What Will Soldiers do if Ordered to Arrest Friends, Families, Neighbors on US Soil?

reply to post by jude11


Take it from a vet. It's not the soldiers you need to worry about. The PMCs (Private Military Contractors) like Blackwater (Xe) and others are where the trouble will come from in the future, I think. To put it into perspective, Blackwater was about 10,000 strong before they were forced to move to the Islamic Emirates and change their name to Xe. Xe is now the largest military force in the region, PMC or otherwise. Think about it, the largest army in the middle east is PRIVATELY OWNED. They can be called back here too, by the way.

reply to post by mkkkay


Good luck with that....

I laugh at this. If foreign troops are willing to come here and try to confiscate arms, I feel sorry for them. Cause if people thought that the US soldiers have been tough in other theatres? They haven't seen anything compared to US persons protecting their families and their homes.

Jaden

I think there would be many military that obeyed orders, but I think just as many would refuse. To me the bigger question is how bad would it half to get to have citizens start shooting their own soldiers. The citizens would put up with a lot, but there is a point that it would have to stop. If foreign troops ever came here it would be all out war and no one would hesitate to kill at will. They have no right to be here. There isn't a big enough army in the world that could stop the citizen army. They know the territory and can blend in at any time. Vietnam would look like a cake walk compared to what would unfold. If our leaders brought this on the people, none of them would be safe, we would soon have a new government by attrition.

reply to post by Primordial


You're right on the money. This is exactly how it will play. There will be bloodshed and lots of it. Lots of confusion from military and police over where their loyalties lie.

Make no mistake those of you in the military and LE, you had better choose to uphold the constitution, because you will be right in the middle of it, and you will have the ability to choose whether it is a bloody, drawn-out battle, or a swift and decisive victory for the people of this country.

reply to post by Furbs


That's not what he's saying at all. He's saying that TPTB have purposefully created the separate deisgnators in order to permit them to segregate the armed personnel when the time comes. By creating the designations and separate identities of Mexican American, African American, American etc, they create a disparity that makes it easier for them to just follow orders. As much disparity as they can create they will, and use it to their advantage, because they KNOW that if banded together as plain AMERICANS, they stand no chance against us. I still say they stand no chance against us.

Jaden

or another question is, what if the military sided with citizens and decided as a whole to disobey governement orders and protect the civilians?

The Top Brass in the military are CFR and will leave all the dirty work to the lower levels while hanging them out to dry.

Thank you Oathkeepers for your diligence and allegiance to the Constitution. I hope it does not come down to such a horrible thing, but things are looking awful bad right now.

Originally posted by antonia
reply to post by jude11

 

As someone who lives with, is descended from and is married to a solider let me give you a quick answer: They'd throw your ass in jail because you don't pay their bills. It's just the way things are, they have to eat too.

That's exactly right, and they would have the NG and the local police with them, because they are all high on the power thing, beating civilians and doing harm for kicks. And they get paid to do it.

reply to post by xXxinfidelxXx


Excellent post and reasoning.
The present invented phoney so called wars are merely to cover up the traing of these private corperate owned armies that kill for money.
Their egos will be been massaged constantly to make them think they are an elite superior brand of soldiers that answers to no country.
Their country will be the global NWO state, and words such as SANITISE will be common place as those deemed inferior will be exterminated.

gravitor

Some will do it, and some won't.


There will be a line drawn.


Most likely TPTB have this already planned out, and I'm sure they'll do computer simulations until it says they will be victorious....


It won't be guns versus guns... It will be psychological+chemical+nuclear+biological+guns versus guns.

reply to post by DaveWx3


"I can assure you that the majority of men I served with would not follow orders to police citizens who are not doing anything wrong."

Therein lies the crux of the matter, for your officers will tell you the people you are corralling and abusing ARE doing something wrong. They will be lying, but you will be in a hard spot as most of your brethren follow the orders and so will you, or put yourself at risk. Yes, I am ex-military as well. Let's not pretend to be more noble than we really are as a people. This same military, while selflessly helping many in Iraq and Afghanistan, have also ruthlessly and without real cause, I mean real cause that would stand up in court, have maimed and murdered 100s of thousands. Do many have guilt? Hell yes and such is part of the sad and justified PSTD so many soldiers now suffer. Let's admit that in the heat of things, we mostly go along and follow orders and I for one will be drop dead surpirsed if American soldiers en masse refuse to follow orders to round up their fellow Americans.

The only way they may have second thoughts is if they are asked to fire live ammo upon citizens peacably assembliing. They WILL however, fire supposedly non-lethal rounds, tear gas, flash bang grenades, etc. convincing themselves that these are not dangerous.

Face it folks, we are not in any way near as restrained and humane a culture as we once were. Admit also that our soldiers are now part and parcel of the military industrial complex, essentially mercenaries to our massive defense contractors.

This is a time of high shame that historians, given the chance should we survive it, will write as one of our darkest periods as a nation. Our only path to salvation is the total rebuke and sending into the shadows the vicious and psychotic legions of Evangelicals.


Perhaps paradoxically, I should add I trust the Oath Keepers, hoping their love of the Constitution is greater than their love of their church (which is NOT a creation of nature or a God, but of fallible, power hungry and narcissistic men).

Originally posted by Fromabove

Originally posted by antonia
reply to post by jude11

 

As someone who lives with, is descended from and is married to a solider let me give you a quick answer: They'd throw your ass in jail because you don't pay their bills. It's just the way things are, they have to eat too.

That's exactly right, and they would have the NG and the local police with them, because they are all high on the power thing, beating civilians and doing harm for kicks. And they get paid to do it.

Oh please, that's just silly. Are there people who get off on that sort of thing in the Military and Police? Yes, there are but the bulk of them are just normal people doing a job.
en.wikipedia.org...
People tend to obey authority figures as socially we are wired that way. It's how society has operated for thousands of years. Sadism has nothing to do with it.

reply to post by jude11


Found this video. In a do or die situation most people will choose to live, to survive at the cost of everyone else.

Warning, the video below is not for children. Not saying one way or the other, but history seems to have a way of repeating itself.



I never thought I would see the day a person would have to stand in front of a scanner, be groped, take off their shoes, and questioned like a criminal just to hop a flight to visit Aunt Maple.............I do not look like a terrorist by a long shot.

I never thought I would see cameras everywhere, recording one's every move............I have nothing to hide but still we now have no privacy.

Police brutality is already increasing

It's getting to the point of needing papers just to cross state lines

Fences being put up along borders can work both ways, to keep people out but also to contain people.

Stolen elections, broken promises, bail outs for the bankers and the middle class being dismantled, jobs out sourced, in sourced, no real news on the TV or news paper.

Read two of Naomi Wolf's books, "The End of America" and Give Me Liberty".

Ya snooze and ya loose.

All the warning signs are there. Many people just can't or won't accept something is up.

I watched a program a few years back, a documentary on holocaust survivors and how they survived. They all answered, "Partly luck, partly I blended into the wood work, no eye contact, no standing out, total blending into the scenery.".................Remember those words, they might just save you.

For those that will laugh and say, "this will never happen here in America".............well, I've seen changes in the past 30 years come about I never thought would be possible.

With each President our Constitution is being dismantled.

I wonder how many of the holocaust victims played the "Oh this could never happen to me" game.

The battle will be a protracted one. The Military will be incapable of not getting their supply lines cut and they will not move easily around. There are too many guns and explosives, they will be forced to stay in protective positions or all out war on the people, they didn't do that in nam and I doubt they will do it here. If they do they will lose soldiers very quickly. The people would soon force new elections and new leaders and they sure won't be coming out of the socialist ranks.

Originally posted by nenothtu

Originally posted by Furbs

Originally posted by overratedpatriotism

No it is not funny that someone has to defend himself when he points out that he notices statistically that some crimes are fueled by color and creed. It is sad, but he is speaking the truth. And that is how it would work.. us white soldiers would be sent to the ghettos and vice versa.

You see, AMERICANS would probably not kill their own fellow Americans.......but African-americans, and Mexican/Latino Americans would kill white Americans since they are not their own people...........think about it. (Ever wonder why there are so many different race designators in order to racially divide the UNITED States of America?)

THIS is the comment that strikes the most overtly racist tones, mate. It has nothing to do with statistics and EVERYTHING to do with inherent racisms.

The AMERICANS in all caps refers exclusively to Caucasians, while indicating other racial distinctions by other names "African Americans" and "Mexican/Latino Americans" (You know, because Mexicans and Latinos are the same thing) indicating that the author CLEARLY feels that Caucasians are the TRUE American.. when in fact Caucasians are just as foreign as Africans.. and Latinos are probably the closest to "REAL" Americans the author even mentioned.

I read "AMERICANS" to mean American-Americans, as opposed to African-Americans, Mexican-Americans, Irish-Americans, Arab-Americans, Native-Americans, and all the other hyphenated "Americans" who split their loyalties right their in their self-designations.

You know, the hyphenated "Half-assed-Americans".

I didn't see race as a factor unless those half-assed-Americans are the ones MAKING it a factor in their own self descriptions.

Guess what race I am? It's listed elsewhere at ATS, already.

Now once you get that right, guess which nationality I am.

The two are not synonymous or linked.

Firstly, I don't care what race or nationality you are. Ignorance doesn't discriminate.

Secondly, he is CLEARLY indicating race. His entire post is about race. He has not said anything about "Half-Assed" Americans (Not sure what that even means, but it was your term, so whatever). That was you. These soldiers did not identify themselves as Mexican/Latino Americans or African Americans, that was what the author of the post labeled them. He speculated that race factored into their decision.

Lastly, what are American-Americans? Are you referring to indigenous Americans? The author was CLEARLY talking about Caucasian Americans, he later called them "white Americans" in the same sentence. The author made no mention of indigenous peoples.

They DAMN well better support the Citizenry! That is the entire BASIS FOR AMERICA! Government of the People, BY THE PEOPLE, and FOR THE PEOPLE! NOT Corrupt or moronic Politicians! NOT Corporate America! Our government only turns against us when WE are Not A Part Of Government! There are too many wealthy in government, too many lawyers, too many elitists. This is hardly Representative of the citizenry and population of the United States of America, which is a Federation of States allowing a central government to Hopefully run things more efficiently from a center rather than bickering states; a place where different people of different states can get together and govern in common instead of rivalry. Our Soldiers are to Defend our PEOPLE and our Constitution and our Bill of Rights, not Those In Power! ANYTHING can be made legal when crooks make the laws! It is in DISOBEYING crooked laws that is the reason America was founded! Making sure not all the work of the people ends up in the hands of the Elite, our own form of Royalty. Is is for Fairness and Equal Treatment that our country came together in the first place. Without the support of our own soldiers, the soldiers of the United STATES, not just Wall Street and Washington DC, then we Cease To Be America and start to resemble Nazi Germany. We fought then. We will fight in the future, if it is necessary, to defend the Public from a government that no longer represents us.

Originally posted by antonia

Originally posted by Fromabove

Originally posted by antonia
reply to post by jude11

 

As someone who lives with, is descended from and is married to a solider let me give you a quick answer: They'd throw your ass in jail because you don't pay their bills. It's just the way things are, they have to eat too.

That's exactly right, and they would have the NG and the local police with them, because they are all high on the power thing, beating civilians and doing harm for kicks. And they get paid to do it.

Oh please, that's just silly. Are there people who get off on that sort of thing in the Military and Police? Yes, there are but the bulk of them are just normal people doing a job.
en.wikipedia.org...
People tend to obey authority figures as socially we are wired that way. It's how society has operated for thousands of years. Sadism has nothing to do with it.

Most people join the military so that they can beat ass and have fun doing it, and get a paycheck. It's all about guns and glory, and kicks for free. The reason they have PTSD when they get back is because they start feeling guilty for what they did.

Originally posted by gravitor

Originally posted by Captain Beyond
All of the soldiers I have talked to about this scenario said they would disobey orders to detain or shoot american citizens. As mentioned in the thread previously, they would send in foreign troops to do the job. I look forward to that day! I will have absolutely no problem putting a round through the head of a foreign soldier. They are in my country illegally, by illegal orders, and they automatically become an enemy combatant!

I am in England.
If a Yanky doodle soldier comes here and is told to arrest Me etc etc?????
What would You recommend I do?

Gravitor

I would suggest you do the same. Sure, it would be an american soldier, but he would there illegally, unless the queen gave him permission....; )

reply to post by jude11


Great thread. But I think we already have our answer. Over 200,000 Iraqi & Afghan civilians have been murdered in two illegal wars. Policemen all over the country are illegally cracking down on protesters (many cops are ex-military), and resorting to physical violence.

Can anyone cite an instance throughout history where a significant portion of a military went against orders due to civil rights? I can't think of any.

Originally posted by v1rtu0s0

It won't be guns versus guns... It will be psychological+chemical+nuclear+biological+guns versus guns.

edit on 5-12-2011 by v1rtu0s0 because: (no reason given)

I've got the psychological, chemical, biological, and "guns" covered for the People's side, No nukes, but if they want to toss 'em, they're welcome to. if they do, they won't be holding that ground, either...

It's not as lop sided as some would like it to appear to be. "Asymetrical", yes, but unbablanced, no...