Sikh soldiers guard Queen Elizabeth II

Originally posted by Udontknowme
It's a symbolic move. Since India gained their independence, having Indian guards is a little jab at India. She is one evil woman.

Maybe in Western terms or American guilt about slavery. In denotation it's way more of a symbol of faith and choice over the other rising minority in the UK.

Sim and Sarvjit are first Sikh soldiers to guard the Queen

Wow....

Imagine that.

Soldiers in the British Army carrying out their duties as required of them, filling in - as has happened previously with other units - while the Household Division is deployed on operational duties elsewhere.

And two of them happen to be Sikhs. Good for them.

Sikhs have been a part of the British Army since colonial times, in the same vein as the Ghurkahs have.

Nothing really to see here unless you have an axe to grind, for the sake of it - that or a predisposition for fantasy hysterics and drama.

reply to post by DenyAllKnowledge


How dare you!

Bloody cheek mate. Are you trying to suggest your own countrymen are treacherous and not trustworthy?

Are you a 'naturalized' Briton, by any chance?

Not that it matters, your comments are both ignorant and outright wrong.

Britons are world renown for their fairness and sense of morality and honour.

We have bad apples just as anyone does, but to say Britons are without honour and are treacherous and so on, is totally out of order.

If you have so low an opinion of your countrymen, why don't you go elsewhere? I'll tell you, because we give you everything you need, education, NHS, welfare, a good standard of living and so on...is that dishonorable?

Go on...get out of it.

reply to post by IDK88


The entire family are german incestous freaks who may or may not be reptilians in disguise.. oh and they are/were Nazi supporters.

other than that...

it's disgusting that they remove tradition in a heartbeat.. if they want to live in this country they HAVE to adapt to this country's way of life

I am a baptised sikh and some of the nonsense in this thread is crazy, anyone can google sikhism and find the truth, instead they spread lies on these forums.
Sikhism preaches a message of devotion and remembrance of God at all times, truthful living, equality of mankind and denounces superstitions and blind rituals. Sikhism is open to all through the teachings of its 10 Gurus enshrined in the Sikh Holy Book and Living Guru, Sri Guru Granth Sahib.

Sikh literally means to learn and would probably never have been militarized if it was not for the mughal attacks on India. When we are baptised we become khalsa sikhs or saint soldiers, a saint first and then a soldier and are part of the army of God whose function is the protection and safeguarding of all the peoples of God.

So I would say the queen is in good hands!..

If you have Sikh friends or if raised around Sikhs like my son has, you would know they are from India and wherever the Arab association came in on the thread is just ....ignorance in motion.

On the subject though, the same situation has happened here in Canada:

Sikh Mounties permitted to wear turbans
archives.cbc.ca...

www.nriinternet.com...

They have served in Brit and Canadian military history and are simply allowed to wear the turban. To remove it would be like being asked not to wear a Christian cross around one's neck.

reply to post by DenyAllKnowledge


Perfidious? Are you honestly implying that Sikh's are more trustworthy than English people and therefore better served at protecting something??

Trust and honor are measured by the individual not races or religions.

Protecting something they probably don't care about either, regardless of their skill

Edit cos I've just seen spikey's post. Good on ya!!

[edit on 6-10-2009 by ItsallCrazy]

Oh man the bait and switch..

I wonder whats next?

Hi,

Reading this thread fueled me to join up ATS! Firstly I'd like to say that I am a Sikh living in the UK, England to be more specific. My first thoughts of seeing the title of this post were that I'm happy to see fellow Sikhs and our faith in more positive publicity. After reading the thoughts and opinions of posters, combined with the absolutely false information surrounding Sikhism left me feeling somewhat saddened. I really feel like I need to clear a few things up because I can't just leave the thread with untruths. I am appaled at the fact that even though this post was referencing a proud Sikh moment, the personal feelings of people on this board has irrelevantly brought Islam into the conversation.

This has hit a nerve as I am getting late for my lecture for the Masters degree I am studying, so forgive me that nothing is linked or referenced yet. I am going to set up a a new thread for a brief history of Sikhism and why it is important for especially America to learn about one of the main religions of the world so that the murders of innocent Sikhs who have been mistaken for Islamic terrorists (whilst driving taxis!) will not happen again.

Firstly, I'd like to say that Sikhism is not a 'fusion' between Hinduism and Sikhism. And by NO MEANS was Sikhism created by the Hindus as their militant wing. Sikhism was created by Guru Nanak Dev Ji. Although born into a Hindu family, Guru Nanak Ji rejected wearing a string traditionally worn by Hindus at a young age.

India was largely based on a caste system at this time. This is by and large a Hindu tradition, and was the motivator for Guru Nanak not to follow Hindu ways of life.

The two prominent religions in India were Islam and Hinduism. Any religious leader, or any individual at the time questioning philosophy would have to take their teachings into account. This can half validate the statement that Sikhism may be influenced by the other two religions.

Sikhism is the only religion which acknowledges and accepts other religions and will peacefully coexist with them. It is not a missionary religion. We do not ever forcefully convert and there has never been one forceful conversion in our history. We belive that if you are going to be a Christian, Muslim, Jew or Hindu, be the best Christian, Muslim, Jew and Hindu you can be!

Now to answer to or correct in my opinion the posts which have bothered me:

reply posted on 1-8-2009 @ 01:34 PM by IDK88
As I pull back the darkness which protects the British Monarchy (ha ha ha) it seems that what begins to emerge is the true nature of your "Queen".

Is it possible that she is not at all British, but instead an Indian Witch that has throughly pull the wool over the eyes of everyone in the UK.

reply posted on 1-8-2009 @ 02:26 PM by IDK88
Some of you don't see things as I...that's cool. Some things happen so gradually that when you cross the point of no return, you don't even know that you've crossed and have no idea of what you would go back to if you knew to go back.

I suppose then if the British are cool with being a Province of a Great Sikh Empire then who am I to complain. I am American...and am not a particular fan of British policies over the last 30 or so years. Good luck with that.

I suppose Hindi will have to become the language spoken within the Church of England and on the floor of Parliament before anyone asks questions.

Edited to include quotes



[edit on 18-11-2009 by life3]

reply to post by IDK88


The queen has sikhs guarding her - oh! I am so relieved - NOT.

Who cares who guards the queen?

Good to see I'm not the only one who's employer prefers Indians to people born in that actual country.

Second line

reply posted on 1-8-2009 @ 06:35 PM by IDK88

In a story called the first book of Adam and Eve, the Serpent was thrown to India, one of the only places mentioned in the story, as most places had no names in the distant past. The city of Bombay/Mumbai is the great city which corrupted the Kings of the Earth.

But all you can see is the obvious...it is no coincidence that your queens current guardians are Sikhs, in the sense that they are not the traditional guardians. From a certain perspective, your queen has been Captured or are you really that dense that this isn't obvious. Sure, they are British soldiers, but they are Sikhs first and foremost, and they are have your queen.

I suppose my warnings to you have arrived to late...best of luck to you.

IDK, the list goes on, where can I start? I think your ignorance can be stemmed by the fact that you do not live in the UK, and I’m guessing you do not know any Sikhs. Your posts show a slight 'hatred' towards the Indian people. Please, please do your research before you post. If you have person opinon, that is fine. But at least make it an EDUCATED opion.

At first I could have taken your post as being a light hearted joke. After reading the rest of your posts, you clearly have an underlying bitterness for the Queen being ‘protected’ by two Sikh men. The keyword is underlying. I think everyone would prefer it if you were just clear about it.

As for everybody who thinks that the guards protect the queen, sure they are the first line of defence but has anybody not considered how many body guards may be protecting the royal family inside? The guards in my opinion have been mostly for show, as well as to protect. They have been considered tourist attractions! Do you honestly believe that two guards who’s history has shown great alliance with the British army means that the ‘big bad Sikhs are coming to take over the country?’

reply posted on 1-8-2009 @ 10:21 PM by googolplex
Originally posted by AgentX09
Does anyone except me remember that Indira Ghandi was betrayed and assinated by her Sikh body guards?It was religeously motivated but i cant recall.



They killed Indira with machine guns because she sent the troops into the Golden Temple and desecrated the temple.

The guards went on vacation went back to Punjab saw what she had done, were baptistized into Sikhdom when back and killed her ass.

One Sikh guy killed Indira Gandhi. It was her personal bodyguard and from what I remember, it was with a knife. Why? Gandhi gave the go ahead for the atrocious attacks in Punjab. The scapegoat was a ‘terrorist’ called Jarnail Singh Bhindrawala. All Bhindrawala was said to have been doing was protecting locals from corruption. I have no personal bias one way or another on this matter. All I can say is, they should have detained him like any other country would have done. Since when did detaining one person include putting bullets into our holy scriptures? The Golden Temple was massively defaced and many many Punjabis murdered. This is why the bodyguard killed Indira Gandhi.
The assassination of Gandhi lead to the riots against Sikhs by the Hindus of India. Thousands upon thousands of Sikhs were murdered, raped and robbed. This isn’t personal bias, it is fact. See the BBC’s accounts of this.



[edit on 18-11-2009 by life3]

Also, why should QE be so protected?
She is just a human being like everyone else.

reply posted on 1-8-2009 @ 07:14 PM by IDK88
reply to post by Johnmike
________________________________________


Timurids

I could only find this map...During Tamerlane's time, but he made at least to Delhi, so this map could easily modified to show that. The rest is self explanatory.

When Tamerlane moved from place to place throughout the region, his palace being in Samarkand, Uzbekistan, he was simply reassembling something that had once existed. Is this proof enough...buttcheeks?

reply posted on 1-8-2009 @ 07:26 PM by IDK88
Here is Persian Darius...you'll notice that the map seems to end at the northern Edge of the Sub continent...but I think this is probably because many rulers didn't venture in the India out of respect for their mother or something.

IDK, there are posts upon posts of you trying to prove that Persia was a part of India for some reason. I really don't understand the point you are trying to make or why it is relevant to Sikhs standing guard for the Queen? I don't like labeling people, but you really sound ignorant bordering on racist via eneducated conclusions.

reply posted on 1-8-2009 @ 02:22 PM by ~Lucidity
they're still british army, right? but them wearing a different uniform is kinda strange is what i meant. if they're in that army why wouldn't they just wear the same uniforms as the other dudes? why make such a change?

Although the Sikh regiment has always been a prominent regiment in the British army, the regiment doesn’t formally exist. However right from the battles between Britain and India before the British took over, the Sikh army of the Sikh Empire were the last army standing in the way of Britain and her empire. After the takeover, Sikhs have been considered a very special and dangerous unit (the Sikh martial art: Shastar Vidiya, has been deemed illegal in the UK). Ever since, the British have always wanted Sikhs on their side and the uniform is a mark of respect for the Sikh army. Sikhs have no problem fighting for the British at the moment, we fight against injustice to humankind no matter where the land.

reply posted on 1-8-2009 @ 02:27 PM by shuck
The Sikhs in UK have always integrated ..reckon a lot of them beieve more in the UK and what it stands for than a lot of Brits do!!
I think it goes back to the days of colonialism and the Raj..

Anyway I don't have a problem with it..and I am an ex soldier!!

I am a Sikh and I love my country! I was born here and I respect this land. I would never see any injustice or harm come to innocent people of where I’m from. I admit, racism used to be bad when I was younger. I was called ‘paki’ many times. People of the UK have become more educated to the minorities which live here that most do know the difference between a Pakistani and an Indian.


Edited to include quotes

[edit on 18-11-2009 by life3]

[edit on 18-11-2009 by life3]

its the skin color thing, for many in this country anyone brown is considered a muslim al-quaeda islamist suicide bomber,

I can here the EDL members now
" what, protecting our glorious Queen? i told you we'd have sharia law here"

reply posted on 1-8-2009 @ 03:02 PM by ModernAcademia
omg

Sikhs are Indian, from India
not one of them are arab

all sikhs were originally hindu
but then Hinduism was in jeopordy because of muslim invaders

Mughals came to india to force many hindus to become muslim with a sword, convert to islam or be decapitated

Hindus, as you know, has a caste system
This wasn't a religious system as many of you think however
Casteism was actually an attempt for a specific economic framework
basically based on your last name, it would be pre-determined what career path you would take, kind of like the movie Gattaca if u've seen it

brahmans were teachers, kshatriya were soldiers, etc..

So they took the hindus belonging to the kshatriya caste and created an army to defend hindus against muslim invaders, they were called the Sikhs

Sikhs are not Hindus and are not a branch of Hinduism by any means. Do not get me wrong, I have no negative feelings towards them; I have many close friends who are Hindus, and my family are married to some. But the truth is the truth! The origin of the myth, many people have explained to me, was the propaganda scheme by somewhat extremist Hindu group, the RSS (Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh). The RSS’s values are rejected by Hindus who call themselves ‘true Hindus.’ The RSS announced that Sikhs were Hindus, created as a militant wing of Hinduism to fight the Islamic invaders, and now that such situation does not exist we should call ourselves Hindus.

This is propaganda mainly released after the massacre of thousands of Sikhs across India after the 1984 attacks on The Golden Temple (operation Bluestar). Our holy scriptures are written in medieval Punjabi (Gurmukhi). Friends from Punjab told me that the government has stopped teaching Punjabi in Punjab! What a disgrace.

reply posted on 1-8-2009 @ 09:16 PM by AgentX09
Does anyone except me remember that Indira Ghandi was betrayed and assinated by her Sikh body guards?It was religeously motivated but i cant recall.

reply posted on 1-8-2009 @ 10:21 PM by googolplex
Originally posted by AgentX09
Does anyone except me remember that Indira Ghandi was betrayed and assinated by her Sikh body guards?It was religeously motivated but i cant recall.



They killed Indira with machine guns because she sent the troops into the Golden Temple and desecrated the temple.

The guards went on vacation went back to Punjab saw what she had done, were baptistized into Sikhdom when back and killed her ass.

One Sikh guy killed Indira Gandhi. It was her personal bodyguard and from what I remember, it was with a knife. Why? Gandhi gave the go ahead for the atrocious attacks in Punjab. The scapegoat was a ‘terrorist’ called Jarnail Singh Bhindrawala. All Bhindrawala was said to have been doing was protecting locals from corruption. I have no personal bias one way or another on this matter. All I can say is, they should have detained him like any other country would have done. Since when did detaining one person include putting bullets into our holy scriptures? The Golden Temple was massively defaced and many many Punjabis murdered. This is why the bodyguard killed Indira Gandhi.

The assassination of Gandhi lead to the riots against Sikhs by the Hindus of India. Thousands upon thousands of Sikhs were murdered, raped and robbed. This isn’t personal bias, it is fact. See the BBC’s accounts of this. It is considered the genocide of Sikhs.




[edit on 18-11-2009 by life3]

Many Sikhs do not consider themselves Indian. Before the invasion of the British, the Sikhs had their own powerful kingdom: The Sikh Empire. This vast land covered Punjab and what is now Pakistan. The land was a happy place for all types of people to live together. Sikhism doesn’t see race, caste or colour. Many Sikhs feel that we were wronged when India regained independence and was immediately partitioned to two countries (Pakistan and Bangladesh, which was then East Pakistan) which never existed! The Sikh were never given their land back.


>>To IDK: why are you so concerned about the geological and geographical histories of India? You say, "I am American...and am not a particular fan of British policies over the last 30 or so years. Good luck with that."

>>How much do you know about your own history? Your laws are based on a Abrahamic religion which is Middle Eastern. Much of your important architechture is based on ancient Egyptian symbolism. But I'm sure you know every in and out of that and the history of America. Please for our sakes educate yourself on the posts you write or just don't post.


Sorry if that seemed like a ramble, but I needed to get that off my chest. Just as the other fellow Sikh poster said, the truth is out there and is easy to obtain, yet people haven't bothered finding it out and decide to post lies.

These posts have further shown the ignorance of many who believe Sikhs are Arabs, Sikhs are a fusion of Islam....
It is this ignorance I want to counter so that the murders of innocent Sikhs will not happen again.

And for all who do not know, many of the turban wearers in the UK (and Vancouver) are Sikh. Please do not mistake us for Arabs. I have nothing against Muslims, Hindus, Christians or any people of any religion. I constantly talk to people of different faiths and have deep and meaningful conversations because I believe that knowing what others believe and understanding why they live and carry out their daily lives the way they do will help us understand where they are coming from.

It is only then we will be able to coexist peacefully.

Originally posted by woodwardjnr
its the skin color thing, for many in this country anyone brown is considered a muslim al-quaeda islamist suicide bomber,

I can here the EDL members now
" what, protecting our glorious Queen? i told you we'd have sharia law here"

Hi Woodward, I see where you're coming from. I have personally seem racism towards me as a Sikh of Indian background decrease as people became more aware about different cultures in the UK. The only time I saw a small rise in racism was about a year ago when the mainly Polish neo-nazi groups moved into my city. They do not in my opinion reflect the nature of every other members of the Polish people as they are generally very nice people.

You are right though, misinformation is fuelling a race war... Many muslims I know love this country as much as I do and do not want to see us in a state of war.

Im amazed how many sikhs are on ATS....and I thought MikeSingh was the only one.....

I think these Guards will do us proud.....good on them....

reply to post by woodwardjnr


I am very much an EDL sympathiser but as previously stated I have absolutely no problem whatsoever with Sikh's protecting The Queen, neither have the vast majority of people I know who also sympathise with EDL, in fact I know a Sikh member of EDL!

Sikh's have a very long and proud tradition of serving Britain in the Armed Forces and have become a valued and trusted part of British society.

Your own bigotry and blinkered viewpoint at times stops you from being objective my friend.