both my sister and I were date raped. Though I know about what happened to her she does not know what happened to me. It is a hard thing to deal with especially when it is someone you knew or thought you knew. The insanity that has been falling out of the mouths of politicians lately has been sickening.

Rape is physically, mentally, and emotionally damaging. It hurts my soul when I hear people talk negatively about the victims and survivors of rape. Stay strong everyone and blessed be.

Originally posted by zazzafrazz
reply to post by James1982

 

I believe I quoted CHarmed,

When quoting ones text one isn't twisting anything.
Look back <

edit on 20-8-2012 by zazzafrazz because: (no reason given)

I'm not really sure what you're trying to say?

What's your answer to the question at the end of my post?

Do you think women CAN protect themselves and do things to lower their chances of getting raped?

Or do you think women are just helpless naive little tulips who are completely at the mercy of those around them?

I know for a fact women are not helpless, they are strong and intelligent and able to protect themselves just as well as anyone else. I think it's incredibly dangerous to try and instill the mindset into women that they are helpless. It should be reinforced and supported that they can and should defend themselves.

Originally posted by Libertygal

Ever thought of the idea that some victims lead the "rapist" on for personal pleasure or conspiracy only after the sex they claim they have been raped to cause defamation of character to the "rapist" who was in fact innocent.

Not all rapes are true claimed rapes. They can also be planned by the victim for a purpose, a hidden agenda, or to have others feel sorry for them.

Some victims are simply liars to put it in perspective.

reply to post by James1982


You should always be so biased for women being raped. Be more neutral and include men in your argument as well. That way there is an even playing field here. No hate.

reply to post by Charmed707


Why must a woman assume that the nice guy, although a stranger, may rape her?

The problem here are the bad humans. That story I told of the girl cheating on her BF with me...I WAS the stranger getting drunk with her. Going home with her. Having intercourse with her and then halfway through stopping. I was drunk and could still know what is right and wrong.

There are good people. There are bad people. The good ones respect everyone's rights. The bad ones don't.

There is no justification for it. Socio-paths will act like a nice guy but then rape a woman. There is no way for them to tell.

You're using crazy speak.

Originally posted by Charmed707
reply to post by Libertygal

 

Do you really not understand the difference in being aggressively pursued and victimized versus pursuing the danger yourself i.e getting drunk in a bar/party or going home with a stranger?

I don't care if you danced naked on a bar 15 minutes ago, dressed in a skimpy miniskirt and bra top and walked to your car at 2am in 4 inch spike heeled shoes.

NOTHING is tacit approval to allow a woman to be violated and victimized.

As unpleasant as it may seem to you or others that may nod their heads in agreement to your posts, there is nothing a man, woman, or child can or will ever do that allows permission for them to be raped, regardless of the position they place themselves in.

That would be no different than saying that driving while intoxicated allows someone else to hit you, because well, you are drunk!

The idea of pursuing danger yourself is absurd, and only an outlet that aggressive prosecutors use in court as a way to discredit a rape victim and to make them seem less credible. Or to suggest that perhaps they somehow *wanted* it.

Unless you were there, and you know exactly what happened, you have no right to judge a woman that says no and is raped regardless of her desire not to be. It is a violation of her will.

Drinking at a bar and accepting a ride home from a stranger does not give tacit approval to violate her body. Only certain men, lets call them rapists, would have the gall to think thus is the case.