why do "palestinians" say they have a right to israel's land

reply to post by siahchi


I have seen all that stuff for years in the past. The Palestinians are far from innocent, they intentionally put their civilians in harms way to tug on public sympathy. That is why all those pictures exist. They hide weapons in hospitals, mosques, schools, etc. Smuggle it into the area under the auspices of being humanitarian or medical supplies. That is why the stay there, its all a publicity thing to turn opinion against Israel.

Palestinians claim they have a right to the land, because until around 1948, they were living on it. Then it was given to the newly-formed nation of Israel. Of course, the Palestinians took it from others, who ultimately took it from the Israelites, and so on. Just about any tribe in the Middle East could probably lay claim to the land.

Understand that this is not in any sense a religious war. The only reason religion comes into it is that the elite Muslims can manipulate the masses by appealing to religious sentiments. So, while many Muslims are motivated by their religion, that is not the cause or the real reason for the wars and fighting. As always, it is money and power, not religion.

*edit*
double post



[edit on 9-11-2009 by siahchi]

reply to post by defcon5


Yeah, sure, Palestinians put their children in harms way as a marketing scheme to destroy isreals public image. This ain't a board room they're meeting in, and it's not a pr campaign. It's real life. The idea someone would put their children in mortal danger for a photo op or to influence public opinion is absolutely absurd.

You can't fake tears like that. Thousands of mothers and fathers,little children and grandparents are not faking tears for sympathy. Homes can be rebuilt, olive trees replanted, lives lost cannot be replaced. Who suffers the most casualties? Whose security is more in jeopardy? If you say the isrealis then your lying to yourself. him that hath eyes, let him see



[edit on 9-11-2009 by siahchi]

reply to post by siahchi


Perhaps you need to watch some of the Hamas and Hezbolla video's glorifying suicide bombing of civilians.

They are found on ATS and Google.

The search function is your friend.

The word Palestine derives from Philistia or Philistine, home to the Philistines who were the occupants of the coastal strip that is now Israel, whilst the Hebrews then lived in the uplands of Judea & Samaria. This problem has been going on for a long time not just since 1948.

The little land that is Israel/ Palestine is located at the only land bridge between the two vast continents of Asia and Africa: Thus, anybody living there is going to have to expect that powerful others will be requiring use of that land bridge from time to time.

Seems to me that any 'God' promising unending ownership of such a strategic piece of real estate, is setting up the said owners for much tribulation.
However, it is how the world goes, spin within spin within spin, solar system & galaxy, with Universe Beyond: All aahhh & aargh about:

reply to post by mrmonsoon


Perhaps you need to read articles like this one. the search function is your friend too.

Rabbi calls for annihilation of Arabs


Rabbi Calls for Annihilation of Arabs, BBC
"The spiritual leader of Israel's ultra-orthodox Shas party, Rabbi Ovadia Yosef, has provoked outrage with a sermon calling for the annihilation of Arabs. 'It is forbidden to be merciful to them. You must send missiles to them and annihilate them. They are evil and damnable,' he was quoted as saying in a sermon delivered on Monday to mark the Jewish festival of Passover. Rabbi Yosef is one of the most powerful religious figures in Israel, He is known for his outspoken comments and has in the past referred to the Arabs as 'vipers.' Through his influence over Shas, Israel's third largest political party, he is also a significant political figure."

I'd actually try to interject facts for both Israel and the Palestianians, but as one who's fallen into that trap before I will simply say this; if I'm an old-school Jordanian from before 1948 reading this thread, I'm laughing so hard hooka water is coming out of my nose.

reply to post by siahchi


We are talking about people who ENCOURAGE their children to sacrifice themselves for the cause here!?! PROVEN FACT! You have any idea what you are even talking about, or are you just spreading propaganda on their behalf?

reply to post by defcon5


And mandatory service in the IDF is not encouraging the young to be violent? What type of double standard is that? Palestinians take it upon themselves to fight their cause, isreal is so desperate EVERYONE must sign up for the military.

The Palestinians are outmanned and outgunned, yet isreal still needs to sacrafice even FORMER isreali citizens:

web.israelinsider.com...


IDF tries to encourage Israeli expatriates to join volunteer reserve unit
By: Israel Insider staff
Published: July 24, 2007

Amid reports of fewer Israeli youths joining the army, the Israeli Defense Forces has initiated a new campaign to encourage Israeli expatriates living abroad to come to Israel for reserve duty in the West Bank. The volunteer unit, HaTikva, is aimed at attracting thousands of Israelis living in the Diaspora. Service usually lasts from 12-13 days.

"The goal is to encourage the soldiers and let them know that they are not alone," the high-ranking officer told the Jerusalem Post. "When a 19-year-old soldier sees a 60-year-old volunteer standing at a checkpoint next to him late at night, the soldier realizes that he is not alone and that the citizens back home have not forgotten him."

[edit on 9-11-2009 by siahchi]

reply to post by resonance


That's a no brainer. Palestinians don't have right to Israeli land, they have right to own and keep their own land, right to oppose any stealing, snatching, robbing etc of their on homes and lands by the Nazi-Israeli's so called govt (terrorist).

They have right to call out against the Genocide being committed by Israeli govt. and as per the latest UN Mandate i.e, Goldstone Report 2009 - Israeli WAR CRIMINALS should be presecuted and executed in International Court of Law same like Nazis were. They should be hunted on the street like dogs like the German nazis were.

The Palestinans and every other person has that right.

Originally posted by Witness2008
Who's to say Jews have the right to any territory?

God

Originally posted by Witness2008
And by the way Muslims and Hebrews along with Christians worship the same male God.....all born out of the fables of Abraham.

You have been misinformed. Christians worship Christ. He rose from the dead. See www.garyhabermas.com for the facts on Christ resurrection.

Originally posted by Witness2008
Circumstances allow people to live and chose...not God.

Choices allow people to live and chose.

Originally posted by Magpie82n
where is israels land, eastern europe perhaps? but one thing is for sure with out any question Palastine is under occupation. Watch a documentary that jewish people have made it is called Occupation 101 but if you don't like the truth don't watch it.

this is a brief history of zionist and if any one think's i'm rasict well i'm not this is history and i can't change it but some can.
www.biblebelievers.org.au...

There land is where they went into from Egypt. Which is Israel although they don't have all of it yet.

All this debate over land!! who owns what anyway. You can't take land with you when you die!! Instead of all this religious stuff people throw at each other, have a look at reality. Religion, any religion, is nothing more than a myth and people throughout history have clung to it. let's start looking after our earth and its people without trying to lay claim to any land

reply to post by resonance


The uk controlled Palestine prior to ww2 and after the war the newly established un decided to make Israel it's own county where Palestine was under British control.

Personally it should be Palestine and not israel. I'm a Christian but I don't agree with anything about Israel. I live in Texas and all of the neo co. Evangleicals quote the bible to support the united states supporting Israel and the wars.

Israel and the wars are all wrong

I appreciate your reasoning. If it's the same God running both scams what leg do they have to stand on?

Historically Islam was modelled after Judaism. Mohammed himself tried to expand Jewish monotheism to Arabic tribes, but the Medina Jews were not interested - after a while they stopped cooperating. That is when he realised he should start his own franchise. Revelations came - and the rest is history. Nevertheless, his followers did come up with a lot of good stuff (I prefer Sufism myself).
He saw Christianity as corrupt, although Jesus was a prophet to him.

I am not writing this to say this or that side is better, just as a historical background to the OP: Islam came from the same godconcept indeed as Judaism.
There is philosophy in it too - all those platonists as well as the Jewish thinkers of the age were thinking about the final unity of everything - and there just cannot be two final unities by definition... or neither would be final.

What that source is claimed to have said to them about property rights through their respective godconcepts... is vastly different though.

It could have been an imposter though. Think Enki...

Originally posted by resonance
so here is my question..the so called "Palestinians" want Israel's land..now..the Muslims say they worship the same God (which they most certainly do not)..in the bible God makes a promise that once Israel is returned to the land they will inherit it forever..since they let their state religion dominate so many aspects of their lives, why would they not know that their God (who they claim is the same God of the Jews) gave them that land and just step aside..

They want it because they were there first?? If some of you guys knew some history you wouldn't ask such silly questions. FYI the white people who currently call themselves the Israelis are not, I repeat NOT the descendants of the ancient Hebrews. The vast majority of them are of Croatian and Russian descent. Thier ancestors converted to Judaism many centuries ago and it was they who were the target of Hitler's anti-Semitism.

The original Hebrews were the people who wrote the Torah and reputedly wandered the desert with the Ark Of The Covenant and all of that other stuff. After killing all of the original inhabitants of the area around Jeruselem, they established a nation and enjoyed a brief but turbulent period as a major power in the region. Eventually, however, their God abandoned them and they fell into a prolonged period of bondage as, one after another, they were conquered by whatever nation happened to have the toughest army at the time. Eventually they were occupied by the Roman Army, the most awesome fighting force that the ancient world had ever seen. This was the period that Jesus is reputed to have traipsed about, healing people and spreading a radical take on Judaism.

These were not happy times for the once proud nation of israel. They had been in captivity for hundreds of years by the time the Romans marched in. Many of the more educated and affluent Jews were openly abandoning their affiliation with the temple in exchange for the many privilages of Roman citizenship. The Jewish Fundy's were complaining about the lack of the promised Messiah and advocating open revolt. And the Hebrew priesthood was trying to walk the thin line between preserving their traditions and placating their Roman masters. The Hebrews' collective story ends badly. The Fundy's succeed in rallying a revolt against the imperial forces which results in the sacking of jeruselem and the total destruction of the Holy Temple by the Roman soldiers.

Many of the original Hebrews fled to distant places, but many more had nowhere else to go and remained in their homeland to suffer still more occupations until the British finally came to be the new landlords of what's left of Israel. By this time the majority of remnants of the Hebrew people were believers of Islam and their numbers were mixed in with representatives from every Arab nation on earth. As bad as things were for the original Hebrews at that time they were about to get a whole lot worse. The Nazi Genocide had resulted in a huge number of Croatian Newbie-Jewbie refugees. The end of WW2 saw a boatlaod of them steaming around the Atlantic in search of a new homeland, only Anti-Semitism being pretty prevalent back then, even in the Allied countries, nobody really wanted to have to assimilate their numbers.

So Britain hit upon the insane idea of turning over the Holy Land to these folks who are essentially Hebrew posers. (Boy am I going to get slammed for this, but it's the truth!) It wasn't long after the New Jews took possession of their kingdom that they began to run the folks that we now call the Palestinians out-of-town. They seized their businesses. They stole their homes. They murdered innocent people in order to take what they had. Today the Israeli government is the only government on the planet that can sustain a policy of Aparthied without fear of condemnation.

[edit on 9-11-2009 by godless]

reply to post by godless


Since the day that the New-Jews took possession of The "Holy Land'" they have persecuted the original inhabitants mercilessly. Home-made rocket attacks are responded to with helicopter gunships raining death down upon the innocent. huge walls have been erected to separate them from the their jobs and relatives and they must pass thru many military checkpoints if they are going to be able to travel into Israel in order to see loved ones or buy the goods they need to survive. Their homes are routinely bulldozed into oblivion, sometimes while they are still sleeping inside of them, in order to make way for the expansion of new Jewish settlements. A few months ago, after several atrocities on both sides, the most egregious being on the part of the Jews, whose gunships opened up on a group of Palestinian children, their power and water were cut off by those Oh-So-God-Fearing people. The Palestinians were denied medicine!

What a compassionate bunch! As if all of this abuse and inhumanity were not enough this nation holds the distinction as the ONLY Middle eastern country to ever openly attack a United States vessel. 1967, the USS Liberty. They did their best to sink her but she survived, but not without the loss of many American lives. And what was their reward for their valor? Admiral McCaine, John's father, called the survivors together and ordered their silence about what they had endured!! Huh?? (Please look it up if you don't believe me).

I hope this little history lesson illuminates your mind as to why the Palestinians would want not only their land, homes and businesses back, but also why they would seek redress for injuries inflicted upon them by a group of white men who posture as if they were the authors of the Bible when, in plain fact, they are only shallow posers whose real objectives are as far away from their proclaimed God's purposes as Pluto is from the sun. A pre-eminant theme in all of our many president's dealings with the Palestinians is the idea that they must accept the ligitimacy of Israel as a nation. I really dont see why. Just because a bunch of Commies say, "I believe", they're suddenly entitled to Real Estate?? If that's true then don't the Born-Agains own Bethlehem?? To me the premise supporting the legitimacy of this oppressive and cruel state is questionable at best.

I honestly have no symapathy for a nation that went from being the oppressed to the oppressor in less than ten years time. Israel is a naton in need of a major class injection. They should stop trying to always play the victim and, instead, own up to their own transgressions, which are now as bad or worse than what the Nazis put them thru.
The end

[edit on 9-11-2009 by godless]

I agree. You'd have thought that they would have learned by now. The persecution of the jews was a dreadful chapter in human history, but now they're persecuting another people. It's high time they had a change of attitude.