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Obama Birth Certificate; 'Document allegedly obtained in Kenya sent to every member of Congress'

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posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 08:05 AM
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reply to post by InvisibleAlbatross
 



The 'appropriate' people? You are joking? Those would be the same people who had a vested interest in hiding cover up!

Not to mention that the 'appropriate people' are employees of the American people, and so if the people require confirmation of the legitimacy of his birth documents, the Government has a duty to provide it to them.




posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 08:13 AM
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reply to post by aero56
 


What exactly do you think is the problem for him to provide his full BC? Given that this doubt exists amongst the people he has sworn to serve, and who pay his wages, and who have the power to keep him in office or not, what good reason could he have to keep it secret? If he has provided the short form, and everything is legitimate, what reason could he have to refuse to provide the long form?

It is such a simple request, why on earth would he refuse?

In the run up to Nov voting, if he wants to keep his votes, wouldn't it be more logical for him to provide the information which people are asking for, allay their suspicions and in doing so, prevent the loss of votes which this situation will otherwise undoubtedly engender?



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 08:26 AM
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Originally posted by wcitizen
What exactly do you think is the problem for him to provide his full BC?


Why should he? There is no need for it, and just how does he get it, as Hawaii does not issue them anymore....


Given that this doubt exists amongst the people


There is only "doubt" amongst birthers, and no matter what documentation he shows they will not accept it!


In the run up to Nov voting, if he wants to keep his votes, wouldn't it be more logical for him to provide the information which people are asking for, allay their suspicions and in doing so, prevent the loss of votes


Birthers would not vote for him anyway...



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 08:46 AM
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Originally posted by wcitizen
so if the people require confirmation of the legitimacy of his birth documents, the Government has a duty to provide it to them.


If these people came up with something that was even partially credible, that indicated a problem, I would agree with you. But otherwise, this is fantasy. The government has no such duty.

So many times I see people repeat these kinds of statements like they're fact or something. When the truth is that they have brought forth a statement that was generated in their brains about some "perfect world". But even in a perfect world, the Government would have NO duty to violate the privacy rights of an American Citizen without probably cause. If your perfect world contains the duty of the Government to violate the rights of citizens, I'm GLAD we don't live there!


Originally posted by wcitizen
What exactly do you think is the problem for him to provide his full BC?


We don't know that there is a problem. Maybe he just doesn't want to. Maybe he thinks what he has shown is proof enough. If it's good enough for the passport office, it should be good enough for the American people. Maybe it would show his parents weren't married and he'd rather keep that private (it's his right, you know). Any reason we speculate is just that. Speculation.


It is such a simple request, why on earth would he refuse?


Whatever the reasons are, they are his and none of our business. Maybe he's tired of people treating him like a dog. Maybe he's had enough with this distraction. Maybe he knows that the birthers would just move the goalposts... Again.

Maybe it's because no other president has ever been treated like this and he refuses to have to answer to higher expectations and standards than the American public has EVER demanded of ANY other president before him.

Just because you have the question, doesn't mean you deserve an answer. ESPECIALLY when it's about another citizen's private matters.



In the run up to Nov voting, if he wants to keep his votes, wouldn't it be more logical for him to provide the information which people are asking for, allay their suspicions and in doing so, prevent the loss of votes which this situation will otherwise undoubtedly engender?


Ha! Do you think there is ONE person in this nation - One birther that's clamoring for Obama's birth certificate - that would ever, in a million years, vote for him??? Most of the people who want the BC are only interested because they hate Obama's policies and want him OUT. There is NO WAY this fringe element is going to vote for him and he knows it.



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 11:33 AM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 





Maybe it's because no other president has ever been treated like this and he refuses to have to answer to higher expectations and standards than the American public has EVER demanded of ANY other president before him.


Bush was treated exactly like this. What did he do? He released his College Transcripts, he released his military records, he admitted to experimenting with Cocaine and alcohol too much in college. He took a lot of heat for being forthcoming while Kerry took the high road and pretended to be an academic. Then Kerry's records were leaked and it turned out his GPA was worse than Bush's, LOL!

You take the oath of the highest office in the land. You command the deadliest and most well-equipped military the Earth has ever seen. You take charge of the largest economy in the world. You break racial barriers that have never been broken. I think he can handle a little criticism and microscopic evaluation of his credentials. I think he can at least give up the information that is requested of him. If he has made mistakes in his past, fine, who hasn't. If he has regrets, fine, he doesn't. If he has something important enough to hide, then we need to find it!!



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 11:36 AM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 





Ha! Do you think there is ONE person in this nation - One birther that's clamoring for Obama's birth certificate - that would ever, in a million years, vote for him???


I would still vote for him over McCain or Palin! I voted for him the first time. I like his energy, I like his willingness to take giant chances. I like how he started running things even before he took his oath in January. I like how he took charge by appointing a million czars, so that he has an ear to the ground in all arenas. I hate the monstrosity of a Healthcare Bill that was created, but I like the fact that he kept their nose to the grindstone and kept telling Dems and Reps if you don't like it, fix it, and bring it back to me. I hate the Bailout Bill, but I like that he was willing to take immediate action.

So, although I have disagreed with a lot of his policy making so far, he could still win my vote if I feel he is honest and making decisions based on his own conscious and morality. I don't have to agree with a leader to follow them, I just have to know that they are in the fight with me, and they are as committed and loyal as I am.



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 11:41 AM
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reply to post by getreadyalready
 


If he has something important enough to hide, then we need to find it!!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I think this is the crux of the birther mindest.
They hate Obama and his politics.
They are sure there is some reason he's not the legally elected President.
They cling to a ridiculous straw that he will be removed from office somehow: finding nothing, they obess with the "birther" issue.
Pathetic.
It's nearly two years into his administration. Birthers have provided ZERO evidence of wrongdoing.
It's over guys! Obama won. If you don't like him think of 2012, not some fictional stupid "conspiracy"!



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 11:52 AM
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Originally posted by getreadyalready
Bush was treated exactly like this.


I don't remember ANYONE challenging Bush to prove that he was who he said he was.
I don't remember anyone demanding that Bush prove the hospital he was born in.
I don't remember anyone asking for Bush's birth certificate or challenging his religion or sexuality, either.

No, Bush wasn't treated exactly like this at all.


Originally posted by getreadyalready
If he has something important enough to hide, then we need to find it!!


There's a difference between "hiding" something and keeping one's private life private. You're assuming that he's hiding something. You have nothing on which to base that assumption.

Yes, I know he spent 1.4 million dollars on lawyers. That doesn't prove that he's "hiding something" from us. That's another assumption. There's no indication that he's hiding anything. That's the basis of the birther position. And it's a big IF...

So, there is one person who would MAYBE vote for him if he released the details of his personal life. You got me there.



edit on 9/14/2010 by Benevolent Heretic because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 11:53 AM
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reply to post by OldDragger
 


Did you not read my entire post? I am one of the ones questioning his birth. I am also one of the ones that voted for him, and might even do it again.

I don't "hate" Obama, and I am not out on some rampage to get him out of office. I still think he was the best choice in 2008, even though I don't agree with a lot of what he has done while in office.

The only point here is that either he has nothing to hide and should give us full disclosure on his background, birth, education, etc. OR he does have something to hide, and if that is the case, we need people like the birthers out trying to find it. This is not a witch hunt, and the longer and more protected his records become, the harder people will try to find the answers. This could all be over if he would just come clean, and then get back to the issues of running the country.



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 12:02 PM
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reply to post by getreadyalready
 


The exception to the rule then.
I doubt if many bithers voted Obama.
Doesn't change me premise.



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 12:17 PM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 





So, there is one person who would MAYBE vote for him if he released the details of his personal life. You got me there.


I didn't say "Maybe." I said I "WOULD" vote for him again, if my choices were the same as last time.

He is still a stronger leader with more heart and grit than McCain or Palin. Even with all of Obama's mysteries, I still trust him to run the country more than I would the other choices. I would love to vote for Ron Paul, but he doesn't even take his self seriously enough to stay off those stupid AJ radio shows so how am I supposed to take him seriously. The other decent Republican candidates now have talk shows and are probably making far too much money to consider running again. At this moment in time, I would vote for Obama again, even though I don't like the direction he is headed, at least he is headed there with commitment and strong leadership, and I can respect that.



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 12:28 PM
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The man who has personally spearheaded the movement to see Obama's BC wrote an interesting commentary today that may serve to explain how many people feel regarding the issue at hand. This is not about Kenya but the BC issue in general.


For more than two years now, I have given Barack Obama the benefit of the doubt.

That may be hard to fathom for some because of my admittedly relentless and tireless pursuit of the truth about his origins and his constitutional eligibility for office.

After all, I am the guy who has posted this question on billboards across America: "Where's the birth certificate?"

But I really have given Obama the benefit of the doubt until now. I have asked the questions and directed the investigative reporting that has changed America's political landscape on the eligibility question. WND conducted the first national poll on this subject 15 months ago. Back then, we were shocked that 50 percent of Americans knew there was a controversy about his birth certificate and his eligibility – because WND is the only news organization in the country that pursued the story. Today, the latest polls show 58 percent of Americans don't believe Obama's story and suspect he is not eligible to serve.

That is a big shift in public opinion in a short period of time.

During that time, despite suggestions to the contrary, I never accused Obama of being born elsewhere. I never concluded he is constitutionally ineligible. I avoided speculation on what we might find if Obama ever did willingly and openly release his records as other presidents and presidential candidates have.

However, when Barack Obama insinuated to Brian Williams of NBC that he had done everything he could to quell America's curiosity and doubts about his constitutional eligibility for office – turning his own cover-up into an indictment of the people – I say the time for deference is over.




"I can't spend all of my time with my birth certificate plastered on my forehead," Obama told Williams in an interview on NBC's Nightly News.

With this kind of arrogance after the patience the American people have demonstrated over this matter, I'd say it's time to conclude that he is ineligible for office. He's had plenty of time to provide the evidence to clear himself of this charge, this suspicion, this indictment in the form of overwhelming public opinion.

He has failed to answer the charge. He has failed to enter a plea. He has failed to show up for a hearing. Therefore, I no longer afford him the presumption of innocence.

It's time to recognize what we have serving in the White House today – a pretender, a usurper, an arrogant narcissist who believes it's beneath him to answer the questions of the public and to demonstrate his worthiness for office.


The man holds the position of highest authority in our nation! He is not above any scrutiny whatsoever. If the truth stands to expose him as the liar that he appears to be, than so be it. It comes with the territory. Transparency... remember?? It is our business!!!! If his story is just one big falsehood It is OUR business.

When a person decides to run for public office his life is opened and on display. Why do you think so many politicians go to such lengths to conceal their indiscretions. At least until they serve enough years to believe that they are above any and all scrutiny.


Many in Washington, who are complicit in Obama's eligibility charade, and the establishment news media, who failed to provide the appropriate journalistic diligence and curiosity to hold Obama accountable, are still wishing, hoping and praying this issue and the public interest in it just fades away.

That isn't going to happen.

And for those who agree with me, it's time to ratchet up the pressure.

Let's just agree that Obama's indifference to calls from the public for transparency and honesty strongly suggests he has something to hide. Since he is a public servant sworn to uphold the Constitution, it is long past time for him to come clean, lay his cards on the table and prove his eligibility. We've given him that opportunity, and he has insulted those of us who now represent an overwhelming majority by political standards. Instead, he dishonestly plays the victim role, pretending he has done everything he can reasonably do to settle the matter.

Get the new, free, landmark study clearly showing why it's time for a reckoning on Obama's eligibility!

So, right here and now, I declare the president ineligible by default. Maybe he can prove I'm wrong. Maybe he can't. But the people cannot be expected to prove a negative.

I feel confident we'll soon learn the truth.

* What percentage of the public would have to express doubts about Obama's eligibility before it became a real story to the news media?

* What percentage of the public would have to express doubts about Obama's eligibility before he would condescend to providing the most basic evidence required for evaluation?

* What percentage of the public would have to express doubts about Obama's eligibility before controlling legal authorities at the state and federal level take appropriate actions to hold him accountable and to ensure America never faces another problem like this in the future?

Personally, I think we're very close to reaching the critical mass that will bring this issue to a head.


www.wnd.com...


edit on 14-9-2010 by jibeho because: double quote



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 12:32 PM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 



I don't remember ANYONE challenging Bush to prove that he was who he said he was.
I don't remember anyone demanding that Bush prove the hospital he was born in.
I don't remember anyone asking for Bush's birth certificate or challenging his religion or sexuality, either.



All of those things were already known about Bush. Instead, he was questioned relentlessly on his Education and Military records and the rumors of his drug and alcohol abuse. How did he handle it? He released the records and he came clean about the drug and alcohol accusations. After that, he was often criticized for it, but the heated debate and rumor mill was dead. It was a "presidential" thing to do. He got the focus back on the tasks at hand instead of all the conjecture and rumor and speculation.

Obama could do the exact same thing with a few simple and harmless acts. Release the college transcript. Release the entire birth certificate, or admit that one does not exist and that he released the only thing he has, and provide a suitable explanation for why. Simple. Presidential. Definitive. And it would get the focus of his energy and the energy of his opponents back on topics that matter.

As for his "sexuality." That argument is infinitely entertaining to me except for the rumors that people have lost their lives over it. To be perfectly honest, I wouldn't vote for an openly gay president, but if a good president was found out to have had gay encounters I wouldn't care. If somebody told me Kennedy or Reagan or Eisenhower or Truman or Lincoln or Jefferson had flings with other men, it wouldn't change my opinion in the least bit. However, I have an issue with openly Gay men that act femininly, so I couldn't vote for one if I knew it up front. That is just me.

My point is, if Obama continues aggressively attacking his agenda and history shows him to be a good President, then the sexuality doesn't matter. If he is indecisive and ineffective, then rumors of his sexuality will grow and blame will be placed on that aspect of his persona. It is his actions as president that will determine the outcome of his legacy, not his sexuality.



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 12:40 PM
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reply to post by lee anoma
 


OK, here goes.

It is a fact that it is that eligibility for the US Presidential candidacy nomination must comply with the Constitution.

It is a fact that it is very important to know about who Obama is, what his past is, and whether he has other allegiances

It is a fact that Tim Adams, a former Hawaii Elections Clerk has stated he is willing to testify under oath that Obama was "definitely" not born in Hawaii and has no birth certificate from any hospital in the Aloha State.
www.wnd.com...

It is a fact that former US Attorney, Andrew McCarthy, anti-terroist Attorney, who investigated the 1998, US Embassy bombing in Nairobi, Kenya, has charged that Obama was involved in 'border line criminal activity' in Kenya as a Senator, and that he campaigned for a pro-communist candidate who was running against a pro-American, anti-terrorism candidate. www.youtube.com...

It is a fact that Obama has not produced evidence that his study was supported by student loans, and that it has been reported that Khalid Al-Mansour, an advisor to Saudi prince Al-Walid bin Talah, told Manhattan Borough president, Percy Sutton, that he was raising money for Obama’s Harvard tuition. Incidentally, Prince Tala is the largest donor to CAIR, a Muslim group declared by the U.S. Government in 2007 as an unindicted co-conspirator in a terrorist financing trial.
www.westernjournalism.com...

It's a fact fact that if the above information referred to an ordinary citizen, who refused to provide full birth detals, who refused to provide details of his past, who had allegedly received financial support from someone with a known connection to a known terrorist group, such information would be more than sufficient for them to be considered a potential terrorist - and as such, that person, when abroad, could legally be shot by Government agents, simply based on that suspicion.

It is a fact that Obama has spent over $1.4 million to block access to all his school, college and university records, likewise for the records of his parents and grandparents.

It is a fact that the US knows less about Obama's past than is the case for any other President.

It is a fact that Obama promised 'the most transparent Administration', yet has proved himself and his Administration to be the least transparent about many vitally important issues, including his own background.

It is a fact that many reputable people doubt the authenticity of the BC, and believe it has been 'doctored'.

It is a fact that at 49 lawsuits have been filed by American citizens, including high ranking military officers, some of which requesting impeachment failing confirmation of Obama's birth details, and that none of them has been given a full hearing.

It is a fact that Lucas Smith, who sent the Kenyan birth certificate to Congressmen sent it with a sworn affidavit, which means he could be imprisoned if he is lying.

It is a fact that Debbie Schlussel has uncovered anomalies in Obama's Selective Service registration form. www.debbieschlussel.com... registration-raises-serious-questions/

It is a fact that Michelle O was filmed saying Kenya was her husbands 'homeland.'

It is a fact that in 2004, the AP ran an article on Obama - 'the Kenyan born US Senate hopeful'.
www.eutimes.net...

It is a fact that on 27 June, 2004, the East Africa Standard ran an article entitled: Kenyan bornObama all set for US Senate.web.archive.org...

It is a fact that questions have been raised about Obama having a social security number reserved for Connecticut, despite the fact he is not known to have had any connections there.

It is a fact that a private investigator alleges to have discovered information which suggests that Obama has used more than one social security number, perhaps several.

It is a fact that in April 2008 the Senate held a hearing on McCain's natural born status, but did not do the same for Obama.

It is a fact that the DNC produced two versions of Obama's 'Certificate of Nomination' as a candidate for US President. One included the statement “- and that the following candidates for President and Vice President of the United States are legally qualified to serve under the provisions of the United States Constitution.”, the other, mysteriously, did not contain this statement. The Certificate of Nomination which included the eligibility statement was sent to Hawaii, the other States received the Certificate of Nomination which did not include this statement. The Rep party Certificates of Nomination sent to all states included the statement of eligibility.
www.therightsideoflife.com...

It is a fact that when someone wants to keep all their personal history secret, they are usually hiding something.

It is a fact that the American people have every right to verify the credientials and eligibility of their President.

It is a fact that this matter could be easily resolved by producing the full birth certificate, and opening records of his education and student loans.

It is a fact that I don't see how making the requested information public could harm him in any way, unless he has something to hide which would harm his Presidency.




















edit on 14-9-2010 by wcitizen because: typo




edit on 14-9-2010 by wcitizen because: add links



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 12:54 PM
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Originally posted by getreadyalready
All of those things were already known about Bush.


They're just as known about Obama. But you never had to see Bush's birth Certificate. Or Clintons, or Bush Sr's, or ... anyone's. SOMEONE put these doubts in the people's minds and the people ran with it, just like he hoped they would.



Obama could do the exact same thing with a few simple and harmless acts.


I agree. He could, if that's what he chose to do.


And it would get the focus of his energy and the energy of his opponents back on topics that matter.


No it wouldn't. Maybe for YOU it would, but you've got to know that the VAST majority of birthers would claim his long form a hoax - after extensive review of the jpg over the Internet by amateur gumshoe-wanna-bees, that is. The birthers would reset the goalposts and this crap would start all over again, getting the press and the MSM worked up and going crazy with the new exciting meaningless story.

By not addressing this silly rumor, Obama's not giving it credibility. getreadyalready, you're too smart not to think about how this all started and wonder if it wasn't his opponent somewhere along the line (Andy Martin) who awanted to make his life miserable. I can't see you being manipulated by this...


I wouldn't vote for an openly gay president, but if a good president was found out to have had gay encounters I wouldn't care.


My point is that they have come out against every aspect of who he is, making claims of the most extreme kind. Being born out of the country is just another one of those claims.


. It is his actions as president that will determine the outcome of his legacy, not his sexuality.


Again, I agree.

Why Stories About Obama's Birth Certificate Will Never Die



If the long-form birth certificate were released, with its unequivocal identification of Hawaii as Obama's place of birth, the cycle would almost certainly continue. Rush Limbaugh already suggested that Obama's trip to Hawaii to see his ailing grandmother, who died not long after, was somehow connected to the controversy. Others, like Michael Savage, followed Limbaugh's lead, saying Obama was going to Hawaii to alter the record.


Remember when that didn't happen?



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 12:59 PM
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Minor point.
Bush was not forthcoming about drug use.
He never admitted to using coc aine.



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 01:05 PM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 



SOMEONE put these doubts in the people's minds and the people ran with it, just like he hoped they would.


That SOMEONE is Obama himself in his own words and written in his books. The speculation has been further fueled by the statements of Michelle and by the the bizarre lifestyle of Obama's mother. Additionally, we must not forget the inconsistencies on his own campaign website.

How gullible does he really think the people of this nation are? (please disregard all of those still waiting for "Obama Money")

Obama needs to put it all to bed and move on with his job instead of fueling the rumors. Redemption!!!



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 01:06 PM
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Originally posted by dereks

Originally posted by wcitizen
What exactly do you think is the problem for him to provide his full BC?


Why should he? There is no need for it, and just how does he get it, as Hawaii does not issue them anymore...

I believe there is every need for a President to prove to the nation beyond any doubt that he is eligible to be President.


Given that this doubt exists amongst the people


There is only "doubt" amongst birthers - lol, of course there is, that's why they've been called 'birthers' - it means ' those who doubt his birth details'.[/i

, and no matter what documentation he shows they will not accept it!

]So, you have become the self-appointed spokesperson for hirthers? Or is this your personal, biased, unfounded assumption which is being stated as truth?


Birthers would not vote for him anyway...


See above


This is a known NLP discrediting tactic. Treat the people questioning with utter disdain, in order to discredit their argument...rather than put forward a reasoned argument in support of your own point of view.

There are the lawsuits, for example, of some senior military officers who are unwilling to go and risk their lives, and those under their command, in Afghanistan, on the orders of a President whose eligibility they have grounds to seriously doubt. I am sorry you don't see fit to treat these men as deserving of more respect. Oh no, sorry, they're just silly birthers who go and put their lives on the line for you and your compatriots.



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 01:07 PM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 


OK. You are probably right that the fight would continue, but it would only continue on the fringe side. There are a lot more people like me than there are like Rush Limbaugh. Some people are simply racist. Others are simply hardcore Republicans. But the vast majority of people are moderate in their views and open to logical arguments.

Right now the Republicans and the Tea Party express are making a mistake by trying to play to the popularity of the fringe right.

Right now Obama is making the mistake of thinking that everyone in the Tea Party and everyone questioning his motivations and background are part of that fringe right.

In reality, there are millions of people like me, that liked Obama before the election. We have some doubts now, but we still admire his energy and conviction. We love the Tea Party movement because it is a grass roots movement and people within our local communities are getting out and getting active.

Obama could trump the entire fringe right if he came out and decisively attacked these rumors. Even if he doesn't have a long-form certificate, he could be honest and direct. Even if he took student aid as a foreign student, he could be decisive and direct and honest. Obama really has a huge opportunity to change the mindset of the moderate conservatives over to his side and kill the Becks and Limbaughs in their tracks.

I could be wrong, but I sincerely believe that the vast majority of Americans are more like me and BH than they are lilke Beck or Palin or Jeremiah Wright. I think we are underestimated and ignored. The politicians spend too much time pandering to the fringe elements because even the politicians believe what they see on the TV.



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 01:15 PM
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Originally posted by jibeho
reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 



SOMEONE put these doubts in the people's minds and the people ran with it, just like he hoped they would.


That SOMEONE is Obama himself in his own words and written in his books. The speculation has been further fueled by the statements of Michelle and by the the bizarre lifestyle of Obama's mother. Additionally, we must not forget the inconsistencies on his own campaign website.

How gullible does he really think the people of this nation are? (please disregard all of those still waiting for "Obama Money")

Obama needs to put it all to bed and move on with his job instead of fueling the rumors. Redemption!!!



Yes.

And that SOMEONE is Obama himself who in 2004 did not challenge the news reports that he was a KENYAN senator, and who even said, when his opponent pointed out to him that he wasn't a natural born citizen, 'That's OK. I'm not running for President'.



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