9-11 and cell phones

See, my opinion is that most cellphone calls were legit. U can use them on planes.

My major issue with the phone calls was not they they existed.

It was the FBI seizure of certain phone calls. The gag order placed on 911 operators recieving the calls. And the content of the calls made by certain passengers to thier family.

See, the FBI was present at Todd beamers house when his wife was on the phone with him, because she had called the cops and told them what was happening to her husband. So, the FBI was listening in on whatwas going on on flight 93. A plan by the passengers to attack the hijackers.

Hearing this, one would think, since all the feds were listening, that maybe, it would not be a good idea to send those jets shooting down flight 93?

But it was still shot down. The passengers uceeded in thier plan. They might have even landed it alive. The feds, listening in on it, knew it.

But the plane was still shot down. Why?Dead men tell no tales, thats why.

The History Channel recently ran a re-enactment of the doomed flight that Mohammed Atta was on. It clearly showed a flight attendant using a cell phone.
I really felt the History Channel was faking it, telling the story that is official versus the truth. (The History Channel's eliability has gone down since the Men who killed Kennedy chapter involving Johnson's involvement was shown.)

I tend to believe the experiment East Coast Kid cited. Maybe, if you had a fancy phone/plan like Skadi mentioned it would get through. But would it get through crystal clear and uninteruppted? I doubt it.
I can't use my two-year old phone in the middle of Walmart or on the freway uninteruppted. I doubt most phones could do the same or better inflight. (My plan has roaming and also allows me to call most of the country in my plan without roaming.)

I read one mainstream article that state that whereas your land cellphone must signal the closest tower, or roam, a inflight cellphone would HAVE to roam to get a signal. How many cellphones are hooked up to roam, esp pre 9/11.
(I realize today many more plans offer this service, often free with certain plans. This was not so on 9/11/2001.)

For general info on cell phones:
en.wikipedia.org...

[edit on 1-1-2005 by DontTreadOnMe]

Estragon says:

"Dewdney isn't particularly biased (in fact taking the position that anything said by the White House or Pentagon is almost certainly a lie can scarcely be called "bias", more like common sense). "

I guess that shows where your bias is, Estragon.

Not too long ago, I've used a cell phone twice on an airplane... Once making the call, once receiving the call. Both times, I was over the city, and we were approaching the airport. Once, I didn't think about it, and simply called my wife to let her know I was getting in late... The plane didn't crash, and I realized my oops quickly, but the call still went through. Another time, she called me for the same reason (the flight wasn't shown as delayed, but it was, so she was worried), again, worked fine.

Gazrok, I believe you. Really. Would your celll have been able to do the same thing three years ago, say in the middle of nowhere in Pennsylvania?

It's the government and media I doubt re: 9/11 cell phone calls.

I believe in conspiracies, but dont believe everything is one!
Ever since GWB won the election in 2000 (contrary to popular belief), Bush haters have pinned a "conspiracy" label on just about everything that has G-Dub's name on it. As time goes by, I believe these Bush haters are driving themselves mad by it, and are actually starting to believe all of the slanderous lies they have manufactured- in hopes that someday some proof that they are right will be evident. Now it has gotten to the point that everything is a conspiracy, no matter who is involved in it. It is funny that these conspiracies only have certain political views involved. BUT, I guess if it werent for minds like those, this site and others would be pretty boring! (in response to the comment that people dont believe that conspiracies exist)

As I mentioned earlier, Dewdney seems to be biased in believing that everything he heard from the government was a lie. That's hardly the hallmark of an objective viewer.

Estrogen defended Dewdney because he was "a reaf prof", and it's true; he has excellent credentials in computer science and mathematics. On the other hand, he's not an EE; and his his statistical failure-mode analysis, while nice on the surface, did not take into consideration environmental changes, which, as anyone familiar with things like the Heaviside Layer realize, have a profound influence on EM propagation.

(I suppose I could say that I, an engineering manager at The Boeing Company, have a similar level of credibility, but the fact is that neither his math PhD nor my 30 years' experience give either of us any magical street cred; you need to look at a lot of variables.)

As "Banned Member" pointed out, both my company and Airbus Industrie have carried out many tests which show that EMF from cell phones pose little or no danger to aircraft systems. My belief (although I have no proof of this) is that the manufacturers and airlines are more afraind of the product liability lawyers than of anything else -- and I can't say I blame them.

Nonetheless, most people who fly regularly will, if necessary, make calls on their cell phones, especially the digital ones. I have called my wife from 30,000 feet over Yuma, Arizona to tell her I'd be on the ground in a half-hour; it took two tries, but I did get through and made a perfectly acceptable 45-second call before the flight attendant gave me the evil eye.

This, by the way, was during my Japan project days, so it was sometime in Spring 2001. You can't very well say that my cell phone was any better than the typical ones of the time.

Understand that I didn't vote for Dubya in either 2000 or 2004 and am not a Republican; unlike Estrogon and others here, I do not have an ideological axe to grind which would probably color my views.

I do not know whether the story of the passengers attempting to take over the highjacked aircraft which crashed in Pennsylvania is true or not. If it isn't, it's a great piece of propaganda, similar to "Honest Abe" or "Father, I cannot tell a lie; it was I who chopped down the cherry tree." If it is, then hooray for our side.

What I do know is that I have made cell-phone calls from cruising altitudes, and so have many of my colleagues. You can do with that what you please.

[edit on 1-1-2005 by Off_The_Street]

As several members here have pointed out wireless phones do work quite well while traveling on a commercial aircraft. While it's wise to comply by the rules of the airline & FAA, you need not worry about any interference with aircraft systems.

Forget all your links with all the lame theories and just give yours a try next time you have a flight. I have used my phone several times (not thinking about it). I also left it on one time just to observe the signals along the way & it worked just as well if not better than in a ground vehicle - lost signal over the ocean. I have not tried the GSM one yet, but the TDMA & analog cells worked.

Conclusion - At least some wireless phones work while traveling at 500mph at a few thousand feet. Thus using the (wireless phones don't work theory) to prove nobody could have made a phone call during 911 is rubbish.



[edit on 1-1-2005 by outsider]

Negative, I call your bluff Outsider.

I am a robotics engineer, we deal with wireless communications alot. We've done our own calculations, and yes some of us have attempted to log the signal strength of various signals during flight one their way back home on the march break.

We got together afterward and correlated their findings, they said straight after their launch down the runway, all transmissions dropped to near 0, and the incoming signal dropped to about 50% fluctuating to 80% of its original values. Once in cruising altitude the signal strength fluctuated from 0% to 1%, transmissions were absolute 0. The only link that remained in tact was the sattelite signal, and a few other wavelengths from the aircrafts onboard equipment... which was troubling as it means that some of the aircraft equipment does not meet FCC regulations... but thats another story.

You, outsider, never performed that test. And if you did, then you were using a sattelite phone, or you never actually tried an uplink to the cell network.

So what was it? A sattelite phone, or you didnt actually attempt a connection?

[edit on 16-4-2006 by johnsky]

Maybe you all were just using every cheap 1980s phones johnsky


A lot of cell phones will work, particularly over populated areas and lower altitudes....
Not sure how you can dispute that as people use them all the time (though it's really not encouraged).

In the end of july, yes it is a long way away, im going florida, and im going to turn my phone on, a razr v3 from cingular, and every 20 minutes ill record the signal stregnth, I know that a few years after 911, airlines started to install cell phone antennas in the planes, so that could be a reason that people doing tests now are getting good reception. I hope the plane i go on does not have one.

I had read on another 9-11 website (I don't remember which-there are so many, but if you want to flame me on this, I'll try to find it again - it's probably bookmarked) that cell phone reception was next to impossible above 3000 ft. in the air. On the same site, it said 757's were not equipped with Airfones in their seats in 2001. In fact, I just flew a 757 from SF to Miami and noticed there were no Airfones installed. I don't know what to think.....

As far as cell phones installed on 757's,that is something the owners of the plane have put on them.I flew on plenty 757's with air phones prior to 911.All AA though,can't answer the other carriers.As far a cell phones in the air goes,I have used and seen used, prior to the FCC laws forbidding them.The reason the FCC rule exists is not because of aircraft issues.It was because you could grab too many cell towers at once,causing it to tie up tower traffic for cells.That alone should help you realize that they will work.Perhaps it is not perfect reception and calls will be droped.That would explain why some callers on their personal cell,made the same call more than once.Hope this helps.

[edit on 17-7-2006 by Duhh]

reply to post by Estragon

You should be ashamed of yourselves, you guys seem a little "nutty", but that is my opinion. I do not understand why everyone in this website thinks that the government is out to get them. My family works for the government, does that make me a bad person, am i going to cover something up. I do not beleive that people are thinking that September 11th did not happen, fake phone calls, missiles hit the pentagon? What is that, If i were you guys I would consider calling a psychiatrist!!!!!! I have a brother that is in the army that is protecting the freedoms that you have. Some countries would imprison you guys for some of the stuff in here. I am proud to live in this country, which is the worlds most powerful super power. I beleive we need not to worry about what other stupid country thinks about us, especially france, china, germany, and russia. Our country has saved so many asses, it is time for some of these countries to return the favor.