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[HOAX] Isaac CARET - Drones [HOAX]

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posted on May, 2 2008 @ 07:25 PM
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Yes, doubles,

again we are confronted with that question: Do you really believe in conspiracy?

But somebody has done this. So the answer only can be yes. The question is only, what kind of...?




posted on May, 2 2008 @ 07:59 PM
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Dana does do cross collaboration, expertise mostly in Bryce and poser, with about 5 yrs experience in photoshop. he has also done covers for several authors books. The most recent being striebers 2012 (WB)shown below.
and greys being produced by Sony.


I dont't think his artwork per se is connected, except an ever present themaic of egyptian mythology space and the paranormal.
IMG]http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc191/sys_config/ScreenHunter_01May022034.jpg[/IMG]

the only thing that noteorthy I found, in the above was the flooring patterns the man is standing on , which in the occult is a circlee functioning much like attos vortex generators. along the outer ring. remember that in all that stuff the mind is an integral part of the machinery. Thats why I laid out those vids in re lay lines, generators and apps. For fotographic analysis he would not be the man to call. As an employee of both in a way, He's not going to say anything or volunteer a comment I would think. But what the hec, why not.
But that was an outstanding tip. I will keep searching to see what other works may be out there. On his website danaaugustine.net he has a few samples from 2001 -2007..perhaps the others can check it out, as I was moving a little fast.

Thanx for that Double!
Peace


[edit on 2-5-2008 by Sys_Config]



posted on May, 2 2008 @ 08:10 PM
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reply to post by Siddharta
 


Interesting you put it that way. Hmmm. Yes, there is a conspiracy, since no one has 'fessed up yet. There are probably "satellite" conspiracies, too, like why on Earth not openly submit a couple of the hi res photos to someone like Bruce Maccabee, who was by the way interviewed on tape by LMH some years ago, in an exchange that can only be described as friendly?

There are people who would immediately suspect Whitley of *ahem* dreaming this whole mess up, but I am not one of them. That's not to say I would not be convinced by several pieces of solid evidence, but I don't see such evidence now and it would really mess with my opinion of Whitley. I think he is legit, but he's human and prone to flakiness occasionally just like the rest of us. I do disagree with a lot of his ideas and beliefs, but I think he has been sucked in by the drone conspiracy, and is not a party to it. I think if he were to direct his considerable resources at finding out who done it, we would all be better off.



posted on May, 2 2008 @ 09:27 PM
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Originally posted by Double_Nought_Spy
reply to post by Siddharta
 


Interesting you put it that way. Hmmm. Yes, there is a conspiracy, since no one has 'fessed up yet. There are probably "satellite" conspiracies, too, like why on Earth not openly submit a couple of the hi res photos to someone like Bruce Maccabee, who was by the way interviewed on tape by LMH some years ago, in an exchange that can only be described as friendly?

There are people who would immediately suspect Whitley of *ahem* dreaming this whole mess up, but I am not one of them. That's not to say I would not be convinced by several pieces of solid evidence, but I don't see such evidence now and it would really mess with my opinion of Whitley. I think he is legit, but he's human and prone to flakiness occasionally just like the rest of us. I do disagree with a lot of his ideas and beliefs, but I think he has been sucked in by the drone conspiracy, and is not a party to it. I think if he were to direct his considerable resources at finding out who done it, we would all be better off.

I agree I f whitley could direct his satellitte to release the pictures, that would be a good faith start
but it looks like a runaway satellite at the moment, waiting to crash thru the atmosphere. Following the people is the best course of action as in following the money trail. DRT wont give up or deny that LMH is funding in whole or in part . That is strange, that they ( a group of 6 individuals, residing in different parrts of the world , acting as one, getting tens of thousands of dollars to funnel to here sounds very complicated. I would love to see those 1099s . Yet, they can't say its not her, or her foundation, that did productions with history channel in the past or even Whitley.How do we know the money isn't coming from a Rick Doty type financier. Why can't they say they have nothing to do with the money? That would go a long way in help us rule out suspects.Since we are free to speculate . Perhaps our guest could also comment on that aspect and what they have discovered so far in a clear and non cryptic manner for that money.
And why they have not spent some of it on a paid professional forensic photo analyst.
I would also ask to see what in writing they have as requests for the hi res pix, to Linda, and what in writing do they have back from her.
If she can't answer, she is wasting our time.
Ask her, Would DRT and the entire Circle benefit and gain more if the matter is inconconclusive or if it was Hoax.?
be honest now.
Its hard I know, but good for you




[edit on 2-5-2008 by Sys_Config]

[edit on 2-5-2008 by Sys_Config]



posted on May, 2 2008 @ 09:36 PM
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Originally posted by Sys_Config
One of the difficult problems we have in relating this to the crop circle phenomena is that we ourselves are not into that area of research, other than what we come across, the designs and enigmas associated.
It seems an entire branch of study is involved. however. we know the the Reyes Whiley pdf linked them, and referenced LMH to them as their key reference, though there are peoople with vast more knowledge then any of them put together. So what we can do is is just remember terms like ley lines, plasma vortices, fengshui, ancient egypian and other symbology, sigils, geometries, etc etc etc. 45 letters would probably have been the one who would have eventually deciphered these linkages as he was an intense croppie analyst under the name of FXriot. He understood them well enough to see which ones were faked and reproducible by man, and which ones were not. Unfortunately, we know what happened at OM, the same thing that happened to us. Believe you me, that boy was no slouch. By the way, the other side has a new label for us, the Sysonfig Exile Group. I thought it sounded rather nice., courtesy of you know who.
well, One thing should be learned if at all possible. You never fire a cook during your rush hour. Thats all the wisdom i have to give out right now, Sidd will have to supply the rest. as Isaac said Believe you me, he is quite good at it. Then again, you can't believe everything Isaac tells you, he could have been saying..Believe you? me? hehehehe.
Seriously, he is the best Compadre I have the honor to know and work with.
We know Isaac is laughing, but wait till he hears us., believe you me


I came across these vids on you tube by gridkeeper, sid meier, and others that give you an idea what I am talking about, and why the designs of the craft, as well as LAP are associated.
Also why the big three really wanted to push this.
Both Attos work, the Lap nodes, and the Crop circle science interwine, based on sacred geometries, shapes, magnetism, mind channeling, and tapping into the forces be it free enrgy or gravitation.
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...

the vids are brief and are for acclimating our mindsets to theirs ,so we identify the patterns in Isaacs work, the PDF, and of course the Big 3.

Please take the time to visit the website on my signature at the bottom.
I will only have it up for a little while.
thank you









[edit on 2-5-2008 by Sys_Config]



Very nice Sys! Very very nice!

But whats with the lady captain from the Homeworld PC game?
It can only make sense if she was there to program something..boost a bit of intelligence in the system shes operating without the fear of any ..ahem Singularity!
Actually I wouldn't find the links all that interesting if it wasn't for the fact I have become to know you..
but interesting was the general topic in youtube where this videos were posted, the way youtube links videos between them, anyway we must have let the little cat out of the bag again with our posts. Note the timing of the post. Its Springers questions in his post that raise another level in the discussion then this trend ends with my post and yours excellent digging for some links.

Cats usually chase little mice, little mice in our case could be represented as scattered thoughts formulating in participants minds but probably are too afraid to voice them. These little mice are going back in hiding after the cat appears and the whole procedure of voicing thoughts is derailed. But not all minds work this way.

Ok now lets not talk anymore about cats.

Solitron Vortex generators in Iraq video is placed in a category by youtube where also another video is displayed in the relevant videos list.

This one:

Twin Vortex living water machine

A device inspired by the works of non other than Viktor Schauberger else know as the water Wizard.

[edit on 2-5-2008 by spacebot]



posted on May, 2 2008 @ 09:37 PM
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Here is the Transcript from the video sequence: (by voice)

Scroll the slider to reach at the 01:12/03:44 time stamp from the video.


Now, turn your attention on the triangular structure on top of the tube.
This is called the triad antenna. The right antenna is composed of an amethyst stone, an metal symbol made of silver, its rumenion (??) diode interface, and a red light emitting diode.
The left triad antenna is the same except for having a gold LED.
The sacred geometric symbol it helps translate direct universal or God energy in to electronic vibrational information that it is imbued in to the restructured water.

Now we move in to the electronic heart of the machine.
At the bottom of each vortex tube. The first thing we might notice are the lights, then the crystal inside the tube and last the electrodes connecting to the sides.
As water runs over the gold plated injectors, roughly 80 thousand volts of a specified carrier frequency and special etheric signal harmonics from an advanced modified Tesla coil electrifies the water.
The electrified water runs over a specially shaped crystal bapt (baptized?) in silver wire that is connected to the triad antenna on top of the vortex tube.
The piezoelectric effect of the crystal is stimulated by high voltage. An etheric electromagnetic resonance programs and restructures the water in addition of the effects of the vortex energy.
Next the colored LEDs in the color plated Star of David representing the dominant elements find in our bodies, adds those vibrations to the water.

When water first enters the system, it is routed in to a carbon filter and next passes the pressure gauge and enters valves controlling flow to the left and right vortex tubes.

Finally we look the brain of the system:
3 pulse DC carrier frequencies are selected here, the first is the musical note B, going to the heavy metal trap and mixing tube.
Next is the note G going to the right vortex with clockwise spin representing feminine energy.
And last is the note D going to the left vortex with counterclockwise spin representing masculine energy.

Together the notes B G and D and make the G harmonic chord that reflect the energies of the sun moon and earth for heart frequencies respectively.
The actual frequency of the notes had been adjusted slightly to be in alignment with cosmic pitch and the base human frequency of the earth.

And special note: the carrier waves actually go to the modified Tesla coil first where the high voltage output containing the violet golden and elemental rays of energy are developed.


First of all many terms and descriptions might be labeled pseudoscience by hard core science but what we might actually have here is a different method of energizing particles for them to work differently in a set of atoms that form matter. The subject of matter is water in this case.
As claimed by the researchers for this technology (V. Schauberger inspired) there are ways to program matter, through frequencies/currents etc and sets of other usables.
That is what they are doing here, they're programming water.

We have talked about programing matter as a scientific concept in this thread already in the past but this is a different method. This one seems a bit more like the work of an alchemist in nature..

Water has properties that probably can be programmed more easily for some reason from anything else. Maybe this is the reason why water is well ..water.
We notice this device makes use of symbols/symbolic language in its circuit for the production of the outcome. A scientist would argue that another method similarly effective would produce the same results we seek if we used something else instead of symbols, but would the new properties we are creating be the same?

So from this video we already can derive two positives for our case about the Issac CARET drones.
First the experimental concept of programmable matter, in this case being liquid/water and second is using symbols in the process of programming.
Now I don't know of any research that would program something mo


solid like titanium or any other metal to have properties easily "programmable" by frequencies through symbols, but no one could deny this possibility in the future.

So here is the concept the Issac drone hoax was created to research.
Are people interest in such tech.
Has this kind of ideas sunk in the general public to accept or denny? research or ignore?

IMO someone someplace might be making strides towards the realization of such technology and someone else might being left behind.

An alchemists technology.

Riddle about why the drone technological philosophy looks the way it looks, solved.


[edit on 2-5-2008 by spacebot]



posted on May, 2 2008 @ 09:55 PM
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Atto is just such an alchemist, and we need him to verify officially this. I deliberately put the homeworld association to emphasize mind. Crystals are important as Atto demonstrated in his drawing intelligence knowing itself takes the form of crystals. To her credit tomi let loose a bit of info, which she knows also but won't divulge. when the music was done, she blurted out about the water going down the pipes. then she stopped. AFIK
thats an indicator she is quite familiar with the concepts, and why she is here now. but not to share but to glean what we know. You have just completed her sentence.The circle affiliation would jam Linda and whitley via that PDF straight up. or to be fair a zealous and sinister crop circle group, and that LMH too donkeyarsed to admit to.Look at the flooring on the 2012 ..what is that spacebot?

hehehehe
oh yes..Just like Attos, not the magnet seperation on outer rings, then inner patterns.
I knew some of the others might not pick up right away, but I could count on you for that, as I am just learning. But together we all will be on the same page soon.
Kudos on the interpretation
gridkeeper, and cross referencing the other video will be a ball..it explains this metascience quite well and its what the lap is all about, and the planetary alignements golden ratios etc etc etc., which if you check our library is posted months ago, I posted already.
E
xcellent work SB my man.

Water has been shown to form crystalline patterns after meditating on it
Numbers comented at UCB that part of the craft was Au or gold. Sorry. I had chemistry too
I will digest this then proceed. I like this very much.






[edit on 2-5-2008 by Sys_Config]



posted on May, 2 2008 @ 10:19 PM
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You guys probably already know this, but old Viktor Schauberger is featured in the book, "The Hunt for Zero Point" by Nick Cook, which is a fun read.

I just got caught trying to cannibalize the microwave so I could hook the transformer up to the Brita pitcher. Granted, it's no Tesla coil, but I'm fresh out of those. Now I have to get a new microwave 'cause I broke some stuff taking the old one apart, and I have been ordered to leave the pitcher alone too.
Oh well, I doubt that I have the right kind of crystals anyway. I know there is a selenium rectifier in the garage, in an old battery charger, but I'm pretty sure that's what makes the charger smell funky when I plug it in.



posted on May, 2 2008 @ 10:31 PM
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Originally posted by Double_Nought_Spy
You guys probably already know this, but old Viktor Schauberger is featured in the book, "The Hunt for Zero Point" by Nick Cook, which is a fun read.

I just got caught trying to cannibalize the microwave so I could hook the transformer up to the Brita pitcher. Granted, it's no Tesla coil, but I'm fresh out of those. Now I have to get a new microwave 'cause I broke some stuff taking the old one apart, and I have been ordered to leave the pitcher alone too.
Oh well, I doubt that I have the right kind of crystals anyway. I know there is a selenium rectifier in the garage, in an old battery charger, but I'm pretty sure that's what makes the charger smell funky when I plug it in.


quietly check where the wedding band is, (diamonds rock and they Really are forever)or go to walmarts for some inexpensive garnets , amethysts, zirconiums even!
That was so funny man, I salute you and everyones humor, from Twain, umberto eco, Sid, gosh, especially Isaac. In the end the Gods literally here (universal forces) are laughing! Sid you were right! Atto get in here and we laugh together! Now we are One!


UPDATE

PS I added another expert Bruce mcbee to the library . There is debate about mcbee no evidence of retraction to date.
thats 5 hoax 1 maybe and 0 real

[edit on 2-5-2008 by Sys_Config]

[edit on 2-5-2008 by Sys_Config]



posted on May, 2 2008 @ 11:04 PM
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reply to post by Sys_Config
 


Thanks, Digger, for the link to the page about Dr. Bruce. I have long been a fan of his, and I've tried several times to find out what he thinks of the drone pics. Real, credentialed scientists who publish objective articles on UFOs are far too scarce. Lots and lots of good amateurs out there, but you have to admire the courage of people like Dr. Bruce and *Mister* Friedman. Everybody wants to call Stan "Dr. Friedman," and he invariably corrects them with patience and humor. He says things like, "Thank you for the honorary doctorate, but I am a nuclear physicist with a Master's degree."



posted on May, 3 2008 @ 12:04 AM
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[ Thank you Double Dutch Shultz! , the equalizer for the ARC, this is the back slapping that OM loathes!

But we have something to celebrate , Space bot has by his interpreetation confirmed my suspicions fromt he beginning, the missing layer and link that bought the other pieces together. As I see it Only two more people can confirm, the more the merrier. Thats Dr.Atto , metaphysician extraordinaire and FXriot , who I know would love to t also and even add to the topic. Dr. Atto has worked so hard on this stuff to bring it into reality and commercial use. Its been very hard for him. He deserves the Honor. Although many might frown on what sounds like mumbo jumbo, just remember what an apple falling on a mans head did, what the ruby gem did for the very first Laser, how the vacuum tube went the way of a sunsrtate to a transistor, how divining rods are still used by water compnies, (mine use it all the time) and lets not forget, the all American Hotdog! my favorite substrate. There.

So Dr Atto we need a confirmation, unless SpaceBot wants to really razzle dazzle here some more.
Give us a background if you do student, professional, ventriliquist, whatever.

credit work below Nikola Romanski EGRD and LAP Isaac








I
Why I wouldnt be surprised if all these and future drone sitings all lay around the ley lines and resulting vortexes. Remember the Alchemical principle All is one. you affect the vortex and the vortex affects you.
and you can get maps of these for about 7 dollars a pop. No UFO researcher or hunter worth his should travel without one in his backpack.
The military thru its Haarp Project certainly sees interest and benefit in this vortex area, and like a child playing with fire, may putting mankind at risk








[edit on 3-5-2008 by Sys_Config]

[edit on 3-5-2008 by Sys_Config]



posted on May, 3 2008 @ 04:46 AM
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Just to set the record stright about some of your assumptions sys,
LMH does not finance the DRT and their PI's. The source of funds is private and based purely on curious interest, and wishes to remain anonymous.

There was no hidden meaning when I said the water sounded like a bathtub drain. That was my husbands mundane manner speaking while I was suggesting spirals as in m brane theory and how dna like spirals form from space dust. Just speculation, that's all.

Next, I don't have to provide written anything about how LMH feels about releasing those hi res images, she has been recorded already telling everyone during nemo's interview with her. Her mind has not changed yet on this.

As far as image analysis goes, a great deal of study has been done by those in our team with others regarding this, using programming models and many different forensic means. So far nothing shows in any traditonal or novel way of examinging photo images any known accurate example of photo manipulation. I even called Lucas Studios over 2 days discussing it with their gatekeeper while several on their creative team examined the images. I was told they would not offer comment.

It seems to me that since the other drone images emerged the case has become so complicated that most ufo image experts don't want to touch this with a 10 foot pole anymore.





[edit on 3-5-2008 by tomiuk]



posted on May, 3 2008 @ 07:47 AM
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Originally posted by tomiuk
It seems to me that since the other drone images emerged the case has become so complicated that most ufo image experts don't want to touch this with a 10 foot pole anymore.


So the drones have a rare effect on researchers. You are saying, here we have the one real thing everybody was waiting for, and than nobody dares to look at it?

This would only make sense, if they think it is fake, and don't want to look foolish, when it comes to daylight. Or do they fear to be punished by the aliens later for having called them fake?

I guess somebody has some aliens imprisoned in his cellar to save them from being reproduced in CGI...



posted on May, 3 2008 @ 09:34 AM
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Just for the records: I see, that ejsaunders gives us the exif-information of a Chad-pic on page 40.


Orientation - Top left
XResolution - 72
YResolution - 72
ResolutionUnit - Inch
Software - Adobe Photoshop Elements 2.0
DateTime - 2007:05:06 17:20:08
ExifOffset - 164
ColorSpace - Uncalibrated
ExifImageWidth - 792
ExifImageHeight – 518


www.abovetopsecret.com...

I can see the time stamps on the other pictures. But I don't see it on the Chad photos. Can anyone confirm this?



posted on May, 3 2008 @ 11:48 AM
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Originally posted by tomiuk

As far as image analysis goes, a great deal of study has been done by those in our team with others regarding this, using programming models and many different forensic means. So far nothing shows in any traditonal or novel way of examinging photo images any known accurate example of photo manipulation. I even called Lucas Studios over 2 days discussing it with their gatekeeper while several on their creative team examined the images. I was told they would not offer comment.

It seems to me that since the other drone images emerged the case has become so complicated that most ufo image experts don't want to touch this with a 10 foot pole anymore.



I find this comment simply astounding. EVERY SINGLE expert in the field of imaging (and I mean current, well known experts - NOT obscure "unknown experts"
) that I am aware of who has looked at these "drones" and the Isaac Caret images has called them obvious CGI.

With regard to the Caret images, when you create images in CGI you don't need to manipulate them.

Re: The drone images, the shadows of the composite images have already been proven to be a common screw up when adding CGI objects to real digital photographs.

I read where Linda Moulton Howe considers us here at AboveTopSecret.com to be arrogant, well I would like to say that the HEIGHT of arrogance and SHADY dealings is to hold onto crucial evidence because it will be exposed as a HOAX. There is only one realistic explanation for refusing to allow LEGITIMATE EXPERTS to review the evidence and that is to keep the hoax going. Now who benefits from that?


Bleh, I have a very BAD taste in my mouth about this whole sordid affair.

Springer...



[edit on 5-3-2008 by Springer]



posted on May, 3 2008 @ 12:02 PM
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Originally posted by Springer
EVERY SINGLE expert in the field of imaging (and I mean current, well known experts - NOT obscure "unknown experts"
) that I am aware of who has looked at these "drones" and the Isaac Caret images has called them obvious CGI.[edit on 5-3-2008 by Springer]


Would you please then produce their reports with examples for the range of drones? Because that's what we going after, the big picture, not one little aspect of one appendage and a tree wire that Bruce Maccabee didn't see, had he examined it close enough.. So.. where's the beef??



posted on May, 3 2008 @ 12:32 PM
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Where's the beef? Well, it sure isn't anywhere near these ridiculous images.

I'm one of the people who instantly saw that these images were fakes, CG elements composited onto photographic background plates. Jeff Ritzmann & I could immediately tell that the first image was a total fake, and the silly story from "Chad" made if painfully clear that this was all nonsense, perhaps perpetrated by C2C & LMH in order to drum up some traffic and interest. Subsequent images were increasingly more ridiculous. From the fact that these images don't match up to any morphology we've seen in over 60 years of publicly reported UFO sightings, to the childish typefaces, the obvious rendered look of the "craft", the lighting mismatch between the CG element and the background plates, jeez, what more do you need? You want a REPORT? Feel free to hire me and Jeff, and we'll do your detailed analysis to show that they're faked images. Our time is worth something, just like yours, except we don't need to waste a second to know that these images represent absolutely squat paranormal.

ANYONE who thinks these images are of genuine UFOs, well, there's a bridge in Brooklyn I'll sell ya, really cheap.

dB



posted on May, 3 2008 @ 12:45 PM
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Can we just change the title of this thread and add the everloving [HOAX] to it please?



posted on May, 3 2008 @ 12:58 PM
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Originally posted by davidbiedny
Where's the beef? Well, it sure isn't anywhere near these ridiculous images.

I'm one of the people who instantly saw that these images were fakes, CG elements composited onto photographic background plates. Jeff Ritzmann & I could immediately tell that the first image was a total fake, and the silly story from "Chad" made if painfully clear that this was all nonsense, perhaps perpetrated by C2C & LMH in order to drum up some traffic and interest. Subsequent images were increasingly more ridiculous. From the fact that these images don't match up to any morphology we've seen in over 60 years of publicly reported UFO sightings, to the childish typefaces, the obvious rendered look of the "craft", the lighting mismatch between the CG element and the background plates, jeez, what more do you need? You want a REPORT? Feel free to hire me and Jeff, and we'll do your detailed analysis to show that they're faked images. Our time is worth something, just like yours, except we don't need to waste a second to know that these images represent absolutely squat paranormal.

ANYONE who thinks these images are of genuine UFOs, well, there's a bridge in Brooklyn I'll sell ya, really cheap.

dB


I appreciate your response to my question above. But I still think with all the controversy and dedicated public out there to this drone business, it would behoove any image specialist to provide and publish a report with across the board and across the spectrum analytical examples regarding this CGI business.

Telling people to take your word for it, calling them lobotomy cases if they don't, all without providing the least bit of weight in evidence of what you are seeing is a bit over the top, is it not?

Over at OM Forum they are putting together an interior Research Team for photo analysis. I think people over there would be honoured if you submitted these irregularities to them for their research and study.

This way we are able to provide a fair, relatively unbiased basis of understanding this drone saga. Will you work with them? Provide your insights for their appraisal? I am not part of that group, I don't know if any other DRT members are or not either, so it is certainly full of many who think like you do.

Cheers and thank you for your consideration.


[edit on 3-5-2008 by tomiuk]



posted on May, 3 2008 @ 01:58 PM
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Tomiuk,

Here's the bottom line - if folks find the Drone images interesting, that's their right. It's my right to think that they're amateur renderings. I can't concern myself with worrying about what other folks believe or not - life is a little too precious for that. The OM forums have spent a lot of time and effort on things that I would simply NOT waste a second on - from the Drones crap to the tall tales of Serpo, and a whole lot of garbage in-between. Hell, John Lear is now over there, screaming about how he believes in the Billy Meier nonsense. Whatever - people can believe whatever they want, while some of us are aware enough to avoid swimming in the mud. I have a research partner - Jeff Ritzmann - and we'll look at images that we find compelling, while not bothering to waste time with images that are obviously bogus. I wish the OM folks luck, but I have no desire to team up with their image analysis efforts. Based on the tone of discussion over there - that silly Meier thread is a classic - I will not join the forums, contribute to the childish silliness over there, much less lend them my image processing expertise.

There's an old saying - from the Bible, if I'm not wrong - don't throw your pearls before swine. That about sums it up for me.

dB

[edit on 3-5-2008 by davidbiedny]

[edit on 3-5-2008 by davidbiedny]




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