Putin: Russia sees the outbreak of global war as almost inevitable, is prepared for it,...

a reply to: spy66

I'm assuming he's referring to the part of Ukraine that practically has to beg for Russian occupation to make the referendum official and end the violence.

You know that without some of the earlier context to what went down in Ukraine it is very easy to miss the truth of the matter . The Nuland phone call and that anti-jew piece really made me focus and keep my eye on the pea .After that Crimea and even whats going on in the east makes perfect sense and justifiably so . That is when the anti-Putin/Russian rhetoric went full blown MSM in the west . It was so obvious they were overselling their kool-aid . a reply to: nukedog

a reply to: the2ofusr1

Yeah well as soon as I heard the leaked recording I immediately knew the US was up to it's old tricks. That combined with the history of Ukraine is the reason why I have been tuning out events there. It's too hard to discern the truth in all the lies.

a reply to: 2012newstart

The sounds very much like posturing to me and of course both sides are equally guilty of this.

Russia need's to be prepared not so much against us in the west however as for a change of face in there new chinese friends.

Even in Stalin and Moa's disfunctional relationship both despotical tyrants and perhaps equally evil men (though as a human being Mao was perhaps far worse) who warped the idiology and notions behind communism into perverted autocratic militarized police states (Communism may very well have taken a completely different path had Lennin not died and Stalin not succeeded him), both are guilty of the mass genocides of there own people's as well as minoritys within there nations some of whom especially in china where some entire ethnic groups were actually eradicated during the cultural revolution and then also Stalins purges (Of mainly communist party members who realised his idiology was perverted and wrong as well as democratic believers and the few remaining white Russians following there defeat - mostly only suspected or sympathizing with or related to white Russian's the white russians were the Royalist and others who tried to stage a counter revolution and fought a bloody civil war with the communists ).

Though out of the Two Mao was by far the more evil though estimates of deaths under there rule are higher for Stalin (perhaps due to better record keeping in Russia in that period), Mao was suffering advanced syphalus and had bus loads of young girls rounded up from chinese villages to be brought to him as his traditional chinese doctors believed balancing his Ying by having multiple virgins every night might cure him as well as elongating his life (there are story's of many commiting suicide and witness hearing them screaming from outside but of course they had to do there duty for the party and chairman Mao now did'nt they).
www.straightdope.com...
www.ifjc.org...
documentaryheaven.com...

Now why should they Russia be careful of China, well there are a number of reason's such as Today China is facing a terrible Crisis due to it's one child policy and the deliberate murder of unwanted baby girl's (Due to there traditional and backward tribal belief that only a boy can continue the family) and today they are looking west to Russia to make up this problem of a shortage in female companionship with good time Russian and Eurasian girl's, these young woman are tricked into thinking they are getting a modelling job in China but when there are they are passed into the Human trafficking ring inside China were the growing desire for female companionship among the growing male population is untenable and so the Chinese state look's the other way perhapse even unofficially sanctioning it.

Traditionally Russia and China have not got on too well at all and a number of conflicts occured between them in the 20th century alone with Russia coming out as the loser in most of those.

For example the Expeditionary Imperial Russian army once tried to invade China but were beaten back in manchuria and routed by a primitively armed chinese army that greatly outnumbered them and used traditional fireworks as weapons against the Russians (whose army at the time was modern with up to date weapons and artilliary) at the start of the 20th century.

On another occasion Stalin thought he could absorb China into Russia and his army was badly defeated and Routed with Russian soldiers apparently throwing there guns away as they ran by the Chinese.

en.wikipedia.org...

en.wikipedia.org...

There is actually a history of long conflict and bitter disputes between the two nations along there shared border and the current cordial relations between the two are only held in place by shared interest but once those interests are satisified they will no doubt go back to rubbing one another up the wrong way.

The Tactic of maintaining readiness for a conflict goes back also the the end of the second world war and of course is the very purpose of NATO so the Russian posturing is merely hot air and saying "Dont Push Me" but in today's case they are not Rocky Balboa and even if they where they are facing a psyched up Mike Tyson in the opposite corner so would be better off just calming down and watching there back were China is concerned with it's new expansionist policys and own territorial ambitions.

I have no doubt China is only waiting it's chance to grab some of that Lovely underpopulated mineral rich Russian Republic Territory as well as closeing the old wound of the divided Mongolia that has always been an afront to Chinese nationalist pride.


It is worth adding this as an edit, China WANTs Russians eastern Naval Facilitys and Dockyard's, they are devious enough to use other methods but if the Russian command (Yemantu) and control are ever disrupted in the west then they will undoubtedly seize them for themselve's.

a reply to: LABTECH767

Two things. It is true china has not liked Russia for some time. Russians have looked down on them I think. I do wonder how feasibly they could work together in a world war situation. I suspect they would leave each other alone mostly and work together.

Also, I have a very very very hard time envisioning china invading anybody. There may indeed be a desire for this or that naval port but a true Chinese invasion? That has NEVER happened. Correct me if I'm wrong

Do you think that in the 21st century the need to forge relations with friendly neighbors who may at one time been a enemy is possible ? I am thinking that by now the petty differences wont ever be enough to divide countries where at one time they may have . I guess it's about who may be ambitious enough to control the whole show . Groups and people with those ambitions surely cant hide it from the rest for very long . If you were to take the propaganda coming out of the west over Crimea and Russia you might think that but it really seems laughable . The US on the other hand ,not so much . a reply to: LABTECH767

Also, Putins little speech seems to indicate he is not at all worried about China. If anything he is insinuating they have already made an informal alliance. Or he's blowing smoke up everyone's but. Who knows?

a reply to: nukedog

Tibet.
Vietnam (the VC actually kicked there arses on that one)
Northern India along disputed Himalayan Territory's.

What you are looking at is the Traditionalist Confiucian view which made IMPERIAL china look inward and was the reason for the great wall being rebuilt, the great wall of course dates back to Qin, he unified seven seperate nations and murdered millions but laid out the unified china.

There have over the ages been progressive emperors and the grand fleet that famously sailed around the pacific a hundred years before columbus in ships over ten times the size of the Nina, Pinta or Santa Maria.

en.wikipedia.org...

This fleet led by the grand Eunoch was also a military fleet to project chinese power around the world, they were to search out new territorys and new trade but when it returned home the old Progressive Emperor had died and been replaced by a traditionalist inward looking emperor inspired by Confuscious idiology and philosophy, he ordered the grand fleet burned to the ground and the great wall rebuilt.

Famously when the Chines saw the first complex Swiss clocks brought by western missionary's they were amazed and had forgotten that they had been able to build similarly complicated mechanical devices over 300 years before as it had been forgotten (they also invented blast furnaces to produce high quality steel over a thousand years ago and had transverse bulkheads moddeled on a cane's seperate chambers in all there ships ake the titanic was the first western ship to try to make use of such) when the New and Controlled line of tradtionalist emperors had taken the throne controlled by there courtyers who feared loss of status with change and virtual prisoners in the forbidden city.

How did you think China got so very Large.

a reply to: LABTECH767

Well I knew that China warred amongst itself for a long time but basically the over all shape of it's boundaries have stayed the same.

Yes Tibet I had forgotten about. Very silly of me. I have a hard time believing it wasn't part of china in some murky past though. That's interesting. Going to have to look that up.

India yes I forgot about that. I don't really view border skirmishing as full on invasion. Maybe a bit of territorial expansion.

This is the first I heard about China invading Vietnam. I thought the French started that nasty habit?

Going to have to crack some wiki pages open....

a reply to: nukedog

Also the current illegal expansion into the territorial waters of other nations and there laying claim to the international waters of the entire east china sea (it is only named the east china sea but encompasses many other nations).

Russian maneuvers
As already mentioned before, China and Russia aren't what I'd call allies.
So Putin would open himself up for a war he starts enclosed by NATO and Europe on the one side, Chechen rebels on the other and China ready to take over what's left.
Yes sounds very smart. I assume the point is more trying to have a not entirely weak position while discussing new deals with Eastern European countries, which are still impressed by his dick move in the Ukraine. My advice to Poland and Finland and all other adjacent countries: laugh and shrug, he's just "slamming his balls menacingly on the table" what a joke.

a reply to: LABTECH767

America has been treating all the world's seas and oceans as their property. Why can't China?

The fleet of the Grand Eunuch was about collecting tribute from lesser nations not about trade or conquest. China had all the land and trade it needed. They just liked to tell people how awesome they were. They never really projected power on other nations in imperial style.

a reply to: Peeple

I'm just not seeing this eye to eye with you.

Humor me.... What was his "dick move" in Ukraine? Like I said, I quit tuning into that as soon as I saw the political disruption actors arrive on the stage.

These threads always crack me up. Defenders of Russia and Putin, and the U.S. is evil incarnate.

It's sort of funny how the U.S. can interfere to assist a nation.. or not.. or speaks out against it.. or not.. they are labeled as either interfering world police with global domination on their minds, or as a country that refuses to help another country in need because there is "nothing in it for them."

And Russia annexes a country, and people defend this as a just and right thing for Russia to do. I am still surprised that this site doesn't end in .ru - on any given day, it typically feels like an anti American, pro Russian site.

a reply to: fleabit

Those are some awesome ideals. Do you have any substance to your views? Enlighten me please.

originally posted by: tavi45
a reply to: LABTECH767

America has been treating all the world's seas and oceans as their property. Why can't China?

The fleet of the Grand Eunuch was about collecting tribute from lesser nations not about trade or conquest. China had all the land and trade it needed. They just liked to tell people how awesome they were. They never really projected power on other nations in imperial style.

So did we the British, it is even enshrined in Rule Britannia, the point was that America took over from us after the second world was as the worlds policeman but it became schewed by the idiological conflict between Stalinist Communism and Capitalism (both evil and twisted mentalitys) and so too did Russia who policed the waters making the same kind's of stops etc that the Americans did and the British before them.

But that was then and today's far more populous world all nations have ship's and sea born trade, the demarkation of national waters made in the past may by some be seen to be unfair or at least an inconvenience to there own modern imperialist desires and make no bone's about modern China is imperialist and racist, in Tibet they have been sterilizing the Ethnic Tibetans while moving Ethnic Han Chinese (the Han are the largest ethnic group in China and the dominant race) into Tibet, they now outnumber the Surviving Tibetans by a considerable margin.

Now they are looking to expand there growing military and economic influence by Force actually building an artificial island and Military outpost in disputed waters near to another country to seize those waters and there encumbant under water mineral and oil deposits.

Your point about america may be valid but only when and where this policing of the oceans has been abused but overall they have been a good force and a stabilizing force protecing many nations as well as curtailing aggression, you know when we british were still doing it we were stopping slave ships off of Yeman right up to the 1970's when budjet cuts ended our anti slavery patrol's, sadly the Yanks did not step into that role as they perhaps should have back then.

But how do wrongs of the past (Assuming they were wrong in a more savage age) make wrong's of the present that are obvious infringement's of international law acceptable.

a reply to: nukedog

ExhibitA
Just as an example and since you already stated you don't have a clue, read more before you argue.

originally posted by: spy66

originally posted by: Lysergic
The real question;

Who ISNT ready for war?

Seems to me all players have geared up.

The EU nations aint ready to fallow the US into a war With Russia. Non of the EU nations have geared up. All they have done is moved some hardware and people around the map. Hardly enought to do much damage.

Exactly!

Ask yourself this, what would the EU do if the US\UK\Canada\Australia alliance collapsed?

If the USD collapsed and these nations were "taken out" first, without warning and completely; what would be the EU response?

Would there be any nations left to stop the Russia/China alliance from total dominion?

All replies in this thread assume it will be USA vs. Russia in WW3; prophecy indicates it will be a United EU vs. Russia after the end of the US/UK alliance as a global factor.

WW3 begins after the US is removed from the equation; that is the final war of the present age.

God Bless,

a reply to: Peeple

Your exhibit is faulty at best. I'm not arguing. I'm stating my views. Thank you for yours.

a reply to: LABTECH767

You post valid facts. I however am highly dubious china is going to invade anybody. Strong arm and expand borders maybe. Outright occupy? No. Not imo. Unless they are really really still ticked at japan.... and I think they are :\