Supreme Court strikes down key parts of Arizona immigration law

reply to post by FlyersFan

I fully agree. Bring 'em home and put them where they belong ... protecting the USA on the border.

The problem is not the border. Most illegals come because of jobs. Solution--mandate all employers use a system like everify and counter proof the SS cards. There also has to be a better system for half the illegals who overstay their visa.

As for all these benefits people accuse illegals of taking advantage of where there is a solution to that as well. Quit electing people who put it into law. Illegals are only entitled to what politicians give them.

Do this and you take care of most of the illegal entries. The only thing you basically have left at the border is your typical drug smuggler who is trying to fulfill the needs of all the addicts we have in this country. There wouldn't be a need to check the ID of every brown person someone thinks is illegal.

Justice Scalia Rages Against Obama On Immigration

In his aggressive defense of Arizona’s immigration law, Justice Antonin Scalia pointedly went after President Obama’s recent immigration policy shift and accused him of deliberately refusing to enforce immigration statutes.

Justice Scalia wrote a 22-page barnstorming dissent against the court’s 5-3 decision Monday which found major provisions of S.B. 1070 violate the Constitution. The conservative jurist accepted the premise that the federal government has supremacy on immigration, but declared that the Arizona law is “in complete compliance” with federal statutes.

In his point-by-point defense of the Arizona legislation, the avowed law-and-order conservative surmised that the Obama administration “desperately wants to avoid upsetting foreign powers.” He accused federal officials of “willful blindness or deliberate inattention” to the presence of illegal immigrants in Arizona.

“[T]o say, as the Court does, that Arizona contradicts federal law by enforcing applications of the Immigration Act that the President declines to enforce boggles the mind,” Scalia wrote. “If securing its territory in this fashion is not within the power of Arizona, we should cease referring to it as a sovereign State.”

Omama is deliberately refusing to enforce immigration statutes.

tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com...

Even a child can understand, those who do not support Arizona rights to secure her boarders are either willfully ignorant, or traitors.

Please vote this traitor out of office

.Obama administration “desperately wants to avoid upsetting foreign powers.”

The justice is wrong here way to trusting, still hard for him to understand that Obama is trying to destroy America he is in bed with the enemy.

Originally posted by SunnyDee

Originally posted by SunnyDee

So tell us where you stand on illiegal immigration, Outcast? Where is the line drawn for you? Do you think our country should just have open borders, but still offer the same social programs to all the mostly poor that come here?

Please tell us where you stand. We know you tow the liberal party line, but aee you capable of taking a stand for legal american citizens for their protections or do they hold less imnprtance to you than illegal immigrants? Do you respect other countries immigration laws that are much stricter than ours?

Thought I'd ask one last Third time.

If you don't answer, I will assume it is not in your real interest to to be part of a solution to immigration issues.

I posed around the same question about the ability to protect the citizens of Arizona and I was also conveniently ignored as well.

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

Well ... the federal government isn't doing a good job. So the state has to take over and take care of itself.

That is your opinion...not a fact.
The States do not control the United States border...sorry...they don't.

It's a fact that the federal government isn't doing a good job. The fact that there are 20 million illegals in this country proves it. And Arizona takes the brunt of the cost of illegals (along with California). OF COURSE they are going to try to stop the illegals from coming in. It's self preservation.

Bad laws coupled with an inept federal government (both republican and democrat) through the years has cost this country hundreds and hundreds of billions of dollars. Time for the people to rise up and take control of their own security since the feds obviously can't handle it. The good citizens of Arizona have taken the first empowerment steps. Kudos to them.

reply to post by TheTardis

So now you admit they have limited resources? So why fight a state that is trying to help bridge that gap? You would think they would welcome the help.

They do work with States.

What this decision is about is a State creating their own laws about immigration...that is not a State issue and the SCOTUS agrees.

The provision that was left standing allows police officers to attempt to determine legal status...they can only do that through ICE though and it doesn't give them any authority to do anything about it.

A State can help the illegal immigration problem by passing laws and coming down hard on employers that hire illegal immigrants. If no one is hiring them...no illegals will come to that state. But Arizona doens't want to do that...they just want to demonize the illegals and make them the target.

So..why won't Arizona focus on what they can legally do about immigration and go after the employers???

Originally posted by Kali74
reply to post by macman

 

One thing you can do is stop supporting laws that endanger the liberty of anyone, if you can't do it for someone who doesn't share your nationality, than do it for those who do... the ones that would be at risk for being stopped, questioned, arrested under any old reason a cop wants. You want the number of illegals in the US to drop? Tell your local, state and your reps in Washington to crack down on those hiring illegals. Take away the carrot on a stick. Don't ever give anyone with authority the chance to abuse it.

You have said this a few times and I dont think anyone here would argue with the fact that the companies hiring them are just as bad. But that does not change the fact that having a readily available work force that will work for nothing isnt helping either. You have to get rid of both. And as a Citizen of the USA, I will gladly carry around paperwork proving I am a citizen and show it every time I get pulled over. I am proud to be from the USA. They are welcome to look up my citizenship status if it means everyone else they pull over gets the same. I have nothing to hide.

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher
reply to post by TheTardis

 

love how you twist things around. My point in that statement since you missed it was that its not that they are not enforcing any laws at all. It is that they are not doing enough to help Arizona and they are selectively enforcing those laws and I dont think Arizona's law was first.

Let's review your earlier comments and see how much I'm twisting things around.

states should be able to do whatever they deem necessary to keep out illegals if the federal government is going to sit back and do nothing and that is what is going on here.

"do nothing at all"...hmmm...that doesn't sound like you are saying they aren't doing enough...it really sounds like you are saying they are doing nothing...because that is exactly what you said.

What else have you said.

Their claim is that the federal government is not enforcing it.
...
The federal government just said that Arizona cannot enforce the law that the federal government refuses to enforce themselves.

Yeah...it still kind of sounds like you are saying they aren't enforcing it...not that they are not doing enough.


I'm sorry you spoke without knowing the facts and that I called you on it...that isn't me spinning things...this is you trying to back track out of an ignorant statment you made.

Dude, really? Are going to have to play word scramble today, again? I didnt say they were doing nothing at "All". I said they were sitting back and doing nothing and in a lot of cases they are by your own admission about prioritizing. You said that right? You said its the presidents job? Correct? Word man. And yes in many cases they are not doing anything. I never once said they were NEVER enforcing ANY immigration laws. So please, stop putting words in my mouth and try actually answering some of the questions people have asked you instead of making things up and putting words in peoples mouths to try and make your president look good.

reply to post by macman

Um, actually yes, yes it does.
I was able to successfully turn over 3 people during a process like that to ICE in AZ. They went from my booking area, to the County, where ICE was responding and they took them.

Yes..they go to ICE...do you know if ICE deported them???

That is up to ICE...they may deport them...they may not...depending on the information available and their investigation.

What you suggested was that they were deported on the spot.

Self admission of a crime still trumps alot.

And if they admit it to ICE, then ICE can use that.

If they admit it to a local cop...that is worth nothing to ICE.

Your sorry doesn't even come close.
When on tape and admitted to other LEO and ICE, it does.

Oh...now they are on tape...you see...you didn't say that before and I'm not psychic.

And yes...if they admit it to ICE, that is different than admitting it to a local cop.

You are kind of proving my point...local cops have no authority...it all has to go through ICE.

reply to post by SunnyDee

Thought I'd ask one last Third time.

If you don't answer, I will assume it is not in your real interest to to be part of a solution to immigration issues.

This thread is not about my personal opinions of immigration...it is about the SCOTUS decision...I'd prefer not to have it go off-topic into a general immigration debate.

If you want my personal opinion...I state it many times in this thread and would love to discuss it with you in that thread.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
Justice Scalia Rages Against Obama On Immigration

In his aggressive defense of Arizona’s immigration law, Justice Antonin Scalia pointedly went after President Obama’s recent immigration policy shift and accused him of deliberately refusing to enforce immigration statutes.

Justice Scalia wrote a 22-page barnstorming dissent against the court’s 5-3 decision Monday which found major provisions of S.B. 1070 violate the Constitution. The conservative jurist accepted the premise that the federal government has supremacy on immigration, but declared that the Arizona law is “in complete compliance” with federal statutes.

In his point-by-point defense of the Arizona legislation, the avowed law-and-order conservative surmised that the Obama administration “desperately wants to avoid upsetting foreign powers.” He accused federal officials of “willful blindness or deliberate inattention” to the presence of illegal immigrants in Arizona.

“[T]o say, as the Court does, that Arizona contradicts federal law by enforcing applications of the Immigration Act that the President declines to enforce boggles the mind,” Scalia wrote. “If securing its territory in this fashion is not within the power of Arizona, we should cease referring to it as a sovereign State.”

Omama is deliberately refusing to enforce immigration statutes.

tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com...

Even a child can understand, those who do not support Arizona rights to secure her boarders are either willfully ignorant, or traitors.

Please vote this traitor out of office

.Obama administration “desperately wants to avoid upsetting foreign powers.”

The justice is wrong here way to trusting, still hard for him to understand that Obama is trying to destroy America he is in bed with the enemy.

edit on 123030p://bMonday2012 by Stormdancer777 because: (no reason given)

Can I give you 50 Stars for that? Outkast? Go ahead and read his post carefully. You may need to read it a few times to figure out how to spin that and then put some words into his mouth.

Originally posted by GD21D

Originally posted by SunnyDee

Originally posted by SunnyDee

So tell us where you stand on illiegal immigration, Outcast? Where is the line drawn for you? Do you think our country should just have open borders, but still offer the same social programs to all the mostly poor that come here?

Please tell us where you stand. We know you tow the liberal party line, but aee you capable of taking a stand for legal american citizens for their protections or do they hold less imnprtance to you than illegal immigrants? Do you respect other countries immigration laws that are much stricter than ours?

Thought I'd ask one last Third time.

If you don't answer, I will assume it is not in your real interest to to be part of a solution to immigration issues.

I posed around the same question about the ability to protect the citizens of Arizona and I was also conveniently ignored as well.

Real solutions don't benefit lawyers.

Thanks for the epiphany Macman!

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher
reply to post by TheTardis

 

So now you admit they have limited resources? So why fight a state that is trying to help bridge that gap? You would think they would welcome the help.

They do work with States.

What this decision is about is a State creating their own laws about immigration...that is not a State issue and the SCOTUS agrees.

The provision that was left standing allows police officers to attempt to determine legal status...they can only do that through ICE though and it doesn't give them any authority to do anything about it.

A State can help the illegal immigration problem by passing laws and coming down hard on employers that hire illegal immigrants. If no one is hiring them...no illegals will come to that state. But Arizona doens't want to do that...they just want to demonize the illegals and make them the target.

So..why won't Arizona focus on what they can legally do about immigration and go after the employers???

First from my understanding Arizona didn't just make up laws, they chose to make themselves able to enforce the federal laws that were already on the books. I could be wrong, I dont listed to talk radio remember? And Secondly, What makes you think they dont have laws to attack business owners as well. Oklahoma does. Maybe you are Demonizing the great state of Arizona and Small business owners that are trying to make it through a recession by hiring cheap labor that is readily available. Demonizing Domonizing.. Your using that word again.> I know.> I know.. its better than calling us Racists again.

reply to post by TheTardis


Well the thing about that is, we have labor laws...enforce them. Why should only the illegals pay for violating the law? If you were starving and oppressed would you not do whatever you could to survive? Desperate people do desperate things such as risking their lives to cross a national border, or live under threat of being discovered every day. I know some employers do get caught and some pay fines, fewer go to jail. They won't come if they know that it's impossible to earn even the most meager of livings.

Just as an update...I just watched Jan Brewer give a news conference.

She is trying to claim that the SCOTUS has vindicated her law....exactly what planet is she living on???

The only part the SCOTUS upheld was the part that has already been in practice by most police departments across the nation.

She is delusional and trying to continue to play the Republican dis-info game...let's call a striking defeat into a victory by saying we were vindicated.

She can say it all she wants...but this was a huge defeat for her.

reply to post by jam321


It's amazing to me that the only people that are actively supporting laws that come down hard on the employers are the people that are sympathetic of the "illegals" plight.

The people who are very militantly against "illegals" just want a which hunt...they don't see to care to actually take care of the issue...which starts with American citizens employing "illegals".

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher
Just as an update...I just watched Jan Brewer give a news conference.

She is trying to claim that the SCOTUS has vindicated her law....exactly what planet is she living on???

The only part the SCOTUS upheld was the part that has already been in practice by most police departments across the nation.

She is delusional and trying to continue to play the Republican dis-info game...let's call a striking defeat into a victory by saying we were vindicated.

She can say it all she wants...but this was a huge defeat for her.

What are you talking about? The way I am reading it they are allowing a police officer during a routine traffic stop (detain) to inquire about the persons status in this country. I am not going to go searching around for your posts but this is the part that you thought was so bad wasnt it? That they might use to profile people?

The court also said the part of the law it upheld — requiring officers to check the immigration status of those they detain and reasonably believe to be illegal immigrants — could be subject to additional legal challenges once it is implemented.

www.washingtonpost.... com/politics/supreme-court-rules-on-arizona-immigration-law/2012/06/25/gJQA0Nrm1V_story.html

Thats a start.

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher

Originally posted by macman
reply to post by OutKast Searcher

 

Yeah, that's nice.


Again. What did 0bama just push last week?

Are you afraid to answer the question? Or just buying time to spin the answer?

I believe I answered it over and over.

He set enforcement priority...which is exactly his job.

Are you ready to drop your ego and admit that you were wrong in saying that the Federal Government is not enforcing the laws??? You haven't been able to provide one single law that the Federal Government isn't enforcing.

SO, the enforcement of some laws will not happen.

Thanks.
So, laws will not be enforced. Whether it be due to 0bama law, budget or man power.

reply to post by Stormdancer777

Justice Scalia Rages Against Obama On Immigration

Justice Scalia has no say in enforcement policy...seperation of powers and all that.

I see Scalia's remarks as out of line and him abusing his position.

Omama is deliberately refusing to enforce immigration statutes.

Obama is setting enforcement priorities, that is his job...he is supposed to do that.

Even a child can understand, those who do not support Arizona rights to secure her boarders are either willfully ignorant, or traitors.

Arizona doesn't have borders to protect...the United States does.

And nothing in this law had to do with the border at all...it had to do with over-stepping enforcement boundries.

Now if Arizona wants to build a fence, or a wall, or a moat...or whatever WITHIN their own boarders (not on the US/Mexico border...because that isn't theirs)...then they are free to do so.

Please vote this traitor out of office

.Obama administration “desperately wants to avoid upsetting foreign powers.”

The justice is wrong here way to trusting, still hard for him to understand that Obama is trying to destroy America he is in bed with the enemy.

Oh...stop being a drama queen...no one is a traitor.

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher
reply to post by jam321

 

It's amazing to me that the only people that are actively supporting laws that come down hard on the employers are the people that are sympathetic of the "illegals" plight.

The people who are very militantly against "illegals" just want a which hunt...they don't see to care to actually take care of the issue...which starts with American citizens employing "illegals".

Where do you get that bull crap? Stop trying to make yourself and others like you the marter. EVERY LAST ONE of us that are for strict immigration have said we also support them going after the employer. Both are at fault though, not just the employer. You can stop lying now. Seriously.

reply to post by GD21D

I posed around the same question about the ability to protect the citizens of Arizona and I was also conveniently ignored as well.

Arizona doesn't have it's own citizens...they have residents.

No one is preventing them from "protecting" it's residents...they just can't pretend to be federal agents and try to enforce Federal law.