you've probably seen this but

How would you know if there's an Army base in Tampa in 2036???

As I mentioned, there is already an Air Force Base here. It is McDill, and HQ for actions such as the Iraqi War, etc. It is pretty unreasonable to suggest that there would ALSO be an Army base here, even in 33 years. It's a good yarn, but the nose knows....bull#, hehe....

www.timetravelinstitute.com...

'Star Trek' teleporter nearer reality

CANBERRA, Australia -- It's not quite "Star Trek" yet, but Australian university researchers in quantum optics say they have "teleported" a message in a laser beam using the same technology principles that enabled Scotty to beam up Captain Kirk.
What the team at the Australian National University have managed to achieve is to take apart an encrypted laser beam and simultaneously rebuild a replica one meter away.
Using a process called "quantum entanglement", the team effectively teleported a radio signal contained in the laser beam of light from one place to another.
Team leader Ping Koy Lam said the technology was the same as that used in science-fiction series such as "Star Trek".
"What we have demonstrated here is that we can take billions of photons, destroy them simultaneously, and then recreate them in another place," Lam told The Australian newspaper.
A photon is a particle of electro-magnetic radiation energy.
But the team are quick to point out that they have not managed to teleport atoms or matter -- a far more complex task.
For the time being, the main application of the breakthrough is likely to be the creation of completely unbreakable encryption codes for computer transactions and vastly improved computer speeds.

Using this technology, a new class of superfast quantum computers which could solve problems millions of times faster than current computers.
And the breakthrough could lead to an increase in the speed and quantity of information transferred in fiber-optic communications.
But for a human to be teleported, a machine would have to be built that could pinpoint and analyse the trillions and trillions of atoms that make up the human body.
"I think teleporting of that kind is very, very far away," Lam told The Australian.
"We don't know how to do that with a single atom yet. But that doesn't mean that in the far future it's not possible," he said.
��������

Originally posted by Gazrok

How would you know if there's an Army base in Tampa in 2036???

As I mentioned, there is already an Air Force Base here. It is McDill, and HQ for actions such as the Iraqi War, etc. It is pretty unreasonable to suggest that there would ALSO be an Army base here, even in 33 years. It's a good yarn, but the nose knows....bull#, hehe....

Why would you assume they have an AF in 2036? Maybe it's all Army? Alot of things can change after a civil and nuclear world war.

I can't wait to get into the research forum so the threads are clean. This is getting kinda cluttered.

Kukla:
Yeah a summary is included. I was listing kinda what order things should be done, but the reader will see the summary first.

maknig a graphic time is a great idea. I can do that once everythign is itemized ... which leads me to itemization. Look at the "how" part below. Realisitcally, every statement fits in one of those topics. The statements will be on a single huge html page. Each statement will have links to other statements on that page via anchor links (html). The Misc. info will be linked to (on another huge misc. page with anchor links). This can all be done in like 2 or 3 big html pages that use spacing and anchor links. Once we get a research thread I'll post a small example so you can see waht i'm talking about...

It's a lot of information to put in once place but it's simple and I'm willing to do the grunt work writing the html.
----
PROPOSAL:

Purpose:

To construct an authoritative event summary from which two conclusions can be drawn:

1) That John Titor is fraudulent and many of his claims should dismissed, and

2) that John Titor is truthful and many of his claims should be respected.

While there is at least one event summary, there has been no rigorous cataloging of John Titor's statements. This is required for disproving or proving his case. The proposed research project will a) catalog his statements, b) construct arguments for each contested collection of statements (such as time travel), c) present a debate with two opposing sides and d) present this material as coherent whole which can easily read by a reader .

How:

Catalog Statements (for user and for references/footnotes):

by Topic and Misc. Items

Each Statement falls under one (or more) of the following topics:
1. Prediction
2. Warning
3. Current Government
4. Future government
5. Current life/society
6. Future life/society
7. Time Travel
8. Safety

Each Statement has some Misc. Items attached to it:

1. Statements that are related (links to)
2. Arguments concerning a collection of related statements
3. Definitions



[Edited on 2-9-2003 by ktprktpr]

ktprktpr,

I'm of the opinion that JT's story cannot, for inherent reasaons, be either totally dismissed or totally credited. There can be more than two conclusions. I would stick to just presenting the topics and the evidence on both sides without the madate of coming to a conclusion. Inherently, there is no conlcusion. The reader should go away informed, not convinced.

May I propose this:

Purpose: To catalog and present the JT story in a structured manner, with all relevant and conciliatory evidence, either discounting or crediting his story presented.

It may be a little wordy but you get the idea.

Do you have a timeframe in mind for this project?

good point. I'll change it to:

To construct an authoritative event summary from which a reader can draw their own conclusions.

I do think, if the team members are willing, a series of debates would be useful. But that can be left out I guess, or stuck on at the end. We'll see. You certainly don't have to write up a deabte ifyou don't want to.

Realistically, all I want is everything he said catalouged in an easy to access manner, with a general summary that has links into the cataloge. Arguments attached to the statments (linked to, not in your face) would place the statements ina larger context and be useful.

Right now Sytar and I are trying to uplaod a back up of everythign JT has said ... but hosts don't take .zip files (its about a meg). We're still looking for a place to dump it. The .html files might be each uploaded via ftp.

[Edited on 2-9-2003 by ktprktpr]

I'd drop "easily" from the purpose.

I think the pro/con approach would work well. A summarized argument for each subtopic that makes use of all collaborating evidence in a classical academic format present via html.

[Edited on 2-9-2003 by kukla]

Oh yeah. I think this would take about 3 - 5weeks to do. Right now I'm trying to get my spreadsheet program set up to take data. I u2u'ed Mr. William and I am awaiting his reply, and hopefully our very own sparkling Research thread.

Originally posted by Gazrok

How would you know if there's an Army base in Tampa in 2036???

As I mentioned, there is already an Air Force Base here. It is McDill, and HQ for actions such as the Iraqi War, etc. It is pretty unreasonable to suggest that there would ALSO be an Army base here, even in 33 years. It's a good yarn, but the nose knows....bull#, hehe....

J-T said, in a couple of places, that the 'bases' and 'forts' of his time are the universities and libraries of our time. He said, in one post, that this was because, after the war, libraries became the place everyone gathered inorder to start the rebuilding process.

This makes some sense... many colleges are in rural areas and, if you look at them from a tactical standpoint, could be easily defended. Collegiate architecture in the USA makes heavy use of medieval style towers and other intimidating things. Colleges and universities also have their own mini-economies, with local power generation and, in some cases, experimental farms.

Now, I still believe J-T is a clever hoaxer, but his point about colleges becoming the new outposts of society, after a nuclear war, does make sense.

My guess, though, is that this part of his story was inspired by visiting one of his kids on campus one day..

To summarize, J-T says, pointedly, that campuses become the new 'forts' after the war.. so, if there is no army base in Florida today... he may very well be talking about the campus of the U. of Florida when he mentions the 'base' he grew up on.

Suggestions for the ktprktpr/Kukla research project:

1. Any third member of the team ought not have the initial "K".

2. Consider further what the outcome of the research is as a volume of work, and whether there ought to be interim reports along the way. I believe some readers are viewing the Research Forum less as a production ground for legitimate theses, and more as a serious Forum which is still "light" in its discipline, but under stricter guidance and leadership and free of clutter... I envisage any team/topic might establish its own presentation rules. Not sure I support OIMD's comment over there that a project could run for eight months... I think they will be both evolutionary and revolutionary.

3. John Titor doesn't do it for me. What will convince me to review the hours of serious quality research that could no doubt be invested in something like this?

Meanwhile, I undertook in this Topic to spend yesterday in 1969, and did so. The space-time continuum shifted such that I arrived in a seaport known as Bluewater, as a dwarf with a speech impediment, and in the course of a day's work took on the lease of a tavern which will hereafter in that reality be known as "The House Of Muth-ked".

www.abovetopsecret.com...


On opening night at The Houth Of Muth-ked, I procured the thervitheth of a travelling band of minthtrelth called the Thtoogeth.

Their performanth of the following thong wath thimply thuperb, and I accompanied them on thakth...

Nineteen Thikthty Nine

Well allright!
Well it's Nineteen Thikthty Nine okay.
We've got a war acroth the U Eth A.
There'th nothing here for me and you.
We're jutht thitting here with nothing to do.
Well there'th nothing here for me and you.
Another year with nothing to do.
Well latht year I wath 21,
I didn't have a lot of fun.
Now I'm gonna be 22,
Tho it'th oh my and a-boo hoo.
Well now I'm gonna be 22, tho
Oh my and a-boo hoo.
No!
Well it's Nineteen Thikthty Nine okay,
Got a war acroth the U Eth A.
There'th nothing here for me and you.
Jutht thitting here,with nothing to do.
Well it'th Nineteen Thikthty Nine baby.
Well it'th Nineteen Thikthty Nine baby.
Well it's nine,
Nine,
Nine,
Nine,
Nine,
Nine,
Nine,
Nine,
Nine,
Nine,
Nine,
Nine,
Nine,
Nine,
Nine,
Nine,
Nine,
Nine,
'teen thixty nine
'teen thixty nine
'teen thixty nine
'teen thixty nine
Yow!
Yow!
Yow!

The patronth were dumbthtruck by the entire performanth and Muth-ked made a tidy profit...



* Edit - oopth *

[Edited on 2-9-2003 by MaskedAvatar]

Originally posted by kukla
I don't think we need detailed profiles or relinquish anonymity, but some background info from contributors should be included. I myself have a B.S. in Env. Science and currently work in Education.

I don't think it's necessary to make anyone seem of lesser intelligence, just because they may not have any significant credentials to speak of. I don't.

Very well, we'll put backgrounds aside and let the arguments stand for themselves.

I'm sorry MA that JT doesn't do it for you. While I remain highly skeptical, I find the subject intriguing and worthy of investigation.

Per your comments, I would offer that I have not joined this venture to convince others that have already settled this matter for themselves. Instead, I'm inclined to research this topic out of my own interest, for as I have not settled this matter for myself.

Being the logical netizen you are MA, I am curious where you find fault in JT's story?

Here are some photos that should shed some light on what I'm talking about:

From my alma mater:




Tower structures, complete with battlements, are common in colleges/universities founded before 1890 or so...








and, here, very old class building. The tower once housed an observatory, but can still be occupied. When you're up there, you actually can look out on the surrounding fields as if from a medieval castle:




Now, for anyone who knows their colleges, isn't the idea that places like Grinnell, Carleton, Oberlin, and Reed might end up as armed forts/en-castled cities pretty damn funny?

MA i'm surprised your already back from 1969.

"
3. John Titor doesn't do it for me. What will convince me to review the hours of serious quality research that could no doubt be invested in something like this?
"

Well I'm not sure if I entirely care if you're convinced to review it. If you do chose to review it, then, you'll be presented with an easy to read, pleasent summary. The summary will be entirely linked into the statement cataloge, which will be very informative in itself, and hopefully you'll be able to reform your current opinon. That's it. If you don't want to read it, you don't have to.

For those that take this topic more seriously, they'll be able to compare all the information side by side. Very valuable, as opposed to wading through thousands of posts and crap.

Originally posted by ktprktpr
Well I'm not sure if I entirely care if you're convinced to review it.

If you do chose to review it, then, you'll be presented with an easy to read, pleasent summary. The summary will be entirely linked into the statement cataloge, which will be very informative in itself, and hopefully you'll be able to reform your current opinon. That's it. If you don't want to read it, you don't have to.

Most people would call that an obvious troll.

Originally posted by MA
Meanwhile, I undertook in this Topic to spend yesterday in 1969, and did so. The space-time continuum shifted such that I arrived in a seaport known as Bluewater, as a dwarf with a speech impediment, and in the course of a day's work took on the lease of a tavern which will hereafter in that reality be known as "The House Of Muth-ked"........blah, blah, blah, yadda, yadda. I can't believe I wasted that much time writing this queer poetry, or whatever I think it is.

That was no dwarf. It was a troll.


[Edited on 3-9-2003 by Satyr]

***WE'VE ALREADY EMAILED THIS GUY SO DON'T BOTHER***

Well I think I've settled it for myself.

UFO city JT thread:

"Anonymous posting, Posted on: 2003/8/19 19:48.

Re: It's time

A Clue
www.geocrawler.com..."


I followed the link to this reference about scalar computing and Unix.


"FROM: Robert G. Brown
DATE: 10/30/1998 00:36:07
SUBJECT: RE: bWatch

... Two reasons. One is that I could never remember what my own code did
after putting down the book for a week or more. I`ve coded in so many
languages I cannot remember them all (I even wrote a version of the game
mastermind in APL on an IBM 5100, a system few here will ever have heard
of:-) but almost all of them were at least approximately procedural.
Not APL, of course... List oriented environments like Tcl and
Mathematica do not "feel" natural to me because of my bad habits and
upbringing (and the fact that I cut a few megabytes of C code a year:-). "

www.geocrawler.com...

Luckily Prof. Brown is easy to find.

www.phy.duke.edu...

Teaching Experience:

1982-present: undergraduate introductory physics, undergraduate quantum theory, graduate classical electrodynamics, and graduate mathematical methods of physics. In addition Brown has taught two independent study courses in computer science and programming and sponsored a PRUV fellowship student studying genetic algorithms. Brown has also been a pre-major advisor for the Trinity School of Arts and Sciences since 1995.

www.phy.duke.edu...

If this isn't JT... The man who crafted this hoax has a similar CV.

Its been fun.



[Edited on 3-9-2003 by kukla]

[Edited on 3-9-2003 by kukla]

[Edited on 3-9-2003 by kukla]

kukla, ktpr

One of the main faults I have found with the John Titor material is I haven't read any yet.





Satyr

The Stooges' 1969 is one of the most significant landmarks in the history of rock music, as the opener of their first album, released, strangely, in 1969.

You should be careful to be less heightist. In some parts, labelling a dwarf a troll would get you slapped with an anti-discrimination suit!

So you think that the anonymous poster is the person who claimed to be JT, and has now decided it is time to reveal all by posting anonymously on a message board with a single link?

Check him out. He has the background. He writes. He programs. He knows his physics.

Like I said, if its not him its someone with a similar background.

hmmm i can't find that the psot your refering to and the search doesn't work to well. Can you post the link to that post?