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I am a member of the English Defense League

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posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 04:31 AM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.



Originally posted by Cythraul
Interesting, because I've been wondering why ordinary moderate Muslims feel the need to counter-protest a protest which is aimed squarely at Islamic Extremism only.


I think you are slightly confused Cy.

The EDL are arranging to protest the march in London I described above. Not the other way round.

The march in London was set up to proclaim support for the Palestians etc.

Supporting the Palestinians has nothing to do with supposedly usurping the "British way of life".

So why would the EDL feel the need to counter that rally?

And why would they be associated with football hooliganism, come to think of it?


As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.




posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 05:05 AM
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Well done EDL

You have my support but i disagree on calling the your group the English Defence league because there are plenty of Welsh and Scots that feel the same way so how about British Defence League?



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 05:10 AM
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There anglo saxons mate,there not gonna want any celts in the mix!



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 05:17 AM
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reply to post by noangels
 

Well if thats the case the country is in worse shape than i thought



Best i just stick to my own sheep and my own valleys



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 05:22 AM
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Originally posted by woodwardjnr
Probably because the EDL chooses to hold their protests and demonstrate in areas with a large muslim population, like Birmingham. choosing to stoke up a racial divide in those communities and in a sense tarring the whole community with one brush.

When Muslim Extremism is what you oppose, wouldn't it be most pertinent to hold the protest in area with a large number of Muslim Extremists? The goal is not to stoke up racial divide, because a) Islam is not a race and the EDL or not racist, and b) the protests are intentionally non-violent and were no moderate Muslims to turn up and counter-protest, there'd be not a single clash.


Originally posted by neformore
So why would the EDL feel the need to counter that rally?

No, I actually agree with you. I'm not sure why the EDL are planning to be there. But you have to also question why moderate Muslims would consistently counter-protest protests which are aimed exclusively at extremists. It just begs the question - do these moderates support the extremists? Do they oppose all criticism of the extremists of their faith?


Originally posted by neformore
And why would they be associated with football hooliganism, come to think of it?

I addressed that point on page 11.



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 05:26 AM
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Originally posted by parrallel
Well if thats the case the country is in worse shape than i thought

Noangels was just trying to make a point mate - ignore him. I don't represent the EDL but I do know that they already have plenty of supporters from all over the UK - including a Welsh division. Noangels was referring to a point I made earlier about the English being ethnically Anglo-Saxon. Extremism is a problem infecting the whole of the UK and I'd strongly hope that Welshmen, Scots and Irish all choose to get involved.



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 05:44 AM
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reply to post by poet1b
 



Hmm, so in your opinion all the problems of the world are created by working class whites who like to go out and have a good time now and then? And yet you don't consider yourself to be a racist or a classist?


Mate, stop putting words into my mouth and please read and understand my previous posts. Where did i say all the problems of the world are created by working class whites who like to go out and have a good time?

My stance is that's there's a lot of problems the EDL should be focusing on and not just Muslim extremism. If they want to defend the English way then they need to take a look at all problems and not just shout in the street. That doesn't help anyone. They fear what one group might do and miss what another group is actually doing. I was making a point that if they want to focus their efforts on 'defending' this country there's more than Muslims to aim that at. And just 'defending' against Muslims is pretty biased against Muslims.



[edit on 10-9-2009 by Nammu]



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 05:48 AM
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reply to post by Cythraul
 


YOU boasted earlier that your little group was full of proud ANGLO SAXONS and then a good mod here showed your little group is linked to football hooliganism.

Your fooling none here sunshine,but the racists lap it up like the lap dogs they are



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 05:49 AM
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reply to post by maya27
 


Don't judge by the picture alone. They come in all shapes, sizes, colours, ages and creeds, although majority tend to be white but that point is moot.


My more integrated asian muslim friends find it just as disturbing and unacceptable as the rest of us white, brits do


Mine too. You can refer to my reply to poet1b above for my stance and why i brought this up cause i can't be bothered repeating it




posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 05:57 AM
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Originally posted by Nammu
I've got a few questions for the OP.

You are outraged by one particular Muslim lawyer saying that Christmas is evil. Have you been in touch with this person to discuss this viewpoint with him? Have you protested near this person's home or place of work to get across your outrage at this particular person making this particular statement?

You are outraged because the city council took down the St George's flags. Has the EDL been in touch with the local council to lobby them about this? Has the council confirmed that this was due to them believing that it may offend Muslims, or for a different reason? Did they receive any complaints from any Muslims about the flags?

You are outraged because the media reported that a number of British mosques are preaching a message of hate and segregation. Has the EDL been in touch with these particular mosques to start liaisons towards your goals? Assuming your goal is to stop them preaching such messages, what plan do you have in place to reach this objective?

And lastly, do you believe that arranging general protests in front of the general Muslim population is furthering your cause? Do you believe that a more direct approach to tackle those 'bad apples' and not the general Muslim population (which you say you do not have a problem with) may be a better approach?


Haydn_17 can i get an answer to these questions from my previous post? I know you can't speak for the whole EDL but i'm genuinely interested on your opinion.



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 06:13 AM
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Originally posted by noangels
YOU boasted earlier that your little group was full of proud ANGLO SAXONS and then a good mod here showed your little group is linked to football hooliganism.

And the two are mutually exclusive? Anglo-Saxon ancestry is not something that can be won or lost by one's actions. You nor I can choose WHO has Anglo-Saxon origins and being a 'football hooligan' does not negate one's ancestry. I've been frequenting the EDL forum and have encountered some of the smartest, most rational, least violent-minded people of all my time on the net. So your stereotyping of both 'football hooligans' as uneducated, violent scum and EDL members as all being 'football hooligans' is unjustified.


Originally posted by noangels
Your fooling none here sunshine,but the racists lap it up like the lap dogs they are

Ya know, I do KNOW why people like you cling to the "R" word even when it's been repeatedly debunked that the group or person in question is 'racist'. It's because without the ability to cry 'racist', you have no further tools of debate that are guaranteed to get the majority on your side.

I'll state again that the EDL are a mixed-race group, open to all and have stated their non-racist stance. Should you choose to call me and them racist again, it will hinder the credibility of any other points you choose to make.



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 06:53 AM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.


reply to post by Cythraul
 


So you did Cy...



To those of you who say the English Defence League are just football hooligans:
Why would that matter? Does it automatically make them violent and uneducated?


Yes. It makes them violent.

I've never seen a football hooligan handing out roses and chocolates Cy...have you? Usually its a damn good kicking or battering with a handy sized object, usually carried out by a pack of people.

Maybe you're lucky enough not to have experienced it at its worst? I have.

Uneducated? Possibly not. Stupid is a better word I think. Such people would invoke violence on the colour of someones shirt, or their proximity to a sporting arena. As such I don't hold out much hope for rational thought from them.

The interesting point here is that football holligans are extremists. Shouldn't they be protesting their own existence?



As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



[edit on 10/9/09 by neformore]



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 07:07 AM
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reply to post by neformore
 

Of all the 'football hooligans' I've known, none would attack someone for no reason. Furthermore, 'extremism' is not merely the will to act violently. Personally, I'm far less worried about outward physical and terrorist attacks by extreme Muslims than I am about the 'supposedly' acceptable practice of converting Churches to Mosques, converting unsuspecting children, creating ghettos, halal slaughter methods, concurrent legal systems and a general afront to British values and tradition.

Bottom line is - this is Britain. Did you really expect the British to not stand up and defend it from colonisation as they have done countless times throughout its history?



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 07:39 AM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.



Originally posted by Cythraul
Of all the 'football hooligans' I've known, none would attack someone for no reason.


Oh you're right. Not for "no reason".

The reason they would attack someone is because their shirt is a different colour, or they are in "the wrong pub", or they are chanting the "wrong song", because they support the "wrong team".

All are perfectly rational reasons to invoke violence on someone aren't they?



Come on Cy.....


As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



[edit on 10/9/09 by neformore]



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 07:40 AM
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Double Post. - removed

[edit on 10/9/09 by neformore]



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 07:54 AM
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reply to post by neformore
 


The reasons for football hooliganism are many.

I studied hooliganism as part of a Social Sciences Course I did quite a few years ago.
It helped that I quite a bit of experience of it.

I would suggest that it warrants a thread of it's own.

I assure you, not all football hooligans are knucke draggers or even violent people outside of that 'scene'.



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 07:55 AM
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Just judge people by the fruits of their labour Nef, not their label. It doesn't matter what type of person makes up the EDL. If they're violent, then they're not complying with the aims of the group. If they're peaceful, and happen to be a football fan, then they are. From the evidence I've amounted, the EDL have only broken the peacefulness of their protest when attacked by their opposition. Self-defense is justified.

The UAF, for example, have proven themselves far more likely to physically attack opponents than any 'right-wing' group I can think of.



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 07:59 AM
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reply to post by Freeborn
 

Indeed Freeborn. Unfortunately our nature is that some human beings are born warriors. Where there is a lack of legitimate outlet for this natural instinct, illegitimate outlets come into play. Better that these people beat each other up than unwilling victims. As such, like I said, I've not know a 'hooligan' pick an innocent, random person.



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 09:12 AM
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reply to post by Cythraul
 


Warriors!Your having a laugh if you think hooligans are that!

The warriors I have known have been very modest and decent human beings,ranging from soldiers to martial artists.Their natural instinct isnt to kick the living daylights out of a fallen oponent in high numbers like the pack of hooligans who are untrained fighters with mob mentality to make up for their lack of fighting skils.

Cant believe your standing up for football hooligans and calling them warriors!

Yeahh not all of them are knuckle dragging bone heads,sick people who get a buzz out of hurting people dont all come from council houses with low education.In all walks of life your going to find people who like to hurt others,and you know what-there still sick pond life no matter the house they own and the car they drive

LOL warriors! heard it all now



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 10:08 AM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.



Originally posted by Cythraul
As such, like I said, I've not know a 'hooligan' pick an innocent, random person.


You must have missed this then


The stab victim at the West Ham v Millwall match was an innocent family man supporting Millwall who was attacked by rival fans, police said.


And thats only from 13 days ago.

Oh look, heres some more



A 24-year-old Charlton Athletic fan suffered a broken nose during the event and several other passengers were head butted, punched and verbally abused.


You are trying to defend the indefensible there Cy.



If the people involved in the EDL, and organising their rallies, are of this ilk, it strikes me that they are there for a ruck, and not for anything else.


As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



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