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Obamacare Slaps $15,000 Annual Fee on Middle Class Families

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posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 07:28 PM
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Well if it passes and get signed into law, I say that all of us who disagree with this, go down and turn ourselves in and demand that they enforce the law to the fullest extent and refuse to pay the fines involved. If the courts end up overloaded, then it will draw attention to an unjust law.
The purpose would be similar to non compliance that forces the government to respond, and make the changes necessary.




posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 07:29 PM
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Well there is the idea that destroying the middle class is essential for domination. The poor traditionally do not poss the threat to conquest that a middle class does. So efforts to target a middle class are likely. Remember income tax is optional.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 07:50 PM
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Originally posted by ReelView
Well there is the idea that destroying the middle class is essential for domination. The poor traditionally do not poss the threat to conquest that a middle class does. So efforts to target a middle class are likely. Remember income tax is optional.


Yeah till you don't pay it, then prison is mandatory.


You do make good points, because by the time the middle class is wiped out, the new election term will have passed and this monstrosity will be in full effect.

I can only hope that the states that have re-affirmed their 10th ammendment rights will move to refuse to follow this.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 08:10 PM
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1 ‘‘(A) WAIVER OF CRIMINAL PENALTIES.—
2 In the case of any failure by a taxpayer to time-
3 ly pay any penalty imposed by this section, such
4 taxpayer shall not be subject to any criminal
5 prosecution or penalty with respect to such fail-
6 ure.
7 ‘‘(B) LIMITATIONS ON LIENS AND LEV-
8 IES.—The Secretary shall not—
9 ‘‘(i) file notice of lien with respect to
10 any property of a taxpayer by reason of
11 any failure to pay the penalty imposed by
12 this section, or
13 ‘‘(ii) levy on any such property with
14 respect to such failure.’’.

democrats.senate.gov...=340

Basically, if the Senate version gets passed into law, there's not a damn thing the government can do if you decide not to pay the penalty tax.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 08:25 PM
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reply to post by reluctantpawn
 


Send me a U2U and I will send you all the paperwork. You don't file LLC you file UCC and Common Law Lein, nullifies mortgage, property tax and all. No more bills, discharge everything to the trust.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:07 PM
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Our elected representatives claim to represent their constituents but we see clearly and loudly that our elected representatives no longer present the citizens that vote for them as much as they represent and do the bidding of big business interests.

These corrupt, greedy, immoral, unethical politicians represent themselves and will do whatever big pharma, big oil, and major lobby groups pushing some government bill to affect monopolies for themselves.

We see the millions and billions of dollars being spent on politicians by big business interests and when we see this going on we are witnessing the cancer that is destroying America called greed.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:30 PM
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Dear God what is happening to us here? Why are they doing this to us? There are moments when I think that logic and intelligence will win in the end, but then I see this kind of change and I am starting to loose hope. It honestly feels like the lunatics are running the assylum. God help us all in these days ahead...



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:45 PM
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Originally posted by x2Strongx

Obamacare Slaps $15,000 Annual Fee on Middle Class Families


townha ll.com

The Congressional Budget Office's analysis of the final Senate health care bill indicates it would slap a mandatory annual fee of about $15,000 on middle-class families that earn an annual income greater than 400 percent of the federal poverty level ($88,200 for a family of four) and are not provided with health insurance by their employer.

On Dec. 19, the CBO sent a letter to Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., analyzing the fiscal impact of the bill the Senate is poised to vote on before Christmas.

The CBO analysis cites five basic facts about the bill that acting together would deal a devastating financial blow to many middle-class families if the bill is enacted and enforced as written.
(visit the link for the full news article)



[edit on 12/23/2009 by x2Strongx]



I'm waiting for the day that the government has #ed up the world so badly, that is starts to affect them. They might not realize it, but it will hurt them in the future...physically, financially, etc.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:46 PM
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Of the proposals still being considered is to cap the cost of mandated insurance (I am totally against the mandates, myself) at anywhere from 8%- 14% of one's annual income which is better than what many people are paying now...I suppose then it will be subsidized. I think this will make the class split in the USA even worse with those paying for all their health care and health insurance spiteful and hateful of anyone receiving subsidies...which I also think is wrong to think this way.

Again, let's fund all health care through a sales tax that everyone pays then have universal care for everyone. Don't let these insurance companies get away with this heist. Let's just eliminate the whole thieving immoral industry...they have already shown themselves to be a great malignancy on our entire culture and economy. Let's join the civilized world, please.

edited for grammar

[edit on 23-12-2009 by ChrisCrikey]



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:47 PM
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About the House's bill in early November, but same idea:



politifact.com...


Ex

posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:50 PM
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I am still at a lose to understand why health care is so
expensive anyway.
No really, who is getting all of these funds?
I don't see any hospitals downsizing,
nor Doctors at a loss for Mercedes or BMW's.
How much on an average do these guys make?
How much does it cost for a private hospital to operate on
a monthly average?
How much does an ER doc make in a month?
How much do the insurance companies make off
of malpractice insurance?
How much are the wheelchair and cane companies making ?
Or the Pharmacuticals?

Why doesn't anyone guestion the bottom line of it all?
Rather than throw more money at the problem?

Anyone??Why do I feel like an idiot for asking?

If that percentage of money was flowing out of my household budget
You could bet your nose,
I would know where it's going and who's making what!





[edit on 12/23/2009 by Ex]



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:51 PM
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Originally posted by NightoftheComet
Oh hail our great comrade leader OBAMA! OUR SAVIOR OBAMA! OBAMA! OBAMA! who can wash away the years of republican rule!


LOL! Seriously, what do people who vote dem think?

Ever notice how people with "vote obama" stickers are driving fancy cars and living the high life? Ever notice that people with republican stickers tend to be salt of the earth type people aka middle-class?

Seriously people need to read Karl Marx and his two class system philosphy very closely.

What? Are you kidding me? People with the fancy cars are the ones with Republican bumper stickers. Middle Class people and lower are the ones with with the Dem stickers. (I'm Democratic)



Republicans are for big buisness and the wealthy.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:52 PM
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I read thru all this thread and decided not to reply to things directly but I can't understand how anybody can be for this bill. Who are those 39% that are still supporting this insanity?
The bill is clearly unconstitutional on a number of fronts and clearly does nothing to actually improve the health care system. Then of course there is the cost ....
I have a friend that claims by the next Nov. elections Americans will have forgotten all about this and be on to the next 'hot' topic (another Tiger Woods or American Idol etc). Thats why congress doesn't seem to be paying attention, they know Americans don't have the attention span to remember come November. I wonder ....



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 10:04 PM
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"Beginning of the end", well, you may have hit the nail on the head with that statement...

I know I can't afford to shell out $15K, and frankly, I don't know where I'm going to get it from!! And seeing how I haven't got a raise in 4 years certainly doesn't help matters much. I guess this is Obama's "CHANGE" that he talked about?



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 10:16 PM
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reply to post by zz0409
 


If every body quit buying Insurance, don't go to Doctors, don't buy medicine in this country and some how manage to live on herbs for a few years, you will see the cost of medical system will come down crashing. I say this because when the government organize these businesses, it is very easy for them to manipulate the public. I have seen it in the country of my birth. Soon as the government took a step in favor of the Doctors, the cost to visiting doctors shot up. But they are still not organized to the point that would force individuals to cough up more money for visits because there is no Insurance system. And if a Doctor charge more they are not obligated to see that Doctor. They go some where else. Thus that Doctor has to keep his charges in line with others. I am talking $ 2/00 per visit which is too much for local people. But when we go from this country, it is convenience for us that we can pay $ 2/00. If you understand this then you will understand why medical system in US is bribing the Republicans to fight Obama's health Plan. About 5 years ago I read an article that a Carolina Carpenter needed pacer. He sold his house. Air Travel cost to India + stay there+ Got pacer and went sight seeing all cost him less than $ 10,000/00. It was quality care and he was pleased with it. This is why a lot of Americans move to other countries when they retire. There is a colony for Americans just south of LA, California across the border in Mexico. Can anybody comment on it. I read it and don't have personal experience with it. I am thinking myself to leave the country. It is my family that doesn't want to move but doesn't let me go either.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 10:25 PM
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Sorry, I don't believe the OP source is credible. Nobody is slapping a $15,000 fee on the middle class at that level. They could not afford it, and more would go to jail or be fined. I think they have their income levels off or something.

I was in business for 20 years. I had at least 7 types of taxes, and I couldn't afford health insurance. Luckily, we were healthy. I don't recommend you go without it. My son was hit by a car, and the state picked up the $150,000 tab because it fell under violent crimes against children. Lucky again. However, someone paid that bill. It was the taxpayers.

As long as so many are not covered, taxpayers will cover the differences. We have to get everyone insured, somehow, economically, to avoid such high health insurance and health care costs.

Seniors on Medicare have great plans. For example, if you are a senior on Medicare Part A, it's free. That gives you hospital. Medicare Part B costs $96.40 per month, and gives you medical. From there, the senior can get a Medicare Advantage plan, usually at no additional cost, and get almost all their costs covered. They would still have a small copay, like $10, for doctor visits. They gain dental, vision, and hearing coverages, too, with some small copays or coinsurances. I expect the health insurance plans for all Americans will follow this type of program. Social Security pays about $2000 per month for the seniors to have Medicare. They have that money from monies paid into the system by those who have received the benefit, as well as those who died before they could receive it.

I expect the national plans will give options, as does Medicare, and will have little or no copays or premiums. We will all benefit from reduced health insurance costs, and the improvement in the health of the workforce and their families will add to the productivity of the nation and the happiness in our homes. Our plans so far have led many to misery and bankruptcy.

Expect a great outcome.

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to all.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 10:27 PM
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reply to post by charlie0
 


Excellent points. I think medical tourism is going to be huge, especially with "baby boomers" who are now, as a demographic most difficult to insure and more of them would retire (age 55-64) and open up the job market for younger people if they weren't so insecure and so many of them have pre-existing conditions - impossible to get insurance.

If they take their health care dollars and savings out of this country it's really going to be a big deal. I have started researching this subject myself.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 10:29 PM
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Universal Healthcare will not kill the United States.. my humble evidence being that the US is the only industrialized nation in the world to not have universal healthcare and HAS been the only industrialized nation not to offer it since the 1920's. (In one form or another)

Stupidity.

[edit on 23-12-2009 by HankMcCoy]



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 10:32 PM
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reply to post by Chett
 


Because Americans are drugged. Next election is too far they don't even remember next day.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 10:39 PM
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reply to post by HankMcCoy
 

And all these other nations with health care are happy?
Anyway we likely do need to fix health care, doesn't mean this is the right way to do it.



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