Is Lucifer Actually God?

However, according to scripture, Lucifer IS God's brother.

Where did you get that from ?, maybe we are talking about another god ? a lord, not the universal creator.

Lucifer wants to be God.

Lucifer is the light bringer.

God was in darkness before making the ether and manifest world.

Lucifer is fallen, like man.

There is one God, creator of all.

Originally posted by zroth
God was in darkness before making the ether and manifest world.

God is the light and darkness at the same time, alpha and omega.

Satan yes, is on the light side, the red pillar that has to do with knowlege, logic and force, it's why he is called lucifer.

There are other beings also on the light side that are servants of god, so being on the light side does not make you a bad apple. It's just that you can be on the light side and chose to do bad things. None the dark or the light are bad, only if you decide to make bad out of them, if you twist tings, use them in a way.

Lucifer is fallen, like man.

You got that right, it's why it's called hum-"AN" a good indication that m"AN" is fallen from god's grace along with the "AN"unnaki.

reply to post by Lucifer777

I see no good reason to attempt to agrue against your position; I consider the criticism and ridicule of religious fanaticism to be a revolutionary activity and it is not just a form of entertainment or a hobby; it is of great importance to the future of humankind.

Thanks, i consider it of extreme importance too. I too, consider this type of preaching and fanaticism to be direct threat to civilisation. Now i have affirmed you are fighting my fight. I grow tired of those who state "why don't people just respect each other's beliefs" - It's a lot more serious than they think as you've explained in your post.

My concern isn't only with religion, It's the cold reading that has been used by preists, fortune tellers and mediums. The charlatans, crooks, huxters and frauds who can get away with anything provided they attain the faith of followers.

Keep up the good work comrade,

Like you,

Awake and Aware

reply to post by awake_and_aware


Hey again,
I really admire your posts,kudos for being so on top of it all and having such a breadth of knowledge and open mind... Just wanted to bring some things up and see what you think of them.

What do you think is in store for the future of humanity on this planet? In my mind the Natural progression or evolution of a concious bearing species occupying the same planet, at some point will have to dissolve all differences and cooperate, same way tribes, communities, and cities, have come about and stayed about. Perhaps this is the reason for much anxiety and hush surrounding NWO and globalization type things, we are all caught in a large wave of heavy history. Perhaps the Illuminati or enlightened ones realized and forsaw long ago that globalization was the only clear path into a future of technological advancement and human progression.

So is our plan to keep on progressing until we reach the stages of assumably much advanced alien civilizations while constantly exercising and pushing our own and collective potential?

How this relates possibly to the story of adam and eve and lucifer... I think the story of adam and eve is expressing how early life must have been to experience life without all the complications of technologically dependant, detail and drama filled more modern versions of life...How the natural and original way of life set up by the forces beyond human wills and wants was a mysterious playground, where it was possible for the most imaginative creatures to run free and test their strengths and wits, view endless drama unfold infront and within their being, struggle and succeed. As Danbones said earlier about how lucifer is the act of observing,disecting,learning,judging nature from the confines of nowhere else but ones mind... It seems that the story of adam and eve is describing the downfall of humanity from being one with the chaotic act of natural earth life/death, to questioning all aspects and making rules and structures and becoming seperate. I can imagine the idea of eternal life being true If one views themselves as a piece of the earth whereas after they sprout and grow,and wilt, they will return to the source that allowed them to be in the first place, and this is the process that has been going on seemingly forever here.. Also the fact that all natural events on this planet, the fact that they exist and occur, is sheer bloody briliance and miraculous., that a lion exists or an epic flower, what mind could have created the idea of a lion, it is a majestic thing, all animals are, all creation is.( dont mean this in a religious sense, just a cell that is surprised it is part of a body) It is amazing that in whatever this thing that a universe is, all that is, has been, and all events from small to large can occur on this planet,the color and shape filled beauty of pure natural vision, feelings of fear or love or comfort or joy, souls who are close with you and who you may share your mind and emotions with, memories and thoughts which are yours and could not have been unless you had been there to obtain them .. But I also dont know if the story of adam and eve is saying that this downfall is bad or if it is even escapable, I think it is hinting that it maybe inevitable or destined, for when it says downfall they are saying downfall from that position as slightly heightened creatures in the animal kingdom, keepers of the garden, enjoyers of that heaven. Could it be that the serpant that tempted eve towards understanding and wanting to know good and evil, maybe this means starting to disect acts of nature and creating rules and laws, Could it be that the serpant is a metaphor for time itself. I have heard the term cosmic serpant tossed around before, and I believe personally that time itself is an unescapable force of change, a force that may not even physically and objectivly exist as we believe it does, but its effects are seen throughout the scope of the universal moment. Maybe this force of time can even be viewed as a slightly evil entity from the point of view of a body bearer for it is also the force that takes from us those we know and love and ourselves, also the striving for humans to gain imortality or be concious in an eternal heaven is the craving to void time and hold onto and stay with the moment you are attached to .. So what im thinking is that the catalyst of time itself, is the cause of humans to question existence, personal and group feelings and actions, once we had a break from hunting and could look at our hands and say wait a second, what am i, where am i, why am i, how am i? Although I personally would enjoy a life spent wondering the land with constant adventure, I can see how just plainly living life to enjoy and live is completly opposite from creating an environment suitable to solve and implement the universes mysteries and powers, and technologically and conciously evolving towards new and better? possibilities of understanding and living life.

God and Lucifer seem to have essentially the same characteristics, powers.

They're super smart, very powerful, and if we read the Bible, both are up to constant mischief.

Many of the biblical stories read just fine if you substitute the one over the other. Not much difference.

SO MUCH for that.

But what does our experience teach us?

The sun seems to shine on the just, and the unjust. The rain is just the rain.

"Ewa does not take sides..." (A good line out of Avatar)

What we see, if we open our eyes is that things are the way they are, and adding gods and devils doesn't help much.

The deeper question might not be whether god is good, or Lucifer is "bad".

First, we need to decide what exactly is "good" and "bad"?

The ancient Greeks have already discussed these points in detail, and there seemed to be no need to really invoke the gods to get to the answers. In fact, the Greeks, especially Plato / Socrates, went to lengths to demonstrate what a cop-out it was to invoke deities at all.

Ultimately, God and Satan, and Lucifer, demons and the Saints, etc. They're just metaphors. I'm not saying there isn't a god or creator, or dark entities, but from our very limited perspective, they're all likely to look quite similar, all rather "divine", certainly powerful, in comparison to our modest experiences.

So, I say, ditch the labels on these mythical entities.

Wouldn't it be far more "enlightened" to simply label their behaviors, or the character of their commands?

For example, if "God" told you to sacrifice (kill) your son, is it a "good" command, or a bad one? If our answer is found in the Bible, and the person in question ends up one of the greatest heroes in the book, then we still don't get it, IMO. And yet, isn't the "correct" answer obvious?

And what's wrong with asking about the "obvious"? Later in that book someone asked if it was OK to pull your ox out of a ditch if it fell in on the sabbath. Yeah, good question, but duh!

Humanity still has such a long ways to go...

JR

God and Lucifer seem to have essentially the same characteristics, powers.

I don't think so, if were talking about someone else then yes, Satan plays God and plays the Devil. It's a game, care to join in the game ? If were talking about God, the supreme creator of the Universe then no, it is not a game.
You see the bible and religion in general is made up to game humanity, to train it and out of the game comes something but it ain't like it's suppose to be.

The religios god is Satan, Satan plays god then plays his role.
If I were Satan and I wanted to gain advantage first I would make a book out of stories and twist it to my advantage, put all the stories I see fit, twist them around and then sell it as a book.
Take the bible for example it contains some truth but it's mixed and twisted around and corrupted, some stories changed around, some books not included because they did not fit the agenda, some translated wrong, different
gods are put into a single god, everything in the bible is cut short as to explenation.

Humanity is like a video game puppet A and puppet B have the same master controling them, but puppet A and B are fighting each other to the sadistic satisfaction of the puppet master that is in control of the puppets, puppets on a string, deep asleep is what humanity is at this time.

Originally posted by pepsi78

God and Lucifer seem to have essentially the same characteristics, powers.

I don't think so, if were talking about someone else then yes, Satan plays God and plays the Devil. It's a game, care to join in the game ? If were talking about God, the supreme creator of the Universe then no, it is not a game.
You see the bible and religion in general is made up to game humanity, to train it and out of the game comes something but it ain't like it's suppose to be.

The religios god is Satan, Satan plays god then plays his role.
If I were Satan and I wanted to gain advantage first I would make a book out of stories and twist it to my advantage, put all the stories I see fit, twist them around and then sell it as a book.
Take the bible for example it contains some truth but it's mixed and twisted around and corrupted, some stories changed around, some books not included because they did not fit the agenda, some translated wrong, different
gods are put into a single god, everything in the bible is cut short as to explenation.

Humanity is like a video game puppet A and puppet B have the same master controling them, but puppet A and B are fighting each other to the sadistic satisfaction of the puppet master that is in control of the puppets, puppets on a string, deep asleep is what humanity is at this time.

OK, I'll play the game a little. Or, maybe not.

I'm probably misunderstanding you, but you mention that if we're talking about "God" the supreme creator, then it's not a "game", but then go on to say humanity is being controlled by sadistic puppet masters?

Sure, the Bible is a mess, and the little bit of "truth" therein is mostly neutralized, IMO, considering the whole, the context if you will. But, even when we put that aside, we might still wonder about the "creator", and what "he" might be up to.

And then, we look at our real experiences, and might logically conclude that "he" can't be "good" in the usual sense. Perhaps it's possible in a much greater context, but there's lots of problems with trying to make that work, asn anyone who has fooled with theodicies knows all too well.

So, that leaves us wondering if our idea of a "creator" is anywhere close at all. Maybe there is one, but whoever, whatever it is, it just doesn't measure up real well to our ideas of truth and justice, and fairness dare I say. Which I think is why we came up with the notions we did. Like good stories, that always need a "black-hat" character, and some perhaps noble conflict, etc. We seem to have written characters into "life", with the ancients giving them personalities almost, that many of inherit today, especially those of a religious bent.

So, you say the game is not like it's "supposed" to be? Well, I can maybe buy that, but no doubt you might get into the religious realm real quick, the minute you depart from what "is", in favor of what we would like things to be.

JR

Originally posted by babybunnies
No, he's not God.

However, according to scripture, Lucifer IS God's brother.

Therefore, not surprising people get them confused.

Actually according to the gnostic scriptures he would be Christ's bastard brother, who was created outside of the union between the Father-Mother and the Mother-Father; the Mother-Father created a being without the permission of her creator the Father-Mother. The first name is Yaltabaoth, the second is Saklas (“fool”), and the third is Samael. And he is impious in his arrogance which is in him. For he said, "I am God and there is no other God beside me," for he is ignorant of his strength, the place from which he had come.

Because he was hidden from the Father-Mother and the rest of the perfect Aeon.

Here is one place the story is found.

www.gnosis.org...

Don't know if someone else pointed this out, but the word "Lucifer" is in fact a Latin word, meaning it was made up, the word, anyway, by the Roman Catholic Church. Latin is their secret language you know. I have always thought of Lucifer as an ET who saw that Yahweh was planning to enslave mankind, and keep knowledge from them, so he intervened.

Originally posted by autowrench
Don't know if someone else pointed this out, but the word "Lucifer" is in fact a Latin word, meaning it was made up, the word, anyway, by the Roman Catholic Church. Latin is their secret language you know. I have always thought of Lucifer as an ET who saw that Yahweh was planning to enslave mankind, and keep knowledge from them, so he intervened.

It's what I'm trying to explain here really, that us people are a mix between god's choice and satan, satan and the aliens, fallen angels call them whatever you want.

Latin or roman is the language that derived from them. The curch of catholic is nothing but the church of Satan.

Notice these connecting words.

ROM-AN
SAT-AN
HUM-AN

From the Sumerian god AN and the ANnunaki comes satan, satan has mingled with humanity, it's teachings and maybe even alteration of our self and how we once were. Hum"an"s are the result of first god then satan's teachings and alterations. So as I view it Satan made the roman empire and is part of the roman empire, part of the religions, and part of the occult that hides behinds crowns and roiality.

reply to post by ImaFungi

Hey again,
I really admire your posts,kudos for being so on top of it all and having such a breadth of knowledge and open mind... Just wanted to bring some things up and see what you think of them.

Please, don't inflate my ego - I'm definetly not on "top if it all" and my knowledge is as narrow as a stream compared to the rivers of knowledge out there. Thanks all the same for nice comments all the same.

You've written quite a lot to think about so i'll try answer one of your queries and share my thoughts the best i can:-

What do you think is in store for the future of humanity on this planet?

I cannot profess a knowledge of the future in regards for human affairs. But i can tell you what we know for certain.....

The Andromeda gallaxy is on a collision course with the Milky Way, not before our star heats up and boils our oceans, and ultimately making it impossible for the Earth to support life.

I think the only logical step for humanity is the final frontier - To escape the (soon-to-be) dangerous confines of Earth.

We need to unify, drop the slave-based monetary economy system, and drop the ancient apocolyptic beliefs in a deity.

Most preachers, and many followers of religion do not care about the on-coming armageddon, whether man-made or nature-made

For all I know it is within the providence of God that the human race should destroy itself in this manner [nuclear war].

"Dr. Geoffrey Fisher, the Archbishop of Canterbury" talking about a nuclear armageddon.

A belief in God, can cause people to not care about disasters, man or nature made. As long as you have "faith" you will be saved - What apocolyptic nonsense to preach

This is what we need to be VERY vigilant towards, especially if we want to save our species.

We need to unify, drop the slave-based monetary economy system, and drop the ancient apocolyptic beliefs in a deity.

Sad to say, friend, that will never happen. Case in point: Christianity has many, many sects, none agree with the others, some see the others as Satanists and Evil. In the Muslim world we have extremists and moderates, and again, many sects, none of which is in agreement with the others. And Each, Christians and Muslims both see the other as Satanists or worse, and each think the other should all be put to the sword. These religions will fight each other until the end of time, and nothing will every change their minds about anything, for their beliefs are set into stone, and never change. The funny thing is, they all, for the most part are monotheists, and claim there is only one God. As far as this writer is concerned, all of them are blind and brainwashed.

reply to post by loagun


To answer your thread's title, no, Lucifer is not the God of the Holy Bible. But he is the god of this world, earth. Go figure?

reply to post by loagun


I have wrote a thread concerning exactly this

Antichrist = The Savior

he can be both .. depending on which side you are

reply to post by loagun

Over the last winter I have watched so many videos pertaining to ancient history, and read a ton of information on it, and now I am at the cross roads where my question is 'is Lucifer God?'

It all depends on your understanding/interpretations of these videos. Somebody else would reach a different conclusion. All subjective.

If anyone is at the point where they have done enough research into the past I would love to hear their opinion. I am however not interested in hearing answers from anyone that is a full blown Catholic, Christian, etc that is going to tell me 'the devil, the devil' for it will be irrelevant to me.

Im not exactly christian and Im not going to say the devil, the devil.

Your still stuck in your brainwashing, and that's okay for you specifically, because you still have time to 'wake up'.

And you believe you have woken up because... you have another set of beliefs?

The Holy Bible does not go nearly far enough back into history to be taken as 'Gods' word, because if you do the research you can clearly see who, as in what group, wrote it. I will just add that I am not saying Jesus doesn't exist so don't throw that at me. I am just pointing to the authors of the Bible.

True. I dont debate the fact that it was written by humans. The authors of the bible were people like you and me. But the idea of a divine being is not exclusive to the bible. Its as old as human history itself.

So given the extraordinary amount of evidence that is being uncovered by us non-elite (our 'awakening') about Divine intervention all things point to the question, 'Is Lucifer God?' Is the whole Lucifer is the Devil thing the greatest conspiracy itself?

What is this extraordinary amount of evidence? What exactly were you supposed to find extraordinary evidence for in the first place?

And given how your entire argument till now simply doubted the argument of the authenticity of the Bible...so why does the conclusion have to 'Is Lucifer God?" ???
I cant make anything of it. If you have any documentation that supports your theory? I would be more than happy to discuss this with you.

reply to post by autowrench

Sad to say, friend, that will never happen.

I'll come to you for more prophecies!

Originally posted by loagun
Over the last winter I have watched so many videos pertaining to ancient history, and read a ton of information on it, and now I am at the cross roads where my question is 'is Lucifer God?'

If anyone is at the point where they have done enough research into the past I would love to hear their opinion. I am however not interested in hearing answers from anyone that is a full blown Catholic, Christian, etc that is going to tell me 'the devil, the devil' for it will be irrelevant to me. Your still stuck in your brainwashing, and that's okay for you specifically, because you still have time to 'wake up'. The Holy Bible does not go nearly far enough back into history to be taken as 'Gods' word, because if you do the research you can clearly see who, as in what group, wrote it. I will just add that I am not saying Jesus doesn't exist so don't throw that at me. I am just pointing to the authors of the Bible.


So given the extraordinary amount of evidence that is being uncovered by us non-elite (our 'awakening') about Divine intervention all things point to the question, 'Is Lucifer God?' Is the whole Lucifer is the Devil thing the greatest conspiracy itself?

Honestly I don't like labelling myself, and I think "religion" is something personal, but to answer your question I must admit that I'm a Luciferian. My story is simple, Yes "Lucifer" is the one, or what you want to call him. I once was intrested in becoming a Christian, but those days where filled with fear and paranoia, I was really afraid that I was doing wrong also when I "asked" for something (like: knowledge or answers) I received:0.

Now I'm receiving knowledge everyday, I'm not really afraid of doing wrong and I get what I want. And please don't think in material ways but more like a peacefull mind, answers to questions, insight in human behaviour and other related things, helpfull people around me and things like that.

When becoming "Lucierian" you will immeadetly start notice the changes around you and in your mind, only the "true" God is capable of this, and that says it all. But again, it's a personal choice....

Originally posted by Hawking
It seems to me that much of the Bible shows God in the position of power over man, who is not worthy of his knowledge and ability. In stories like the tower of Babel, God is shown confusing man in order to better control him.

Lucifer, or the "Light-bringer/Light-bearer" is thrown out of Heaven for wanting God's knowledge and power. Depending on how you interpret a lot of this, it would seem that God is an oppressive force trying to keep man from attaining certain enlightenment and ability.

I have also been putting a lot of thought in to this and how we are coming to a point in technology that is making us God-like. Are we going to be put down again by God or enlightened?

edit on 20-4-2011 by Hawking because: (no reason given)

Lucifer is thrown out of "heaven" because he is the real one, YHWH is the angry one who has taken the power and manipulated the bible and story's to control people. YHWH=the deceiver !!

reply to post by notimportant


So if Lucifer was the "real one" as you say, how did he get beat and thrown out of heaven? Who is more powerful?

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