Overlooked evidence in School shooting

reply to post by 5K3P7IC41


Yeah their story changes as info comes in....is that not what happens with nearly every breaking news story ever? whether its a shooting or a natural disaster or anything else? They use terms like.."Police speculate", or "we have reports of..." It seems many of the users in this thread take everything they hear as fact and then try their damnedest to turn it into a lie, when it's actually just information. Some information is good, some information is bad, but until you get it all you can't know which is which, having said that I think I'll go do something that I don't think I've done yet.....read some articles on the shooting. ALL the info I have is from ATS giving me a unique perspective, but even with all my info coming from a conspiracy theory website I still have a tough time seeing this a conspiracy......

Originally posted by Asktheanimals
There is something so blatantly obvious about the massacre that has not been questioned until now. The coroner who autopsied the bodies said that every victim was shot between 3 and 11 times each. Regardless of the weapon supposedly used would it make any sense that someone would use that many bullets per person? Lanza would have had to pull the trigger once for each and every shot fired according to the OS.

So let's say the average shots per victim is 7 bullets.with 25 victims at the school. That's 175 shots. My point being that the Bushmaster .223 used in the murders was probably fully automatic. That would account for the exceptional number of wounds sustained by each of the victims and doesn't include misses which for the sake of argument we'll say he missed once for every 3 shots fired. That's another 47 bullets + 175 gives us 222 (by contrast the Clackamas mall shooter used 50 rounds)

We're talking at least 7 - 30 round clips and he supposedly had hundreds more rounds on him.
It really makes much more sense that it was an automatic weapon used, it accounts for the excessive number of wounds per victim (his mother was shot 3 times in the face - a likely result of automatic fire).
I have my doubts that anyone shooting semi-automatic could have killed so many people in such a short time. I also have my doubts about the supposed shooter's ability with firearms which makes the OS that much more difficult to accept.

The pattern of bullet holes in the school will tell the real story, so I have my doubts such evidence will ever be released to the public. We probably won't ever see any video footage of the shooter as Adam Lanza's slight build would be apparent even while wearing a tac vest. Maybe I'm way off the mark here but I am very familiar with firearms and these events simply do not make sense as presented.

edit on 18-12-2012 by Asktheanimals because: corrections

He said all of the victims at the school, including 20 first-graders and six adults, were shot with a Bushmaster AR-15 assault rifle and that "numerous" magazines were emptied at the scene.

Source - www.newsday.com...

edit on 18-12-2012 by Asktheanimals because: added link

Accurate sustained rapid fire from a semi automatic at any appreciable distance would be difficult but not impossible. Firing rapidly into a group of people at comparatively close range in a confined space, especially where the bullets have a high chance of passing through the body without expanding and hitting someone else in the group? Certainly not impossible, improbable or even that difficult.

For comparison, when we do speed snaps competitions at the range - AR15 with a .22RF conversion in semi-auto (can't have semi auto with centrefire here, only .22) - I can repeatedly put 27 aimed shots on a standard target at 25 metres in under 15 seconds and still come last in the competition (because I'm not very good, not because the others are superhumans or special forces studs or anything). I know several competent (not superhuman, not ex-mil, not Delta-SEAL-CIA operators, just "competent") shooters who could do that much faster even with centrefire.

With only a little practice, a magazine change will take seconds - and will be quicker if you are not trying to retain the magazine, which sounds like the case here if they were found discarded. I think 8 magazines is a traditional "combat" loadout. If he was carrying any kind of bag it would be possible to carry that much - weight is more the limit than space I would think here.

I just checked out a few "bumpfiring" videos on youtube - you can routinely find people dumping a standard capacity AR15 mag in around 3-5 seconds using a semi-auto.

I find it rather staggering to claim that three shots to the face of a sleeping person must mean full auto. It seems much more likely that he just pulled the trigger a few times. It only takes seconds, but after the first shot he could have taken all the time in the world.

I'm not saying that it wasn't an assisted job or that the kid wasn't a patsy (I don't particularly believe it though) but I would certainly disagree with the statement that it is unlikely or difficult for the kid to have been solely responsible for the amount of injuries.

reply to post by starviego


wrong. some people are just psychotic, this kid certainly was, in fact he was on medication to control it. One could simply argue that his motive was extreme anger and apathy towards mankind. Yep there are people out there who hate everyone and want them all to die, don't freakout, they're few and far between.

Is what I'm saying somehow less likely than......what? the Mossad did it? puhleeeeze.

Excuse any typing mistakes in this post, my eyes rolled out of my head before I could hit the reply button.

Originally posted by liquidsmoke206
reply to post by starviego

 

wrong. some people are just psychotic, this kid certainly was, in fact he was on medication to control it. One could simply argue that his motive was extreme anger and apathy towards mankind. Yep there are people out there who hate everyone and want them all to die, don't freakout, they're few and far between.

Is what I'm saying somehow less likely than......what? the Mossad did it? puhleeeeze.

Excuse any typing mistakes in this post, my eyes rolled out of my head before I could hit the reply button.

Its nice to read a little sanity on here these days. Thank you.

Originally posted by liquidsmoke206
reply to post by 5K3P7IC41

 

Yeah their story changes as info comes in....is that not what happens with nearly every breaking news story ever? whether its a shooting or a natural disaster or anything else? They use terms like.."Police speculate", or "we have reports of..." It seems many of the users in this thread take everything they hear as fact and then try their damnedest to turn it into a lie, when it's actually just information. Some information is good, some information is bad, but until you get it all you can't know which is which, having said that I think I'll go do something that I don't think I've done yet.....read some articles on the shooting. ALL the info I have is from ATS giving me a unique perspective, but even with all my info coming from a conspiracy theory website I still have a tough time seeing this a conspiracy......

Yeah, but these are pros. They apparently get paid to speculate and spread rumors like we do on these forums. They also didn't seem to have these problems with the Oregon mall shooting. I don't know if you can chalk that up to law enforcement in Oregon being more professional, but the information they gave the public that day was considerably more consistent and accurate.

Originally posted by Asktheanimals
reply to post by zonetripper2065

 

You don't believe Adam Lanza was any kind of marksman, do you?
I realize people can shoot very fast semi auto but not young, inexperienced shooters.

Apparently, he had several first person shooting games and played them often. The US military uses these and it's been shown from other massacres that these typs of games can make people better shots, especially head shots. I'd say he had more target training than most from his playing these games. They of course, do not take into fact, someone shooting back at you and the psychological impact that has on a shooter but these defenseless children were not shooting back.

reply to post by 5K3P7IC41


Yes, they get paid to speculate on info as it comes in...YOU call the info "rumors" and then spread as you see fit on this site.

Whether or not info comes in faster or more accurately is dependent on a list of factors that is only limited by imagination. Face it, I own everything single person in this thread.

I should probably get out of here, the level of ignorance that I'm combating is gonna end up getting me banned......AGAIN.

I'll go work on my new avatar......just like my current one, but updated.....

I don't understand all the speculation about this guy in the woods that the police initially detained but haven't followed up on.

He must not be involved (derp), or we would have heard further. One tell in my mind is if he was involved he would have been long gone, not hiding nearby. How stupid would that be? Commit the crime of the century and then hide outback...

Originally posted by Asktheanimals
Are we all in a rush to hurry and convict Adam Lanza without any evidence?

Exactly. Where is all this evidence?


--How many witnesses can identify the shooter as Adam Lanza?

--Did anybody see him drive up to the school parking lot and walk to the door?

--Were his fingerprints found on the weapons?

--Was gunshot residue found on his hands and clothing?

--Can all the weapons be traced back to the home Lanza lived in?

--Can all the slugs/expended shell casings be traced back to the weapons found at the scene?


If they had this evidence, I think they would have made it public by now. But they haven't, so I doubt it exists.

Originally posted by burntheships
reply to post by SisyphusRide

 

Cant seem to find a mention of it in the media at all.
Nothing.

not surprising at all, I remember hearing it as I am sure others have.

I was living 1 mile away from the Pentagon during 9/11, on the news they begun to talk about possible biological agents and there were first responders dressed out in white bio suits. Needless to say they cut that off nearly as fast as they broadcast it.

reply to post by liquidsmoke206

ALL the info I have is from ATS giving me a unique perspective, but even with all my info coming from a conspiracy theory website I still have a tough time seeing this a conspiracy.....

Except the media calling for more gun control ?

Originally posted by starviego

Originally posted by Asktheanimals
Are we all in a rush to hurry and convict Adam Lanza without any evidence?

Exactly. Where is all this evidence?


--How many witnesses can identify the shooter as Adam Lanza?

--Did anybody see him drive up to the school parking lot and walk to the door?

--Were his fingerprints found on the weapons?

--Was gunshot residue found on his hands and clothing?

--Can all the weapons be traced back to the home Lanza lived in?

--Can all the slugs/expended shell casings be traced back to the weapons found at the scene?


If they had this evidence, I think they would have made it public by now. But they haven't, so I doubt it exists.

How on earth do you know they don't have this ??? Because you haven't seen it on the box in front of you? There are a plethora of reasons why they haven't released that info. None of which have anything to do with a conspiracy.

Originally posted by starviego

Originally posted by SMOKINGGUN2012
A few thoughts......and updates......
Just reported on FOXNEWS......a 25 year old former Marine says the kid was mad that his mom cared more about the kids at school she volunteered for than him and that he saw that court papers that she was preparing to have him committed.......How does your kool aid taste folks??? We now have motive.......

And where did he get his information? He 'heard' it. Not exactly the best of sources.

the mother never had any affiliation with the school... she never taught there nor was she an assistant there. The only apparent connection with the school is he attended it when he was of elementary age.

reply to post by liquidsmoke206

What's with the gun and hoodie avatar, is that supposed to be "cool"?

reply to post by bknapple32


no pun intended buy ya'all are jumping the gun... give it time. What the poster mentions is proper forensic evidence which will happen.

but without the video footage I myself will always have suspicions about everything... though we're approaching a time where that can be manipulated too. (HD video anyway)

the last report I heard there was an officer speaking to the news caster and he said they found evidence on smashed computers which may shed light on the connection/motive.

the officer also (which surprised the heck out of me) said right now don't believe everything you may hear about the incident.

Originally posted by bknapple32
There are a plethora of reasons why they haven't released that info. None of which have anything to do with a conspiracy.

Like what?

Originally posted by starviego

Originally posted by bknapple32
There are a plethora of reasons why they haven't released that info. None of which have anything to do with a conspiracy.

Like what?

Well for one, they arent done yet? Forensic reports can take some time. Its not CSI where they get all the conclusive evidence in a day

Originally posted by DeeKlassified
Interesting post OP, I'm not a gun person so would never have thought of it the way you have.

The fact the shooter had a mask on is also suspicious, why go to the trouble of wearing a mask if you're going to kill yourself? James Holmes also wore a mask?!

This part I see as like wearing sun glasses ...."The fact the shooter had a mask on is also suspicious, why go to the trouble of wearing a mask"...
Just as people can't look others straight in the eye, perhaps he used this mask in much the way people hide behind sunglasses... Just a thought, or else your question in it's entirety stands...

If the op had ever fired a fully automatic weapon he would know that in fact you can't shoot someone in the face 3x with one unless the barrel was in there mouth or something.

It takes alot of skill to effectively use a machine gun against multiple targets which is why they are used for suppression purposes only by the military.

I've shot them in the past and even standing there in the a non stress environment with the best possible grip I couldn't approach the accuracy that you are talking about.