The Origins of the King James Bible and the New Testament, and the Forgery, and Pagan influences in , page 12

reply to post by Lucius Driftwood

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Just because you feel something is worth burning yourself at the stake, does not make you right. It also possibly means you are a fanatic, which can be dangerous in almost any situation.

reply to post by Starchild23

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I think the fact that he felt he didn't need to blow up, destroy or kill other people in the process speaks volumes. He didn't cause anyone else to be a victim to his own beliefs.
He wanted the common man to be able to read the Word in his or her own language.
The powers that be did not approve. Such is the distinction between the message and discipleship of Jesus and those that choose to follow a religion that carries a thin veneer of truth but denies the truth at its very core.
I trust in Jesus as my Lord and Saviour. My hope is in Him.
I do not worship the church, Christianity or any organaization that would seek to usurp the authority of Christ and use it as a power base against me , a child of the Father, in the name of Jesus.
Whether I stand or fall is not based on whether you agree with me or not.
Live and let live,.
But if you see obstacles in the road, any good traveller should warn his fellow traveller to watch for them.

reply to post by Lucius Driftwood

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Why do you think that he personally is your savior?

Why not the ideals he stood for? No man is any other man's savior. Only principles that can be stood by, rather than a man debasing another person in saying, "I am your lord and master", are healthy for a human being.

It is crazy, really...how so many nationalities will detest slavery, but turn right back around and beg on bended knee to serve someone who promises hope. Why can't you be your own hope? Are you that helpless?

I doubt it. It's your choice to be helpless, to hand everything over to a higher power that supposedly exists outside of yourself just so you can convince yourself that everything will be fine. Stop handing off the responsibility and be your own god, your own savior, and the master of your own fate.

You don't need a god. You need to take control. Is that such a frightening prospect, taking life by the horns without a manual? If you're too frightened to take a leap, a leap that must be taken, then you'll never truly fly.

reply to post by rasta420

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What did Constantine have to do with the Bible, you haven't been reading Dan Brown books have you?

Originally posted by racasan

Originally posted by SimonPeter
reply to post by autowrench

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Is that the best you could do? You actually read that all the way through ! Boy your really pulling at straws . Couldn't find science to deny creation by God as a superior being able to do the impossible ,

If you are going to say a ‘mythical being able to do the impossible’ did it – then any ‘mythical being able to do the impossible’ might have done it – there is nothing to distinguish between Odin/Zeus/Bible god or any other ‘mythical being able to do the impossible’

So why should anybody think your choice is right over any other guess as to which mythical being did it?

Well I guess we could remove mythical being /creation stories that we now know have to be wrong
for example:
in genesis it says bible god made life forms that use photosynthesis to live (plants and so on) before he got around to making the sun – and that’s just plain silly so we can forget about the bible

What bible are you reading ? God created the sun in the 1st chapter of Genesis. Most people have a reason not to believe , mostly that 10% tithe stops them . The other thing is vices such as alcohol or drugs or unnatural affections or riotous living . These are things that the person just can't give up . Don't feel like you have shunned God . He doesn't want every body . God said he will send a strong delusion in the last days that those who loved unrighteousness would reap unrighteousness . At the time of the end everybody would see the truth of the bible and proclaim Jesus . That would be like your heckling worst enemy trying to become your best friend when you win the lottery . Ain't happening . So go on with your bad self !

reply to post by Lucius Driftwood

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Don't throw your pearls to the swine .It's hard to not answer and proclaim Jesus but some of these people came on this site to destroy faith not to find faith . You faith is the target not theirs .

Originally posted by SimonPeter

What bible are you reading ? God created the sun in the 1st chapter of Genesis.

Day 3 bible god makes plants – life forms that use sun light as their energy source
Day 4 bible god makes the sun/moon/ other stars (and that bits just wrong anyway)

Do you see the problem now?
And yes I know it says bible god made light on day one – but here on planet earth the sun is the source of day light and trying to pretend it works any other way is silly

back to my original point
There are more religions in the world than yours and each of those has its own version of a creation story
So what evidence can you provide that will show your religion/creation story the right one and all the others wrong?

And by evidence I don’t mean stuff from the bible or any sort of special pleading
en.wikipedia.org...
I mean real actual evidence

I doubt it. It's your choice to be helpless, to hand everything over to a higher power that supposedly exists outside of yourself just so you can convince yourself that everything will be fine. Stop handing off the responsibility and be your own god, your own savior, and the master of your own fate. You don't need a god. You need to take control. Is that such a frightening prospect, taking life by the horns without a manual? If you're too frightened to take a leap, a leap that must be taken, then you'll never truly fly.

reply to post by Starchild23

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You know, you seem just as evangelical, fundamentalist and intolerant as the people who hold to spiritual convictions.
You are TELLING ME WHAT TO DO ('Stop handing off the responsibility'.....'You need to take control').
You are thereby telling me with this mindset that YOU ARE RIGHT and I AM WRONG. I'm the stupid ignorant one, you are the enlightened one and why can't I be more like you, etc....

You have taken a personal crusade upon yourself to convince me to think like you and reach the conclusions you have reached, otherwise I am ignorant, superstitious, naiive, etc.....
How much control do you actually think you have over your own life? How much have you abrogated to a 'higher power'? Do you pay taxes?
You have personal choices to make in your life, and personal decisions to take on a daily basis.
If you go to court on a charge, you can dress up as smart as possible to influence people, you can get the best lawyer available to represent you (which of course YOU wouldn't do because that would involve handing over control of your life to someone else), and you can supply the best character references to all and sundry...but at the end of the day the outcome is out of your hands. Your influence is minimal.
That's just a petty example in the grand scheme of things.
If you really think you have control over your life, you are the deluded one.
Enjoy your flight, Icarus.

reply to post by Lucius Driftwood

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I'm not the one praying to thin air for help that can't be proven to have been given. I am not the one waiting for a man who has been dead for two thousand years to drop out of the sky and accomplish in one day what our leaders have failed to do for 50 years. I am not the one debasing myself to a god who is vindictive, overbearing, and jealous...and very proud of it.

I don't need tradition to live a good life, and I don't need a god to tell me what's right and wrong.

And yet, Christians operate under all of these assumptions...all of these hare-brained beliefs. I have no problem if someone decides to take a path just as logically sound as my own...as long as they've shown some modicum of intelligence in dealing with real-life dilemmas.

Christians don't fit that bill.

reply to post by Lucius Driftwood

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Cast not your pears to the swine .

There were no 12 Apostles, that is why. The Bible is made up and those who died believed in a lie, it's sad but true. Sometimes people just fall victim to cults.

reply to post by arpgme

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You need an encounter with the resurrected Saviour Jesus Christ.
No argument, theory, assumption, extrapolation, observation, assertion, quantification, rational interpretation, mathematical equation, cosmological theorization will cut it.It's difficult to consider anything outside of the dimensions we are comfortable with, in spit of many scientists speculating we live within at least 10 dimensions.
But hey, someone have designed a 4 dimensional cube object but it can only be perceived through our 3 dimensional reality.
Your interpretation of truth as filtered through your eyes doesn't make it so.
Cults are everywhere. Some can even be found inside 'religious institutions'.

Who'd of thought?
Jesus doesn't fit the microscope of our limited and tainted perceptions.

reply to post by Lucius Driftwood

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So Zeus, Horus, Krishna, Mythra, and all the other gods can exist. Why would anyone "NEED" Jesus? People can live their life fine without a belief in Jesus.

reply to post by Lucius Driftwood

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Pearls !!!!!!!!!!!!

reply to post by SimonPeter

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Not everyone reading is a swine, my friend.
But I hear what you're saying.
Shalom

reply to post by autowrench

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Because of this thread, I have already gotten a bunch of hate mail, but hey....I knew that was coming. I haven't seen one of them offer any refute as yet.

what ever happened to love your enemies?
like king james did.

this is my problem with self professed christians:
the diference between preach and practice.

reply to post by SimonPeter

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Created the Sun? God WAS the Sun for thousands of years, look up Ra if you doubt me. There are a lot of Bibles, friend, you must me one of those who thinks they are all just alike? Well, you have to read, and compare. That preacher you listen to doesn't always tell the truth, you know. He/She just says what they think is true.
Let me see, different versions of the Bible....
1. The Septuagint: 250 C.E. Written in Greek
2. Vulgate: 400 C.E. First version of the Bible which is canonized at the Council of Carthage in 400 C.E. Written in Latin
3. Martin Luther's German Bible: 1534 C.E.
4. King James Version: 1611 C.E. The most widely used version. It contains a large number of errors, and it is widely understood that none of the original writers had an understanding of the Hebrew Language.
5. Revised Standard Version: 1952 C.E. Liberal translation into American English which used the earliest possible text
6. New International Version: (NIV) published during the 1960's and 1970's. This is a conservative, contemporary English version
7. Jerusalem Bible: 1966 C.E. This is the first version of the Bible to be commissioned by the Catholic Church since the 400's.
9. New Revised Standard Version: 1990 C.E. This is the most academic and scholarly version with the most accurately possible translations of the original text.
(Sources: Wikipedia, and others.)
In truth, there are as many as 50 different English versions of the Bible. Why are they different, you ask? If you, or any other modern reader were to pick up and try to read 1611 King James Version of the Bible, it would be virtually unreadable. Everything from the spelling, to syntax, to grammar, to phraseology is very different. Modern linguists state that the English language alone has changed more in the past 400 years than the Greek language has changed in the past 2000 years. The English Language is constantly evolving, constantly changing. Fierce loyalty to a particular version of the Bible is illogical, and is very counterproductive.
Here is a good page on the different versions and translations....
Bibles - different versions, translations, etc.

Originally posted by SimonPeter
reply to post by Lucius Driftwood

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Don't throw your pearls to the swine .It's hard to not answer and proclaim Jesus but some of these people came on this site to destroy faith not to find faith . You faith is the target not theirs .

That is exactly how some of us feel about you Christians. We come here and educate you, inform you of things you do not know, and you damn us for it, condemn us to Hell, and call us names and insult us in the name of your Godman. Sometimes we feel as though we are casting pearls to swine. Perhaps if some of you could offer some tangible proof of concept, and original text of rules and stories.....all we ever get is parroting of the same rhetoric, based on the same dogma, supported by the same Bible quotes, each and every time, like clockwork.

Vladimir Lenin said, A lie told often enough.... becomes truth.

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