Pastor to waitress: I GIVE GOD 10% WHY SHOULD I GIVE YOU 18%?, page 18

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ATS Members have flagged this thread 18 times

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 01:08 PM by interupt42

Originally posted by destination now
reply to post by interupt42

You're not from the UK are you? As I and many others have stated their is no need to tip waiters in the UK they are paid by their employers to serve customers, tipping is optional, they are paid the same minimum wage that many other workers are paid, who don't actually get the opportunity to earn tips, so yet again an obliging shop worker or cleaner has less value than a waiter in your eyes, as they are not generally or expected to be given tips. That seems a bit unfair, what makes waiters so special compared to other minimum wage workers?

Nothing makes them special compared to other minimum wage workers, I don't see a correlation between salary and a person.

However, unlike other minimum wage workers , waiters in the US do not take the job to make minimum wage whereas most mininum wage worker agree UPFRONT to make minimum wage.

In addition the way it works in the US you are expected to make at least 15% of your sales so much so that most restaurant expect you to pay other restaurant employees like bussers and bartenders a percentage based on 15% of sales.

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 01:09 PM by SeekerofTruth101

reply to post by destination now

In the US, you will be pleasantly surprised that cleaners are very well paid and even have unions. Is it the same for UK, or illegal immigrants does those jobs on a pittance?

The issue of 'min wage' is often misleading, as many would presume all would have the same starting point, but the reality is that it differs from one occupation to another. Some would have higher min wage due to labour shortages or skills, or some would have a min wage but with fully 'legal' deductions such as lodging, foods, etc.

There are many tricks and loopholes employers can play around with, so do not be fooled look at issues on a as is basis. There are more than you may stubbornly refuse to realise. This is ATS, to deny ignorances.

In any case, no one is forcing anyone to tip, and USA DEFINATELY has no intention to export such successful egalitarian economic wealth circulation policies to other nations. It does look strange to americans, I suppose, but then, if austerity measures are a sure sign for UK's economic prowess and not the recession it is mired in now, all the best.

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 01:10 PM by MidnightSunshine

reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin

I can't believe people are sending you u2u's??...That is hilarious!! Not on your end I'm sure, but it's just so telling of how people love to jump to conclusions about people and don't even give them the benefit of the doubt before they start trashing... And why bother for that matter??

Just evidence that this issue is important and deserves it's place ATS, if anything it's a social issue for sure. I find the topic and thread very interesting, while somewhat disgusting at the same time.

Stupid is as stupid does...

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 01:23 PM by destination now

reply to post by interupt42

That's a fair point and whilst I think it's scandalous that waiting staff are only paid $2 to $3 dollars per hour, that's how it is in the US and as such customers who are aware of this should have no issue with the tipping system as it does seem to be an ingrained part of American culture in the food service industry.

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 01:27 PM by MidnightSunshine

Originally posted by Juggernog
reply to post by MeritocracyNow

First of all, she fed his arse,

She didnt feed anyone, the cook made the food and im sure the pastor fed himself.
All she did was carry his food from point A to point B, a delivery person.
I wouldnt mind being given a number and pick up my own food when the cook calls out the number, that would make these whiny ass waiters obsolete.

Dude! Where do the servers only have to carry food from point A to point B?? PLEASE tell me, I need to get a job there.

You should see the lump that throbs out of my carrying wrist after work some night, it's freaky and pain is putting it lightly. My shoulder is BALLED the * Up and I walk like an old lady when I first get up after sitting for more than 10 minutes.

In 21 years I have worked every restaurant position there is and must say that serving is the most physically demanding and also requires the most skill.

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 01:35 PM by destination now

Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101
reply to post by destination now

In the US, you will be pleasantly surprised that cleaners are very well paid and even have unions. Is it the same for UK, or illegal immigrants does those jobs on a pittance?

The issue of 'min wage' is often misleading, as many would presume all would have the same starting point, but the reality is that it differs from one occupation to another. Some would have higher min wage due to labour shortages or skills, or some would have a min wage but with fully 'legal' deductions such as lodging, foods, etc.

There are many tricks and loopholes employers can play around with, so do not be fooled look at issues on a as is basis. There are more than you may stubbornly refuse to realise. This is ATS, to deny ignorances.

In any case, no one is forcing anyone to tip, and USA DEFINATELY has no intention to export such successful egalitarian economic wealth circulation policies to other nations. It does look strange to americans, I suppose, but then, if austerity measures are a sure sign for UK's economic prowess and not the recession it is mired in now, all the best.

Nope, minimum wage is the same across the board in the UK (with the exception for employees under 21) no matter what the job is and most employers can't hire illegal immigrants due to the necessary paperwork requirements. Also we have welfare top ups in the form of housing benefit, tax credits etc so that everyone can attain a decent living wage.

And I don't think the US is really doing much better than the UK in terms of the recession, I don't think the US manufactures and exports much more (on a like for like basis) than the UK, you too get all of your goods from China, and outsource much of your employment opportunities as well, so I think that both of our countries will need to rethink our economic strategies for the longer term and you are entirely wrong in your assumption that the US is better in terms of the circular flow of income, all of our workers earn a wage and then plough that back into the economy in exactly the same way as US workers do, so absolutely no difference.

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 01:50 PM by interupt42

Originally posted by destination now
reply to post by interupt42

That's a fair point and whilst I think it's scandalous that waiting staff are only paid $2 to $3 dollars per hour, that's how it is in the US and as such customers who are aware of this should have no issue with the tipping system as it does seem to be an ingrained part of American culture in the food service industry.

Most do, its the minority that take advantage of the system, but in one shift it can make a difference depending on the amount of the bill. Like I said most places require the waiter to tip out the bussers,food runners, and bartenders on their sales for the day. One place (large well known franchise , lets just say it has the last day of the work week in its name) even wanted to try to get the waiters to tip out to the cooks as well.

In the UK the restaurant incorporates its employee salaries into the meals where in the US they incorporate a much lower percentage cost into the meal in order to cover the employee salary because its commission based.

What these cheap B@stards like to do is take advantage of both systems to their benefit. They basically want the UK version but with the lower US salary percentage cost built into the cost of the meal. So they want the business to not only provide them a service but they also want the business to not pass the cost to them.

Their is no excuse for it besides being selfish. The system can either work one way or the other , but not both. The UK way (no tipping higher meal cost) or the US way (Tipping, lower meal cost ). However, they want it the selfish way (no tipping, lower meal cost)

edit on 2-2-2013 by interupt42 because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 01:59 PM by destination now

reply to post by interupt42

Can't argue with that

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 02:49 PM by OtherSideOfTheCoin

reply to post by MidnightSunshine

Yeah I know I found it kind of funny, U2U’s are private as far as I am concerned so I wont give any details. I get quite a lot form members and I really do enjoy reading and responding to most of them but yeah, that made me laugh.

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 03:20 PM by Scuzzlebutt

Originally posted by destination now
reply to post by Scuzzlebutt

So your customers are just a burden then? God forbid they would want to know what was in their food, have a drink or (gasp) want ketchup! I think you'll find your low wage job would turn into a no wage job without those pesky customers wanting to purchase food at your place of employment.

And yes, I'm from the UK, which is obviously different in terms of minimum wage to the US and no, mostly I don't tip waiting staff anymore than I would tip a shop worker or the refuse collector as they all earn at least the minimum wage and most of the waiting staff I have encountered are totally disinterested, bang your plate down in front of you and getting a friendly smile seems to be totally out of the question. I have on occasion left some of the change from my bill, when the staff have done a good job and made me feel like a valued customer, but nothing like 18% or even 10%.

Absolutely they are a burden...when they are assholes who think that because Im "low skilled" it gives them carte blanche to act as if Im "the help." In the USA...you get what you pay for. If I am only to bring your food, then get the # up yourself and clean your table, get refills, and check google for what Arugala is.
The point is, you tip because I may brighten your day, or get your whiny kid a coloring book, or bring your ugly date a free piece of birthday cake.

Lets play devils advocate here:

Suppose tipping were outlawed and all wait staff had to get paid minimum wage. Just think of the ramifications of just that.
First, half the staff at restaurants would be fired. You would force restaurants everywhere to close because the cost of staff would be so high.
Second, would you even wanna eat at a restaurant where the server got paid whether you were happy or not? I wouldnt.
Third, if owners were forced to pay workers three times current wages to achieve minimum wage, that steak you bought last week for a twenty would be a hundred bucks, and then you'd whine about that.
Fourth, pretty soon you wont have to worry about tipping anyone in your craphole country....arent they set to ban knives soon??
Listen, I truly dgaf if you tip anyone ever, I have no skin in the game, but to classify all wait staff as "unskilled" is just asinine.

Before I go, lemme clue you into a little server secret....we make more money in a weekend then you make all week. Doesnt matter what you do for work, I easily clear $400 TAX FREE on just a Friday night. So when you claim I whine, it is the exact opposite, I love serving....even douchebags such as yourself

edit on 2-2-2013 by Scuzzlebutt because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 03:20 PM by FlyersFan

THE WAITRESS HAS NOW BEEN FIRED FROM APPLEBEES

Tha'ts right .. that 'pastor' from the 15 member congregation, called Applebees to complain about the '0' tip being talked about ... and Applebees fired the waitress. Now she's out of work, has no income, and can't go to school like she wanted to.

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 04:40 PM by Liquesence

Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin
reply to post by Liquesence

Please see pervious page.

Why should i have to see the previous page?

When i replied the thread was already 16 pages long. I only read the first page (which your comment was on and to which i replied), which is why my first sentence addressed the fact that what i was writing had likely already been addressed. I felt to need to reply to the fact that your original statement was made in ignorance.

Regardless of the economics of the industry as some mentioned on the previous page, it does not make my--or others'--point any less valid, that many tip-based workers receive far less than minimum wage when tips are not factored in.

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 04:57 PM by destination now

reply to post by Scuzzlebutt

You have such a bad attitude it's a good job tipping is mandatory in the US, because your true colours are very obvious, you hate what you do and it shows in your total disrespect for the people who pay your wages.

Before I go, lemme clue you into a little server secret....we make more money in a weekend then you make all week. Doesnt matter what you do for work, I easily clear $400 TAX FREE on just a Friday night. So when you claim I whine, it is the exact opposite, I love serving....even douchebags such as yourself

As you're very new to ATS, I should probably point out that making personal insults to other posters is against T&C's on the forum and it is not good manners to call someone a douchebag because they have a different opinion to you...even though they have pointed out, on several occasions why it is perfectly acceptable to have a different opinion, due to wide cultural differences between our respective countries.

And as for your "huge" paycheck of $400 equates to £254.88p..you clearly have no idea of the employment markets if you think that no one can match that...I used to do freelance training for propriety software solutions at a rate of £110 per hour ($172.63c) with the result that I earned more in under three hours to sit in a very comfy training suite, with comfort breaks, paid lunch etc and show employees how to use the company's information management systems...so your claim is false, as I was paid for 6 hrs per day, even though I only worked for about 4.5, for 5 days per week, equals £3,300.00 or $5178.91...

edit on 2-2-2013 by destination now because: quotes

edit on 2-2-2013 by destination now because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 05:04 PM by destination now

reply to post by FlyersFan

It was the girl who posted the customer's financial details on the internet who was sacked, not the waitress who served the pastor. And as that is a serious breach of confidentiality it's right she was sacked, okay from an American perspective, moaning about a tip does have ramifications for the waiter's pay check, but then to post the person's credit card details all over the internet is not a smart move, and was incredibly irresponsible.

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 05:13 PM by OtherSideOfTheCoin

reply to post by Liquesence

Well if you had even bothered to look at the details below my Avatar you would see I am form the UK we have very different cultural views on such things including tipping. Yes it might be 16 pages long but if you’re going to respond to me I would really appreciate it if you would bother to look at more than one of my comments.

Not everyone is American, it is actually very ironic that you say my original statement was made in ignorance when you post this rubbish about how you didn’t even bother looking at the post I suggested, you are the one being ignorant not me.

A waitress in the UK will be earning at a minimum almost $10 a hour so why should I tip, as a customer I expect them to provide me a good level of service as that is part of their job without having to pay them a extra 18% on top of my bill.

In America that might be different , fair enough, but I am giving a perspective form the UK so please don’t address me like a American.

edit on 2-2-2013 by OtherSideOfTheCoin because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 05:27 PM by interupt42

Originally posted by destination now
reply to post by FlyersFan

It was the girl who posted the customer's financial details on the internet who was sacked, not the waitress who served the pastor. And as that is a serious breach of confidentiality it's right she was sacked, okay from an American perspective, moaning about a tip does have ramifications for the waiter's pay check, but then to post the person's credit card details all over the internet is not a smart move, and was incredibly irresponsible.

I agree posting the actual credit card information was going to far. However, I think he is probably more embarrassed about his actions being revealed to his friends and family than the actual credit card information.

Another time I had an interesting moment in waiting tables was when a large group of people 10 or so had dinner.

Everyone was delighted with the service and the food and they were mostly regular customers. When it came time to pay one guy took out a wad of hundreds and paid for the bill in cash. I gave him his change and I saw him leave a hundred plus tip on the table then everyone got up and walked away expect for one guy who made a beeline to the bathroom . On the way out of the bathroom he stopped by the table and picked up the tip and put it in his pocket. Note this was a different guy than the one who paid and left the tip.

I walked out to the rest of the party in the parking lot who were still talking and waiting for the one guest. I went up to the guy who paid and asked him "Sir, was everything alright with my service, is their anything I can improve upon"? He had a puzzled look in his face and he said "What do you mean, everything was great and that is why i left you such a good tip" . I said " Sorry sir, but their wasn't a tip on the table and I wanted to make sure there wasn't something I could improve upon for next time" Immediately , one of the other guest came forward and said Johny (don't remember real name) did you take that money. Johny came forward like he did a prank, but everyone knew he wasn't joking and it was no prank. He was basically stealing from the guy who paid and he made him give back the money in front of everyone and made him apologize.

Unfortunately there are a lot of undercover @ssholes in this world that don't like being exposed.

edit on 2-2-2013 by interupt42 because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 05:42 PM by Grimpachi

People keep talking about how the pastor’s credit card information was posted however after many searches on the internet I have yet to find a picture of the receipt that shows the credit card number.

Most receipts show the number like this xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-7654 only showing the last 4 digits in fact that is law in many states. BTW a number would be useless without the exp date and number on the back.

Let’s stick with verifiable facts here. OK.

Edit to add

I don’t see why people are complaining that a simple 18% tip is too much if you are from the UK. The system in the UK is different this is about NJ and the article isn’t trying to change your system in the UK it should be a non-issue from that standpoint.

What I find interesting is how the pastor expects forgiveness yet she sure wasn’t thinking that way when she got the girl fired. She is the worst kind of hypocrite in my book.

edit on 2-2-2013 by Grimpachi because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 05:48 PM by aspiechick

I actually say good for the pastor - although I'm not impressed by the "I pay God 10%" (really? Bank transfer? or maybe God prefers cheques?)...

I think the problem is the restaurant... they should just up the price of the food 18%, if that's the money they want/need to pay their staff a decent wage.

Tipping to me is a privilige, both for me and those that receive the tip. If I tip, that means I feel I've had a waiter/waitress that's gone out of their way to make my stay and meal enjoyable, and it's a pleasure to be able to both tell the waiter/waitress about it, and to let them know with money. If the meal itself is a real enjoyment, I always ask if tips are shared with the kitchen too.

I don't like the idea of being forced to tip! Why would I tip just to have someone serve me a meal? That's what they get paid for (although in a lot of cases from what I've heard here, they only get paid peanuts!). I will pay for the extra service they provided... what they aren't forced to do, but that they go out of they way of doing (in the hope of getting a good tip... and it works with me).

Many years ago I worked for minimum wage. The job was good, the pay was the minimum what my employer by law could give me (so not much appreciating from the company - bastards), it was enough to pay the bills, and the reason why I took the job... it was my first job in a place where I got tips, and it was a wonderful surprise to get it! Depending on who was using the fascilities of the building (most men great tippers, most drunken women great tippers, middle age rich people terrible tippers), I generally made about double a day in tips compared to my actual wages. I did however always greet everyone with a smile, a thank you, a "have fun!", and liked to compliment people on either their outfits or their hairdos.

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 05:50 PM by BigBrotherDarkness

So this pastor wants to cheap skate out on a bill...by saying he gives 10% to god eh? So lets get this straight, the people of his church probably think they are giving 100% in the tithe plates to god. When actually only 10% of it is going to the church and then 90% is going into the pastors pocket. Maybe someone needs to write on a tithe slip: Here's 10% of what I normally give that actually goes to god; since the other 90% would just go to a greedy cheapskate.

reply posted on 2-2-2013 @ 05:58 PM by OtherSideOfTheCoin

reply to post by Grimpachi

I don’t see why people are complaining that a simple 18% tip is too much if you are from the UK.

Probably because included in the cost of the service we are already paying for we pay a 20% VAT tax that goes to the government, then you want to add another 18% on to that price we are looking at paying a extra 38% on top of our bill. Furthermore the waitress is actually getting a fair wage for the service she is providing anyway about $10 a hour