The Apple iPad Conspiracy

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
I've used both Kindles, and the iPad is somewhat better. The text has a clarity that is different than the crispness the Kindle is attempting to achieve. And since there's no buttons, the iPad has a more natural feel... swipe the page to continue.

so, then, my nook, which has a touch screen on the bottom that I swipe to turn the page is similar in feel? my nook has that and, to be honest, the button push is actually easier. why? because, when I am reading, I am, usually, taken in the by the book and a slight press of my thumb is far easier than having to let go and swipe. I know it looks cool and you can move the page back and forth but, for an avid reader, it's actually more work than to turn a page the just apply a bit of pressure under your thumb. In other words, a neat thing but really nothing more than that.

I don't doubt that the look of the page is incredible but, as I said, a voracious reader, who might sit on the beach and read for 4 hours, something like the ipad might not work well, other than the workout of holding a pound and a half up in the air for that length of time.

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

It's the produce we dreamed about on the CompuServe Interactive TV forum back in 1993 -- quite literally.

that might explain why, in a world of ever shrinking technology and user generated content, they came up with a device that does the exact opposite.

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

It's a "toaster" for the digital content world... a drop-dead easy-to-use device for getting and using digital content.

you should read the boingboing article linked above. you just proved the author's point, to a "t"

it's easy enough for mom to use is not a game changing, world altering device. it's the equivalent of a walker for the digital age. a way for mom and dad to get emails, view the internet and listen to their pat boone records.

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

For the web: It's hard to fathom (until you've done it) how very-different it is read a website on something book-sized that you hold in your hands in a relaxed position you'd use for reading a book. "Something" changes, it's hard to describe. (I used to read voraciously, so maybe it's just me, dunno.)

I would imagine it looks almost the same as it does on any monitor, except those with higher hd ratings, only now you can lift it up and move it around, until you want to type, then you have to sit down or put the pad down.

you make it sound like things look different. they don't.

the first book I read on my nook was by one of my favorite authors and, about half way through it, I realized I hated the book. Not because the story was bad. No, I realized I was impressed and mystified by the concept of reading it on this little device that I wasn't focusing on the book itself. I went back and reread the first half once I got over my "what a cool gadget" and, guess what, it's just a book to me now. the coolness wore off.

Once the coolness wears off, I'm wondering, will it still be an awe inspiring thing to have to rest it on your lap or hook up a keyboard every time you want to search for something on the internet?

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

Magazines: The Time Magazine app is very good for a first go at a iPad magazine. If this is the evolution of magazine content, there is some hope that might justify the hype the publishers are pushing. There are still some bugs, but overall, it's a better delivery system for the digital-minded people than ink on paper.

Again, read the boingboing article. it really covers this as well. Time Magazine's articles are a week old upon release. The current issue will have movies that closed last week being reviewed. I recall discussing this with Mark a few months back. I pointed out the number of crotch bomber articles in the current issue and it was two months after the incident.

These media companies are praying that this device will convince people to pay (or overpay if you are the WSJ) for the same news that is already available on the internet, for free. For the media companies to survive, they need to come up with a new model. Taking the old, printed format and, basically, charging for it on an ipad, isn't going to work.

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

It's a strong "evolutionary" product with significant potential to change the game. "Revolutionary," as applied to the iPad is a big nebulous since there's not one item you can point to (except maybe multi-touch on a larger screen) that is revolutionary -- it's a culmination of evolutionary steps.

Evolutionary or devolutionary? Everyone is going smaller. Everyone is pushing to make things to aid us in generating content.

This does neither.

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

My biggest disappointment/surprise was the need to plug into iTunes to get it started. Unless I missed something somewhere, if you don't have a computer with iTunes, you can't start using the iPad. Once you've initialized everything, it can buy content from the iTunes store all on it's own just fine... which is odd that you're required to initialize via iTunes.

To me, this makes sense and I see nothing wrong with them doing this. They want you to be applecentric. The only way to do this is to make sure that everything you do comes back to them. Apple is a money making machine, possibly one of the best out there. Can't fault them for tightening the leash around the collective necks of their users, can you?

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
(This was typed sitting outside on my iPad)

put some ilotion on, lest you get an iburn.

(this was typed at my desk, using an ergonomic keyboard, staring at a high def screen, not an itoaster)

Originally posted by Damian-007

Originally posted by johnny2127

Originally posted by cripmeister
reply to post by johnny2127

 

I might not be a problem to you. Until Apple gives the option of flat rate iTunes accounts I can't see this happening.

I can understand that. See I already have a ton of movies and tv shows to put on mine so it isn't an issue. But if you don't I could see how it would be frustrating. I do find it amusing that the whole time I have been typing in this thread about iPad's, I have been doing it on my iPad. LOL

How are you going to put your Media on that iPad?

You only have a couple of "Not So Good" options.

WiFi, Media Card or 3G. Is there any other way you can do it?

What media do you mean? Pictures? Movies? TV shows? All of it sync's to your iPad, and anything can be received via email if someone is sending to you. I have had zero problem getting any form of media on the iPad. If you would like me to test anything specific, let me know and I will. The iPad is about media and content consumption, so getting it is very easy.

Originally posted by Faiol
if some people are against the iPad, that would mean that they support freedom, since they want free content, free ideas, free software, open source ideas, instead of a centralized standard by Apple ...

• free content - such as the entire web (except for Flash), any mp3, any epub without DRM, any YouTube video, any PDF
  
• free ideas - How is the iPad restricting what you think?
  
• free software - the number of free apps available from the iTunes store is huge... likely outnumbering the paid apps, but I don't know that for certain
  
• open source ideas - again, how does the iPad restrict ideas?
  
• instead of a centralized standard by Apple - You're right. Apple is the gatekeeper to executable code running on some of the devices that they make. But many people are developing web-based apps that run just fine from the built-in browser and bypass the need for a developer's license or approval by the app store.
  

Originally posted by Crakeur
so, then, my nook, which has a touch screen on the bottom that I swipe to turn the page is similar in feel? my nook has that and, to be honest, the button push is actually easier. why? because, when I am reading, I am, usually, taken in the by the book and a slight press of my thumb is far easier than having to let go and swipe. I know it looks cool and you can move the page back and forth but, for an avid reader, it's actually more work than to turn a page the just apply a bit of pressure under your thumb. In other words, a neat thing but really nothing more than that.

While I haven't actually seen the iPad's reader (probably will this afternoon), I read a book in the Kindle app on the iPod Touch recently, and while you could swipe a finger to turn the page, you could also just tap on the right half of the page and it would go to the next page. No swipe necessary... simple & efficient motion.

Originally posted by Faiol

Originally posted by Otto Von Bismarck
This has been the most entertaining thread I've read in quite some time, and one thing is very, very clear to me regarding this whole thing:

For people who pride themselves on thinking "outside the box" and questioning authority, the vast majority of posters have fully bought into Microsoft/x86 thinking.

Hilarious, yet sad at the same time.

lol, can you explain better your point of view ?

if some people are against the iPad, that would mean that they support freedom, since they want free content, free ideas, free software, open source ideas, instead of a centralized standard by Apple ...

can you elaborate in your arguments? its not like everyone here is defending windows, people are just defending the decentralization of the information, and the movement by Apple and some mainstream media of trying to centralize everything

There isn't a restriction on ideas or media on the iPad. Flash isn't available, but flash is also less secure on the internet in general in moving towards having both flash and a more secure form of player.

What it seems like you guys are all complaining about is that Apple has created the App Store and iTunes. Apple doesn't make 99.9% of the apps on the app store, and actually have made app development more accessible to everyone. Without an app store, most application developments were dominated by the big boys. Now, anyone can create an app and submit it to the app store. I know multiple people that have created apps and made money from it. This is a good thing people. There is no restriction on the iPad. The app store is a distribution channel that Apple created and that is their right. They created a new way for people to consume media, and they have the right to control the distribution channel for the apps and make money off of it. You guys don't run down to the mall and complain to the stores that they sell other people's products and decide what in the store do you? Of course not.

Originally posted by JoshNorton

Originally posted by Faiol
if some people are against the iPad, that would mean that they support freedom, since they want free content, free ideas, free software, open source ideas, instead of a centralized standard by Apple ...

• free content - such as the entire web (except for Flash), any mp3, any epub without DRM, any YouTube video, any PDF
  
• free ideas - How is the iPad restricting what you think?
  
• free software - the number of free apps available from the iTunes store is huge... likely outnumbering the paid apps, but I don't know that for certain
  
• open source ideas - again, how does the iPad restrict ideas?
  
• instead of a centralized standard by Apple - You're right. Apple is the gatekeeper to executable code running on some of the devices that they make. But many people are developing web-based apps that run just fine from the built-in browser and bypass the need for a developer's license or approval by the app store.
  

reply to post by johnny2127




free content, ideas and software ? apple decides if they can or cant accept an APP in their store
open source ? iPad'software is not open source, you cant know whats happening in it, and you cant change it, so, you cant feel safe, you dont know what they do with your information as an example
centralized ? do I need to explain? they want to control everything and restrict content to APPs and restrict access to the internet

Internet is decentralized and will always be, thats why they cant control the content

well, just research man, your post proved that you dont know anything about programming and you probably never used anything besides an apple

if you want to research, I recommend google.com, you will have an idea of why I said those things

[edit on 5-4-2010 by Faiol]

Originally posted by Crakeur
you should read the boingboing article linked above. you just proved the author's point, to a "t"

Can't speak for SO, but personally, I can't read Cory Doctorow's op-ed pieces without them being tainted by his own hypocrisies... The guy has written articles praising the writing of fan fiction, and has championed the Creative Commons license to the point of being its poster boy, yet his early CC novels do not allow for the creation of non-commercial derivative works... He could have explicitly allowed for fan fiction being based on his own works by just clicking one button, but he didn't. It just pisses me off (and I don't even like fan fiction — I just want to see cool things coming out of open-sourcing books, movies & music content)

reply to post by JoshNorton


the specific part of the article I was talking about was where he mentions the amount of time it takes for an ipad user to tell you it's so easy your mother could use it.


no bias there, just straight observation on the author's part and Bill so deftly proved his point.

Originally posted by Faiol
well, just research man, your post proved that you dont know anything about programming and you probably never used anything besides an apple

if you want to research, I recommend google.com, you will have an idea of why I said those things

Careful on the personal attacks... I've written games as DVD-ROM content for top selling Disney, Fox & Sony movies. And yeah, I wrote them on a Mac. The iPad as a platform is no more restrictive than writing for the PS3, the Wii or any other closed game console. To compare it to a home-built, linux-driven PC is missing the point, because that's not what it is, and not what it's pretending to be.

[edit on 4/5/2010 by JoshNorton]

just to make it clear

Apple store is centralized:
> you need to get approval to release your APP
> they dont check if its safe, just if the content follow their agenda (just last week an APP have extreme security issues and compromised every user, they didnt even try to check)
> operational system in the iPad is not open source, so people cant see whats inside, cant optimize, cant make it better, its just bad for everyone besides Apple

so users are depend on Apple to get things done in the device, and that never works ...

lets just hope new devices get released

Haha...love Crakeur's and SkepticOverlords little "one on one".

"(this was typed at my desk, using an ergonomic keyboard, staring at a high def screen, not an itoaster)" - quote from Crakeur

made me laugh.

Well since no one have said anything about my earlier post I guess I am the only one seeing a pattern. =P

Anyway, the iPad is surely a great device, but in me world it seem to lack to much that the rest of the world uses. I know I know...it's not a computer, BUT...it still handle the same type of media as a computer do, so why not include stuff like network port, USB and camera. And Flash... I still can't understand why they remove Adobe Flash and implement the HTML5 only. Why not both??? GAAH

If it was MUCH less expensive I would concider buying one just to be able to spin som photos. But I would certainly get bored pretty soon. So the iPad is nothing for me. The Courier looks awsome. I guess that is just a concept but still.


[edit on 5-4-2010 by Akezzon]

reply to post by JoshNorton


yeah, the point is to limit to their desires, thats not something I support, if you like it, go ahead, I wont discuss anymore

I am just saying that this device goes against everything that the internet stands for, it doesnt matter if you like or not, it is a fact

there are a lot of articles, and I am reading reviews today, all review I read are bad ... it looks like just new york times and others are supporting it, since they can create an maganize newspaper like App to sell it

and I am not doing personal attacks, I just find it weird, since you programmed before, that you support these things ...

A lot of people are gonna be very mad when they find out they
can not play framville or all their other Facebook games on the
iPad, since those games all need Flash This might be a good
thing.

Originally posted by Faiol

 

free content, ideas and software ? apple decides if they can or cant accept an APP in their store
open source ? iPad'software is not open source, you cant know whats happening in it, and you cant change it, so, you cant feel safe, you dont know what they do with your information as an example
centralized ? do I need to explain? they want to control everything and restrict content to APPs and restrict access to the internet

Internet is decentralized and will always be, thats why they cant control the content

well, just research man, your post proved that you dont know anything about programming and you probably never used anything besides an apple

if you want to research, I recommend google.com, you will have an idea of why I said those things [edit on 5-4-2010 by Faiol]

You obviously do not understand the iPad and how it or Apple works. They don't want to restrict the internet to Apps. That is a flat out 110% lie. The internet is uncensored. You can go look at all the porn or conspiracy crap you want. The apps are programs my friend. Not the internet. The apps are made specifically for iPad for a very specified purpose of the program. Want a version of facebook, NY Times, Wall Street Journal, Bloomberg, Google, etc that is optimized to work on the iPad? Great download the app. If not, feel free to use the normal internet version you use now.

You really don't understand this thing in anyway do you? The only content that Apple cares about in apps is illegal content or porn. And for the porn they are creating an adult gate for the programers that want to build apps for it. And again, if you are fine with the internet's version of anything then you don't need to download the app.


[edit on 5-4-2010 by johnny2127]

All this over a product from a company that wants to make money.
There is no conspiracy involving this product other than Apple wants to make money. The media blitz is one of the best that money can buy, so no conspiracy on the part of the media. The media did what they were paid to do.

Is it a perfect product? Most likely not.
Will it do what the majority of users will use it for? Most likely.
Will there be better products along this formfactor? Most likely.

So why all the fuss over this one product? There are more valid issues regarding computer and software that should concern people.

Originally posted by Crakeur

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

It's a strong "evolutionary" product with significant potential to change the game. "Revolutionary," as applied to the iPad is a big nebulous since there's not one item you can point to (except maybe multi-touch on a larger screen) that is revolutionary -- it's a culmination of evolutionary steps.

Evolutionary or devolutionary? Everyone is going smaller. Everyone is pushing to make things to aid us in generating content.

This does neither.

You are quite quite wrong here. Its not about making the product itself smaller. Its about making the technology itself smaller inside of the product so it can do more things. Phone are the same size they now as they were a decade ago when motorola was spitting out flip phones. Same size. What's different? What they are able to do. Why? Because the technology inside has been made small and better, and made to do things it never could before. Plasma and LCD TV's? Same size as when they came out, if not bigger. But the pictures are better and they can do more. Why? Exactly what I said about phones.

You're missing exactly what is being made smaller here. Its not the products itself most times. Its the guts of the product so they can fit more in, and the products themselves can do more. That is exactly what the iPad did. You yourself talk about your Nook. Well for the same size as your Nook, you can now have exponentially more memory, access to the entire internet, ability to stream movies and TV shows, download 100's of thousands of apps, trade your stocks, play games, etc. All with a battery much better than a cell phone, laptop, Kindle or Nook.

The exact argument you made about things being made smaller, actually is why this product is a marvel. Shows you don't really understand the iPad, or what it is that is being made smaller

reply to post by johnny2127


so they go with everything being smaller so they can fit more inside it and, therefore, make a product that can do more but then they only throw 256mb of ram in it, limiting what it can do.

Originally posted by Crakeur
reply to post by johnny2127

 

so they go with everything being smaller so they can fit more inside it and, therefore, make a product that can do more but then they only throw 256mb of ram in it, limiting what it can do.

Again, you are misinterpreting what this machine was meant to do and be. Skeptic Overlord is right, until you have it in your hands and play with it, it won't make sense to you. You have the internet or a movie or tv show in your hands, not on some desk or big clunky product, you won't get it. Its a very neat thing. And the thing runs incredibly fast. Faster than my 4GB RAM laptop. In terms of media, it is the best device I have seen. Would I be surprised to see Apple create a version that is catering towards business and media creation? No. Mac's are amazing at creating media. This device is made for consumption of information, all from a small device, but with a large enough screen to make it real like a newpaper or magazine. Imagine being able to hold the internet in your hands like a magazine, while the same device holds a few dozen movies, tv shows, applications, hundreds or thousands of pictures, and dozens of your favorite books. All on one device. Bring all of that with you anywhere. Its great, really. Even for the 1st generation of iPad, the thing is amazing. Better than the gen 1 iPhone, even though that was great too.

[edit on 5-4-2010 by johnny2127]

Originally posted by johnny2127
Imagine being able to hold the internet in your hands like a magazine, while the same device holds a few dozen movies, tv shows, applications, hundreds or thousands of pictures, and dozens of your favorite books. All on one device.

so, it's a really big version of the iphone, the droid, the pre, the storm etc.

and don't say no because you said

Originally posted by johnny2127
Better than the gen 1 iPhone, even though that was great too.

if you are saying it's better than the iphone, than you are putting them in the same category.

listen. I understand that it's really cool and fun and neat and all that but Apple labelled it as some innovative, game changing, life altering device and I have yet to hear anyone tell me how it does that.

To be honest, it's a big iphone, without the camera or the calling capabilities. Oh, wait, iphones have that dropped call issue. maybe they are even more similar than I thought.

its a great fashion device and a great reading device

I really look foward to reading how much hours people will be using with this device in like 2 months