It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Is Christianity inherently discriminatory

page: 11
12
<< 8  9  10    12  13  14 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:14 AM
link   

ReturnofTheSonOfNothing
Lo, and there was much wailing on ATS and gnashing of teeth..



I have I idea. go to that link i posted then try to explain WHY the LAW you QUOTE still Aplies ok? K thanx Buh bye.




posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:16 AM
link   
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 


So, you're of the mentality that if something is fufilled that it must be continually done? That's not always the case.

For instance, if my job requires a degree, that doesn't automatically mean that I've got to stay in school the rest of my life. now, if I get the job without the degree--I might still have to go to school to finish the degree. But that would be between me and my employer, no? So, if things in the real world aren't this bound, why do we force the Bible to be?

But then, although there was a curse involved wit not following the Law, it's not like everyone who transgressed it was punished for it, ever. There's leniency in the OT, as well as smack-downs when it comes to obeying the law.

But one thing to note is that much of Romans, a good bit of Acts, Hebrews, and a whole bunch of NT books were about trying to put the breaks on the Judizers (people who wanted to bind the law to everyone who claimed Christianity). It goes on about this very subject for so long that your eyes would cross before finishing reading on it.

And anything that has that much to say on the subject is'nt likely to fall in neat lines of following/not following Law.



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:18 AM
link   

yuppa

FreeWillAnomaly

yuppa

FreeWillAnomaly
reply to post by yuppa
 


Simply false but I don't feel like debating it.


BS. you dont want to debate it because its spot on. NT christians are NOT UNDER THE OT COVENANT and as SUCH ARE NOT SUBJECT TO ITS LAWS,EXCEPT THOSE SPECIFICALLY SPOKEN BY JESUS HIMSELF FOR THEM TO FOLLOW.


Jesus is the Law fulfilled. If you follow Jesus you follow the Law anyways. You can not disregard the OT.

I'm not going to debate with you.
edit on 21-2-2014 by FreeWillAnomaly because: (no reason given)


Well you obviosly DIDNT READ MY ENTIRE POST. The OT law WAS fulfilled yes BUT that MOSAIC COVENANT was for the HEBREWS/JEWS ALONE AND ISRAEL. I tell you what Ill even give you a link where i found the information,but only if you read it and do not dismiss it.

Christians and the OT confusion


It is very ironic that you are being legalistic about wanting to disregard the Law.



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:20 AM
link   

CynicalDrivel
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 


So, you're of the mentality that if something is fufilled that it must be continually done? That's not always the case.

For instance, if my job requires a degree, that doesn't automatically mean that I've got to stay in school the rest of my life. now, if I get the job without the degree--I might still have to go to school to finish the degree. But that would be between me and my employer, no? So, if things in the real world aren't this bound, why do we force the Bible to be?


Seriously? The real world?

Stop.



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:21 AM
link   

CynicalDrivel
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 

And anything that has that much to say on the subject is'nt likely to fall in neat lines of following/not following Law.


That's because it doesn't. We are not justified by works. But still, if you follow Jesus, you follow the Law by default. You are not bound to it by way of curse, but the precepts are still of God's will.

edit on 21-2-2014 by FreeWillAnomaly because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:22 AM
link   

yuppa

ReturnofTheSonOfNothing
Lo, and there was much wailing on ATS and gnashing of teeth..



I have I idea. go to that link i posted then try to explain WHY the LAW you QUOTE still Aplies ok? K thanx Buh bye.


I'm sure that explanation makes sense to you, but whatever words you want to make up for it, it still resembles cherry picking to me.

Regardless, I'm content to sit back and watch the arguments for and against.



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:23 AM
link   
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 




Jesus replied, "And you experts in the law, woe to you, because you load people down with burdens they can hardly carry, and you yourselves will not lift one finger to help them." Like 11:46


I left this scripture as an accusation to you, of your method of deliberately confusing the words and teachings of your master. You sit in your own, self made, holy of holies, worshiping a God that hates, a God of jealousy and wrath, as you proudly look down on others. You don't follow HIS teachings, you don't know how to forgive others or even understand how important it is to your own salvation. You are walking through life with a proverbial millstone, of your own design, around your neck.



You can not be forgiven for your sins without Jesus. I was telling you what is necessary to come to Jesus.


That's not what Jesus said.



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:25 AM
link   

FreeWillAnomaly

ArtemisE
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 


God sure didn't love the phillisteans. I quite sue I slaughtered the spelling. He quite literally " told" the Israelites to commit genocide. Killed them, their children even there live stock. Or did god love them too?


The worshipers of Baal were wiped out in the OT. He told some guy (forget his name)to kill them all. He rounded them all up by pretending to have a ceremony honoring Baal and then wiped them all out. Of course, they were sacrificing their kids to demons and committing every sin imaginable.... So yeah, God hates some people. People who say "God loves everyone equally" are just fishing for donations and followers.


It's like stating "God loves even Hitler". It's kind of a yes/no thing. His love is available to all (as in, a ticket to Eternal Life), so it's not like he's ever totally withheld His love for anyone, but God clearly allows people to walk away from His offer. And when they walk so far from Him that must murder innocents, there always comes a point where He's had enough of our arrogance.

But then, we sacrifice our unborn on the alter of convenience. That's really all abortion is--child sacrifice to ourselves.



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:28 AM
link   

windword
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 




Jesus replied, "And you experts in the law, woe to you, because you load people down with burdens they can hardly carry, and you yourselves will not lift one finger to help them." Like 11:46


I left this scripture as an accusation to you, of your method of deliberately confusing the words and teachings of your master. You sit in your own, self made, holy of holies, worshiping a God that hates, a God of jealousy and wrath, as you proudly look down on others. You don't follow HIS teachings, you don't know how to forgive others or even understand how important it is to your own salvation. You are walking through life with a proverbial millstone, of your own design, around your neck.



You can not be forgiven for your sins without Jesus. I was telling you what is necessary to come to Jesus.


That's not what Jesus said.





I do not proudly look down on others. You are trying to manipulate my thought patterns through deception. There is a reason it will not work.

The first thing I did was throw away my pride. I did that when I realized it is what got us all in this mess in the first place.

Yes you have to forgive everyone who wrongs you and, something you conveniently do not mention, pray for your enemies.

Jesus said He is the only way to the Father. Considering how you talk about the Father, you don't care. I love the Father.

You don't follow Jesus and you display malice towards those who do. I wonder if He told us people like you would do that...
edit on 21-2-2014 by FreeWillAnomaly because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:29 AM
link   
reply to post by ReturnofTheSonOfNothing
 


Well different strokes for diffrent folks. I can respect that stance. You sir win a internet.



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:33 AM
link   
reply to post by yuppa
 


Very kind of you to say so, thanks.

BTW - Like your avatar. V is one of my all time favourites! Such an awesome movie.



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:34 AM
link   
reply to post by ArtemisE
 


God is a PERSON, not just words on a page. You are using faulty logic because you have no factored in this fact. You are thinking like a human and you expect God to also think like a human.



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:40 AM
link   
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 


God is not a foul, bottom feeding creature called Man.

He is love, and the creator of existence and all the righteous laws, and some ends up destroying whatever, wether it was an angry storm cloud, volcanoes, or an idiotic tribe that need motivation to destroy their opposition for territory.

I think you insulted the almighty spirit, by comparing God greatness to a feeable sinner.

I think your going to need alot of forgiving.

GET ON YOURS KNEES!



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:43 AM
link   
reply to post by Specimen
 


Remind me to stop reading your posts.



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:56 AM
link   
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 


You gotta read it. Or else your going to hell!

I HAVE TO SAVE YOUR MENTALLY ILL MIND FROM THE DEVIL!!!

PRAISE JEBUS!



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:57 AM
link   
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 





Yes you have to forgive everyone who wrongs you and, something you conveniently do not mention, pray for your enemies.


Jesus said to LOVE your enemies. But you can't, because you believe in a God that HATES his enemies. You haven't learned the part of Christianity that teaches love and forgiveness. You're too tied up with ideas of wrath, punishment and hell.

Jesus' message was one of love, forgiveness and an "easy yoke". Christianity isn't complicated and it isn't brain surgery or rocket science.



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 10:58 AM
link   
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 




reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 


Actually, that's a good part of it. I think if you'd end a search in Romans 2+3 and never go further it would sound a great deal like that. The OT law was a law of works: do this, don't do this.

Rom 2:17-29
17 But if you bear the name "Jew" and rely upon the Law and boast in God, 18 and know His will and approve the things that are essential, being instructed out of the Law, 19 and are confident that you yourself are a guide to the blind, a light to those who are in darkness, 20 a corrector of the foolish, a teacher of the immature, having in the Law the embodiment of knowledge and of the truth, 21 you, therefore, who teach another, do you not teach yourself? You who preach that one shall not steal, do you steal? 22 You who say that one should not commit adultery, do you commit adultery? You who abhor idols, do you rob temples? 23 You who boast in the Law, through your breaking the Law, do you dishonor God? 24 For "The name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you," just as it is written.
25 For indeed circumcision is of value if you practice the Law; but if you are a transgressor of the Law, your circumcision has become uncircumcision. 26 So if the uncircumcised man keeps the requirements of the Law, will not his uncircumcision be regarded as circumcision? 27 And he who is physically uncircumcised, if he keeps the Law, will he not judge you who though having the letter of the Law and circumcision are a transgressor of the Law? 28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh. 29 But he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that which is of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter; and his praise is not from men, but from God.


Rom 3:27 Where then is boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? Of works? No, but by a law of faith.


Romans 4 gives some complication to it:

Romans 4:1-14
1 What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh, has found? 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. 3 For what does the Scripture say? "Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness." 4 Now to the one who works, his wage is not credited as a favor, but as what is due. 5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness, 6 just as David also speaks of the blessing on the man to whom God credits righteousness apart from works:
7 "Blessed are those whose lawless deeds have been forgiven,
And whose sins have been covered.
8 "Blessed is the man whose sin the Lord will not take into account."
9 Is this blessing then on the circumcised, or on the uncircumcised also? For we say, "Faith was credited to abraham as righteousness." 10 How then was it credited? While he was circumcised , or uncircumcised ? Not while circumcised , but while uncircumcised ; 11 and he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while uncircumcised, so that he might be the father of all who believe without being circumcised, that righteousness might be credited to them, 12 and the father of circumcision to those who not only are of the circumcision, but who also follow in the steps of the faith of our father Abraham which he had while uncircumcised.
13 For the promise to Abraham or to his descendants that he would be heir of the world was not through the Law, but through the righteousness of faith. 14 For if those who are of the Law are heirs, faith is made void and the promise is nullified; 15 for the Law brings about wrath, but where there is no law, there also is no violation.

We're not heirs through the law at all. We don't inherit family though the law.

And the rest of the book goes on and on about things in an effort to pull them away from an OT Law: a works-based mindset.

Now, yes, there's a lot of things that I wind up keeping in the OT law. I don't see the point in murder. A lie is generally hurtful. And I would be ticked if my husband divorced me to go back to his cheating first wife (not likely, lol). But seeing merit in bits and pieces of a law (or even the whole) is NOT being either under the law, or being subject to that law, or even truly following the law through default. But it's darn close. So close.

Really, I find the biggest difference is the mindset. This thing put the whole idea of what law is on it's ear.



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 11:17 AM
link   
reply to post by FreeWillAnomaly
 


Where's the logic in torturing the souls of babies please......? Is it in the best interest of god some how?

Maybe it's in our best interest. You know. If he'll torture babies for all eternity then I better tighten up. Cause no tellin what he would do to me!! If that's the case he's a pretty jacked up spiteful dude...

I really hate the " he's god so he just gets to do it and if he does it it must be good. If there were debate refs they would throw a flag.



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 11:24 AM
link   
reply to post by CynicalDrivel
 


Like I said before, the single most important thing is your relationship with God and your secrecy with God. I don't mean lie to keep your relationship with God secret. What I mean is when you do things, do them not for yourself, or for others to see, but for God to see. When you talk to God, do that in secret too.

"But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you." biblehub.com...


God constantly warns about all of the ways that religion will be used to trick people. It is not about people, or religion, but instead is about you and your personal relationship with God. It is through faith that we are justified. He knows everything, including your thoughts and your true intentions and the intentions of those around you. He wants you to have a personal relationship with Him, and choose Him over the world - which is corrupt, dying, and in the hands of Satan. If you receive the Spirit of God, the one in you is stronger than the one in this world.



Remember, not all of the things you think come from you. If you do not will a thought into existence, it does not come from you. It could come from faulty wiring in your brain, a demon, psychological subversion, or a number of other things. All of these things will try to trick you into betraying your relationship with God. Only hold yourself accountable for the thoughts that you chose to think. God knows what you think, and he also knows why those thoughts are there. Not everything is internal, despite what the world wants you to think.

Remember to never trust humans. Only trust God. Put all of your faith in God, and put none of it in humans. When my wife asks me if I trust her, I tell her I don't trust her but I trust God and trust that God wants me to be married to her until I die, and that I do love her. I wonder if she figured out how much better that is than trusting her yet. While I trust my wife more than I trust other humans, I still would never be foolish enough to fully trust a human. That is guaranteed to bring disappointment. Anyways, I am only using this as an example because you mentioned that you are married.



posted on Feb, 21 2014 @ 11:27 AM
link   
reply to post by ArtemisE
 


You seem to be confused. I was not debating with you. That's why I am not going to respond to your extremely flawed "argument." I already addressed the issue with you.



new topics

top topics



 
12
<< 8  9  10    12  13  14 >>

log in

join