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The Santa Myth: Should we perpetuate the lie to children?

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posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 04:41 PM
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I remember sneaking out of my bedroom late one christmas eve when I was about 5 to see if santa had come.

there were presents around the tree !

he came !!!!

I have no idea how I discovered the lie, or how I felt

I'll always remember the magic

thanks mom and dad !




posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 04:42 PM
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By all means tell your own kids and ruin the bit of fun for them but dont be so cold hearted and dead inside to force others to do the same.
I remember many years ago waiting for "santa" to come and it was great fun, no harm was caused to anyone.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 04:49 PM
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reply to post by Jenna
 


So, if my 3-year old asks me where babies come from and I answer, "They grow inside a mommy's body and then when they're ready, they come out." I have just lied to my child, according to you.

What is the lie? What lie did I tell?



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 04:49 PM
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Originally posted by gimme_some_truth
What harm does it do? None. Who can sit here and honestly say they were harmed by believing in Santa?

Kids have great imagination. It is fun and helps to teach the spirit and goodness of giving.

Let them believe.


what harm does it do? As a story-- none. Presented as fact by the most influential people in a child's life --- It twists and portrays a false reality to children.

Your right kids do have a great imagination and don't need to be told a lie to feed their imaginations.

And if your objective is to teach about the goodness of giving, create a tradition of helping the less fortunate around the holidays, or tell them if they don't share all year they won't get any presents, not " be good and you'll receive whatever you wish for." Santa teaches rewards for obedience not the spirit of giving.

With that said, i have nothing against santa. It is a great tradition and a fun story, but thats all it should be, A STORY.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 04:51 PM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 


You didn't read my post. What I said was to that particular question, your answer was the truth. If the question was how do babies get in a mommy's belly, that answer would be a necessary half-truth.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 04:54 PM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 



Defination



A lie of omission is to remain silent when ethical behaviour calls for one to speak up. A lie

of omission is a method of deception and duplicity that uses the technique of simply remaining

silent, when speaking the truth would significantly alter the other person's capacity to make

an informed decision.

A lie is NOT in the words, or lack of words it's in the INTENTION OF THE DECEIVER



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 05:09 PM
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Originally posted by DarknessMatters
reply to post by Jim Scott
 

I challenge anyone to watch the grand daddy of all Santa movies, "Santa Clause: The Movie" from the 1980's and NOT get choked up at the end when the Sheena Easton song "It's Christmas all over the world" starts playing.

I have watched that movie on every Christmas Eve since I was a child. This will be my 30th year (I am almost 34) watching it.



LOL, I loved that movie, I have fond memories of watching that while growing up, and I just recently found it on instant view on Netflix, so I think I will join you watching it this Christmas eve.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 05:13 PM
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Hail Odin.
Nuff said.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 05:13 PM
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Originally posted by DarknessMatters
The belief in a Santa Clause by children should be encouraged. They're children. Let them stay innocent as long as possible.
This whole "War on Christmas" thing is ridiculous at best.


Letting them be children is part of the problem with today's youth.
They should learn responsibility at an early age, which makes for a more responsible adult.
Telling them there is a santa claus is LYING to them.
Some children, myself included, can get quite upset over the fact that their most trusted parents have lied to them. After all they are taught that lying is unacceptable behavior.

Wouldn't it be better, if you want to play that game; tell them that we are going to Pretend there is a santa claus.
Children like playing games of pretend and the can quit playing anytime they feel like it. That way there is no big let down, no sense that they have been made a fool, no sense of betrayal.....



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 05:16 PM
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It just wouldn't be Christmas on ATS without the santa debates thread.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 05:16 PM
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Man, some people are drippier than an icicle in early spring!

If you don't want your kids believing in Santa, then you should also stop allowing them to blow out candles on their Birthday cakes while making a wish.
Don't tell them that good things happen to good people because that isn't always true either.
Don't allow them to believe in luck. Luck is for losers.
Tell them that wishing on a falling star is for idiots.

Did I miss anything?

I'm so glad I was a kid before everything became so damned politically correct and the word liberal existed.
I believed in magical things when I was a kid and as an adult I still do. I still leave a penny on the ground if it's tails up. I make a wish if I find an eyelash on my cheek. I make a wish when I see a falling star. I believe that Bourbon Street was protected by Voodoo during Katrina. I wear my birthstone because I believe it brings me luck. Believing in these sorts of things makes me unique and and keeps mystery alive for me.

As another poster stated... Thanks, Mom and Dad!

edit on 23-12-2011 by Afterthought because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 05:18 PM
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Without a doubt we should continue the SANTA Myth as you call it. In Fact it's not a myth www.stnicholascenter.org... however over time we have made it more and more about consuming unnecessary things than celebrating the birth of Christ or spending time with loved ones, whatever you believe in.

As a father of two wonderful Children I am trying to prolong the myth and fantasy as long as humanly possible. In Fact every year I make my children go into a store and buy toys for homeless or those with less good fortune than us with money they earn from doing chores. I do this not to be mean, but when the time comes and my Son says dad I know Santa isn't real I can look him in the eyes and say Son for the last X years you have been buying gifts and making someone whose life isn't as good as yours a little brighter. For one day of the year you brought joy to a child who lives in sorrow, you made someone forget all the pain in their lives for a few moments.. Son for one moment you were Santa.

There is enough sorrow, pain, and misery in this life for him to experience later. For Now I want them to be Kids and enjoy the best part of their lives..

So Yes SANTA should continue.. Have Children and you will know what I am talking about.
edit on 23-12-2011 by Dorfdad because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 05:24 PM
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Let them know that Santa really does exist in our minds. Like everything we believe in.
They still get presents and all that.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 05:30 PM
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reply to post by FlySolo
 



OMG OP, you have GOT to be kidding me. Are you seriously taking life so seriously that you would consciously deprive a kid of Christmas and Santa Clause?

Here's a newsflash OP, because you were obviously the one and only kid in your life that was fooled I guess and actually thought Santa Clause was real beyond the age of 4 or 5 and must've been incredibly disappointed when you finally found out when you were like 14. But really.....every kid even when I was young 20-25 years ago, who had access to FAR less info than kids today, knew Snata Clause wasn't real. We just all go along with the joke because it's fun and a celebration.

It's the same reason people dress up for Halloween or........tailgate before a sporting event, or do various other things we all do......at least normal people. It's just fun tradition.

So again.....OP, just to drive it home for you. The kids already know their parents are Santa Clause, and you said they're what was it?.......6? If that kid doesn't know he or she will in a year or so. But they will still go along with the gag. Why do you think kids tell THEIR PARENTS what they want Santa to get them for Christmas?

Kids are smarter than you give them credit for or smarter than they act. That's why, or a similar reason, why I won't talk to even little babies in "baby talk". I can remember being like 4 and wondering why my aunt is talking to me like I'm an idiot, lol.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 05:33 PM
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reply to post by Dorfdad
 


You are using Santa to teach your children good values, I salute you sir!

When your kids grow up and have your grandkids they will pass on your wisdom to them. Personally, I think that telling a kid Santa is real can be good if done properly, giving a gift can be more rewarding than receiving a gift..It's a good thing in your case because when your children grow up and learn the truth that Santa isn't real they'll be smart enough to know that you told a little fib but for a good reason and helped them grow to be kind, decent people, and they'll respect you a lot for it, there aren't enough people like you around these days.

If only more people would realise that teaching their kids that being kind and helping others who are less fortunate is more important than receiving extravagant gifts the world would be a better place overall for most children.sadly we live in a world where kids can be bullied and outcast because their parents can't afford to provide them with expensive toys, clothes, etc.

It's also nice that you teach your kids the value of working, and teaching them how to anage money sensibly.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 05:48 PM
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Originally posted by Larry L
reply to post by FlySolo
 



OMG OP, you have GOT to be kidding me. Are you seriously taking life so seriously that you would consciously deprive a kid of and Santa Clause?

Here's a newsflash OP, because you were obviously the one and only kid in your life that was fooled I guess and actually thought Santa Clause was real beyond the age of 4 or 5 and must've been incredibly disappointed when you finally found out when you were like 14. But really.....every kid even when I was young 20-25 years ago, who had access to FAR less info than kids today, knew Snata Clause wasn't real. We just all go along with the joke because it's fun and a celebration.

It's the same reason people dress up for Halloween or........tailgate before a sporting event, or do various other things we all do......at least normal people. It's just fun tradition.

So again.....OP, just to drive it home for you. The kids already know their parents are Santa Clause, and you said they're what was it?.......6? If that kid doesn't know he or she will in a year or so. But they will still go along with the gag. Why do you think kids tell THEIR PARENTS what they want Santa to get them for ?

Kids are smarter than you give them credit for or smarter than they act. That's why, or a similar reason, why I won't talk to even little babies in "baby talk". I can remember being like 4 and wondering why my aunt is talking to me like I'm an idiot, lol.


Larry,

Did you really read my post without blinders on? Let me clarify. I never believed in Santa and I already said this in my OP. I was never disappointed so this thread isn't a result of childhood trauma. My god.
My point is Lying about it as if he were actually real. Letting corporations control the story and running with it for consumerism. Using Santa as a means to manipulate kids into proper behavior. And finally, devaluing the trust children have in parents and grooming them to be non questioning consumers.

I have no problem with the story of Santa and his little elves, but I have a big problem convincing children it's true. Why is that so hard for most people to understand?
Let me put it this way. The only reason why everyone goes along with it is because well, everyone goes along with it. Can I come to your house and tell your kids about some made up make believe character that will steal their shoes and eat their food if they don't behave? I think not and I would guess I may even leave your house with a black eye too. But put a few million people behind me and some advertising, I might get away with it.




edit on 23-12-2011 by FlySolo because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 05:49 PM
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reply to post by Dorfdad
 


I have children.

I have Christmas

I have Santa

But it's all about a "pretend" .... it's a "Business Created Hallmark Holiday"

The real part of Christmas is that it is a time for giving and gathering and sharing and remembering what we are thankful for and to look to the future and discuss out hopes and dreams.

I don't have a need to give credibility to a fictitious Santa for the sake of Some "magical" enjoyment.

Me and My eldest (5), are planning on building a rocket to the moon this week, now he knows it's pretend, but we both play the game. We have just as much fun "Imagining" .... but at no point do we need to have belief in the "Rocket" to enjoy the "magic"..... and we both know the "rocket" is pretend.

Why does the "SANTA DECEPTION" have to have "BELIEF or FAITH" attached. IT is A STORY.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 05:54 PM
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Last christmas I played santa for my lil niece and nephew. I put on the suit and got into character.

I swear the joy and looks on their faces were one of the most heart warming experiences I've ever had.

Santa is fun and good for the occasion, I mean I'd never take my kids to a mall and stand in line for 45 mins, you have to be insane.

But if it makes my child smile I don't mind.

I just get a feeling a lot of people just want to force into a little childs head that the government is out to get you... Go ahead, push the suicide rate up.



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 05:58 PM
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Originally posted by nawki
reply to post by Dorfdad
 


I have children.

I have Christmas

I have Santa

But it's all about a "pretend" .... it's a "Business Created Hallmark Holiday"

The real part of Christmas is that it is a time for giving and gathering and sharing and remembering what we are thankful for and to look to the future and discuss out hopes and dreams.

I don't have a need to give credibility to a fictitious Santa for the sake of Some "magical" enjoyment.

Me and My eldest (5), are planning on building a rocket to the moon this week, now he knows it's pretend, but we both play the game. We have just as much fun "Imagining" .... but at no point do we need to have belief in the "Rocket" to enjoy the "magic"..... and we both know the "rocket" is pretend.

Why does the "SANTA DECEPTION" have to have "BELIEF or FAITH" attached. IT is A STORY.


oop replied to wrong post.
edit on 23-12-2011 by steveknows because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 23 2011 @ 06:00 PM
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reply to post by FlySolo
 


I do not have children either, but I sure can remember being one (i am 30 now). I remember the insane lengths my mom went to to make me believe in the tooth fairy, easter rabbit, santa, etc. So much, that when it finally dawned on me that it was a load of crap, I lost a little faith in my mom. yes, it was that bad. i cried for days and felt truly betrayed by her. so, i don't think i will be teaching my kids about all of that. if they choose to believe, so be it, but i wont be forcing them.




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