Is it time to ditch the bible?

reply to post by Thistled


As I mentioned before, if you can't see the manipulation with religion, then you won't realize the next manipulation. What good does it matter if you get rid of religion if people are still subject to the same manipulations? Getting rid of Religion isn't going to get rid of the manipulation. You're looking at a symptom, not the cause. All you are going to do is replace it without another belief system.

And if you can see the manipulation from Jesus to Paul and the church, then doesn't that mean that Jesus is actually on your side? And what would that mean? What if Jesus actually doesn't stand up for the hypocrisy. What is he speaks out against it? What if Jesus tells people not to follow church type leaders? Then what?

But see, people who reject Jesus and the bible because of the dogmas of the church, because of the hypocrisy of the religion do not see this. They do not know what Jesus actually stood for, the actual understanding he gave. You proved this because you assumed I was a bible thumping Christian.

For example. You know how Christians always claim they are the only ones who can go to heaven and such? Guess what. Jesus doesn't say that. Not only because the religion didn't exist at the time, but also because it's not true. He says directly, if you don't love him and hear his words, the words you hear are the fathers.

Or how about Paul saying that following Jesus means submission to authority(no coincidence the book is called Romans, the authority of the time). Does Jesus every listen to authority? No, he doesn't. In fact, he doesn't to the point where he is killed for it, because he threatens the powers. They conspire against him to keep their power. The only thing Jesus doesn't do is fight back and break a commandment. He doesn't submit to authority, he just couldn't fight back without killing people, which is to break a commandment.

Did you know he directly talks about these people who go around doing things in his name? Directly says it.

Tell me, isn't it a bit odd that someone needs Paul in order to understand Jesus? Why is it that Paul makes up nearly 50% of the NT? More than all the apostles who actually walked with Jesus combined?

All the stuff you see as bad and brainwashed people is warned about and told it's going to happen. If you don't realize this, then you are accepting and rejecting the understandings Jesus gives based only on the manipulation, not what is true.

There are millions of religion, all it is, is something created that presses the ideas of the creator of the religion, like if you know of the new FAD in mexico of I believe st. muerto the Saint of death that you pray to for gold and revenge on others, well its growing, apparently they pray to it to harm people who have wronged them.

Basically we all have a perfect idea of what the world should be, but it sounds so much nicer when we say "This is what GOD wants". You have to admit it has a nice ring to it.

As for me, i'm running right next to Richard Dawkins. Stopping religion is the best thing (Its gods will)

reply to post by Thistled


No, that is not right. Moving against the Throne is an the explicit attempt to overthrow the natural design and order and operate according some arbitrary concept of law and authority you developed after taking a few law and philosophy courses at the community college.

Being against the Throne is not about not worshipping it or paying it tribute, it is about an act of War, which deprives others of the very rights and privileges you'd want for yourself. Seriously, I don't think men were ever intended to spend time confirming or proving the existence of God. Like he would care what solution you arrived at.

There are plenty of non-religous people who aren't locked in combat with the Throne I built. There are plenty of religious people who are. Honestly, I am not sure that a non-religious person could effectively make war on the Throne I built. The Russian Orthodx Church, many Governments, the Banks and Corporations were all postured against my Throne and they've all been drastically changed. And this Throne still isn't operating at full strength.

So, I reassert that the Bible has plenty of practical information. Most noteably it contains the instructions for building and operating Thrones.

reply to post by huckfinn


So you suggest (because your throne is built ((based)) on the bible) I am declaring war against you because I don't subscribe to your throne?

reply to post by Thistled


My Throne is not based on the Bible, its based on scientifically verifiable facts. The Bible was useful as a reference and it was also good to see that there is a precedent to what I've built.

By you saying you don't subscribe to the Throne I built is to imply that you believe you can deprive innocent people of their lives, their property and their Constitutionally guaranteed rights and that noone is going to do anything to stop you and that there are no consequences to your actions. It also suggests that you operate according to another Throne that makes this type of behavior lawful for you to do.

I say you are wrong and that you will eventually be caught and when the Throne is operating at full strength and you commit a crime against someone you won't last long enough to celebrate it. If you don't believe me ask Rod Blagojevich why he isn't Governor of Illinois anymore.





[edit on 1-2-2009 by huckfinn]

Badmedia said
In context
[[For example. You know how Christians always claim they are the only ones who can go to heaven and such? Guess what. Jesus doesn't say that. Not only because the religion didn't exist at the time, but also because it's not true. He says directly, if you don't love him and hear his words, the words you hear are the fathers.]]


Excuse me Badmedia but could you show me that scripture please ?

Are these the verses you are talking about ? Sounds like your mixing the message a bit here ...arnt you ?

Jhn 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.

Jhn 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.



PS >..I really think you need to reread the book of John ...you sort of missed this too .

Jhn 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.

[edit on 1-2-2009 by Simplynoone]

reply to post by Thistled


Hello Thistled,

Just my own thoughts to add, I dont think any material should be ditched and every single religion is guilty of this, trying to kill off other histories of beliefs so their own shines forth as the right one.

And forgive, I have not read this whole thread...but still wanted to respond to you.

The Bible is special not because it is divinely inspired, but shows the difference in a ruling forceful god and the true divine essence of the god of love. The OT god is a ruling lord and I see this as the primal nature that emanates from the body complex....the Holy Spirit that we also see in the Bible is often the loving and nurturing one, who emanates mercy, grace, love, unity, wisdom ect....

We can learn what our own divine nature can be through the true spirit, the divine essence or we can choose the bible literal, and that all the claims Yahweh in the OT are god, along with the good loving god. I choose to separate them by the natures and I see how god is not the one displayed in the OT.

Mabey you are atheist, mabey you are seeking for understanding, I dont know....but if you are spiritual at all....I think the Bible should not be ditched, but just not taken literal word for word for what it ll says.

I think the Bible or any other material should not be ditched, but I think where people go wrong is choosing only one material to find all the truth. Search them all, learn from all the teachers, then seek with a humble heart and trust your intuition to show you what you need.

Just personal thoughts,
LV

Christianity, judaism and islam belief systems are religious sects where the
main power is fear. In these systems, fear is used to control the people. The
fear of hell, of eternal damnation, the fear of having your soul destroyed or
tortured and burned for all eternity.

Ask yourself, is such a belief system even worth a second thought?

These belief systems are the cause of the most devastating clinical disease
known to mankind: religious insanity. This disease completely wrecks the
the mind and body of a human being, either causing death or life long im-
prisonment.

Ask yourself, is such a belief system something you want to poison your
life with? Even as a small child, I instinctively felt to stay far away from
anything having to do with religion.

Other religions are destructive too, but none have produced consequences
as vile as the three control mechanisms called christianity, judaism and
islam. I recommend to stay far away from them, and if your mind is already
contaminated by them, do your best to cleanse yourself from its ideas, by
focusing on love and meditation for example.

I have a firm belief in God: I have been in pain and misery all my life, but
never have I blamed God for my pain, because I know that a person is
responsible for everything that happens in his life, because I know that when
a soul is born, he chooses in detail how his life will unfold, and keeps making
new choices on a subconscious level as he lives his life. Nothing will ever
shake my belief in a loving God.

But religion, is vile, religion has nothing to do with the real God.. the God of
love and compassion we all can feel deep in our heart, if we but only open
it and listen to it.

[edit on (1/2/09) by Wehali]

reply to post by LeoVirgo


Many thanks LeoVirgo, I am glad you are calm. It's so much better when people get to the point and are calm about it.

You still mention god, I don't do god, any god. I am all for ditching the bible, and certainly do not have a problem with it being displayed in a glass cabinet like all the other manuscripts, scrolls etc.

I will add however, this is not a personal attack, just a proposition /question.

reply to post by Wehali


Wehali! You speak what I think.

To me I would say no. There are some not ready as people like my father can't find meaning in life without having a bible guiding him. Long ago I realized that the meaning of my life is just living.

Anyway I think the literalists will eventually fall away and the book can be viewed as philosophy and mythology.

reply to post by Wehali


I keep hearing about this fear us christians are supposed to be under ..I have less fear now than I did before I believed in him ..knowing that GOD loves me is enough to ease my fears about everything ..and certainly caused me to NOT FEAR the world or anyone in it ...the word says fear not what man can do as he can only kill the body of which we reside in .....and I have already been in many situations where men did try to kill this body and of course tried to quench my spirit and kept me in fear of them ... ...I no longer fear any man or woman ...I dont fear satan ...and I sure dont fear death and I do not fear anything that may come at me in this world ..I have been tried and tested in that area and I learned exactly what the bible says ...that nothing in heaven on earth or anything can take me out of his hands ....I am his ...

Originally posted by toochaos4u
Long ago I realized that the meaning of my life is just living.

Beautiful.

Anyway I think the literalists will eventually fall away and the book can be viewed as philosophy and mythology.

That'll be the reference to bibles in glass cabinets. A part of history in a museum.

Originally posted by Simplynoone
Badmedia said
In context
[[For example. You know how Christians always claim they are the only ones who can go to heaven and such? Guess what. Jesus doesn't say that. Not only because the religion didn't exist at the time, but also because it's not true. He says directly, if you don't love him and hear his words, the words you hear are the fathers.]]


Excuse me Badmedia but could you show me that scripture please ?

Are these the verses you are talking about ? Sounds like your mixing the message a bit here ...arnt you ?

Jhn 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.

Jhn 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

I was referring to John 14.

23Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

24He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

25These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you.

26But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

But, this is all dependent on the day you know 14:20.

20At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

Don't really know why you are asking though, I've pointed this out to you like at least 20 times before.






[edit on 1-2-2009 by badmedia]

Originally posted by Simplynoone
PS >..I really think you need to reread the book of John ...you sort of missed this too .

Jhn 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.

43Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

44Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

45And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.

There seems to be a general consensus amongst those who say no to ditching, and that is the old testament is bad, and the "good" way is jesus and the new testament.

So why not ditch the old testament and focus on just the new? Why still promote the "bad" old?

As I see it, the old testament is a reminder of bad ways and dictatorship with a plethora of connotations. Some of it is an interesting read
, but some of it bad.

Hence ditch it, the whole thing that is.

reply to post by badmedia


Please lets not turn this topic into a quotation competition.

Although please do quote:

Leviticus, Exodus, etc etc

reply to post by Thistled


So ditch it. Why does anyone else need to ditch it?

reply to post by Thistled


May I ask, since you dont believe in god, why posts such a topic?

What is one line anyways
LV

Originally posted by Thistled
reply to post by badmedia

 

Please lets not turn this topic into a quotation competition.

Although please do quote:

Leviticus, Exodus, etc etc

Oh, so you are one of those low level thinking people who believe it's all or nothing with the bible huh?

It's just like I said, you just want to portray the bible in a certain light to support your agenda.