OKAY. I'm going with Jill Stein if I can't go with Bernie

many top economists and investors predict an era of much lower asset-price returns over the next 30 years,

America’s ability to offer up even the appearance of growth—

via financially oriented strategies like low interest rates, more and more consumer credit, tax-deferred debt financing for businesses, and asset bubbles that make people feel richer than we really are, until they burst—

is at an end.

(same source)
It's over.

Next!!!!

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

You all have made this into some sort of troll-fest, and it's disgraceful.

Disagreeing with you isn't trolling. People have been trying to point out that Stein is a bit of a crackpot, and there isn't really a point in voting for her.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Unfortunately, all those sources are biased.

They are however, very clever and, convincing to a specific audience.

a reply to: kaylaluv

Now dear....

NOOOOOOoooooooo!

LOL that actually made me blush.

a reply to: Domo1

Lying is trolling. You and others are simply lying.
You are using definitions that do not apply to the suggestions on offer.

You are LYING, and refuse to acknowledge it.
Nice button-pushing and chain-yanking, but lying all the same.

You can dig whatever antiquated definition of "socialism" you want to out of your stinky monkey-hole, and it still won't mean that you are telling the truth about what Sanders is proposing.

You are either IGNORANT,

or deliberately LYING.

And that is the fault of no one but yourselves.

a reply to: xuenchen

Unfortunately, all those sources are biased.

Then go to Bernie's website...read what he wrote. What he "approves" as the message.
Oh - you're too smug and lazy to be bothered?

Bernie Sanders website

You guys are really being pathetic, and infuriating.
At least, AT LEAST, read what he's saying - which I doubt you've ever done. Just READ THE CRAP - and then open your yap.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Which "definitions" are off kilter to you?

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Lying is trolling. You and others are simply lying.

Is it? Are we? I haven't lied in this thread.

out of your stinky monkey-hole

I'll have you know my monkey-whole smells like a spring morning.

and it still won't mean that you are telling the truth about what Sanders is proposing.

I've barely even talked about Sanders. This thread is about Jill Stein. We should stay on topic.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: Domo1

Lying is trolling. You and others are simply lying.
You are using definitions that do not apply to the suggestions on offer.

You are LYING, and refuse to acknowledge it.
Nice button-pushing and chain-yanking, but lying all the same.

You can dig whatever antiquated definition of "socialism" you want to out of your stinky monkey-hole, and it still won't mean that you are telling the truth about what Sanders is proposing.

You are either IGNORANT,

or deliberately LYING.

And that is the fault of no one but yourselves.

No one is digging antiquated definitions out of the ether for socialism.

I used Google.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

I've asked you for your definition of 'democratic socialism', you have provided none.

The article you pasted, only shows that my generation is not very educated on the actual subject.

Would you like me to continue? Because this one will hurt your brain.

A system based on infinite growth, on a finite planet, cannot sustain itself. We do not live in a capitalist society, capitalism takes the booms with the busts; a fascist society takes the booms, and uses corporate protectionism/bailouts to pad the busts. Capitalism reflects nature, like a deer population growing to a point then thinning out to ensure longevity and enough resources for everyone. To delay the collapse of our fascist system, while implementing a transitional system such as 'democratic socialism', it is necessary for expansionary warfare over dwindling resources, which is culminating in a global war between the east and west. It is also necessary for the erosion of civil liberties to quell domestic unrest during total collapse of the vestiges of the old system. We are moving away from nation-states. The end product is still many decades away, we will go through a process of corporate-states and naturally evolve away from a society geared towards profits to a society focused on the longevity of the human species. If we are lucky and do not destroy the planet, we will evolve into a Global Scientific Dictatorship, one in which every aspect of human activity will be monitored and controlled (you should be especially happy about that), with most of our resources allocated towards space exploration/colonization to ensure the longevity of the human species.

Your push towards socialism is premature, you want it now but if you do not allow it to form naturally, we will resemble something more like the Soviet Union; that is not something desirable. These so called 'socialists' are more properly termed useful idiots, because one group wants to gain dominance over everyone else. The supposed leaders of the socialist movement are closet aristocrats, they will hurtle this world into death and decay; we will not evolve, there will be no drive for advancement.

Now, this is simply my theory, based on all the knowledge I have accumulated over the years.

I would very much like for you to actually answer my question on what you consider to be DEMOCRATIC SOCIALISM

a reply to: Konduit

Video is so accurate. Cracks me up every time.

The goal of socialism is communism. Vladimir Lenin

www.brainyquote.com...

Maybe a little Trotsky will help too

Marx named this first stage of the new society “the lowest stage of communism”, in distinction from the highest, where together with the last phantoms of want material inequality will disappear. In this sense socialism and communism are frequently contrasted as the lower and higher stages of the new society. “We have not yet, of course, complete communism,” reads the present official Soviet doctrine, “but we have already achieved socialism – that is, the lowest stage of communism.”

www.marxists.org...
Tragically, Trotsky a communist apologist tried to rationalize away the failures of the communist regime in the Soviet Union by suggesting that they were not really communist but still capitalist..... but the truth is that communism is simply not going to work and Marx and Lenin both knew that it would require an authoritarian revolution of the proletariat dictatorship to bring in their world communist state..... the truth is that forcing communism and/or socialism in any stage is going to be authoritarian and its no use trying to pretend that democratic socialism is anything but pretending everyone is going to be happy if only they will trust their government masters and give their masters all the fruits of their labor to redistribute to all the less fortunate slaves of the dictatorship....

I would ask the proponents of socialism to consider truthfully, were the collective farms of the old Soviet Empire an example of Capitalism? Were the Gulags an example of Capitalist economy? Just asking

"Bernie Math"....oh that is classic.....

originally posted by: ThirdEyeofHorus

The goal of socialism is communism. Vladimir Lenin

www.brainyquote.com...

Maybe a little Trotsky will help too

Marx named this first stage of the new society “the lowest stage of communism”, in distinction from the highest, where together with the last phantoms of want material inequality will disappear. In this sense socialism and communism are frequently contrasted as the lower and higher stages of the new society. “We have not yet, of course, complete communism,” reads the present official Soviet doctrine, “but we have already achieved socialism – that is, the lowest stage of communism.”

www.marxists.org...
Tragically, Trotsky a communist apologist tried to rationalize away the failures of the communist regime in the Soviet Union by suggesting that they were not really communist but still capitalist..... but the truth is that communism is simply not going to work and Marx and Lenin both knew that it would require an authoritarian revolution of the proletariat dictatorship to bring in their world communist state..... the truth is that forcing communism and/or socialism in any stage is going to be authoritarian and its no use trying to pretend that democratic socialism is anything but pretending everyone is going to be happy if only they will trust their government masters and give their masters all the fruits of their labor to redistribute to all the less fortunate slaves of the dictatorship....

I would ask the proponents of socialism to consider truthfully, were the collective farms of the old Soviet Empire an example of Capitalism? Were the Gulags an example of Capitalist economy? Just asking

Well if we were electing Lenin or Trotsky these definitions might prove to be truthful, but we are not and it is quite disingenuous to use them as examples of modern democratic socialism as it would be being created in the US of A.

So we must stay with the status quo because of Russias past, BS!

a reply to: GodEmperor

Your push towards socialism is premature, you want it now but if you do not allow it to form naturally, we will resemble something more like the Soviet Union; that is not something desirable. These so called 'socialists' are more properly termed useful idiots, because one group wants to gain dominance over everyone else. The supposed leaders of the socialist movement are closet aristocrats, they will hurtle this world into death and decay; we will not evolve, there will be no drive for advancement.

We will adapt some but certainly not all aspects of socialism and it would not be a carbon copy of the past, rather it would be a modern evolved form of socialism fitted to the needs of the US of A. To think that suddenly we would follow the failures of the past to duplicate their failure is simply denying the fact that everything changes and evolves, while history may repeat its self it is never duplicated.

No our push towards socialism is not premature, it is the starting point of a more evolved form of socialism, American democratic socialism, something that is preferable to the Corporate Rule!

a reply to: AlaskanDad
So are you one of those people who says oh Lenin or Trotsky or Stalin didn't do it right but by golly we in the good ol USA are going to do it better? Ok then.... How long will it take because we already have socialist mechanisms. Please don't try to insult us with the tripe that if only we had a Bernie or a Jill we can do it right . It won't happen. Bernice's plans will destroy what's left of the economy and Jill sounds not much different and the same ok same ok utopian ideals. The soviet union failed because of centralized planned and authoritarian communism. It's that simple. No amount of trying is going to make it better. I mightadd the new fav buzzwords are things like "communitarianism", "stakeholder", "consensus", "public/private partnership" and oh goody "democratic socialism". Most of those terms are out of Agenda 21 which is green red.

a reply to: AlaskanDad

So you think bernie or Jill will do it better because they are more evolved than Trotsky or Lenin? In what way are they or their plans more evolved?
You know what's interesting, under a democratic socialist potus, we have a new sort of line.........I just heard. A news report that 3 hour lines have formed for security in airports.....just now. Under this potus we got groping security agents.....lol that's so much progress.

a reply to: ThirdEyeofHorus

So are you one of those people who says oh Lenin or Trotsky or Stalin didn't do it right but by golly we in the good ol USA are going to do it better?

Nice try at twisting my words!

I will say it again we would not adopt an exact copy of their attempts at socialism, many European countries have adopted forms of socialism tailoered to their needs, not the Trotsky Lenin crap you wish to use in example.

I see that the status quo is failing ,as we have enacted trade agreements that empower corporate globalism ruling over the nations of the world.

If you're the 1% our system is working, if you're the 99% it has become a total failure an oligarchy wasting its economy on empire building regime changes that profit the 1%.

Your opinions are quite dishonest, but you seem to have an agenda of falsifying both Sanders and Steins campaign platform to suit your debate, more BS!!!!!

Lols U R a funny Guy!

a reply to: ThirdEyeofHorus

Wow you have stereotyped me and put a spin on everything I have said, are you just a liar, stupid or is there another reason that you're spinning everything.

So you think bernie or Jill will do it better because they are more evolved than Trotsky or Lenin? In what way are they or their plans more evolved?

I never said anything about Sen Sanders or Dr Stein being more evolved, that is simply a very stupid lie on your part. Quit being a idiot and address my posts, and the points I make rather than making things up!

I said any form of socialism that was adopted by the US of A would not be a carbon copy of the socialism of Trotsky or Lenin, but an evolved form tailored to the needs of Americans!

I added the bold hoping that even with your diminished reading skills you might be able to see what I actually wrote.

What a effing dolt!