The hidden history leading up to WWII

Originally posted by redoubt
I would like to bestow the Joseph Goebbels Golden B-S Award on this thread.

Congratulations... you may pick your brown shirts up at the exit.

Of course anyone who disagrees with the official story of WWII is obviously a Nazi Antisemite. No need to bring any facts to the table, just name calling is enough to make people stop searching for the truth. Well played.

Originally posted by mayabong

Originally posted by redoubt
I would like to bestow the Joseph Goebbels Golden B-S Award on this thread.

Congratulations... you may pick your brown shirts up at the exit.

Of course anyone who disagrees with the official story of WWII is obviously a Nazi Antisemite. No need to bring any facts to the table, just name calling is enough to make people stop searching for the truth. Well played.

I don't give a flying rat's ass what you believe. But... if you don't mind, I will point it out when you track that B-S all over the carpet.

Have a nice day

Originally posted by ManFromEurope
As far as my grandparents were willing to unveil their motives of that time (they were teens in 1933), there was this huge movement of rising patriotism, fed by legends like this.

It didn't matter if they believed those stories at first, as even rational thinkers were overwhelmed by the sheer emotion of coming from a time of intense depression to a time when Hitler started to give the people jobs by building autobahnen and other massive public projects.

These people were depressed, by poverty and media. The government was weak and bound by several internal and external anchors, giving them only small amounts of free powers. Then came someone like Hitler, shouting loud, being a very charismatic speaker to the masses. He had the opportunity to have a walk-over the existing boundaries of the previous government by calling them manacles and obstacles against the fulfillment of the peoples wantings.

Those were words falling on a primed field. The people were anxious to follow a man promising them new wonders (aka jobs and more self-respect than a beaten war-loser had in that time). At first they didn't care about his book or some parts of his speaks (like jews being the source of all evil befallen on Germany at that time, and so on), taking more of the optimistic and patriotic gist.

Later, it was too late. They took the bad with the worse, were patriotic and increasingly hostile against Jews. This led to the well-known start of the Third Reich, as far as I was told by my ancestors.

I had a grandfather who was in the Waffen-SS, today I'm quite sad that I didn't use the opportunity to ask him about his views on that time - on the other hand, we cleared out his house after his death and let me say it this way: most of the found books and manuscripts were far too ugly to keep or even dispose of them by selling to "collectors". We threw them away and even I, a live-long enthusiastic reader of all kinds of books, didn't want to keep a single one of them. They were the ugliest, racist crap you can imagine (no pornography, sry

).

There were those people in Germany at that time, too.

^This^
I was going to tell it like my grandmother told me but it's almost exactly like this so I'll just quote it. I remember when German friends would visit they would always end up in conversation about how that history was taught here. They always brought up that although Hitler was a [snip] nobody ever talked about what the German people saw until the genocide was brought to light. It's easy to see how good people bought into madness until it was to late to stop.

Originally posted by ltinycdancerg
I haven't read much of HItler's writings/memoirs...
but to those who have,
do y'all think Hitler intentionally set out to incite another world war?

No it was the drugs. I am 100% certain of this. Meth makes people do some crazy stuff. I think he politically invaded Poland to free the German population in western Poland from persecution. Then he got a new doctor that started giving him amphetamines and from that point he lost his mind. I think the drugs combined with PSTD from WW1 was what really caused the nasty parts of WW2

Thanks for all the great info and back and forth in this thread. This is just what I am looking for, alternating perspectives and their debates. I do live in america now, and notice there is a good deal of fear and resentment about the unequal representation that AIPAC and zionism has over our politics and media, and many here seem to feel that we are engaged in many hostilities due to Israeli interests rather than american, and was wondering if the situation then may have seemed similar.

Regardless of what the situation was then, however, I do have contact with ex pat jews from time to time, and it seems that the truism remains, "beware lest ye become that which ye hate", as I have several times heard from people i knew that seemed otherwise rational, that "the arabs and palestinians must be eradicated like cockroaches. They are like dogs, and must be overwhelmed with terror, that is the only way to deal with them", this I heard yesterday from a jewish patient of mine, when we were talking and I stated that many of the people being tortured in abu ghraib are civilians, some women and children. After which he called me a nazi.

Point being, it seems to me that israel has suffered such calamities that now the regime has come to resemble the object of their fear, using fear and instigation in order to expand their borders, and willingly subjecting the citizens living in that area to gulag like situations. I know there are several interpretations, but this is how it seems to me, though i know that the majority of jews also criticize their own regime much more so than happens here. Also, I have known many palestinians as well, and I have yet to hear them randomly throw such bile and slander onto jews in general. Seems similar to me to how most often american vietnam war vets are filled with hate and disgust towards their vietnamese counterparts, and yet I have never met any vietnamese who were filled with racism or blind hatred towards us....not saying they are not there, just that it seems to be more the exception, as opposed to the rule.

reply to post by pexx421


ive got a good book for you to read its by captain archibald m ramsey its THE NAMELESS WAR 1951 so its free to download . member of parliment locked up for 4.5 years with no charge ever . re took his seat the day after being freed from jail dudes a hero happy reading

have a read of the TUTANKEAMUN CONSPIRICY by gerrald o farell when you finish it you will understand why the first world war started .why rothchilds are hated .wars are distractions to loot ancient tech & artifacts .plus get rid of some stupid cattle ( goimshe yup ) . the world at war series bbc black & white nicola tesla is the last mans face i wonder why . growing up surrounded by old soldiers -polish -russian scottish my history teacher was one of 9000 ex natzis given NEW IDENTIIES BY BRITIAN . WATTEN NEAR WICK IN SCOTLAND WAS A RE ENUCATION CENTRE FOR NATZIS . A LOT STAYED

reply to post by pexx421


Don't know if you have a twitter account but there's a professor from England tweeting daily news in real time leading up to ww2 it's pretty interesting and an insight to the time period.

@realtimeWWII

Originally posted by ltinycdancerg
I haven't read much of HItler's writings/memoirs...
but to those who have,
do y'all think Hitler intentionally set out to incite another world war?

I have not read much of Hitler's writings. I have a few times out of interest looked at threads on neo-Nazi websites and was intrigued to read some of his speeches which seemed more moderate than I was led to believe... having said that, when any politician sets out to make a public speech the first aim is always to appear reasonable and moderate and garner support so I would not put much stock in such speeches either.

What I am aware is that Hitler was originally closely tied with First World War General Erich Ludendorff who advocated Germany should be in a state of total war. Ludendorff became disaffected with Hitler and senior Nazi circles for their racketeering involvement in Fritz Tausend's scheme to manufacture Gold from Lead (something he actually could do) and Company 164. The Nazis ran Company 164 and sold more bonds than they could actually honour with Gold. Later Hitler tried to reconcile with the former general, but Ludendorff dismissed them as a bunch of crooked gangsters.

The Nazis found something far more serious through business contacts which Goering developed with big business interests. First of these was steel magnate Fritz Thyssen, who then widened the circle of business supporters to other German corporates and bankers who began to view him as the only person who could impose mob control. Germany was wracked from 1919 by riots and strikes, even armed attempts at coup d'etat by communists. Hitler used the Brown shirts to impose rough justice beating up protesters. Thyssen used the brown shirts to put down the unions in his coal mines and steel mills.

Then Hitler was introduced to several US corporates like Ford, Rockerfeller and General Electric who wanted a piece of the commercial action in Germany. At that time USA was shut out of trade with British and french colonies so Germany and Russia were seen as the most promising trade partners.

Rockerfeller especially felt embittered. In 1920 the Bolsheviks seized his Caucus oil fields and nationalised them without paying compensation. Likewise the Jewish Rothschild banking family had embarked upon developing oil exports from the middle east destroying the oil export monopoly of his former Standard Oil empire.

Rockerfeller probably wanted rid of the Jews in Europe far more than Hitler even and was willing to bankroll Hitler to do so. Later, I personally believe it was Rockefeller who pushed Hitler into war with soviet Russia to settle old scores and get his oil fields back. I would wager a bet there was a secret agreement between Rockerfeller and Hitler to reinstate Rockerfeller in return for his support of the Nazi party. If so, then really Nelson Rockerfeller perhaps ought to have faced trial and hanging at Nuremberg.

Instead like so many US corporates who backed the Nazis even after USA was at War with Germany, they got slaps with wet bus tickets and went on to be praised as role models for capitalism.

:?)

reply to post by pexx421


The history of the rise of Hitler is quite simple. Take a people angry about their condition of living. Promise them a better life, and fill their head with patriotism for their culture and country above all others.....Then add an enemy that the people could rally against, and oppress (therefore bringing their own standard of living higher, by oppressing and stealing from a minority).

Originally posted by pexx421
Oh, another question. From what I understand, and I may be off here as well, Jewish groups started clamoring for a jewish war against germany well before german oppression of the jews... What was the motive here? Why were these groups so strongly against the german nation? Was germany at that time (I believe it was right as Hitler took power....maybe same time he was TIME's man of the year) much more oppressive of its jews than any of the other european nations?

I understand your thirst for knowledge

One thing that perhaps you aren't aware of, is that jewish persecution was a fact 'way' before nazi germany - And by 'way' I mean, you can go back as far as the first century BCE to find instances of jewish persecution - Further on in history the jews weren't permitted to enter into certain occupations, they weren't permitted to be farmers or own land, they were forced into the money sector, lending, and tayloring etc because of the limitations placed on them - These restrictions were all over Europe and later it went as far as the British colonies ie; Australia in the early years of settlement - and the US.

With the restrictions and the occupations left to them, they learned how to make money - We can't blame them for being big money makers, that was forced on them - and then oooh! they are making too much money!! Do you get what I'm trying to say? They were a people being terrorised in such an insidious fashion, they were hated and kept out of many areas of society - So if they wanted at some point to defend themselves - well gee -
wasn't 'everyone' trying to defend themselves, the germans included. And I think, anyone, who's done some history reading has to admit, the Germans didn't like losing the 'great war' WW1 - So the facist nazis slowly and with their propaganda worked their way up to government, using Hitler as they did (read Mein Kampf- Hitler wasn't anti jew to begin with), he was a good speaker. They used the fact that the jews had money still even when everybody else didn't, as strong propoganda against them and the people fell for it - This is why 'nationalism' per say is dangerous - Ok supporting your country in sports, being patriotic that way is fine, but when you start thinking your country is better than any other, then you have big problems - In the case of the US, they believe all the hollywood hype - Jets flying in to save the day from all kinds of disasters; aliens, asteroids, russians, muslims, etc - In reality that hasn't really happened (I'm not belittling their ww1 involvements when individual american men and women went to fight as pilots, soldiers and nurses - nor am I playing down what was done by them in ww2 - pretty much at the end of the war in Europe, and with the Japanese involvement, and when the rest of us had been doing it for years and lost so many numbers of people - their work in China with the Japanese occupation there, and the pacific of course, is well documented ) but if anyone can comment on any real 'save the day' like the movies portray, please do - I'm open to new info -

reply to post by pexx421


Where have you been reading up on this stuff, Stormfront?

reply to post by pexx421


Germany was in the forefront of many developments and perhaps by the end of
the 1930s there was an effort to capture these many patents that the US kept
as spoils of war eventually. So the strict security and outward hostilities given
whatever reasons were lied about. Sure rockets and jets were looming right behind
their most advanced planes and devices that were not kept up to date in real time
while America made better same technology advances in their wasted time.
So I'd say leading up to WWII the German technological developments had to
be stopped or acquired by people other than those who invested. Like the internet
bubble with many investors that lost out because there were others that brought in
more controlling factors and took over sinking many stocks. So of those we hear
invested in Germany were most likely losers by the bigger players.

Originally posted by TeslaandLyne
reply to post by pexx421

 

Germany was in the forefront of many developments and perhaps by the end of
the 1930s there was an effort to capture these many patents that the US kept
as spoils of war eventually. So the strict security and outward hostilities given
whatever reasons were lied about. Sure rockets and jets were looming right behind
their most advanced planes and devices that were not kept up to date in real time
while America made better same technology advances in their wasted time.
So I'd say leading up to WWII the German technological developments had to
be stopped or acquired by people other than those who invested. Like the internet
bubble with many investors that lost out because there were others that brought in
more controlling factors and took over sinking many stocks. So of those we hear
invested in Germany were most likely losers by the bigger players.

So............................by your logic, since the West wanted German technology and know-how, they somehow convinced the Germans to embark upon a campaign of world domination in order for the Allies to be justified in attacking them?

Odd. I thought the West appeased the Germans time and time again as they took Danzig, annexed Czechoslovakia and Austria and then invaded Poland? But your saying that had nothing to do with WW2 right? And the USA, who you say wanted their technology didnt join the war until the Japanese attacked at Pearl Harbor. So the Japanese were in on this too? Maybe the US and Japan made a deal to have Pearl Harbor attacked so the USA would have justification to join the war?

Here's a "German view" of WW2, basically a transcript from a German documentary Hitlers Krieg? Was Guido Knopp verschweigt. It is an interesting and thought provoking read and I suggest it to anyone interested in the subject.

This is the true sequence of action of WW2. It´s the transcript for a 1,5h documentary which is by now only available in german ("Hitlers Krieg? Was Guido Knopp verschweigt") and which has reached a huge audience by now. One might say, it´s a kind of block buster for it tells the german perspective of WW2 for the first time in a professional manner. It is based on Gerd Schulze Rhonhof´s Book "Der Krieg der viele Väter hatte" ("The war that had many fathers"). Rhonhof- beeing a former high ranked german military person w´did what a good historian should do: He went to the archives and by help of historians wrote that book- which could not be refuted so far. As this is just the transcript meant to be narrated in the film, I tried to spice the reading up with some images.

Adolf Hitler:

"...insults over months a nationstate, and threatens it, to beat it up, to fight battles in berlin, to chop germany´s armies, to displace the frontier to the Oder-river or the Elbe- river, and so on and so forth. And this nationstate- germany- patiently watches these on-goings. Solely the english and french warmongers needed this war but not peace. "We need a long war" as Mr. Chamberlain put it, "at least 3 years long". because of my peace offer I have been abused, personally insulted- in front of the world public Mr. Chamberlain literally spat into my face and refuses to even talk about peace. I hear but one cry from London: That now even more this war has to continue, that they continue this war, even if it meant england to perish. It´s not my ambition to be at war, but to create a new social nation state of highest culture, EVERY YEAR OF THIS WAR LOOTS ME OF THAT WORK.

www.twcenter.net...

Originally posted by Shred

Adolf Hitler:

"...insults over months a nationstate, and threatens it, to beat it up, to fight battles in berlin, to chop germany´s armies, to displace the frontier to the Oder-river or the Elbe- river, and so on and so forth. And this nationstate- germany- patiently watches these on-goings. Solely the english and french warmongers needed this war but not peace. "We need a long war" as Mr. Chamberlain put it, "at least 3 years long". because of my peace offer I have been abused, personally insulted- in front of the world public Mr. Chamberlain literally spat into my face and refuses to even talk about peace. I hear but one cry from London: That now even more this war has to continue, that they continue this war, even if it meant england to perish. It´s not my ambition to be at war, but to create a new social nation state of highest culture, EVERY YEAR OF THIS WAR LOOTS ME OF THAT WORK.

Chamberlin spat in Hitlers face and demanded war? How very droll.

Chamberlin was the patsy who stood by as Hitler annexed and threatened his way across Europe. Thank god Churchill was in charge when Poland was attacked, or we could have all been goose-stepping around right now. Well, those of us who are caucasian. The rest of you would be dead.

Originally posted by nightbringr

Originally posted by Shred

Adolf Hitler:

"...insults over months a nationstate, and threatens it, to beat it up, to fight battles in berlin, to chop germany´s armies, to displace the frontier to the Oder-river or the Elbe- river, and so on and so forth. And this nationstate- germany- patiently watches these on-goings. Solely the english and french warmongers needed this war but not peace. "We need a long war" as Mr. Chamberlain put it, "at least 3 years long". because of my peace offer I have been abused, personally insulted- in front of the world public Mr. Chamberlain literally spat into my face and refuses to even talk about peace. I hear but one cry from London: That now even more this war has to continue, that they continue this war, even if it meant england to perish. It´s not my ambition to be at war, but to create a new social nation state of highest culture, EVERY YEAR OF THIS WAR LOOTS ME OF THAT WORK.

Chamberlin spat in Hitlers face and demanded war? How very droll.

Chamberlin was the patsy who stood by as Hitler annexed and threatened his way across Europe. Thank god Churchill was in charge when Poland was attacked, or we could have all been goose-stepping around right now. Well, those of us who are caucasian. The rest of you would be dead.

edit on 7-3-2012 by nightbringr because: (no reason given)

Chamberlain was still the PM when the war started.

World War I was a family spat that got out of hand, the German Kaiser, King of England, and Russian Czar were all cousins.

The allied surrounding of Germany with fortifications and troops was in direct response to German troop and armament buildup, not the other way around. Since the early 1930's, German was an agressor in the region, taking back the Alsace region and annexing Austria and parts of what was once called Czechoslovakia.

If Germany was forced at all, it would have been by the terms of the treaty that ended World War One, not by allied movements prior to World War 2.

England and USA had no imperialistic interest in Europe during the years between World War 1 and World War 2, even Russia behaved itself during this time frame. The only agressor in Europe at the time was Germany.

Now Japan is another thing entirely. The USA claims that Pearl Harbor attack was "completely unprovoked" which is a massive lie. At the time, US Navy had been blockading imports to the Japanese mainland for some time. History conveniently forgets to mention this in all descriptions of the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor. The USA also KNEW that the Japanese fleet were on their way and let the attack happen in order to sway public opinion towards joining the war in Europe. Prior to Pearl Harbor, US public sentiment was firmly against joining the war effort.

reply to post by Shred


Ahhhhh, right you are! Regardless, up until the invasion of Poland, Chamberlin did nothing but appease Hitler. He famously declared "peace in our time" after meeting the Germans. The next day they retook the Sudetenland.

Originally posted by Shred

Originally posted by nightbringr

Originally posted by Shred

Adolf Hitler:

"...insults over months a nationstate, and threatens it, to beat it up, to fight battles in berlin, to chop germany´s armies, to displace the frontier to the Oder-river or the Elbe- river, and so on and so forth. And this nationstate- germany- patiently watches these on-goings. Solely the english and french warmongers needed this war but not peace. "We need a long war" as Mr. Chamberlain put it, "at least 3 years long". because of my peace offer I have been abused, personally insulted- in front of the world public Mr. Chamberlain literally spat into my face and refuses to even talk about peace. I hear but one cry from London: That now even more this war has to continue, that they continue this war, even if it meant england to perish. It´s not my ambition to be at war, but to create a new social nation state of highest culture, EVERY YEAR OF THIS WAR LOOTS ME OF THAT WORK.

Chamberlin spat in Hitlers face and demanded war? How very droll.

Chamberlin was the patsy who stood by as Hitler annexed and threatened his way across Europe. Thank god Churchill was in charge when Poland was attacked, or we could have all been goose-stepping around right now. Well, those of us who are caucasian. The rest of you would be dead.

edit on 7-3-2012 by nightbringr because: (no reason given)

Chamberlain was still the PM when the war started.

Yes, which is what the person writing the response said "Chamberlin was the patsy who stood by as Hitler annexed and threatened his way across Europe"

Churchill took over shortly after the war started. Churchill had actually been a DISASTER in previous roles in Government, but made some crucial decisions early on (such as destroying the French fleet when it looked like they would be captured by the German Navy) that cemented his leadership style for the rest of the war.