Killing babies no different from abortion, experts say

reply to post by Lazyninja


Again right wing is Nazi, left wing is communist.
Both advocate Eugenics though...

Originally posted by Unity_99
reply to post by marg6043

 

Handicapped is no excuse either. A society is judged by how it treats the least of its members. Human life is not valued at how useful a slave you are.

My earliest memories started before one month of age and remember my infancy.

edit on 29-2-2012 by Unity_99 because: (no reason given)

I call B.S on this. It isn't possible to have memories from before you were one month old. I took a child growth and development class and was told that studies show the earliest memories can be formed are around 6 months, but even then it was more like memorization.

No source, I'm recalling this from memory (no pun intended).

I'm not advocating killing babies under 6 months old, but don't sit there and tell me your earliest memories were from before one month old just to strengthen your argument

reply to post by Unity_99



I bet they got the idea from South Park, there was an episode years back when I was stationed in easter Europe where Cartman's mother went to the doctor to ask for an abortion, the doctor asked how long has she been pregnant, her response was, no he 8 years old and I think I made a mistake...

If memory serves she then slept with the mayor or Clinton to request the law be changed so she could have Cartman aborted...

I would never defend the freedom of a person that believed in abortion after birth...

I am shocked, soldiers getting killed next door to me in Afghanistan and they demand we apologies about the burning of Koran's (and I am Muslim but do not believe its worth murder)...a 3/4 million dollar half soccer field built in Guitmo approved by the DOD or White House...and now this...makes me sick...

going back to my vantage to take a nap...

Marine Sniper...

Saw that earlier, and the whole thing is beyond SICK! They talk about ethics, and freedom, and advocate killing helpless babies??? Those people are no different from old child sacrifice cults. SICK SICK SICK.

To those saying abortion should be a right, why, exactly? That IS a baby. Not tissue, not a "potential human", but a living person, simply at an earlier life stage. I have seen early ultrasounds. You can see the heartbeat at 5-6 weeks. At 11-12, you can see a face, hands, feet, fingers and toes. These children have their own DNA, their own bodies, and they have a right to live. No, not even for rape could I condone such a thing. I once knew someone that was raped, and became pregnant. Single girl that attended my church. Her parents called the baby"theirs" to protect her reputation, but her friends knew the truth. She said, quite simply, that aborting her daughter would have been wrong, as that would punish the child for the crime of the father. Beautiful little girl, too. Abortion is always wrong. I would gladly die for any of my kids, and would have before they were born as well.

Besides which, when a society fails to protect the most helpless members, that society has failed utterly.

reply to post by Pigraphia

A fetus, baby whatever you want to call it isn't actually shooting back at you.

Not while it is inutero... but it certainly will have that capability if you let it grow in the womb and become a fully formed fetus who is born and grows up.
Like no kid has ever shot his parents? Kid around here killed his with a hammer.


You need to leave what is in a womans stomach up to her.

reply to post by newcovenant


I honestly don't care what your position is on the matter I am just suggesting you need a better argument.
Your comparison to a kid growing up and attacking their parents probably does your argument a disservice even more so.
It almost puts it into the absurd.

reply to post by LadyGreenEyes


Playing devils advocate because even the devil needs help sometimes.

What if carrying the baby to term would kill the mother?
It happens all the time.

What if carrying the baby to term would kill the mother and the baby?
This is also possible.

For this argument both situations are discoverable months before term is reached.

Originally posted by Pigraphia
reply to post by Lazyninja

 

Again right wing is Nazi, left wing is communist.
Both advocate Eugenics though...

I'm not gonna get into it, but the Nazis were socialists.

Hitler was hostile to capitalism. The Nazis pushed free healthcare, guaranteed jobs, abortion, euthanasia, gun control, control of the private sector, racial quota systems in hiring, abolished market lending, and heavily increased entitlements. The Nazis were, very OBVIOUSLY, leftwing.

reply to post by Lazyninja


You're not gonna get into it but then you get into it.

Far right is commonly associated with persons or groups who hold extreme nationalist, xenophobic, racist, religious fundamentalist, or reactionary views.[10] Typically the term is applied to fascists and neo-Nazis,[11] although there is a running dispute among scholars about where fascism resides along the left/right spectrum.[12][13][14][15] However major elements of fascism have been deemed as clearly far right, such as its goals of the right of superior people to dominate while purging society of claimed inferior elements; and in the case of Nazism, genocide of people deemed to be inferior.[16]

And

The far right claims that superior people should proportionally have greater rights than inferior people.[5] The far right has historically supported elitist society based on belief of the legitimacy of the rule of a claimed superior minority over the inferior masses;

Claiming superiority and inferiority yup sounds like Hitler to me.

source

Hitler actually hated socialism because socialism means everyone is equal.

Socialism is far left, Nazi fascism is far right.

You may not associate the far right as wrong or fascist but it is.
Just as the far left is fascism of a different light.
Both want to remove individual rights.

Too far right or left is very bad either way.

I understand the anti-abortion argument, but I cannot stand by the religious undertones of it all.

If a woman feels that she cannot fully support a child and needs to have an abortion why not support her decision? It does not impede your ability to live your life the same way you have been, yet creating legislature that stops the woman from doing so would impede hers.

reply to post by Laokin


nothing better than seeing propaganda exposed.


great points. Circumstance is key

reply to post by BetterCallSaul


I did. I remembered it all my young years too. And described to mom the memory and the pink blanket, and the prickly grass, and feelign like I was slipping down a slope and crying to picked up, there was a lot of fear, and then a flash. She showed the pic and told me that it was taken in with a few other rolls of film a few weeks after it was taken and I was under a month old. And she also said that she had held me near the drop, but that this wasn't right at the drop, so that drop made a huge impression on me and caused fear. That is Object Permanence. They claim its at 6 months, and that babies think their rattles, their bottle, their moms even, just vanish when they're out of sight. And why do they think that, because babies can't speak and really don't share an interest in their tests but have rather simple needs, food, sleep and mom/dad.

At that time, I was screaming for the man to pick me up right now!

Also, I showed them where the high chair was put in later months, and never fed my infants peas or plain baby food because I knew what it tasted like and so always doctored things up with a dab of butter and a touch of salt, or even a touch of gravy, and alot of details from my first year of life, which I had quite a few memories of.

Your disbelief doesnt take away that lifelong reality of remembering. And the part about coming in like a shooting star, that I remembered from about 2 on, after asking myself where I came from? I always thought about things.

And they know very little about babies, they're people from birth, with consciousness and feel just like you do in a clear, meditative moment.

And I'm going to add this, when I was growing up, I thought everyone remembered, and it was quite to discover most don't. Though I've read a few other accounts.

You're not gonna get into it but then you get into it.

Yeah that was a hint that I just wanted to comment and was not interested in a reply.

You can't cherry pick a single defining characteristic for a political group and decide that's what defines the group. All political parties in history have been experiments with a mixture of policies. The fact that the Nazis were called the National Socialist Party should suggest something to you. In addition to their overwhelmingly left wing policies. In this case, eugenics, always has and always will be a socialist policy. Right wingers are against ideas such as eugenics, abortion, stem cell research and euthanasia while the left are the ones arguing that it's acceptable.

The reason nobody likes to associate socialism with Nazis is because modern socialists are uncomfortable being associated with a genocidal maniac, often saying the Nazis were "not real socialists" (I wonder who decides these things.) The fact is though that modern socialism isn't a hell of a lot different from Nazi socialism, the only thing missing from it is the blatant racism, and that's only because it's politically incorrect.

Well, I think that these people are devoid of ethics, human compassion thus are disabled and are a danger to everyone else. So therefore I think that it is perfectly reasonably acceptable to kill these creatures as they lack humanity therefore they are not human..

A new born baby is about as perfect as a human can be before people like those fowl creatures get their filth on them..

Can we make a law where it is okay to kill people who believe abortion is ok to do? That makes more sense than this.

First of all, did anyone finish reading the article? They said that a newborn baby and a fetus were basically the same, and this could be used as an argument against permitting abortion. Second, I do think that there are circumstances where an abortion would be necessary and even the right thing to do, but having carried a child, I can't imagine using abortion as a form of birth control or just out of convienence. Basically, do I think that 8 men on the Supreme Court and one woman get the right to make the call for every potenial mother? No.

reply to post by Pigraphia

What if carrying the baby to term would kill the mother? It happens all the time. What if carrying the baby to term would kill the mother and the baby? This is also possible.

Abortion to protect the life or health of the mother is an entirely different issue. It is basically no different than killing in defense, and even born adult persons are permitted to be killed in defense, not even talking about foetii. Even in countries where abortion is restricted or banned, it does not apply to risky pregnancy. Therefore this is kind of a strawman from the pro-choice side.

Posted this about 6 hours earlier than this thread here. www.abovetopsecret.com...

All those people claiming "they are right morally" or whatever other excuse you want to give, this gives just another precedent that will eventually lead to the view that "murdering humans for x reason is alright"...

We already have quite a few environlunatics who claim that the human population should be culled by the billions "because Gaia told them so" or "because some scientists claim is better for Earth, the world, and mankind", or whatever other excuse they want to give.

You don't think it will get this far?... It used to be that the "accepted view by the brainwashed masses was that "it is ok to abort a human fetus"... now they are moving to the direction that "it is ok to murder newborn babies for x reason"...

Heck, a group of scientists can come up with the claim that "the Earth is too populated and it would be morally, and logically reasonable to murder a couple billion people for the good of the world and the rest of mankind"...

This should be stopped right now, it is not ok, nor moral to murder newborn babies, nor a human fetus...

Originally posted by Pigraphia
reply to post by Lazyninja

 

Again right wing is Nazi, left wing is communist.
Both advocate Eugenics though...

Obviously you are completely ignorant of the history of Nazi Germany...

Nazi stands for Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei (National [size=]Socialist German Workers' Party).

Nazis were National SOCIALISTS and very leftwing. They just differed in ideology from other forms of socialism/communism just like Stalin and Lenin differed in their ideas on communism.

Socialists/communists have a LOOOOOONG history of turning against each other and even murdering each other if one section of the leftwing ideology was in the way of what the other leftwingers wanted to achieve.

Stalin, for example, went so far as to send death squads against other communists including Trotsky who wrote a journal explaining how a death squad of Stalin was sent to kill him on several occasions until he was murdered by poison...

So the fact that the Nazis were very anti-communists doesn't make them any less leftwing...

Originally posted by Unity_99
[My earliest memories started before one month of age and remember my infancy.

I have two womb memories. Supposedly it can't happen. But it really did.

1st memory ... noise. I remember being in the womb, sitting, with my left side towards my mothers stomach/heart etc. It was loud and I used to like putting my head towards the outside because it was quieter. But then one day a horrific noise came through on that side. It kept happening. I didn't like it one bit.

Of course, I didn't have words at that time to say what I just said. I just remember the feelings and now that I have words to match up to them I can explain it.

Turns out that when my mother was 8 months pregnant she went with my father to some very loud stock car races. She says that every time the cars went by it was very loud and I would 'stiffen up' inside her stomach. I think that memory has to be that incident.

2nd memory ... feeling hurt and burned inside the womb. It was like a crawling burning feeling that hurt. Of course, I didn't have language at that time so I'm using my language now to explain it. Turns out that at 9 months pregnant my mother had both xrays and had to take some labor drug to try to induce labor ... which didn't happen so they went in to get me. I came out all peeled and raw .. burned.