IRAN - Final Verdict for Christian Pastor - DEATH

reply to post by charles1952


We have no real media in the US. It is all owned by the same people, and they don't like other versions of things besides their take on it. People have ruined careers trying to report the news in an un bias way. The US has almost NO real journalists, just talking heads who get their prompters filled with garbage and fact sheets given to them by the people the news is about.

Just saying, how often is the news actually trying to find both sides of a story.

This law covers those who renounce their faith INSIDE or OUTSIDE Iran?

(Note: This article is dated February 2008)

The proposed Iranian law would enshrine the mandatory death penalty into the country's civil code for men.

Women apostates would be imprisoned.

Two types of apostasy are set down in the legislation: parental and innate.

Innate apostates are those whose parents were Muslim, declared themselves as Muslim as an adult and then leave the faith.

Parental apostates are those whose parents were non-Muslims, who had become Muslims as adults, and then left the faith.

Article 225-7 states the “Punishment for an innate apostate is death,” while Article 225-8 allows a parental apostate three days to recant their apostasy.

If they continue in their unbelief, “the death penalty would be carried out.” Article 112 would give the law an extraterritorial jurisdiction, extending its mandate to cover those who renounce Islam both inside and outside Iran.

The law criminalizes heresy saying that anyone who claims to be a Prophet, or a Muslim who creates a sect based on that which is contrary to the obligations and necessities of Islam, is considered an apostate.

www.religiouswatch.com...

reply to post by strato

Wrong. Atheism is the default state. Believing in nonsense is the result of being brainwashed by the parents as a kid. If believing in ultimate authority is hardwired why does society try so hard to make us believe it?

Your argument is flawed by default since Atheism is something made up by adult humans.

Remember that 'faith' is not the belief in an ultimate authority...the ultimate authority(books etc) is what people make up trying to explain 'faith'.

Just a question in semantics. Is "deflection" as applied to threads the idea of changing the subject from the original one to one that the poster would rather talk about because it makes them better off?

I suppose it would be relevant to compare the number of apostasy trials in the US to the number of those in Iran. Or perhaps trials for religious crimes in the US compared to those in Iran.

Any takers?

reply to post by charles1952




Why discuss X when Y is in such bad shape [Which we hear about Y all day everyday 24/7]
The obvious answer is not to discuss X I suppose, unless of course X are perceived as being victimized.

I hope that clears it up

Am I the only one thinking that this "apostate" issue that was passed into law in 2008 is just a way to make sure that the current regime doesn't get overthrown again?

But execution of apostates is not new in Islamic history, in fact it was born with Islam itself. Islam means surrender and when someone chooses or forced to surrender to Islam then he/she loses everything and there is no way back out.

Amil Imani put together a great collection of verses from Quran and Hadithes about punishment for apostates: Apostasy is defined both in the Quran as well as the Sharia and its punishment is clearly stipulated:

“Those who blasphemed and back away from the ways of Allah and die as blasphemers, Allah shall not forgive them.” [Qur'an 4:48] Islamic law does not allow the freedom to choose one's religion: “Let there be no compulsion in the religion: Clearly the Right Path (i.e. Islam) is distinct from the crooked path.” [Qur'an 2:256] The Quran also specifically addresses the issue of murtad milli: “But those who reject faith after they accepted it, and then go on adding to their defiance of faith, never will their repentance be accepted; for they are those who have (of set purpose) gone astray.” [Qur'an 3:90]

The Hadith further restates the provision of the Quran regarding punishment of the apostate: “Kill whoever changes his religion.” __Sahih al-Bukhari 9:84:57 “The blood of a Muslim who confesses that none has the right to be worshiped but Allah and that I am His Apostle, cannot be shed except in three cases: In Qisas for murder, a married person who commits illegal sexual intercourse and the one who reverts from Islam (apostate) and leaves the Muslims.”__ Sahih al-Bukhari 9:83:17

www.iranianatheist.com...

Ayatollah Khomeini in his speeches frequently used to threat apostates or people who ridicule mullahs with death penalty. He talked about apostates quite often. i. e. "Whoever insults Prophet, whoever insults sacred Imams, there is an obligation for Muslims to kill him"

"If anyone ridicules a mullah, he ridicules Islam. If he does it intentionally (he is sane, not crazy) then he is an innate apostate. His wife is forbidden to him. His possessions must also be given to heirs. He should be killed."

One of the defining traits of a cult is "Not being able to leave"

A death sentence for leaving Islam is an insult to freedom of religion.

But, if you say anything about Islam, even if it's true, then you're an Islamophobe.


Ironic

reply to post by Deetermined


My thoughts exactly. I think the whole issue is that Pastor Youcef Nadarkhani was leaning towards the democratic movement that swept through Iran. His congregation was probably affiliated with the movement and so to send a message to them, they targeted him.

In 2009, he got attention when the authorities learned he challenged the law which insists that all schools should teach Islam. He was later arrested.

This seems to be the going message in the Iranian democratic movement. To separate church and state.

He is probably loyal to the cause.

They are targeting him because he supports the message of tolerance and democracy in his country. The regime uses any law they can to set an example. It is a shame they can't just listen to what the people want.

Originally posted by Blaine91555
reply to post by Mister_Bit

 

You do understand that the Theocracy in Iran is a Dictatorship and the President is a figurehead correct? The citizens are prisoners to that Theocracy. It's not the people of Iran doing this.

They are not free. To turn a blind eye to evil is the same as being part of it. In Iran what they believe is forced on them under threat of death as this so clearly illustrates.

Speaking out against evil acts is not wrong. Trying to divert the argument by pretending it's about something else is very dishonest and revealing. A People living under a Theocratic Dictatorship have no choice.

Theocracy ..bla bla bla ...you are not so loud about this today news

NATO strike wounds nine schoolgirls in Afghanistan

english.al-akhbar.com...

He was arrested in October 2009 and a year later was sentenced to death for apostasy on a charge which has doubtful legality in the Iranian civil legal system, but which is underpinned by sharia law.

Pastor Nardarkhani pleaded not guilty, partially on the grounds that from puberty he was never a practising Muslim and thus had not renounced his faith.

But he has denied that Muhammad was the prophet of God.

news.sky.com...

so by Iran's own legal system they can't execute him. They turn to religious law to get rid of him.

Originally posted by Blaine91555
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

What is even sadder is how the apologists here will simply remain silent.

All the worlds leaders, including Obama, should go on record condemning this action.

There is no gray area in this action. It makes it crystal clear what a world under that system would be like.

The fact this is so in our face public and not hidden from the world tells me, this is a message to the world.

Obama won't go on record defending Christianity because according to his administration Christians are Domestic Terrorists.

What gets me is why would this guy not move his family out of the country if he knew there was a very real possibility he would be killed for converting?

Doesn't make any sense to me. You can't be a champion for a cause, if you're dead.

just so we understand why there is a power strugle in Iran for democracy, here is this...

SUPREME LEADER
The role of Supreme Leader in the constitution is based on the ideas of Ayatollah Khomeini, who positioned the leader at the top of Iran's political power structure.

The Supreme Leader, currently Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, appoints the head of the judiciary, six of the members of the powerful Guardian Council, the commanders of all the armed forces, Friday prayer leaders and the head of radio and TV. He also confirms the president's election. The Leader is chosen by the clerics who make up the Assembly of Experts.

Periodic tension between the office of the Leader and the office of the president has often been the source of political instability. It increased during former president reformist Mohammad Khatami's term in office - a reflection of the deeper tensions between religious rule and the democratic aspirations of many Iranians.

news.bbc.co.uk...

PRESIDENT
The president is elected for four years and can serve no more than two consecutive terms. The constitution describes him as the second-highest ranking official in the country. He is head of the executive branch of power and is responsible for ensuring the constitution is implemented.

Mr Ahmadinejad replaced reformist Mohammad Khatami who was elected president in May 1997 with nearly 70% of the vote. He failed to get key reforms through the Guardian Council and was hampered further after conservatives won back a majority in parliament in elections in 2004.

so you now see that the problem is not Iran's religion or its legal code, it is those that are in power trying to maintain their hold over the people. The crime this man committed was the same one that has landed all the freedom fighters in jail in Iran. They challenge Iran's unelected religious officials. They challenge the rule of the most powerful.

The movement for democracy is not for or against any one religion. Islam is used to maintain power in an unelected body the people have no choice in. He could have been a Buddhist or even a regular Muslim. He challenged the authority of Islam being mandated in schools, and in doing so he challenged the power base for the next supreme leader and all those unelected officials.

Originally posted by FlyersFan
reply to post by Agent_USA_Supporter

 

that didn't take long. ...

...FACT - The guy is getting killed by the Iranian government for simply being a Christian.

Maybe the Iranians haven't heard the Good Word yet.
Maybe we should send as many Christian ministries as we can until they get the news!

reply to post by casenately


Good work, Casenately!

What do you think the chances are that it will ever change?

For those watching the situation in Syria drag on for a year, I wonder if the reformists have it in them enough to want to try and change it.

Here's the latest on the election front.

"Iran: Election Race Cuts Across Political Camps"

The group around the president is aiming for a large parliamentary faction that would help preserve the president’s vision in the coming period. They also hope to field a presidential candidate next year to follow in Ahmadinejad’s footsteps. Informed Iranian sources say that at least two issues about the presidential elections have been decided. First, after Ahmadinejad, no one from the school of thought to which he belongs will reach this post, which would also exclude Khamenei advisor Ali Akbar Velayati. Second, those candidates who lost to Ahmadinejad in the two previous election cycles are unlikely to win the presidency. This would therefore exclude Tehran’s mayor Mohammad Baqir Qalibaf and head of parliament Ali Larijani, who ran in 2005.

The current electoral map consists of three large lists that belong to the fundamentalists. The reform movement, for its part, is almost absent as it is divided between those calling for participation in the elections through regional lists and others who want to boycott the electoral process so as not to grant it popular legitimacy. According to informed Iranian sources, the fragmentation of the conservative camp is “due to the emergence of clear divisions between Ahmadinejad’s supporters and the group known as the ‘fundamentalists,’ who helped him become president.” The sources adds that these “divisions are a result of two things. The first is the president’s failure to immediately comply with the supreme leader’s request to dismiss his deputy Mashaei. And the second is Ahmadinejad’s refusal to attend Cabinet meetings for ten days in protest of Khamanei’s rejection of the president’s dismissal of the minister of intelligence, Heydar Moslehi.”

english.al-akhbar.com...

It looks like the reformists may be too split to do any good.

reply to post by FlyersFan


And the US unjustly jails someone selling a bag of weed.

Same diff. This whole planet is screwed. We can not comment on any other country when our own are nowhere near perfect.

reply to post by casenately


Same reason there are Iranian Revolutionary guard terrorist cells in the Us and other parts of the West Iran is not without sin here or anywhere else in the Middle East.

The same reasons Iran is preparing for war and gathering intel.

All the Bs condemning what the Us and Isreal does and yet Iran has done and continues to do the sames things and kill a guy for not calling God Allah.

Anyone who defends Islamofascist actions such as the op well has my contempt.

Am i the only one who's going to ask this question?

Where's the proof this is actually happening in Iran. Are there any sources from Iran saying anything about this man? All sources lead to the same article.

When did you guys start mindlessly following mainstream media? Oh wait, that's where all of your sources #ing come from. HELLO, ITS A GAME.

The journalist who reports this is Lisa Daftari. Lisa Daftari is an award-winning journalist with expertise in the Middle East, specifically in counter-terrorism, Iran and the Iranian American community. Her stories have appeared on CBS, NBC, PBS, the Washington Post, Voice of America, and Front Page Magazine. Presently, she appears as a guest commentator on the Fox News Channel. Lisa has her own column in Front Page Magazine where she serves as the publication's Iran analyst. Lisa holds a masters degree in broadcast journalism from the University of Southern California where she received a Presidential Merit Scholarship and completed her undergraduate degree in Middle East studies, Spanish and vocal performance at Rutgers University. From her own website www.LisaDaftari.com

Who's interests is she really serving? All of her articles on fox news are:

Lisa Daftari Archive

Get updates from Lisa Daftari

www.foxnews.com...

Iran court convicts Christian pastor convert to death

Published February 22, 2012

A trial court in Iran has issued its final verdict, ordering a Christian pastor to be put to death for leaving Islam and converting to Christianity, according to sources close to the pastor and his legal team.
Signs show sanctions are taking toll on Iran

Published February 14, 2012

Reports of the Islamic Republic ofIran’s resorting to bartering for essential imports in order to bypass economic restrictions show signs that sanctions have been effective in economically pressuring and isolating Iran

Published January 11, 2012

New cyber regulations announced by Iran last week, including requiring Internet cafes to install surveillance cameras, could be just a precursor to the Islamic Republic’s “halal” network, many observers are saying.
Bomb Iran or Let Them Get the Bomb -- There May Be a Third Way

Published November 22, 2011

Mistakes of the past with Iran still have one final chance to be reversed. The IAEA report should be considered a last warning before the world becomes witness to nuclear armed Ayatollahs, and by default, a nuclear Hezbollah and Hamas as well.
Iranian Authorities Pressuring Jailed Christian Pastor to Convert to Islam, Sources Say

Published November 04, 2011

It isn't clear whether this signals the ayatollah's willingness to give the Christian pastor another chance, or rather a trap to document his alleged blasphemy against Islam and justify his punishment.
Four Reasons Why the Iran Terror Plot Makes Perfect Sense

Published October 17, 2011

If you look at the Islamic regime in Iran, and the mullah's agenda and history with terrorism, the alleged terror plot against the Saudi ambassador and the plan to blow up two embassies in Washington, the plan makes perfect sense.
Locked Up Abroad: What Americans Need to Know

Published October 10, 2011

Flight? Check. Hotel? Check. Passport? Check. Review of destination country's legal code? Most of us usually forget that one.
Iran Keeps Lights on to Keep Tempers Cool

Published August 09, 2011

As summer temperatures in Iran reach 100 degrees, many Iranians are not paying for their electric bills. But that hasn’t stopped the hard-liner regime from pulling the plug on its people.
Students Preparing to Take on Authorities by Staging Another Water Fight

All anti-iran. Do a little of your own research and see these 'reports' are shallow with very little to no proof this is happening.

To be expected from a nation hi-jacked by Arab extremist. Arabs only comprise of 2 percent of the population there. The Persians love America and Israel. Its the Arabs that are always causing problems for them.

Anyone who thinks Iran is a democratic country is way off their rocker. Look what the Arabs did to the protesters who rose up against Amidinanut when he rigged the last election for himself.

Persians should rise up and toss these nut bags out of their great country. Send them to Pakistan to fight with the Taliban in body bags.

This kangaroo court over there is disgusting and no human deserves to die for wanting to practice Christianity or any other religion.

reply to post by FlyersFan


Nothing like a religion that says "we will murder you if you don't believe what we tell you to believe". Yeah there's a whole lot of truth in that. That inspires nothing but the opposite and reveals their true identity. It also reveals what they fear the most. The Truth.

I feel for this man.

You're not allowed to criticise when an apostate is executed
You're not allowed to criticise when a Homosexual is hung
You're not allowed to criticise when a rape victim is stoned to death
And you defentialy cannot criticise when a women is stoned to death for falling in love with another man.

If you do you're an Islamophobic Nazified Zionistic Racist.

To the sick people defending this disgusting evil practise WHAT THE F*** IS WRONG WITH YOU ?

Hitchens Nails it right


ETA RIP HITCHENS We really need another you right now