The Origins of the King James Bible and the New Testament, and the Forgery, and Pagan influences in

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by 1nOne

 

Right...

You realize Yahshua means "YHVH Saves" right? His Name is a "consecrated" Name, it must carry the root name of His Father.

"I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive." John 5:43


You just hate the Jews, go join a Neo Nazi group.

edit on 26-4-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)

I've tried explaining to you, many times over, the absurdity of the consecrated name theory.
Two other notable NT characters, Jesus Barabbas and Bar-Jesus, shared the "holy name" as well: one being a convicted murderer and the other a persecutor of Christians.

Something is rotten in the state of Denmark when so-called Christians charge other Christians with "anti-Semitism" for refusing to bow down to the god of those who killed Christ.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by Screwed

 

Where are your sources? Nothing you said is supported by a source.

Care to start over logical dude?

This will now be the fourth time.
So, here we go.

It is NOT MY JOB TO DECONSTRUCT YOUR REALITY!!!!!!
You are really having a tough time getting your head around this concept my friend.
You are not open to sources. You are open to arguing. YOu have your mind already made up.
There is obviously no point in even having more than a passing conversation with you.

Look at how hard it is for you to listen to ME already.
I have told you FOUR TIMES that I am not interested in arguing with you and you pass right over it like it wasn't even said. This is what christians do when you present evidence that their holy book is full of holes and inconsistancies. YOu just ignore what you can't defend and defend what you can't ignore.

You are the winner.
YOu are winning for jesus pal.
Jesus has an extra special place in heaven for you because you are going to bat for him right now.
The bible is the one true word of the one true god.
all those who reject it will burn in a firey lake of sulpher.
Jesus is lord.

You are a warrior for jesus.

YOU ARE A WINNER IN CHRIST!!!!!

Now that is the fourth time!!!!
Let's see if there will be a fifth.

reply to post by SimonPeter

Truthfully, humankind has not the capacity to answer all questions. We are held back by where we are on the Spiritual Evolutionary Scale. (Third Dimension of Time/Space) I have "back engineered" a great many things, and have made some startling discoveries along the way. That does not mean I have all the answers, nobody does.

All I really do is open topics for discussion, mostly in the hopes of gaining new information for my own self. Sadly, when it comes to religion, I seem to be the researcher, and the religious crowd can only repeat the same things over and over. I have appealed to them several time, post your own thoughts, your own theories!.... all to no avail.

I guess the glaring question is, and believe me I have a lot of them, who created religion in the first place?

reply to post by autowrench


Religion is a very necessay tool.
So is a pacifier.
So are diapers.
So are bottles.

Hopefully we someday outgrow them and move on as our understanding increases.

But, what happens all too often if we don't outgrow these things is a five year old with a binki in his mouth and a grown man who still believes in the bible.

reply to post by Screwed

May as well give it up, Screwed, NOTurTypical has been brainwashed by religious dogma, mostly by his own hand, and will never come out of that box of faith he lives in. Notice how he attempts to derail this thread with his vast knowledge of everything. Such a well read and intelligent personage.....you would think, would do much more that copy/paste and post Bible/Christian rhetoric over and over.
Wonder if he knows anything about Ascension? After all, he claims he does not live in the Dimension the rest of us live in.

reply to post by autowrench


The real question that we ask is how did life get here and is there others out there . In the vastness of space being so cold, hot , distant , and radioactive as it is how could a single organism survive long enough to have made a journey from some unseen origin to populate earth? Then for that organism to genetically change into millions of different organisms and then man . Going back to that unseen origin , how did it begin ? Beyond that is where is this point of origin located with relation to what? Can we relate our parameters of understanding to the vastness of space that we can see . Is there much more that we don't see . We are like a baby in it's crib opening it's eyes for the first time . All we can see and know is whats within the confines of the room about us . If moms out of the room are we to assume that we evolved from a microbe ? We all seek our own Convenient compromise of reality . It's real to us and we can exist unchallenged there in it's comfort at least for a while . Then when challenged we form a new reality of compromised reality . The bible does not let us compromise and therefore is the enemy and must be defeated along with the author . God the Father created what you call religion as you call it . There are many religions such as Atheism , car worship , the worship of money , of alcoholism , drugs , of power and of evil . Many people have dedicated their lives to destroy the bible and creation . Most especially the ACLU that is created and funded by Jews has worked tirelessly to expungethe Name of JESUS from the world . To the Jew you as a Gentile has no right to reverence God as you are a non person and no right their God . That's why my thoughts the reason God blinded the Jews to Jesus . They would not have shared Jesus with the rest of the world . As the chosen people , and Judas was chosen directly by Jesus , the Jew will carry out Gods plan . What we are seeing today with the economic , enviromental,and political enviroment is totally the work of the Jews , Gods little helpers .The chosen ones control all of the worlds banks , most major news companies, most movie and TV companies except Mel Gibson , our government, our medicine producers , the NWO and the Bilderbergers .
Within the focus of the bible is one major item that is always overlooked upon which the scholar falls to ruin . It is FAITH . The same faith that mom and dad will always love you , that good will triumph over evil .
The Bible is the standard for societal law and etiquette for thousands of years , it's hard and fast . How is it now that we have become so smart that we can back engineer the bible and fault with it now citing unproven claims . 2nd Timothy chapter 2 attempts to Pre Address that question some 2,000 years in our past .
One must ask himself ; what does my heart have to say about the matter ? Or will stay with whats convenient to my established routine . For if it's not in your heart you can see and not perceive the matter .
Blessings to You and Yours

Click here for more information.

Originally posted by autowrench
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

I invited you hear because you stated to me that you could in fact refute anything I said against the Bible. That challenge inspired this research. I appreciate that in itself. Care to throw out a new challenge?
So, let's see your evidence, proof, please? I say the KJV Bible was edited by a Rosicrucian named Francis Bacon. Can you offer anything to prove me wrong, or to prove the theory flawed?
I thought you may like to discuss the facts I presented here, instead of attempting to take the topic off on a tangent of physics. From your own Profile, under "Stuff I Don't Like:"
"Nothing. I don't hate".
Let's see it then.

Indeed. PSALM 46 is the KEY. From the end of the bible to PSALM 46 are 666 books
Psalm 46 was famous by Shakespeare and Martin Luther.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Burbank Lodge (See page 10)
www.burbanklodge.com...

reply to post by SimonPeter

The real question that we ask is how did life get here and is there others out there .

Deleted, what it the use, anyway?

reply to post by Screwed

This will now be the fourth time.

Don't throw a hissy-fit with me, you claimed to have posted "facts". I'm just asking you to provide them. Arbitrary assertions and opinions aren't "facts".

Originally posted by 1nOne

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by 1nOne

 

Right...

You realize Yahshua means "YHVH Saves" right? His Name is a "consecrated" Name, it must carry the root name of His Father.

"I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive." John 5:43


You just hate the Jews, go join a Neo Nazi group.

edit on 26-4-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)

I've tried explaining to you, many times over, the absurdity of the consecrated name theory.
Two other notable NT characters, Jesus Barabbas and Bar-Jesus, shared the "holy name" as well: one being a convicted murderer and the other a persecutor of Christians.

Something is rotten in the state of Denmark when so-called Christians charge other Christians with "anti-Semitism" for refusing to bow down to the god of those who killed Christ.

Take a basic course in Hebrew or Aramaic. You won't make absurd statements.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by Screwed

 

This will now be the fourth time.

Don't throw a hissy-fit with me, you claimed to have posted "facts". I'm just asking you to provide them. Arbitrary assertions and opinions aren't "facts".

*******This will now be the sixth time.********



I am not interested in shattering your religion and dismantling your world view.
It would literally be like taking candy from a baby.
Not in the sense that it would be easy but in the sense that it would be cruel.
Who would do such a thing?

You have a right to live in ignorance.
You are exercising the free will that our creator gave each of us.
It would be cruel of me to TRY to expose you to information that you are not ready to hear and would do no good anyway because all you would do is what you were trained by your church to do.

Lie
Deny
Justify
Counter Accuse
Minimize
Blame
Hop Over

You are skilled in defending a made up religion.
I could train myself to defend anything too.
Give me enough time and I could have a list a mile long of all of the reasons "Barney the Dinosaur" is real.
I could also formulate all of the possible responses one would need when confronted to a non believer who keeps spouting out inconvieniant facts.

At the end of the day, Barney the Purple Dinosaur is still just a creation of a man with an imagination.

I am not about to walk up to a random kid on the street and prove to him that Santa isn't real
and I am not going to prove to you that Jesus isn't real.

The kid isn't ready to hear it
and YOU refuse to hear it.

It wouldn't matter how many facts I threw at you!
You are prepared with a canned response.
Your mind is not ready to learn only to teach.

reply to post by Screwed

*******This will now be the sixth time.********

Okay, you don't have "facts", just don't ever call prejudicial arbitrary conjectures "facts". You can have any arbitrary opinion you choose to, that's cool, go for it man.

reply to post by autowrench


Deleted my butt ! It is a reasonable question . You have rejected the Book of Life for your own reasons and basically called people who do believe in God a bunch of weak minded nuts beyond the comprehension of sound judgement . Where did life begin and how exactly ? How did life begin considering DNA does not assimilate randomly outside of a living cell and is the building block for every living cell . Abiogenises should be your argument but that doesn't answer the question it's only a catch phrase .
The bible offers an answer for your existence . Most assuredly we could not understand the full explanation of the creation of life . Even now mans grasp of the human anatomy is limited . But I am sure that you have an alternate answer to that real question . Maybe you don't care how life began here on earth . A lot of people don't , their main question is who drank all the beer.
If you try to debunk the biblical account of life have proof . The beginning of life on this earth and how it happened is the real question . If you can't explain how it happened what makes you so sure you have looked far enough into the matter to have a valid opinion on the bible?

reply to post by racasan

. . . the roman general Vespasian and his son Titus where sent to Judea to put down a Jewish revolt . . .

Did you buy the book?
I never heard of this.
I watched the 5 min. video you posted, then went on Amazon, and sure enough, they have it for sale.
Caesar's Messiah, by Joseph Atwill.
Feel like doing a review?
Podcast of interview of Atwill on Gnostic Radio
www.gnosticmedia.com...

reply to post by Screwed


On the other hand when I was a child I thought as a child . I could only think of fast cars, girls and music . But when I became a man I thought of grown up things . With age comes wisdom and an understanding of your own eventual mortality . You start to look at things differently just like old dad did. You start to learn that you aren't always right or the smartest and sometimes just how stupid you must have looked to other people in your youth .
Being a christian is not easy . It would be easier to be a party hound . Christians are not weak by any definition. Actually the fact that some people are constantly trying to debunk the bible indicates that they are trying to form a consensus that there will be no hell because they are not really sure and the possibility of their sin sending them to hell worries them . Why else would they spend the time trying to debunk it . Surely you have more important things to do !

reply to post by jmdewey60


Hi jmdewey60
Yes I have the book – it’s an interesting read - plenty of references and Atwell puts his case well

Some of the book is here:
www.scribd.com...


but Atwell's idea is that the Roman general Vespasian was sent to put down a Jewish revolt, he may have been chosen because he had distinguished himself in the invasion of Britain (apparently one of his tasks was to destroy the druid – so he had some knowledge of destroying/subverting/creating new religions) the destruction of the druids was probably done for the same reason it was felt necessary to destroy or subvert Judaism – to take the fight out of the people

en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...

Titus (Vespasian’s son) who also went to put down the revolt became the patron of Flavius Josephus, a Jewish resistance leader captured at the Siege of Yodfat

So with Josephus, Vespasian/Titus had the means/method/motive to subvert the Jewish messianic movement with a story of a peaceful (roman supporting) messiah who had come but that the Jews hadn’t recognised and so killed him

Titus declared Vespasian to be a god on his death (making Titus the son of god) so if Atwell is correct then Jesus is just Titus and christians are praying to a roman emperor

After that I think the Romans just found Christianity (as it became known) such a successful meme that they used it as the basis for their catholic(general/all encompassing) religion

Originally posted by SimonPeter
reply to post by Screwed

 

Why else would they spend the time trying to debunk it . Surely you have more important things to do !

This is precisley why I will not waste my time tring to debunk it.
When I see a ufo I feel no urge to call anyone and prove it.
When I listen to my co-worker insist that there is no such things as dinosaurs because the bible doesn't come right out and say that there are dinosaurs........I feel no urge to prove it.

People deserve to live in ignorance and it is not my job to drag anyone kicking and screaming into the light.
Christians however DO feel it is their duty to convince people to believe what THEY believe.
I believe you call it "Witnessing"?

So yes, though you were trying your best to be a smart ass, I do indeed have better things to do.

jesus is king!!!
jesus Saves.
WWJD?
The bible is the word of god
god will burn us in hell for all eternity cuz we've been bad for not believing the same thing you do.
(how arrogant btw)

I get it.
You believe it.
That is great.
I am happy for you.
One day, in this life or the next, you willget to a place where you are comfortable branching out and have the courage to throw the shackles off of your mind and stop living in fear of hell and damnation.
It really is quite liberating.
I strongly reccomend it for those who think they might be ready.

reply to post by racasan

This looks like something that will be a big deal, so thanks for the heads up.
I'm going to get the Kindle version to see if his arguments have anything to back them up.
The interview I linked to above is a good way to pick up his main thesis.

ETA: after buying and downloading the book and reading into it some:
"OH CR#P!" was my reaction.
The author's theory is that Josephus wrote at least some of the Gospels, and you can see a correlation between his own autobiography and the depiction of Jesus in a couple of places right away, like the story of discussing theology with the elders as a child, and the questioning by Pilate.

reply to post by Screwed


i]reply to post by Screwed


Screwed wrote: "When I listen to my co-worker insist that there is no such things as dinosaurs because the bible doesn't come right out and say that there are dinosaurs........I feel no urge to prove it."

I'm going to give you the red pill regarding this:

Online Etymology Dictionary:

dinosaur
1841, coined in Modern Latin by Sir Richard Owen, from comb. form of Gk. deinos "terrible" (see dire) + sauros "lizard," of unknown origin. Figurative sense of "person or institution not adapting to change" is from 1952.
terrible + lizard

lizard/wizard
"an animal resembling a serpent, with legs added to it" [Johnson], late 14c., lusarde, from Anglo-Fr. lusard, O.Fr. laisarde "lizard" (Mod.Fr. lézard), from L. lacertus (fem. lacerta) "lizard," of unknown origin, perhaps from PIE root *leq- "to bend, twist" [Klein].
one who twists or bends (truths) = lies, deceives
dinosaur = terrible twister of truths

wicked
late 13c., earlier wick (12c.), apparently an adj. use of O.E. wicca "wizard/lizard" (see wicca).

Wicca
An O.E. masc. noun meaning "male witch, wizard" (see druid)
wiz·ard
n.
1. One who practices magic; a sorcerer or magician.
2. A skilled or clever person (thefreedictionary)

Sorcerer: alchemist; philosopher; pharmacist; author; wordsmith

Druid
1560s, from Fr. druide, from L. druidae (pl.), *dru- "tree" (especially oak) + *wid- "to know" (cf. vision). Hence, lit., perhaps, "they who know the oak" (perhaps in allusion to divination from mistletoe). Anglo-Saxon, too, used identical words to mean "tree" and "truth" (treow). O.Ir. form was drui Mod.Ir. and Gael. draoi, gen. druadh "magician, sorcerer."
(see Jew)

Jew (n.)
late 12c. (in plural, giwis), from Anglo-Fr. iuw, O.Fr. giu, from L. Judaeum; Fr. Juif
jew (v.)
"to cheat, to drive a hard bargain," 1824, from Jew (n.) cf. gyp, welsh/Gypsy, Egypt; Welsh

oak
O.E. ac "oak tree," from P.Gmc. *aiks, of uncertain origin with no certain cognates outside Germanic. The usual I.E. base for "oak" (*derwo-/*dreu-) has become Mod.Eng. tree. Used in Biblical translations to render Hebrew "elah" (probably usually "terebinth tree") and four other words.

St. Patrick banishes all snakes from Ireland
Pious legend credits St. Patrick with banishing snakes from the island,[59] chasing them into the sea after they attacked him during a 40-day fast he was undertaking on top of a hill.[60] This hagiographic theme draws on the mythography of the staff of Moses, messenger of Yahweh to gentile Egyptians. In Exodus 7:8–7:13 , Moses and Aaron use their staffs in their struggle with Pharaoh's sorcerers, the staffs of each side morphing into snakes. However, all evidence suggests that post-glacial Ireland never had snakes...Wikipedia

The caduceus (☤; /kəˈdjuːsiːəs/ or /kəˈdjuːʃəs/; from Greek κηρύκειον kērukeion "herald's staff"[2] ) is the staff carried by Hermes in Greek mythology. It is a short staff entwined by two serpents, sometimes surmounted by wings.The snake returns in Exodus when Moses, as a sign of God's power, turns his staff into a snake and when Moses made the Nehushtan, a bronze snake on a pole that when looked at cured the people of bites from the snakes that plagued them in the desert. The serpent makes its final appearance symbolizing Satan in the Book of Revelation: "And he laid hold on the dragon the old serpent, which is the devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years." (Revelation 20:2) Wikipedia