The Story of Christ in the First Word of the Bible - In the beginning

I heard that harold camping guy is like a math wiz for the age of the earth.

Originally posted by juveous
I heard that harold camping guy is like a math wiz for the age of the earth.

I heard that after his THIRD failed prophecy he mysteriously had a stroke that just happened to affect the part of his brain that controls speech.

reply to post by spy66

That quote speaks a thousand words

I am a believer in a creator, but i have to be true to my mind, I have no choice, My mind cant be told what to believe without reasoning. My mind wont accept everything the Bible is saying. I am still having problems accepting Genesis chapter 2. My mind just wont accept it. Maybe because i haven't found the right reason to yet.

I could have written what you put down here. However, I am way beyond this and back in the arms of Christ at this point. There is no better truth than love. The epicenter of this truth arrived to our minds 2000 years ago. You should read an article I wrote where I said the very thing you are saying now. LINK

reply to post by spy66

Before i can go on with the rest of the Bible. Genesis chapter 2 must make sense to me. Chapter 2 must fit chapter 1. Making that happen is not easy, even if i put my very, very good will into it.

Its one thing to read genesis chapter 1. and than closing the book, looking around at reality, our universe, our existence.
Because; how you picture genesis in your mind have to resemble reality. If not we are dealing with two realities;; the one you imagine when you read the book and the other when you close the book.

The bible is supposed to resemble reality not a mind game, so it must be treated as such. Because reality is the only truth.

You can imagine a train engineer arguing with a friend that the train whistle changes pitch. They come to blows one day over the topic. Each has a recording of the train whistle. Which friend was correct? They both found out when another friend comes by and tells them about the Doppler Effect.

This is called the excluded middle. All paradox can be resolved when we have the perspective that sees both from logic and from frame of reference. Perspective is the key. With Genesis 2, we need to realize that there are two creations. One is fallen and the image of the true creation. In Genesis 1:27, it references the image that God created. Then he says, 31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the sixth day. On the seventh day he rested.

Now, just ask yourself what just happened. God created the image of what was going to be rendered into material by Jesus. YHWH is the Lord God, whereas Genesis 1 was the Father God. Same God, different parts of the process. God designed the form and essence of the seed and the womb. The Word projected it into existence by speaking the wave of creation in Genesis 2. Genesis 1 was the image and design before the rendering.

Why do I arrive at this? God the Father is light. God the Son is Word (John 1). The only one left is the Holy Spirit (Consciousness of God). God is one, yet three in our reality. We are one person, yet we have all three of the Trinity.

Light is both a particle and a wave. It is energy in all forms. Before it was rendered, it was formless and void. The waters of the deep represents energy as an ocean of light. High order and low entropy. God separates the light form the darkness and in Genesis 2, the Word (Wave) takes light and forms matter into life. Light is both a particle and a wave. All particles have an associated wave. All matter is then animated to life by consciousness. Genesis 2 is the breath of life. Genesis 3 is the fall of creation and the plan of salvation.

reply to post by SuperiorEd


What i am afraid of is that one can easily reason genesis chapter 1 and 2 to add up. That is the easy part.
The hard part is accepting it as a fact, and than wanting to teach others about the discovery. What if we are wrong, than past on knowledge will always be wrong.

We base our interpretation on past down knowledge from others. Our knowledge generates feelings about what we know. Knowledge and feelings; is our foundation to have faith in what we think we understand.

How we perceive knowledge/information differs from person to person. I tell people something that i think is very important to visualize.

-Everyone who know how to read; thinks they understand every word they have read. But the truth is; Only a fraction really understands what they have just read.

-Most people know how to solve a simple equation, but only a few knows what they have really solved.


When two or more people read the same story from a book, they will perceive the reality, the topography of the story differently. The result of this is that: what started out as one story; has turned into two or more additional stories with different realities and topographies.
The out come is as vivid as the definition for exponential growth ,We may have reasoned ourselves into darkness by having fallen victim of having changed the truth over time. A lot of time has passed since the beginning.

The danger of being so far away from the truth (The beginning), is that we create our own truth with our own personal knowledge, which again is based on our interpretation (learned information) of other peoples knowledge.



I want to tell you how i understand genesis chapter 1, And i want you to tell me what is wrong with it.

- I dont believe God is a person; I believe God is a personality. What i mean is; the infinite has a personality/awareness. PS. We can not have something that the creator dosent have..."personality/awareness"

This is how i image the infinite from reading Genesis Chapter 1. verse 2.

2. And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep.

This is the infinite body of initial awareness. This is the creator of heaven and earth. There is no earth, there is no heaven and there is no light. Just the creator.

The image will look 2-dimensional because there is no light to perceive depth/information.

Verse 2. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

The creator must move to be able to create. Because the creator is infinite, a constant. Something that is a constant wont change unless there is a will to do so.

Why??. Because a infinite is as large as it can be and as small as it can be, all at once. It has no reason to change, because it is all that it can be already. So there must be a will and a reason to change.

3. And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

The creation of light has two causes: 1. Gods will to change. 2. The spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. The face of the waters is the 2-dimensional image.

Gods movement creates a compression of infinite energy. The compression creates a finite energy mass. The creation of finite energy mass is the cause of light/information.

The beginning might have looked something like this:


This is the seed of our existence being formed within this light. Within the light lies the compressed energy mass, that will evolve into the universe/world we perceive today.

Everything that God have planned to evolve is within this energy mass. You and Me and everyone who has been alive before us and who is alive today; lies within this energy mass. This seed (energy mass) within this light is the book of life. Everyone's name is written in it.

If my knowledge is correct, genesis chapter 2 is impossible. God wouldn't create the apple tree first, and than later create the apples and put them on the branches. "We are the apples".
Reality shows us that a apple tree produces its own apples.

reply to post by spy66

I want to tell you how i understand genesis chapter 1, And i want you to tell me what is wrong with it.

- I dont believe God is a person; I believe God is a personality. What i mean is; the infinite has a personality/awareness. PS. We can not have something that the creator dosent have..."personality/awareness"

This is how i image the infinite from reading Genesis Chapter 1. verse 2.

Like you say, we all have a perspective. There is a presupposition that we can rely on to be accurate. There is a territory, but everyone has a different map of the territory. Until we possess awareness encompassing the entire territory, we will only be able to see a slice. There are many people who have had spiritual experiences where they claim that the entire universe was experienced in one second and they were at one with all existence. I do not doubt this for a second. The reason I believe this comes from a book called the Corpus Hermeticum. The best English translation is called 'The Way of Hermes'.

You made the statement that God must be able to move to create. I see it differently. Thought (Consciousness) is at the center of creation. There are only two things that a person can do in this world. We move and we think. The only reason we can move is because we are thinking. The movement is the result of collapsing infinity. We do not make our hair grow, the sun shine, the earth turn, our eyes see or anything else besides thought. Thought is what takes something out of nothing.

I recently wrote a book. The book was immaterial before I brought it into existence by thought. Thought moves to movement and movement becomes reality. For thought to become reality, there must be a resource used. As Genesis states this:

1 In the beginning (TIME) God (INFINITY AT REST) created the heavens (SPACE) and the earth (MATTER). 2 Now the earth (MATTER) was formless and empty, darkness (ABSENCE OF MOVEMENT) was over the surface of the deep (EXPANCE), and the Spirit (CONSCIOUSNESS) of God was hovering over (ABOVE) the waters (ENERGY / PRIMA MATERIA).

3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light.

The light is separation of darkness from light. This is taking the waters and liberating the light. A physicist would tell you that this make a great deal of sense when it comes to our understanding of the early universe with high order and low entropy. At this stage, the universe would have been a wash of high frequency energy in all directions.

God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.

Keep in mind that we are not experiencing a literal day and night. We are only seeing separation of the light and empty space into differentiation.

I could keep going here, but the first creation was simply a formatting of form and sequencing of the universe into the pallet that would be used for the second stage in Genesis 2.

This is merely my view. We will all know at some point.

reply to post by SuperiorEd

There are only two things that a person can do in this world. We move and we think. The only reason we can move is because we are thinking. The movement is the result of collapsing infinity. We do not make our hair grow, the sun shine, the earth turn, our eyes see or anything else besides thought. Thought is what takes something out of nothing.

I cant agree to this. The reason we have the ability to think, is because of a process of constant chemical changes taking place within our body. Our body dosent change because we have the ability to think.
The constant changes within our body is do to our bodies being a finite energy-mass composition, and exposed to differential pressure; "external energy mass" (its surrounding atmosphere). Our ability to think depends on our bodies ability to maintain a constant circulation of vital energies. Our hart is a pump that creates a differential pressure needed for blood to circulate to vital parts of our body.

Our physical surroundings can change if we have the functions, tools and materials to make the changes. Your book would not be created by pure thought alone. You need many different function to be able to put your thoughts on paper or even verbally.

On a bigger scale, the universe works in the same way. It must be able to expand to be able to let changes take place within its system. Our universe/Gods creation, can expand because there is a differential between the dimension of Gods creation and the dimension of God. God is infinite and Gods creation is finite.

Originally posted by spy66
reply to post by SuperiorEd

 

There are only two things that a person can do in this world. We move and we think. The only reason we can move is because we are thinking. The movement is the result of collapsing infinity. We do not make our hair grow, the sun shine, the earth turn, our eyes see or anything else besides thought. Thought is what takes something out of nothing.

I cant agree to this. The reason we have the ability to think, is because of a process of constant chemical changes taking place within our body. Our body dosent change because we have the ability to think.
The constant changes within our body is do to our bodies being a finite energy-mass composition, and exposed to differential pressure; "external energy mass" (its surrounding atmosphere). Our ability to think depends on our bodies ability to maintain a constant circulation of vital energies. Our hart is a pump that creates a differential pressure needed for blood to circulate to vital parts of our body.

Our physical surroundings can change if we have the functions, tools and materials to make the changes. Your book would not be created by pure thought alone. You need many different function to be able to put your thoughts on paper or even verbally.

On a bigger scale, the universe works in the same way. It must be able to expand to be able to let changes take place within its system. Our universe/Gods creation, can expand because there is a differential between the dimension of Gods creation and the dimension of God. God is infinite and Gods creation is finite.

edit on 27.06.08 by spy66 because: (no reason given)

You are not getting what I am saying. The entire universe down to your hair growing is produced for you, not by you. A person thinks in the vehicle that they posses. They do not make hair grow, eyes see or body regulate. The only thing a person does is move into the body that is provided for thought and movement. The thought produces movement. Apart form thought and movement, there are no other things we do. Name one thing, apart from thought and movement, and you can say I am in error on this.

The point was to demonstrate that thought is the center of what takes place. We first think of what we will create and then transmute matter into our creation. We are a copy of God in our abilities. It all originates with thought. This is where we get blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. Spirit is consciousness. What does science leave out of their equation? Preexistence consciousness. This is saying that the Holy Spirit does not exist. This leads to disbelief and the materialistic worldview. This worldview says that matter comes first. God says that He cannot be represented by matter. Hebrews 11:3 says that the universe comes from what is not seen. Thought and consciousness are not seen. Read the Corpus Hermeticum. This would have been the schooling that Moses would have had in Egypt.

reply to post by SuperiorEd

You are not getting what I am saying. The entire universe down to your hair growing is produced for you, not by you. A person thinks in the vehicle that they posses. They do not make hair grow, eyes see or body regulate. The only thing a person does is move into the body that is provided for thought and movement. The thought produces movement. Apart form thought and movement, there are no other things we do. Name one thing, apart from thought and movement, and you can say I am in error on this.

The point was to demonstrate that thought is the center of what takes place. We first think of what we will create and then transmute matter into our creation. We are a copy of God in our abilities. It all originates with thought. This is where we get blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. Spirit is consciousness. What does science leave out of their equation? Preexistence consciousness. This is saying that the Holy Spirit does not exist. This leads to disbelief and the materialistic worldview. This worldview says that matter comes first. God says that He cannot be represented by matter. Hebrews 11:3 says that the universe comes from what is not seen. Thought and consciousness are not seen. Read the Corpus Hermeticum. This would have been the schooling that Moses would have had in Egypt.

Sometimes i also travel a bit of the path, but that is so that i can get a feel of the environment and the people there I have to learn by being guided. I have to know how people think and respond, to be able to understand.



We might be human, but we are also animals. And we live by a set of very strict..natural priorities. Most people don't consider to think about what set of priorities they must live by. Do to the modern support system they live by. The system creates a illusion about our set of priorities. This also clouds our mind.

If i ask my self; Who is in control of my physical body??. Is it "me" or is it my mind. I know "I" have a function, and i know my mind has another.
Our body forces us to do specific everyday task so that our body and mind, and the "I am" will function. What those functions are depend on geographical location of the person, And the geographical locations ability to sustain the physical body with food, water, shelter and so on.
These are the bases for our primary functions. Everything besides the primary functions are luxuries which "You" can use your mind and body to your disposal. (That is when you can use your "I am" function to write a book for instant). I like to call it reserve energy. Some like to call it spare time. People can only read your book in their spare time.

There is a big difference between primary functions and spare time functions/ideas.

When we enter a body, we are immediately bound by a set of very strict rules, which we have to priorities. And our main priority is to sustain the life of our body and mind. Our body informs our mind about what "You" have to do. That is the order of life in this dimension.

What we choose to do in our spare time becomes a moral issue. Because that is when we form ideas (moral values) about how to improve.