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AboveTopSecret.com is a Government COINTELPRO Disinformation Operation

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posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 07:56 PM
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EastCoastKid,

I knew it you are also an agent of the government, I knew it.




posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 08:03 PM
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Originally posted by marg6043
EastCoastKid,

I knew it you are also an agent of the government, I knew it.


Not anymore!



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 08:10 PM
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Oh no....they found us out again.... Hurry, hide or trash all the evidence and paperwork, and let's agree with everything everyone posts so the "rumors" stop.....

This is really something. I have noticed that there are a few members that "always" start yelling "government agent, government agent" when there are facts presented to them, that make sense, and contradict things they "believe in with heart and soul and would never change their minds about nomatter what."

I haven't read that thread in which one of our members is "branded" a government agent, but i have seen it happen to me, and a few others.

What I have noticed is that more often than not, these same people who claim "those who disagree with them must be government agents" can't back up their "theories" with "real facts," and instead spend hours trying to justify theories that do not stand up to reason, or common sense, not to mention scientific facts.

ATS is supposed to be a place where people can discuss their ideas and theories, but i have seen this been used as an excuse to present some theories as "facts", but which don't make sense, are full of discrepancies, and which the authors always try to hide all these discrepancies and exagerations by claiming "You are a government agent" if you don't immediately bow donw to them, proclaim them to be the enlightened one, and ask for them to please show you salvation.....

Sometimes these members try to insinuate that you work as a government agent by saying...."how much is the government paying you?" or some other nonsensical comment, when the fact is that you don't agree with them, and can show them they are wrong, or at least can show facts which contradict what they say.


Some people really need to learn that just because someone disagrees with them, and can show them facts, it doens't mean "they must be government agents."

Anyways, i think this is a way for some of these people to try to disuade other members from reading the facts, and instead to make other members accept their theories nomatter how wrong they are.

It is really getting tiresome to tell you the truth, and more often than not I just stop responding to these people, although they keep coming back with their "theories" claiming they are victorious.

I am pretty sure that some of these people would be happy if "everyone that disagrees with them" is branded "government agent", just so they can try to justify their "theories," as being the truth and nothing but the truth.


[edit on 12-1-2006 by Muaddib]



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 08:26 PM
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Originally posted by billybob
great thread, skeptic! *applause*


Ok Billybob ~ DONE!~ since you do not actually have the ability to applaud SO and I do......I have done so on your behalf!
SkepticOverlord can thank YOU for his recent council applause for this thread......but I agree its VERY applause worthy.......good call Billybob!


I am siding with Val about dragging that very insightful thread out of RATS......bring it out in the open and shed some light on it.......



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 08:47 PM
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Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

Use this thread to post more of your favorite "hard core" conspiracy theory threads from AboveTopSecret.com.

The "impossible" sinking of M/S Estonia. How did it happen, who did it and why? 852 people died and the real facts are being hidden by government. Coverups!

How did the 'Estonia' sink 1994?



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 08:47 PM
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Originally posted by LazarusTheLong
If you look at the first page, it will give you everything you need to know...
this isn't so much a "ATS is or isn't cointelpro" thread,
as much as a
People say we are disinfo, but if so, then how/why do we provide such good real info... that is researched and debunked... so as to be solid.
and then list the threads that you see as good researched conspiracy stuff...

And to the administrators...
could we get a cumulative "in case you are wondering, we are not cointelpro" statement so that we can all be satisfied that it isn't some sort of confusion scam...?



Ah Gotcha Muchas Gracias



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 09:33 PM
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I'll say one thing for this thread... It has become an instant classic on my notebook PC, it is a great defacto index to some GREAT threads I had forgotten about.


Regarding the actual subject of this thread all I can say is nope. That's it, nope.

Some have asked why we we care about this particular accusation and why we are being "public" about fighting it. This is a coordinated and malicious attack that has been launched against this community in the hopes of distracting from a rude and dishonest lifting of our content AFTER we asked the offenders, NICELY, to simply follow our Creative Commons Guidelines.

We didn't ask them to remove the content or anything else, we just asked them to follow the rules of collaborative sharing - THAT'S ALL.

Next thing we know the three of us, Simon, Skeptic and I are all being accused of being psychopaths and CoIntelpro operatives!


That's the most LUDICROUS thing I've heard/read in years.

Simon is a guy in the UK who started a cool site about military stuff and government secrets (AboveTopSecret.com) back in 1997 or some such.

SkepticOverlord is an expert at the On line Community gig and has been since the mid 1980's when these type Communities started.

I (Springer) am a simple Businessman who has been involved with the internet almost as long as Skeptic (1988 for me). Scary huh?


Our SINGULAR dedication is to this community and NOTHING else. We are all three AMAZED and awestruck by the membership of this community. The WillyPalooza 2005 Podthread www.abovetopsecret.com... is a good example of why.

These people chose the path of most resistance which we discovered has been their M.O. for years. Why? I have no idea. Lack of ETHICS www.abovetopsecret.com... certainly comes to mind but that's speculation on my part.


So be it. The Legal types will get it worked out and all will just as it should be.


Springer...


[edit on 1-12-2006 by Springer]



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 09:44 PM
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I think we should dust off that old April Fool's Joke Forum, hehe....



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 10:35 PM
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Originally posted by Majic
Ahh, but wasn't ATS originally founded in 1997? What accounts for those missing four years? And how do we know his real name isn't “Chris”?

Ah... right. While I was typing, I was thinking ahead to when I started posting, early 2001. Online conspiracy sites were a sorry state back "in the day"
Not much happening in 2000/2001... until... well, you know.

How do you know he's not one of my more "special" pieces of code?



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 10:37 PM
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Originally posted by Gazrok
I think we should dust off that old April Fool's Joke Forum, hehe....


Nah... but then... hrm... in a few weeks...

-eh-

Who knows.



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 11:08 PM
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I was hired on to debate topics concerning UFO's and Aliens, specifically crop circles. Since the threads have pretty much bogged down as of late on the subject I have more free time to search the rest of the site.



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 11:26 PM
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When I saw the title on this thread, I started to wonder. Then I remembered certain unwarranted and unprovoked attacks on me and others, and I really started to wonder. Then I slipped in and actually read some of the posts. Interesting stuff.


For the record: I trust Simon and SkepticOverlord but I'm not sure about that Springer guy.
My own agenda changes periodically with the phase of the moon and sunspot cycles; sometimes daily, depending on other spiritual, celestial and organic influences. Not to mention those pesky electromagnetic fluctuations.


IMO - we need a "Deconstructing Disinfo" forum. When I first joined, everyone was giving me links to posts and threads here about it: Logical Fallacies; How to Argue Constructively; Russian Manipulation Techniques; CIA Mind Control Techniques; you name it, I got it. It was very cool stuff. Gave me some much-needed tools for self-defense. Plus it was a great take. Opened up a whole new dimension. Now, half the fun of being here is figuring out who's pitching what, who's into disinfo, and who's an agent provocateur. But I love ya all. [smooch]

Anyway, if we had a special disinfo forum, we could centralize all the educational background stuff and then use it to rip each other to shreds, on topic.


.



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 11:31 PM
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soficrow -

Are you saying there needs to be a test to become a member? I will agree.



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 11:35 PM
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Originally posted by Frosty
soficrow -

Are you saying there needs to be a test to become a member? I will agree.


No.


I'm being serious: a "Deconstructing Disinfo" forum. When I first joined, everyone was giving me links to posts and threads here about it: Logical Fallacies; How to Argue Constructively; Russian Manipulation Techniques; CIA Mind Control Techniques; you name it, I got it.

...I learned a lot from that stuff.



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 11:44 PM
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I don't care if it is. Since I am not in on it, I think it would be a poor strategy to offer people like me a place to voice their opinions.

Are there individual members who are part of a disinformation campaign? Probably. ...But again, who cares? Their voice is no stronger than mine...


Originally posted by horusthechorus
One thing which strikes me about this site is the lack of support it offers to others within the alt media/truth movement, unless it is directly connected to and benefits this site. A red flag.


So what? This is a message board. ATS *is* its membership. Anyone wishing to participate can. Why should the Administration champion any agenda? If they did, I probably wouldn't be a participant in this site.



Originally posted by horusthechorus
Another thing is the level of censorship imposed on its members, and I'm not talking about swearing/abuse/insults. Another red flag.


I, more than most, can vouch that is NOT true. There is no secret that I have been quite candid on occasion with this site. The administration has always demonstrated to me that content is NEVER the issue. They regulate behavior. Period. ...If that ever changes, I'll simply stop coming here.



Originally posted by horusthechorus
If we stand back and analyze the site for what it is, we see a business. Great. Nothing wrong with that. Business is business. Does it care about the movement, apart from making money from it? I doubt it.


What movement? ATS' business model owes its success to that segment of the consumer market that seeks alternative information, opinions about that information, and/or a voice on such subject matter. In my view, ATS is an example of the new MEDIA. It is a portal for the exchange of ideas dedicated to seeking the truth....about anything. The portal is the business concept....the rest is pure magic. Change the portal, change the magic...

The fact that ATS is a business is a consequence of a consumer need.

...and I personally have no need for ATS to serve some specific agenda.

Your comments strike me as the equivalent to complaining that HomeDepot does not serve gourmet meals.


ATS is NOT a political action committee, a charity, or a religious institution. Those can be found elsewhere.



Originally posted by horusthechorus
Maybe ATS isn't in touch with the rest of the movement(s), hence the lack of action/support they offer. Maybe those who run this site have become arrogant.


Perhaps they are.
But even if you think they are, so what? If you don't like what they have to sell....don't buy! Simple enough.



Originally posted by horusthechorus
Granted there is a lot of valuable information here, but remember mixing fact and fiction is a fantastic tactic many shills use.


And sites advancing some specific issue related to your "alt media/truth movements" will deliver to me the truth? I don't know about you, but I have never found cabals of people, of like mind, capable of doing any more than advancing the very predetermined belief that justifies their continued association. That is not truth seeking, imho.



Originally posted by horusthechorus
For what it's worth, it seems many of the major players and groups (real activists) within the alt media movement actually avoid ATS. Again, a red flag.


That should be your first clue that those "major players and groups" may have altogether a different "agenda" than the one you assume. After all, if their "truth" is so important, why wouldn't they use every opportunity, including using ATS, to get the word out??




Originally posted by horusthechorus
For ATS to bring this to our attention seems.. pointless. Why focus on this self-indulgent exercise while there are much, much more important issues you should/could be bringing to peoples attention?


It may be self-indulgent...but I don't remember it being a condition of ATS membership that I read this thread.




Originally posted by horusthechorus
Who else in the alt media movement do you see crying about being called names?


Are you kidding?



Originally posted by horusthechorus
None of the respected members/groups - because there is a job to do which is far more important than ego or making money.


Well, then, good luck.


By the way, HomeDepot still doesn't deliver dinner.


EDIT: BTW, horusthechorus, please don't read this response as an attack on you or any of your ideas unrelated to this site. I'd encourage you to share your opinions on any subject matter you desire. That is, after all, the point of the site.


After re-reading my response, I realized it reads more harshly than was absolutely intended.



[edit on 13-1-2006 by loam]



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 11:45 PM
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[[[ATTENTION! The following is a secret message for all mindless robot slaves controlled by time travelers. If you are unable to read this, please disregard it. This is an emergency, can someone do me a favor and look up everything they can find on Maxwell’s equations, relativity and the formulas for volts and amps. I left all my physics books back in the time machine…and remember, just because I control your mind doesn’t mean I think you’re an idiot. MESSAGE OVER.]]]



posted on Jan, 13 2006 @ 12:01 AM
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soficrow -

make a thread about that information and have mod sticky it for you.



posted on Jan, 13 2006 @ 12:04 AM
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soficrow,

I agree. I think the idea is an interesting one.



posted on Jan, 13 2006 @ 12:05 AM
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Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
Use this thread to post more of your favorite "hard core" conspiracy theory threads from AboveTopSecret.com.


The different views diametrically opposed to each other with regards to the 'Waco-type events' starting in 2004/2005 and other 'predictions' of a very interesting 'time-traveller.' The story continues...

The American Civil War of 2005 as predicted by John Titor



posted on Jan, 13 2006 @ 12:16 AM
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Frosty - What do you mean "sticky it" ? ...And but - I really do not have time to pull that stuff together although I do know it's here. I could help, but not do it all...

Thanks loam - just a thought. Liked your "Who cares?" comment. My sentiments exactly. This site is here for everyone. Whatever their agenda or chosen calling. Of course, some of us have more integrity than others... Just foolin around. No insult or annoyance intended.


I guess it's inevitable that conspiracy theorists will find conspiracy on a conspiracy site. So many people here have such wonderful imaginations. Ya gotta love it.



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