Atheism is a fraud.

Originally posted by LoneExplorer
Religiphobia is alive.

Fear of religion? I think that's a bit of a stretch.

As Christians, it occurs to me that one of the first things that we should do is acknowledge that many of us have become mired in the same dogma and intolerance that Christ came to free us of.

If you asked them, I suspect that few atheists would say that they fear religion, but plenty would say that they dislike it. And that's on us, you and I, not them.

[edit on 22-7-2010 by adjensen]

> Reliphobia is a range of negative attitudes and feelings towards Religion and people identified or perceived as being Religious. Definitions refer variably to antipathy, contempt, prejudice, aversion, and irrational fear. Religiphobia is observable in critical and hostile behavior such as discrimination on the basis of a perceived non-Atheist orientation. <

Atheist suffer from Religiphobia.

Originally posted by adjensen
the rejehction of God is the tipping point, not what you reject him in favour of.

You would first have to believe in something to reject it.

There is no rejecting god.

Originally posted by adjensen


If you asked them, I suspect that few atheists would say that they fear religion, but plenty would say that they dislike it. And that's on us, you and I, not them.

I don't care one way or the other.

Actions - in the name of a god/deity/religion - - is a different matter.

> Reliphobia is a range of negative attitudes and feelings towards Religion and people identified or perceived as being Religious. Definitions refer variably to antipathy, contempt, prejudice, aversion, and irrational fear. Religiphobia is observable in critical and hostile behavior such as discrimination on the basis of a perceived non-Atheist orientation. <

I tried to find attested instances on the web, and only came up with a few, all from web disucssion forum postings, one of which was yours, and another of which was in Danish.

It's also not part of the usual pretentious [Greek root]-phobia stuff that, long ago, used to be the cat's meow in jargon. Religion phobia was called theophobia, which sounds like it means fear of God. It was indeed also used for that.

That's ironic, since the phrase "God fearing" usually describes someone on good terms with God. Gotta love language.

Bottom line, I am unable to locate any of the definitions, plural, you mention, so maybe you could provide a citation to two of them? Or just to this one.

Anyway, all that past tense when talking about -phobia is pertinent to this,

Atheist suffer from Religiphobia.

If it were the name of a condition (something from which anyone might "suffer'), then it ought to have come up in my search as being in the current DSM. I'm not surprised that it didn't, because the whole -phobia suffix classification (non-)system isn't used much these days in clinical work, as I've already mentioned.

But, if you do have a DSM reference to it, then please share.




[edit on 23-7-2010 by eight bits]

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by adjensen
the rejehction of God is the tipping point, not what you reject him in favour of.

You would first have to believe in something to reject it.

There is no rejecting god.

Well, perhaps I should have included "in the Christian faith", but I figured that it was implicit. Disbelief of the Christian God is, by Christian definition, rejecting him. Following Satan, as the OP thought was a cheery alternative for some, is, by Christian definition, rejecting God. Believing in God, but leading a crummy life and ignoring what the faith teaches, by Christian definition, is rejecting him. And so on.

And it is perhaps a point of semantics, but not believing in something is essentially rejecting belief in something. If you had no notion of God, whatsoever, then you're not rejecting it, in the same way that I don't reject the beliefs of someone on another planet, as I have no notion of what they might believe.

As an aside, how did that "h" get in my quote up there? I'm usually reasonably careful in my postings, so I was surprised that I'd done that, but when I go to the original, it's not there. Get the "h" out! Har har har.

Originally posted by LoneExplorer
Religiphobia is alive.

Stand up Christians and let your voices be heard.

Stand up Christians and defend the great Lord.

Religiphobia is alive.

Religion has been the #1 reason for murder, war and persecution for literally THOUSANDS of years.

You bet your sweet ass I have religiophobia. It is a fearsome and merciless force.

Not too many people have been murdered BY atheists because they weren't atheist (communist regimes don't really count, Stalin and Mao were trying to be Gods themselves) .

Religion, on the other hand, will kill you for interpreting the same words from the same god in a slightly different view.

Don't confuse atheism with satanism/devil worship. We don't believe in that cat either.

Originally posted by beefytee

Originally posted by LoneExplorer
Religiphobia is alive.

Stand up Christians and let your voices be heard.

Stand up Christians and defend the great Lord.

Religiphobia is alive.

Religion has been the #1 reason for murder, war and persecution for literally THOUSANDS of years.

I would suggest that you change the word "reason" for "motivator" in that sentence, and it will become slightly more accurate, though I would still question the #1 ranking.

Murder, as in homicide, is rarely done for religious reasons. It is usually the result of anger or greed, two things that my religion, at least, discourages in its dictates. If you wish to take "murder" to mean "killing people", I would point out the atrocities of the 20th century, whether Stalin's purges and famines, the Cultural Revolution, the Killing Fields of Pol Pot, and so on, in which hundreds of millions may have died, with religion playing no part in it.

War is more about power and resources than anything else. If you remove religion as a potential motivator, it will just be replaced by something else, nationalism or racism or whatever, because the average Joe doesn't give two hoots about Saddam Hussein, and ain't going to be signing up for battle unless you convince him to.

reply to post by beefytee


That's the reason I am atheist or close to, I think if there really is one almighty all knowing god who does good he wouldn't force his religion on us but give us free will and not the whole oh you can have free will BUT if you don't follow me I will condemn you. The whole bible is hypocritical, any religion that preaches peace and then kills excludes certain groups and people because they are not the same is just not logical. If your god is almighty and forgiving why does he allow this? and why does god punish if he seeks peace and do unto others as others do unto you? If some one doesn't agree with me and provides adequate reasoning I don't smite them or kill them I seek to acknowledge their freedom of opinion.

God is a selfish hypocrite, I would rather worship satan than the christian god, satan is forth coming. You know everything is a lie, so in essence satan is more trust worthy from god...

Xiamara

i had a good rebuttle but had to order a pizza for my honey when she gets home.

go figure, it's been months.

oh ya, atheism ONLY exits in the presence OF religion.

soooooooooooo, nah nah! lol.

reply to post by adjensen


Good points all. "Motivator" makes a stronger argument.

You are correct that in many cases where religion is key, it could just as easily have been something else. But would it have been? Would anything like the crusades or the Holocaust have happened? Would the western world have carved Israel into Arabic nations, would we have all of the strife and violence and distrust in the Middle East? Would Ireland and Northern Ireland be like cats and dogs for decades?

These are just the large scale things that we see and are aware of. The easily accessible. There are countless other persecutions motivated by religion every day. From simple bigotry to witch burnings in Kenya.

I understand that we are human, and to separate and persecute seems to be our M.O....but perhaps it would be a bit less if we didn't have the stark lines of religion neatly dividing everyone up.

This is the more emotional side of my atheism, and really not the reason I'm an atheist at all. A by-product I guess. I'm sorry to get off topic so wildly, but again I will state as simply as possible:

I just don't believe in it. God, Gods, afterlife, spirits, divinity, any and all of it. Just doesn't hold water in my opinion.

Originally posted by fooks

oh ya, atheism ONLY exits in the presence OF religion.

What is religion? What is god? What is a deity?

When man lacked knowledge of the unexplained - - man invented god.

Atheism does not need invention.

Non-invention - - - does not require invention to exist.

reply to post by beefytee


" Would the western world have carved Israel into Arabic nations, ..."


Would you care to explain the above ?

This thread is a fraudulent attempt to force a widely held mythology, which may or may not have some basis in fact... upon people who are pragmatic and exceedingly cautious.

The absence of something cannot be fraudulent. You need "something" to either in reality or theoretically exist before you can say it is "fraudulent."

If you do not believe in something no one else can see or prove...how can that be fraudulent?

The belief no one can see or prove sets itself up as the most possibly fraudulent because it cannot be either seen or proved.

God might be a fraudulent concept, Atheism cannot be.
The worst it can be is untrue.

Originally posted by okbmd
reply to post by beefytee

 

" Would the western world have carved Israel into Arabic nations, ..."


Would you care to explain the above ?

After World War II 1947, 48, and 49, the UN essentially "recreated" one sovereign nation where another already existed.

I will not argue entitlement, because I don't know...but the ongoing conflict in Palestine/Israel would be a lot easier to resolve if they didn't each think certain sites were "holy"...

reply to post by beefytee


Okay , I gotcha .
Maybe you should have said 'from Arab nations' instead of 'into Arab nations' .
Misuderstanding on my part .

Hi, all.

Here we see, again, the totalitarisme of
so called "religious" persons. . . B-)

Blue skies.

The absence of something cannot be fraudulent.

Holocaust deniers. Some of them write books that are sold as non-fiction.

Sounds like fraud to me.

Personally, I do not believe that atheism is "fraudulent," but the reason is not that atheism is somehow "privilged" and "could not possibly be" fraudulent. It just happens not to be, IMO.



[edit on 23-7-2010 by eight bits]

Originally posted by beefytee
reply to post by adjensen

 

Good points all. "Motivator" makes a stronger argument.

You are correct that in many cases where religion is key, it could just as easily have been something else. But would it have been? Would anything like the crusades or the Holocaust have happened? Would the western world have carved Israel into Arabic nations, would we have all of the strife and violence and distrust in the Middle East? Would Ireland and Northern Ireland be like cats and dogs for decades?

These are just the large scale things that we see and are aware of. The easily accessible. There are countless other persecutions motivated by religion every day. From simple bigotry to witch burnings in Kenya.

While I suspect that non-religious aspects of all of those could be found (the Holocaust, for example, killed people who were not Jews, and it's generally accepted that antisemitism was used by the National Socialists to further their political ends, as others still do,) I agree that religious fervor has done its share of evil in the past.

Fact of the matter, though, is that, in the case of Christianity, Christians are supposed to follow Christ, who was "turn the other cheek" and "love your neighbour as yourself" and there's no place in his teaching for the Crusades, the Inquisition or other nastiness. People corrupted his teaching, and again used peoples' faith as a motivator to accomplish their goals.

It was a little flippant, but I remember seeing a headline in The Onion shortly after 9/11 along the lines of "God to terrorists: What part of 'Thou Shalt Not Kill' don't you understand?"

reply to post by adjensen


In all actuality , it is human nature that cause the great suffering and death in this world sans natural causes and disease(chalk that one up to religious thought that created god or god itself).

If religion was not the motivator for such death and wars , then I am sure we as humans would've found a different albeit more logical reason. Usually cultural differences , resources , territory , revolt , or greed are the main causes of unnecessary death and conflict . It just so happens that most religions , probably because they are man-made , make it a good moral and ethical choice to involve their groups in these acts. In the case of Islam, their theology implores them to conquer and convert until all religion "belongs to Allah".