Is it really about preventing voting fraud or is it about preventing as much people as possible from

96-year-old Chattanooga resident denied voting ID
www.timesfreepress.com...

So when she learned last month at a community meeting that under a new state law she'd need a photo ID to vote next year, she talked with a volunteer about how to get to a state Driver Service Center to get her free ID. But when she got there Monday with an envelope full of documents, a clerk denied her request.

That morning, Cooper slipped a rent receipt, a copy of her lease, her voter registration card and her birth certificate into a Manila envelope. Typewritten on the birth certificate was her maiden name, Dorothy Alexander.

"But I didn't have my marriage certificate," Cooper said Tuesday afternoon, and that was the reason the clerk said she was denied a free voter ID at the Cherokee Boulevard Driver Service Center.

www.timesfreepress.com...

•Ricky Tyrone Lewis is a 58 year-old Marine Corps veteran. Despite the fact that he was able to offer Wisconsin voting officials proof of his honorable discharge from the Marines, Milwaukee County has been unable to find the record of his birth that he needs in order to obtain a voter ID card.
•Ruthelle Frank is an 84 year-old former elected official who voted in every election for the last 63 years, yet she will be unable to obtain a voter ID unless she pays a fee to obtain a birth certificate from the Wisconsin government — despite the fact that the Constitution explicitly forbids any voter from being charged a fee in order to vote. Worse, because the attending physician at her birth misspelled her name on her original birth certificate, she may need to pay hundreds of dollars in court fees to petition the state judiciary to correct her certificate before she can obtain a voter ID.
•Paul Carroll is an 86-year-old World War II veteran who has lived in the same Ohio town for four decades. Yet, when he attempted to vote in the recent Ohio primary, he was told his photo ID from the Department of Veterans Affairs was not good enough because it did not include his address.
•Dorothy Cooper is a 96-year-old African-American woman who says she has voted in every election but one since she became eligible to vote. Yet, when she attempted to obtain a voter ID, she was turned away because she did not have a copy of her marriage license. In a subsequent interview, Cooper said that she didn’t even have problems voting in Tennessee “during Jim Crow days” — only now under Voter ID.
•Thelma Mitchell is a 93-year-old woman who cleaned the Tennessee Capitol for 30 years. She never received a birth certificate, however, because she was delivered by a midwife in Alabama in 1918 and there was no record of her birth. When she attempted to obtain a voter ID, she was turned away for lack of a birth certificate by a clerk who suggested she could be an illegal immigrant.
•Virginia Lasater is a 91-year-old woman who has been active in political campaigns for 70 years. Because of her advanced age, however, she is no longer able to stand for extended periods of time. When she attempted to obtain a voter ID, she was confronted with lines that stretched for several hours and no place to sit while she waited — forcing her to abandon her effort to obtain an ID due to her physical constraints.
•Darwin Spinks is an 86 year-old World War II veteran. He was told to pay a fee before he could obtain a voter ID in Tennessee, despite the fact that charging someone to vote is unconstitutional.
•Rita Platt is a Wisconsin resident who was turned away from her attempt to obtain a voter ID because she required either a birth certificate or a passport to obtain one — both of which can only be obtained if the voter pays a fee. Worse, in Wisconsin, voters must fill out a misleading form which suggests that they cannot obtain the birth certificate they need to obtain a photo ID unless they already have a photo ID.
•Jessica Cohen is a Texas resident who lost her license and other identification papers in a burglary. She now must also pay an unconstitutional fee in order to obtain the birth certificate she needs to obtain a new voter ID. Because Cohen lives in Texas, she will likely be able to vote in 2012 because the Department of Justice blocked Texas’ law under the Voting Rights Act — although there is a high risk that the Supreme Court’s conservatives will declare the Voting Rights Act unconstitutional.

thinkprogress.org...

And these are just the folks that made a stink about it...How many people do you think are quitely getting disenfranchised? Or can't afford to take time off to go get a Voter ID card?

reply to post by Indigo5

are they eligible to vote? how do you know?

that's the funny thing. anything that you can bring number-wise is completely reliant on determining whether someone can actually vote or not, which is exactly the purpose of voter ID.

if there is corruption in the system by all means, ferret it out, but requiring someone to prove who they are and that they can vote is common sense. the alternative is very destructive.

also, we're only talking about one single issue: voter ID. many of the things in the bill are good ideas.

I think it's about time. There are very few "disenfranchised" compared to the numbers of illegal immigrant, deceased, duplicate and fictitious voters out there so bring it on!!

I would also say that if you get ANY kind of government handout or assistance you should be off the rolls until you are no longer being subsidized. (gonna get flamed for that one)

Voter ID and Term Limits combined...now that would do this country some good.

Just to add..ban the super PAC's and lobbyists. Pure corruption.

reply to post by muse7


This website is supposed to be about deconstructing disinformation. You are absolutely doing just the opposite. You are adding to the disinformation.

I.D. is required to drive, buy alcohol , cash a check, and a multiple other endeavors.

If it is a problem to you then boycott those things and don't do any of them.

If you and your fellow liberals are so concerned about voting rights and peoples voting rights being infringed upon why don't you do it the right way?

Let me make it simply enough for any moron to understand. That way you might be able to comprehend it.

They should make it free for anyone to go to their local D.M.V. and get a state I.D. Problem solved. If you can make it to the polls to vote then you should be able to make it to the D.M.V. to get an I.D.. You would still have to prove citizenship to get an I.D., But isn't that what it is all about to begin with.? Stopping voter fraud. I have no problem showing my I.D. to vote, neither should you. What I do have a problem with is a bunch of illegals determining who our next potus will be.

Originally posted by Diisenchanted

They should make it free for anyone to go to their local D.M.V. and get a state I.D. Problem solved. If you can make it to the polls to vote then you should be able to make it to the D.M.V. to get an I.D..

You must not be following the Voter ID laws and Proposals??

Sure...what you suggest would be palatable, though inconvenient.

But it also doesn't serve the end-game of Voter ID laws.

Under the facade of conservatism (reducing expenses) the requirements usually involve Citizen Expense...pay for your Photo Voter ID...and/or...offices that only issue them one day amonth during work hours...or only one or two offices in the state...

Dig a little into the proposals and see how they are implemeted...Yes...the DMV giving free Photo Voter ID cards would be convenient...but that defeats the whole agenda of inconveniencing folks.

It's just a hodge-podege of suppression.

NC just passed a law that reduced early voting from 2 weeks to 1. Plus eliminated Sundays...when Blacks typically vote after church...plus take Mecklenberg county...they had 22 early voting stations last election AND had long lines!...NC just passed a law limiting Mecklenberg county to 1 ...yes just 1 polling place...

Explain that to me?

It's ugly and the GOP are going to pay the price...just my strong opinion.

Originally posted by Bob Sholtz
reply to post by Indigo5

 

are they eligible to vote? how do you know?

How about this...we invalidate Drivers Liscenses as a valid Photo ID for voting...they are forged an exponentially higher rate than fraudulant voters!

Then we demand EVERYONE get a specific VOTER Photo ID....and EVERY DMV is obligated to issue them during any hours of operation and for free?

That way...a 98 year old lady doesn't have to go to her DMV during the hours of 12-3 on the one day a month they issue Voter IDs...and then if she is turned away after presenting her utility bills, birth certificate etc...just cuz she forgot her marriage certificate...then everyone can share the pain?

reply to post by muse7


After voting machines were instituted, anyone who actually thinks they're still a fair and honest voting process is a moron. Tptb can decide who they want to win with ease now.

reply to post by Indigo5

That way...a 98 year old lady doesn't have to go to her DMV during the hours of 12-3 on the one day a month they issue Voter IDs...and then if she is turned away after presenting her utility bills, birth certificate etc...just cuz she forgot her marriage certificate...then everyone can share the pain?

Wow.
That sounds like a trip to the Social Security office to file for benefits.....
Not a big hurdle for most seniors.

Originally posted by macman
reply to post by muse7

 

So, how do you verify that someone voting, is who they say they are and that they can legally vote then?

And not one of the loudest Progressives in this thread will even answer this question.

Makes me wonder of the outcome being sought really is just voter ID, or just to further the Progressive crap just a little bit more.

Muse7 and Indigo5, Sharpton just called. He wants his talking points back.

Again...Despite how outright unamerican the suppression is...this is no big thing to me...because the efforts to suppress minorities and the poor from voting is already backfiring.

The GOP have only won the Popular vote of a Presidential election ONCE in 24 years....and they keep thinking if they can just stomp on minorities and the poor hard enough, they can win...and yet they continue to lose.

Hell...No incumbant in the past 80 years has kept the Whitehouse with the unemployment rate Pres. Obama had...and yet the GOP lost again.

Just keep stomping on folks that aren't like you...ethnically...economically...religiously...Sexual orientation...Just keep hammering away at everyone not like the farthest right.

The GOP is on it's way to obsolescense...The Karl Rove "shock" moment last election is a spreading disease, the right-wing lives in a shrinking bubble.

The Voter ID laws are voter suppression...

A new Florida law that contributed to long voter lines and caused some to abandon voting altogether was intentionally designed by Florida GOP staff and consultants to inhibit Democratic voters, former GOP officials and current GOP consultants have told The Palm Beach Post.

Republican leaders said in proposing the law that it was meant to save money and fight voter fraud. But a former GOP chairman and former Gov. Charlie Crist, both of whom have been ousted from the party, now say that fraud concerns were advanced only as subterfuge for the law’s main purpose: GOP victory.

“The Republican Party, the strategists, the consultants, they firmly believe that early voting is bad for Republican Party candidates,” Greer told The Post. “It’s done for one reason and one reason only. … ‘We’ve got to cut down on early voting because early voting is not good for us,’ ” Greer said he was told by those staffers and consultants.

www.palmbeachpost.com...

Hey...Keep it up...See how the GOP do in 2016.

reply to post by Indigo5

The Voter ID laws are voter suppression...

Yes.
They suppress those potential voters that are either to lazy or don't care enough to do what it takes to vote.

We could argue that requiring a license to drive suppresses driving. Does it also suppress minorities and potential democratic party drivers more than the rest?
I have yet to hear anyone claim that, but the same rules are in place for both drivers licenses and voter ID cards.... except that it is easier to get a voter ID card (and free in most cases).

Originally posted by butcherguy

We could argue that requiring a license to drive suppresses driving. Does it also suppress minorities and potential democratic party drivers more than the rest?

This is a repeated and silly argument...

Do we demand that people drive? Own cars?

Is owning a car a guaranteed constitutional right?

Again...You want Voter Photo ID...Then go for it on an equal playing field. Invalidate Drivers Liscenses as a valid ID for voting...make EVERYONE get a new Voter ID...and make it free...no discrimination...when the GOP opt to only have one office that issues the IDs for every 500k people and place that office in Bumble-eff...then everyone equally suffers.

Also have open voting for two weeks prior to elections...

Problem solved? Right?...Hmmmm...see my last post...GOP Staffers, Consultants, even a effen ex-govenor and lead legislator...all admitting that the GOP strategy is to supress the vote...Voter ID laws only matter if they can supress votes of the poor and minorities.

The GOP should be figuring out how to help the poor and minorities...instead they just want them to vote less.

Have fun with that. See how the American people outside the right-wing bubble recieve it....I smell another late Tuesday night in 2016 with Karl Rove wearing a shocked expression of "how the hell did that happen" on his face.

reply to post by Indigo5


All of your proposals are just free versions of state ID. You have substituted one term, drivers license, for another, voter ID.

And it is not free, as the tax payer foots the bill.

At what point in 2013, does an adult not have either a state ID or drivers license. You can't cash a social security check without an ID, you can't deal with a bank to withdraw funds against a Govt check, and the list goes on and and.

So, in a nut shell, all you want is for people to get another "free" thing from the Govt, in some false Progressive narrative that by requiring an "ID", it makes minorities not want to vote.

Funny, as your whole ideal is based upon the way a Govt operates by buying votes. You, after all state that the most affected groups are minorities and the elderly. And it has also been pitched that these groups vote Dem in high numbers, because after all, the Rep only want to cut Medicare and Govt assistance. By any other definition, that is buying votes.


You, are about a full of crap as anyone on ATS.

Originally posted by macman
You can't cash a social security check without an ID, you can't deal with a bank to withdraw funds against a Govt check, and the list goes on and and.

Your are completely ignorant of the claims you make.

You can indeed conduct banking without a photo ID...and Social Security checks were moved to automated deposit in 2013...SO not only CAN you recieve SS without a photo ID, that is the standard practice now...and to route that deposit, all that was required was to call up and and answer several security questions, similiar to credit card companies conducting business via the internet and phone. I am an administer/power of attorney for my Aunt and handle her finances and know the process well...no photo ID needed...Photo ID is lacking in comparison to a full on security screening/validation.

A whole generation conducts banking now via the net and phone...no standing in line with a Photo ID neccessary, and if you have ever endured a full security check with a financial institution, you know that the bar is set higher than a simple DL which can and is forged often.

Originally posted by Indigo5

Your are completely ignorant of the claims you make.

Alright, lets get into then, shall we.

Originally posted by Indigo5
You can indeed conduct banking without a photo ID

Oh, so you can cash a check, open an account without photo ID??

Yeah, hold please............................................................................................................Just called a local bank, and they stated a photo ID is required, or....you can provide your SSN and other identification proving documents, but...that will take time.
So, you still need to provide ID for who you are. Money was still spent on gaining those identifying documents.

Originally posted by Indigo5
...and Social Security checks were moved to automated deposit in 2013...SO not only CAN you recieve SS without a photo ID

Yes, once you prove to the SS Admin who you are, and prove to the bank who you are as well.

Originally posted by Indigo5
, that is the standard practice now...and to route that deposit, all that was required was to call up and and answer several security questions, similiar to credit card companies conducting business via the internet and phone.

Oh, like Robo-signing and such.
You still had to establish the identification in the first place.

Originally posted by Indigo5
I am an administer/power of attorney for my Aunt and handle her finances and know the process well...no photo ID needed...Photo ID is lacking in comparison to a full on security screening/validation.

That is very nice and all, but so what.

Originally posted by Indigo5
A whole generation conducts banking now via the net and phone...no standing in line with a Photo ID neccessary, and if you have ever endured a full security check with a financial institution, you know that the bar is set higher than a simple DL which can and is forged often.

*sigh* and they still had to establish it first some how.



Thanks for addressing just a part of what I stated. Maybe next time, you can go the full thing and try to back all of your BS with something?

reply to post by Indigo5


Oh, let's not forget about being identified during a criminal investigation.

If someone is arrested, regardless if bad or good arrest, the person needs to prove who they are.
Showing LE a copy of your electric bill doesn't cut it.
Most every state has it in their laws, that if someone can't prove who they are, they can be detained until that proof is provided.

So..........The whole idea of people not having some form of Photo ID is just you parroting crap of the Progressive forums.

Originally posted by macman

Originally posted by Indigo5

Your are completely ignorant of the claims you make.

Alright, lets get into then, shall we.

Originally posted by Indigo5
You can indeed conduct banking without a photo ID

Oh, so you can cash a check, open an account without photo ID??

Yeah, hold please............................................................................................................Just called a local bank, and they stated a photo ID is required, or....you can provide your SSN and other identification proving documents, but...that will take time.
So, you still need to provide ID for who you are. Money was still spent on gaining those identifying documents.

Wow...this is getting comical...What does that sound like? Oh yah...the same requirements for obtaining a Voter registration card...

What forms of identification may be needed when I register to vote?
Two forms of identification with at least one showing your current residence address is needed when you register in-person. If you register by mail sufficient proof of identity is required by submission of your driver's license number or State identification card number. If you don't have either of those, verification by the last 4 digits of the your social security number, a copy of a current and valid photo identification, or a copy of a current utility bill, bank statement, paycheck, government check, or other government document that shows your name and address will be required. A person may also demonstrate sufficient proof of identity by submission of a photo identification issued by a college or university accompanied by either a copy of the applicant's contract or lease for a residence or any postmarked mail delivered to the applicant at his or her current residence address.

reply to post by Indigo5


And your point is what?

Yes, there is a method to be used by SOME banks for opening an account and/or cashing a check.

I called a couple of others, and they stated Photo ID is required.

In order to get a copy of your SS card, you must present a photo ID. Same goes for birth certificate.

The need for a photo ID is constant and ever growing in this world.

The only reason you rail so hard against photo ID for voting, it seems, is that is the marching orders for the Progressives this month.

In study after study it's been shown that if everyone in the USA
voted, the pendulum would swing way too the left.
So suppress voting? Absolutely. That scenario scares the poo
out of conservatives.

That's why a representitive from S.Dakota has as much clout
as a representive who speaks for millions in California.

For the people by the people?
Um...nope.

reply to post by sealing


You must be a daily reader at Salon.com and TheHuffingtonPost.com to believe that crap.