Mandela Effect - A Civil Conversation Between Skeptics And Effected

a reply to: SaturnFX

There's is tons of evidence for ME...lol just like with most paradigm adherents, ME false memory adherents simply dismiss said evidence because it doesn't fit their paradigm.

Jaden

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

you're getting ridiculous and showing your LACK of logical reasoning ability. Why would a universe need to be gone, why would it have to be a multiverse problem if it's not just faulty memory? I know you're a troll and I don't know why I'm feeding you, but whatever.

Jaden

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Again, your assumptioning is off the charts. An alternate explanation would be that it IS a gradual process and only people that AREN'T looking at the maps every day can notice the appearance of a drastic change.

Also, who are you to say that there aren't Aussies who look at a map and say what the hell? I thought we were farther south than that.

The majority of ME affected people are not going to even know what ME is let alone be online discussing it.

Jaden

a reply to: Krahzeef_Ukhar

Finally, the whole Lion and Lamb thing makes me laugh.

They are clearly opposites in behavior which is CLEARLY the point of the scripture!

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Again, really? you took a survey of all Australians, Mexicans and Brazilians? My guess would be most Mexicans and Brazilians rarely even look at a map. LOL

Jaden

There are a few things to respond to - so I'm going to do it in one post.


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"They all believe they shifted universes - is that the simplest explanation?"

A 2-fer! Firstly, I have never said I think it's shifting universes. In my early threads, many tried to bait me into that and it never worked - because I don't have any idea what's causing it - that's being honest then and now.

A YT'er I subscribe to proposes shifting conciseness - another proposes a Biblical cause, and another proposes we're possibly in a simulation etc.. I think many ME'ers think it could be related to CERN due to timing and plausibility - but that's what I think - not what I know. All of them are interesting ideas to explore.

There's been two new theory's in this thread I've never heard before. A glitch in the Universal Consciousness, and something about a cataclysmic event where Consciousness doesn't die but moves on to the next closest reality.

Lastly, I use Occam's Razor too - and have for years (it's a rather obvious scientific method). "Mass forgetting" doesn't explain everything, so for me mass forgetting is out - regardless of it being a simple explanation.. If it doesn't fit, it doesn't fit.

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"Only Americans think they are Effected."

Nope - it's world-wide.

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"They don't know the difference between Affected and Effected."

"Mandela Effect" is a term coined by someone else (not me), and it's what most folks use so it's what I use too. I'm not going to try to change a term used by a group, even if it's not correct. There's no doubt tons of examples of misused English in the world that are now staple terms.

"Mandela Affect" doesn't work either because it implies we all have Mandela's affect. I'm not aware of a trait I carry that's the same as a trait of Mandelas' (other than human).

I know the difference between the two words, and use the correct terminology at all times (go back and search my posts for "affected").

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"They're all Flat Earthers - They're all on par with Flat Earthers."

Wrong - I solved a flat Earth thread here: www.abovetopsecret.com... I don't know how to say it, other than stop grouping people you don't understand or agree with - we aren't all the same...

One isn't indicative of the other. The only commonality is mutual exclusiveness. For instance no YT'ers I subscribe to have ever made a video about flat earth.

We're also "on par" with alien abduction folks. I'm sure many abduction folks don't put any weight in ME, but I can imagine the conversation where the same courtesy is extended:

"I think I may of been abducted last night."

"Shut up stupid, you must be American - why can't you simply understand and accept you had a bad dream. You chem-trail people are all the same - uneducated fools."

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"Someone's making money off this"

The only person I know making money off this is MoneyBags73. He has ads on his videos. No other person I'm aware of does.

The sites listed in my signature are project sites not related to the work I do. One is for a code project and the other is for a band I was in in '94 (is used as a blog for now). None of those sites have ads on them. I run the server and pay for it - it costs me money, not you.

That doesn't mean someone won't come along and try to make money off it - I'm positive there will be a book, movie etc - just like there's movies and books about alien abductions. I would have to pay for the material just like you.

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The Millennial Shock Video Parade

This isn't something anyone here has said - but I wonder if it's where some of the bias comes from.

There are tons of videos made by young folks attempting to shock you by their startling revelations - like the ME. "Look at how shocked my face is!" These folks have a lot of views because many of them are 20 year old blond bombshells - not because they report well researched news (not that there's anything wrong with it - they're doing "their thing", and we have to let the kids be).

It should go without saying they're regurgitating news researched by other people - you shouldn't get your ME news there - nor should you allow that to represent the Effected. In fact, actual ME researchers are a little peeved at them (Evan Powers is a prime example).

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This thread has taught me a few things.. and I hope it's helped others too.

One thing I learned is that there is a strong difference between the average skeptic and an anti-ME'er.

The average skeptic reserves judgement while staying firmly on their side of the fence. They can toy with the idea, but are stationary until something comes along that can prove it beyond doubt.

The anti-ME'er (I coined that term) seems to fixate in an odd way that's hard to understand for both sides. Apparently these are the folks I'm attempting to understand the anger angle on.


The wall of misunderstanding is coming down between us - it's fascinating progress to observe. That doesn't mean I intend to change anyone's mind - only to communicate with the skeptic and the Effected, identify the misunderstandings and clear them up.

Also, I like to hear skeptic opinions because it helps me understand where others are coming from - but know I'm not talking about the tired "fallible memory" augment.

Until now, I haven't been able to hear their opinion through the cloud of anti-ME'ers - now I can, and that's a good thing.

Please for the love of God, unless you are attempting a pun because of Effect in Mandela Effect, learn the difference and use affect where you should. I get really frustrated reading people's posts that say mandela effected. It would be mandela AFFECTED... affect is a verb, effect is a noun.

Jaden

a reply to: fleabit

For example: Froot Loops and Depend. Constantly brought up, but those are likely just mistakes.

The Depends is one I am positive of myself used for my stepfather as he died from cancer and if you think about it Depend does not even sound right, along with Pampers, Luvs, Huggies attends, Oh look what I still see when searching brands:

originally posted by: mclarenmp4
a reply to: OccamsRazor04

In that case there should be people investigating why so many people have a wrong shared memory.
If it was just bad memory, the geography changes for every person would be different because each individual would have their own faulty memory but we don't it's all the SAME memory.

It's not a memory issue.

No it's very simple really, there are common mistakes that people make, we all do them, it doesn't signify anything spooky going on, it's just human nature and how our minds can be tricked, as can our eyes!

For instance, "Interview with the Vampire" just doesn't roll off the tongue as well as "Interview with a Vampire...

Sydney opera house is a massively iconic building and it featured on many a TV program as I was growing up... I always thought Sydney was the capital... Mandela effect? No just bad at geography and put two and two together to make 5...

There are logical reasons why a lot of people will be wrong about the same thing.

EDIT: Now lets take this text for example...

cnduo't bvleiee taht I culod aulaclty uesdtannrd waht I was rdnaieg. Unisg the icndeblire pweor of the hmuan mnid, aocdcrnig to rseecrah at Cmabrigde Uinervtisy, it dseno't mttaer in waht oderr the lterets in a wrod are, the olny irpoamtnt tihng is taht the frsit and lsat ltteer be in the rhgit pclae. The rset can be a taotl mses and you can sitll raed it whoutit a pboerlm. Tihs is bucseae the huamn mnid deos not raed ervey ltteer by istlef, but the wrod as a wlohe. Aaznmig, huh? Yaeh and I awlyas tghhuot slelinpg was ipmorantt! See if yuor fdreins can raed tihs too.

Our brains can unscramble this, we can all do it without any effort and get the same result, as in we can read what is SUPPOSED to be there rather than what is actually written.

It's just a little bit of proof about how our minds can play tricks and how it can effect a lot of people, infact anyone that can read.

a reply to: SeaWorthy

When I saw them type "Depend" it looked pretty foreign to me too - it always will.

Herbal Essences and Vaseline are other ones I won't ever get used to.

...and now it's "Hillshire Farm" - no more Hillshire Farms - which sucks 'cause I loved getting Hillshire Farms sausage+cheese things on holidays.

The anti-ME'er will say it's because there's more than one Depend in the package so we're all just used to saying Depends. Residue won't mean anything to them as we're all a product of our stupidity, hence the residue. Blah.

listen, i know this is pretty off-topic, but i have to ask: where in the world was the tilde in the coke logo?? above the e? the O? i'm so confused and interested

a reply to: Masterjaden

Each of these are quotes from my posts:

"If the tangled pairs we're creating can affect reality here and in "another place" then there is plausibility for the impossible."
www.abovetopsecret.com...

"I want to address your thought that this doesn't affect people in other countries."
www.abovetopsecret.com...

"The only thing I can say is when it affects you personally (as it has myself), there's no turning back."
www.abovetopsecret.com...

"I put up a fight - until it affected me personally"
www.abovetopsecret.com...

"I use the term "the Effected" because it's shorter than "Those affected by the Mandela Effect""
www.abovetopsecret.com...

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For good measure:

""Mandela Effect" is a term coined by someone else (not me), and it's what most folks use so it's what I use too"
www.abovetopsecret.com...

"I know the difference between the two words, and use the correct terminology at all times (go back and search my posts for "affected")."
www.abovetopsecret.com...

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All of those came before your post - so I'm qualified in saying "For the love of God please look closer before you bandwagon."

I know the term isn't correct, and I know that doesn't make it easier for you (or anyone else) to read.. Alas it is what it is.

Fair?

originally posted by: pixeltheft
listen, i know this is pretty off-topic, but i have to ask: where in the world was the tilde in the coke logo?? above the e? the O? i'm so confused and interested

Coca~Cola

At an even line-height with the letters, and in the same style.

Edit to add:

Here's a photoshop of the way it looked:



Now that's refreshing!

Some of these ME issues are beyond a small memory differential.

A member of my family was a grade school teacher for almost 50 years. She regularly used the now-controversial bear books as part of her spelling and pronunciation lessons. When I first learned of of these controversies a few years back I called her up to ask how it was spelled and she knew right away. I also have a younger associate who remembers the struggle, questions and issues relating to pronounce "stein" is an "I" sound or as a along "E" sound. It's beyond a simple memory mistake in spelling because the "stein" spelling was integral to an array of notable, significant life events for both of these people that would never have existed had that not been the spelling. Neither of these two was working on memory at the time years ago either. They were using the actual books and book-related materials both as students and teachers.

A decades-old amusement park based on nursery rhyme and built just after disney land has always and continues to have "Mirror, mirror on the wall" written under the mirror in the Sleeping Beauty attraction. It's been there nearly 50 years. It's still there to this day. Plenty of time to have corrected a mistake.

a reply to: Pearj

First of all, thank you for presenting such a clear and concise OP. I think your approach is great, and I applaud you for your brevity at revisiting the subject, despite the aforementioned anger and aggression that typically results on ATS from such discussions.

I am an "Effected", to use your terminology. Not by every "ME", but I think I can say most of them. Some of them, such as the human anatomy thing, are in my opinion complete hysterical bull#...not intentional fabrications on the part of the "Effected" either...but rather some kind of experiment/psyop/sadistic manipulation which is made possible by the fact that there are actually true, real "ME" events already happening. In short, someone in a position to do so has taken advantage of a real phenomenon to # with the minds of the American people, as much and as often as possible. I think this was done as just one of many things during the election to confuse, frighten and cow the people so that they'd become more malleable, easily herded.

I think it's possible that some of the hostility toward people experiencing these changes stems from simple fear, and the human propensity for attacking things that don't seem to fit in or "belong"...and that applies to other people as well. The idea that this entire thing is just human manipulation of our environment appealed most to me for that reason.

I read about an experiment years ago...I think it was with chimpanzees...where the researchers were doing things like changing the appearance of just one chimp in a group. I think they put clothing on it. Anyway, as soon as the "different" chimp was re-introduced into the group with all the others, who accepted it just fine before the change in appearance, it was brutally attacked and then completely ostracized by the rest of the group. They wouldn't groom it or let it eat or drink, they wouldn't let it sit anywhere near the others or anything. Total hate and rejection for the crime of simply looking different.

People aren't chimps, but we share a lot of their behavioral traits. This is the same thing. It's important to realize that the chimp did not think it was any different. It couldn't help the fact that it had clothes on. It didn't act differently or treat the others differently. But that didn't stop the rest of the group from deciding that it was undesirable.

I have never seen anyone on these forums claiming to be "special" in any way. That ridiculous, hateful designation came straight from the people who claimed not to be affected by the changes...and it is nothing more than a fear response. It doesn't excuse the reprehensible way that anyone who tries to talk about this here is treated, but it is most definitely the primary underlying reason for it.

What I have seen, however, is a rather sizeable group of people who are experiencing something that they can't explain and trying to reach out to others for answers...and comfort. Can you imagine being the only one on the planet experiencing these things? What a frightening situation that would be to find oneself in? Imagine the treatment a person like that might receive...it would be a miracle if they weren't locked up in a psych facility and branded a loony.


I personally refuted the idea of any of this being the result of quantum shifts or alternate realities for a long time with regard to this phenomenon. You can see that by my post history on the subject. I firmly believed that it was nothing but deliberate mind games being perpetrated somehow by people in power...and I still think quite a bit of it was, particularly in cases where corrections have been made, like Tidy Cats.

But, like so many lessons I've learned in all my trips around the sun, it took a generous slice of humble pie to teach me. Let's just say I ended up having seconds, and thirds of that particular dish. I experienced...and continue to...what I can only describe as reality shifting...right in front of my eyes. I wasn't alone either, save for one occasion.

I'm not going to bother describing these events, because I have no patience left for the mockery and sarcasm from people whose minds remain firmly closed. It's not worth my energy, frankly. Suffice it to say, my world view is quite different now.

I don't personally have the effect related to Nelson Mandela, because I know nothing about him really...I despise television and have watched it a handful of times in the past 25 years, so I had no exposure to him at all. I can tell you that I vaguely recall my parents talking about his death years and years ago, but I never saw any news stories on it myself. So I dislike the 'ME' label. I just call them Shifts, because that's exactly what it looks like when they happen right in front of you...like the entire "frame" you're standing in shifts sideways.

I think it probably happens all the time, but it's so quick that most people either dismiss it or don't notice it at all. Some people are simply magnets for high strangeness, and I'm one of them, but I always wonder how many times there's a Shift that I don't notice; if I'm asleep or really busy. I'm guessing a lot. I'd imagine there's rather a significant uptick in the frequency with which people can't find an object that they know good and well was in a certain place before, or having things go inexplicably...and permanently...missing, stuff like that.

I'm pretty sure I know what is causing it...from research, a whole lot of reading and asking questions...and have accepted that, no matter how unbelievable it may seem to be, these Shifts are really happening. No human is going house to house, moving things around or anything like that. But for a long while, that was the silly explanation I clung to...and I did so out of fear. Pretty sad for someone who generally considers herself enlightened and open to new possibilities, but it's the truth.

It is worse, however, that rather than coming together and trying to understand these things and how they affect our reality as a whole, and investigate the larger implications of what is happening, people choose to turn it into a vicious argument...or full on attack anyone who dares to speak up and share their experiences. Nothing is ever learned that way...and instead of moving, we are standing still.

People fear the unknown and scepticism is a choice that's often made when the unknown gets too close for comfort. So they lash out; mock, insult, degrade and harangue those who show signs of being the bearers of the unknown. Fear turns to sneer, the shutters come down...and the chance to learn something is gone. It is such an effective mechanism to shut folks up in fact that the same people go from one discussion to the next with the sole intention of killing the conversation...and sadly, they often succeed.

They make derisive claims that anyone sharing their stories about this fancy themselves to be "special" in some way because deep down they're afraid that conversely, they're not special all. I don't say that to mock them. I say it because it's human psychology, and it's true.

Sorry for the extensive post. I haven't talked about this in a long while.

a reply to: tigertatzen

Long time no see!

If I remember right (no pun intended) aren't you a nurse or were a nurse?

It's remarkable that none of the bodily changes affect you - but other Effects do.

It's in line with "Why do professionals in a given field not speak out?" Some do, but the majority don't even if their affected in other ways. It's because those things didn't change for them somehow. It points to a fallacy or flaw with ME; almost like an intentional mind screw - yet Effected folks won't back down from other affects outside their profession.

Another interesting ME mystery is why do some of us have dual memories - another seemingly intentional mind screw.

From that angle it looks like there's human design behind the ME with inserted FU's - like "Bond #1 - Mandela - We are happy @ CERN".

I may be unusual regarding the fear thing. I don't really have a fear of the unknown, in fact I march toward it. I fear letting someone down that was counting on me - and have a hard time living with those mistakes.

Thanks for your openness.

originally posted by: SeaWorthy
a reply to: Krahzeef_Ukhar

Finally, the whole Lion and Lamb thing makes me laugh.

They are clearly opposites in behavior which is CLEARLY the point of the scripture!

So a lion and a lamb being opposites is CLEARLY the point of a scripture that states the wolf and the lamb?

How do you come to that conclusion?

a reply to: Krahzeef_Ukhar

..because the opposites will lay down together - co-commune where they wouldn't otherwise (that is the point of the verse).

Here's a made up semily to help understand:

"Republicans and Democrats are opposed - but in the end they came together to pass the bill."

..Is the issue with Lion vs wolf?

The problem there is that "wolf" has symbolic Biblical connotations "A wolf in sheep's clothing".

Lion also has symbolic imagery which is why it was used in the verse.

With that understanding - replacing Lion with wolf is scary (for religious folks) because of the underlying meaning.

originally posted by: Pearj
The anti-ME'er will say it's because there's more than one Depend in the package so we're all just used to saying Depends. Residue won't mean anything to them as we're all a product of our stupidity, hence the residue. Blah.

My answer would be that we're too lazy to say a pair of Depend Undergarments.
And saying a pair of Depend is as offensive to our grammar as saying a pair of pant.

It's just the result of them being such a popular brand that the name of the product line isn't used.

No different to when you Hoover the carpet, FedEx some documents or Google something.

I JUST WROTE AN EMAIL TO WEAREHAPPY@CERN.

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Subject:

Why Are You Happy

Body:

Have you discovered reality's bendable?

If so, will you briefly describe the principal behind the ability or cause?

Does it have to do with entangled pairs?

Thank you,
XX

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The mail went through - so that's good. No bounce, so that's better.

Most MTA's have a catch-all so it's not surprising.

I'll post any response I get.