How did God come into existence?

reply to post by davesidious

And no, no one has ever demonstrated they have met god. That is hilarious.

I would disagree. They have spoke of it. You do not consider that proof because you do not believe.

Do you believe in life after death?

reply to post by davesidious


What is the supporting evidence that Alexander the Great ruled most of the world. I hope it is not something that is written down on anything that you have as support. Because from your argument that would be dismissed.

reply to post by Conclusion


No, that's not proof because it's conjectural. The human brain, the organ reporting to have met God, is capable of being fooled very, very easily. Testimony, on its own, is not evidence.

And no, I don't believe in life after death, as there is also no evidence for it. I'm not going to waste my time believing in crap people can't be bothered to demonstrate exists. That would be a waste of a life.

reply to post by Conclusion


Lots of different written accounts, literally hundreds of tonnes of archaeological evidence, genetic evidence, and so on and so forth. Not simply some guy saying he met him once, and he told him that he was Alexander the Great. That would be nonsense.

Originally posted by davesidious
reply to post by Conclusion

 

No, that's not proof because it's conjectural. The human brain, the organ reporting to have met God, is capable of being fooled very, very easily. Testimony, on its own, is not evidence.

And no, I don't believe in life after death, as there is also no evidence for it. I'm not going to waste my time believing in crap people can't be bothered to demonstrate exists. That would be a waste of a life.

reply to post by Conclusion

 

Lots of different written accounts, literally hundreds of tonnes of archaeological evidence, genetic evidence, and so on and so forth. Not simply some guy saying he met him once, and he told him that he was Alexander the Great. That would be nonsense.

I would basically say that if we think about something, we usually discuss it with our self in a little abstract thing I like to call the realm of thought. What puzzles me is this. Thought is something that cannot be measured. The waves that certain thoughts produce can be measured, which does prove that a thought gives off a frequency, but cannot measure the actual thought. Only the individual inside of natural reality and outside of physical reality can perceive only their thoughts. No one else s.

That would put it in a realm of no proof in the physical universe. It is taken for granted that it is real because it falls into the natural universe. Some would argue that a change in frequency is proof itself. I would argue that everything we see, hear, touch, smell, feel, taste, and think is just a change in frequency.

We have all these so called Doctor's of Psychology who try to figure out how the mind works using their own opinion of their thought to explain why people are the way they are. We are the way we are because of change. Something changes in your life, it changes your perspective by just a fraction. Something else changes in our lives and the perspective changes again. Whatever you want to call a change in perspective, it happens through the five senses. There are limitations to these vehicles that we call bodies. They die. Death, no matter your view on it, cannot be denied as the ultimate change for these bodies.

The question of whether there is life after death can be answered by the simple fact that death is of the physical universe. It is a change. From the physical to the natural. Do we keep our mind? Well it is already in natural universe just waiting on us.

Oh and genetic evidence? Come on. Please show that.

reply to post by Conclusion


Sure! Here's a paper in Nature about the genetic evidence for the Greek invasion.

You are talking about thoughts. I'm talking about reality.

Your notion of life after death demands that the human consciousness is not simply an electrochemical chain-reaction sustained within the brain. As there is no evidence that the chain-reaction isn't real, you're leaving the realms of rationality

Proverbs 9:10
"The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom, and knowledge of the Holy One is understanding.

But here is my problem...

Proverbs 26:4
Do not answer a fool according to his folly, or you will be like him yourself.

Proverbs 26:5
Answer a fool according to his folly, or he will be wise in his own eyes.

Should I be silent, you will consider yourself wise and to have proven your point. If I speak, I bring myself down to this pathetic level or argument that is repugnant.

Can you prove that God does not exist? You cannot.
Many people have had experiences where they claim to have seen God's face, just like many claim NDE's.

Matter itself may not be proof in your eyes, but to me, a planet where every little detail works out so perfectly that life can be sustained, where even the angle of the planet and its exact distance from the Sun combined with its atmosphere allow us livable temperatures. Where we can think and have free will and thought. Where the seasons come and go only to return and bring new life, sustaining every living thing on the planet in their time. This I see as proof and I believe it is in fact very logical.

The only reason it is illogical is because you disagree. Since when have you become the authority on wisdom?

According to:
www.gallup-international.com...

45% of people believe in a personal, relational God
30% believe in a spirit or energy that pervades life
14% are unsure
and 8% don't believe in a god at all.

I don't even agree with the majority of people listed in that category, but it seems to me that it must be logical that a higher power than us exists.

All creation declares God's glory.

Romans 1:20
For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.

reply to post by Mykahel


Very nice. That about sums it up.

Star for you.

I do not believe people could honestly answer this question except, “I don’t know”.

I believe that we have been restricted since the creation of religion. The Buddhists say that the world is like a stream, there is no beginning and there is no end. Just look at the earth, there is never an end to our planet. There is no real end to the flow of water as water can sink beneath the ground and into the clouds. The land is never ending because when it sinks below water it continues until is rises back up. We say that when we reach the Atlantic coast that it is the end of the land, it is not, the land continues on through the whole ocean. We have restricted ourselves into a box, we are made to think inside a certain box and when we try to think outside of the box it seems irrational. If you tell yourself that there is no beginning and no end you immediately doubt that possibility because you were always taught that there must be a beginning and an end.

But the religious people believe this thought that there is no beginning and no end. They believe that god created people and when you die you go to heaven, hence no end. We have perverted the concept of thought into a restricted zone which was created by people who were less intelligent than us but we continue to use their thoughts. It is like a highly intelligent person who refuses to accept any concept that a person far less intelligent cannot accept. In the days of Christopher Columbus it was thought that when you reached a certain part of earth it ended, we figured out that that was not true. The world continues forever.

So what does this have to do with god? Well life is like a circle, you are born then you die. But that raises the question, since we have not reached the end of the world and returned to tell of the other side, how do we know what is or is not there? Just because our bodily lives end does not mean we may not continue on maybe through spirit or heaven/hell. I believe that we all have spirits and the proof for it is inside us all, it is a part of us that cannot be changed our erased just because we want it to be. It is our subconscious, it judges everything we do and we cannot change its’ judgments. It warns of what may be dangerous, it is the feeling you get deep in your stomach when there could be danger. Our subconscious is our spirit, and I believe it lives forever.

reply to post by Mykahel


As I've said before, you can believe what you want with however much conviction you want.

Just don't think for a second that belief in an unproven, even undemonstrable, concept is rational. It isn't. It's departing from the logically-defined default position of "I don't know", with no evidence, and leaping to "there's a magical sky wizard who killed his own son to make a point about something that he made and who will let me live forever". If you think that's logical, well, damn.

The whole problem in coming to Know the Truth.... is often prevented by the Conspiracy of the Flesh against LIFE.

Some are like sheep but some are also like Ostrages.

The sheep see Light, and the Ostrage sees darkness, when he puts his head in the ground.

At at the end of the day there is.

a. The observed... The human species and the rest of this Little Universe.

b. The Observer... The Living One or LIFE.

One is Not the Other but are Opposites ....

This is why Flesh has great difficulty Accepting LIFE...

It was once said that Man (more correctly the Descendants of A'DAM) and God are Natural Enemies."

So guess Flesh Not knowing LIFE, will WAR against LIFE, and won't Accept LIFE or the LIGHT of The World, or LIGHT of MAN...

As it is written in The Gospel of Thomas... Quote;

56. Jesus said,

“Whoever has come to understand the World
has found only a corpse,

and whoever has found a corpse

is superior to the World.”

Now This IS TRUTH....

The Flesh knows nothing at all of LIFE, except denial within the Flesh.

But LIFE is the Opposite to Death, and knows LIFE, and The Place of LIFE...

Death can NOT be LIFE...

And it is impossible for LIFE to be Death...


[edit on 13-3-2010 by The Matrix Traveller]

i've put some thought into this and to discuss this means to accept other theories..first you must accept that there is a god and that he created everything we see and thats around us but a god that created everything had to be created itself if said god didnt exist at some point then obviously god cant create itself

this being said maybe there are parallel universes or dimensions our god is the god of this dimension or universe and each has a god that created it and each god has a god that created it so everything is infinite..the acinets worshipped gods that had gods themselves i've thought that if there were visitors from gods from the sky that

in order to maintain being worshipped here by ancient man a "god" couldnt let a worshipper that they themself worship a god because obviously if a god is worshipping a god then the god is not a god so while visitng man they kept there religious beliefs if had any to themself and when either left alone for the night or on home planet or space they worshipped a "god"

as i have read before space,life,numbers,and the gods are infinite!

reply to post by metalholic

i've put some thought into this and to discuss this means to accept other theories..first you must accept that there is a god and that he created everything we see and thats around us but a god that created everything had to be created itself if said god didnt exist at some point then obviously god cant create itself.

The Problem is that the Human Species interpretation of what a god should be.

Every person has their own Idea what God should or should Not be, according to their own human Rules....

You can't establish TRUTH, based on the Rules, laid down by the Human Species...

We have to put these Rules aside, and See what has Created this world, Not as you would want it to be...

But rather see it as it truly is....

Everyone is telling their God what it should be...

How about we ask ???

If you don't get an answer you have only asked your imagination.

Some hear Voices in their head but this is only the echo of them selves.
Some pills may fix this little problem ???

But seriously....
When you get an answer then you have asked God.

This will happen through something that is NOT in your Control.

But how do You ask ???

Thought is the end result NOT the Cause.

So first you need to figure out How to Ask.

In time Passed, many asked for a sign, but Jesus the Carpenter said,

" It is a wicked and Adulterous Generation that asks for a sign."

So don't ask for a sign, that is decided by your own disbelief, but rather ask for knowledge and Understanding...

The sign of My Father is Movement and Repose.

The kingdom of the Father, is spread out in front of you on the Earth, but Men do Not recognise it...


[edit on 13-3-2010 by The Matrix Traveller]

reply to post by metalholic


But once You establish what has produced ALL... then you may discover HOW ???

And how what produced ALL came into being ???

[edit on 13-3-2010 by The Matrix Traveller]

reply to post by The Matrix Traveller


everything come and goes from somewhere...when a blackhole vaccums everything around it where does the light go? obviously to us it would seem like maybe the light gets bent the gravitational pull bends the light so that it does not escape..but all the mass and substance has to go somewhere!

at the center of every galaxy there is a blackhole 1/3rd the size of that galaxy...how do we know that these blackholes doesnt take everything it sucks up here and deposits it in another galaxy which would be in another universe and everything we are made up of hasnt came from another universe where a blackhole did as it does here

we know nothing when it comes to this stuff we can only speculate

but i'm going to say that I believe that if there is a god it has a god!

reply to post by davesidious


But here again we disagree, because belief in God is rational. I'm not even arguing my own faith here in that God sent His son to save us but that there is a God period, who also created all.

Why would every people group around the globe explain their existence by means of a god or multiple gods? Not all of these people got their ideas from other cultures or "holy books" but observed life and found no other explanation other than God. They didn't do this just because they didn't have an answer, they did it because logic and reason told them that there was a God. They could have explained their existence and all of life by numerous different venues, but ultimately they turned to a power higher than themselves.

They could have decided that we all hatched from some other animals eggs, or we came out of some kind of ooz, or that we crash landed here on a comet, or whatever you wanted. I mean seriously, what made these people decide it was God?


Note: My apologies to the OP for getting off track and staying there.

reply to post by Mykahel


good logical argument you have but then think about what you just asked...what would make these people around the world turn to some god as a answer to existence...then maybe a question that cannot be answered just yet is the answer to that question...is it possible an alien species visiting earth mining for gold which is useless to us and any living thing on earth created man to help mine for it...if so then the creator of man being an alien is the god of man because that god was the creator!

reply to post by Mykahel


Not every society in the world is religious, and truth is not a popularity contest.

Irrational behaviour and beliefs don't suddenly become rational when a certain magic number of people join in.

reply to post by davesidious


in the beginning every society was religious and that is where the belief in a god creating us in its image and fighting wars alongside man began and every since in some way shape or form every race of man has its own god or gods

so with the question being how did god come into existence...the minute god created man using his dna! but if you mean the god that even created them! then you have to understand that there is a good chance that god was created by a god!

Originally posted by orionthehunter
What I was told was that God has always been here and always will be. God is without beginning or end. As far as to why God created the universe, maybe God wanted something to watch. I can imagine it would be a dull universe without stars, planets, galaxies and life forms to inhabit them.

So there are other intelligent life-form out there?

I want something quantifiable.

Please...

Walk out your door on a christal clear night and look up into the sky.
Then walk back into your house and look at the keyboard you are using to hopefully reply to all posts here and zoom in.

Where does it start, and where does it end?

That my dear ATS friends?
Is God.