It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Thank you.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
YOUR ignorance is not accepted.
My answer is why you can't offer an honest reply.
I guess I also missed the part where it says its ok to assume it also happens in humans. Your ingnorance is not accepted.
(that’s spelt ignorance not ingnorance) I see you are still rejecting everything based on your ignorance. Well at least you have admitted it now.
You have fallen off track, AGAIN, I wasn't talking about evolution.
It's a metaphor, I'm assuimg you know what that is.
Nope evolution is a word. I know you don’t have a clue what that word is.
Because there is not other choice for our tampered DNA.
Then you just agreed that intervention did occur to us, and they did in fact alter our DNA, thanks for finally agreeing.
You really are desperate, how do you get the above from: 'Again: Evolution is a word. It cannot change DNA. Have you been reading any of the posts you reply too?'
Ah I remember you reject everything from ignorance. A statement by you. You had better add to that your dishonesty
Its even more true when your agreeing with me.
Therefore intervention is the only way it could have, yay, you got it finally.
Illustrates how you come to all of your conclusions. Don’t worry about what is written make your fantasy fit. You failed again. You do highlight your insanity and desperation around a word and how dishonest you are prepared to be to hide from it. How tragic.
I don't believe in the written word. All religion is false in my understanding.
I know a lot more about it than you do, thats for sure. Of course I have read a lot about it.
I see no evidence of that understanding. I do see evidence even in this reply that you have a very limited ability to understand the written word. Couple that with your admission: Reply to this post by tooth
You must not know much if your comparing tying your shoelaces to understanding DNA.
So your term is not accepted out of ignorance
That leaves me with very little confidence you know how to tie shoe laces let alone understand DNA.
The ONLY PERSON that has even commented on this example, told me, no it would not be considered evolution if ADHD caused changes. Since scientists are unable to identify the cause of changes they are looking for in DNA, this means that not all changes are evolution, yet they are being accepted as such. It's a false observation by scientists.
Yet its never been proven that evolution is the reason for these changes. They just find changes, and assume its evolution. Like I explained earlier that my friend who has ADHD because his mother smoked witle pregnant with him, would appear to be a change, therefore evolutionists would chalk ADHD up to evoltuion, which is false.
Another answer by you from ignorance despite having this fully explained. Makes your claim of knowledge of DNA a little hollow don’t you think. I refer you back to that answer.
You missed the whole point, again, some of those changes are NOT evolution, and that has been proven by my suggesting the ADHD scenerio. How do we not know that all of the changes are not from evolution. There is no way to know, so scientists just keep assuming.
I don't have to, evolutioists confirmed that they don't know by coming up with multiple scenerios that could be the cause of change, mutation, sexuall selection, natural selection, etc...It's all just a guessing game and they have no way to know, much less identify what causes the changes.
That is because there are multiple reasons for that change. But tell me how many times have you posted what you think is true or how you think things work and expect people to believe you? You of all people.
You have had many examples of confirmed and observed speciation but you choose as you say to reject based on your ignorance.
Look its real simple ok, in order for us to have evolved from primordeal slime, your genes must have grown in size. There is no way that we share a common ancestor with apes if they have more genes and chromosomes than us. The numbers imply that they rather evolved from us.
Humans have fewer chromosomes and less genes so there is no way in hell that we evolved from apes or share a common ancestor.
Fewer than what? You must try to be more coherent. Again we did not evolve from apes. You showcase your ignorance again
Well its not a save all in the idea but I'm sure someone somewhere would be producing a DVD about it. A lot like the idea of peer reviews. I totally dissagree with your assumption that peer reviews are the determination of true and false findings. Granted if others can recreate something, its obviously true, but when they can't it doesn't necessarly mean its false, just suspicious. Not to mention there will always be others that don't agree with the findings and that in itself doesn't not determine truth.
There is no DVD on it, and I would be money it would be the most important one if it were true.
A DVD is how you think information is confirmed. Where did you study to be a science major?
Well that is your observation. It makes no sense that we would have this unilatteral development of other life, in such a way that is unidentifiable.
Your just unable to see the big picture in order to understand that if evolution is capable of doing all the things your claiming, then it must have some type of intelligence behind it.
Your denial is so deeply ingrained you don’t see any picture than that of an alien. Evolution is a word. It cannot do anything, it does not have intelligence. IT IS A WORD.
The process evolution clearly describes is lead by natural forces within the environment not some godly intelligence you so desperately desire to comfort your deep set fear of life.
Except that our planet is currently not revealing any new emerging species for us to witness at this time. I understand its a slow process, which I call BS on for excuses. We also have no bones or fossils that could prove any of this so again I call BS on this.
You could say the same thing about an automotive assembly line. Looking at it from the individual perspective, you could say they are not creating anything because each one of them does a small part like put on a door, or add glass, or install the shocks.
Nope. You could say that and as usual with your analogies you would be wrong. Here is why:
But the finished product is a creation, with intelligence behind it.
There is never a finished product. The organism either goes on to breed and pass its advantages on to the next generation or it dies, selected for by the environment
Sometimes you can really be ignorant colin.
I meant from YOUR ignorance.
Really? What you wrote was:
So your term is not accepted out of ignorance.
I find that much more of an accurate statement of how you reject all conflicting arguments.
Your examples, and all others considered might account for 2% of the population, and that is stretching it. Most species on this planet have one head, have two eyes, a mouth, a nose, etc...Your examples are very small in comparison to the +5 million species on this planet.
I'll never be convinced that all evolution changes are by a mutation. If that were true, we would see a hell of a lot of species that have 4 heads and 10 limbs, but we don't, in fact most if not all are in order.
Spiders have eight legs. Centipedes and millipedes have many more. An Octopus has one main brain and an auxiliary "brain" in each of their 8 tentacles, in effect, 9 heads. We also have many examples of organisms with no heads or limbs at all.
There are thousands of other examples which show your statement above to be again baseless. Grounded in ignorance.
Now you tell me what advantage 4 heads would give?
I know you were trying to offer one of your ignorance based excuses. Evolution still remains a word. It has no hands, eyes. Cannot make decisions and does not create,
You have fallen off track, AGAIN, I wasn't talking about evolution.
Other than the choice science explains without having to even mention intervention.
Because there is not other choice for our tampered DNA.
The bible is 'the written word' so where does that leave your historical document?
I don't believe in the written word. All religion is false in my understanding.
You don’t even appear to understand the meaning of this either: That leaves me with very little confidence you know how to tie shoe laces let alone understand DNA. classic.
You must not know much if your comparing tying your shoelaces to understanding DNA.
Then you really should refer back to XYZ's reply which you obviously ignored as usual.
The ONLY PERSON that has even commented on this example, told me, no it would not be considered evolution if ADHD caused changes. Since scientists are unable to identify the cause of changes they are looking for in DNA, this means that not all changes are evolution, yet they are being accepted as such. It's a false observation by scientists.
414 pages and that is the best piffle you can muster. Oh dear what a disgrace
Look its real simple ok, in order for us to have evolved from primordeal slime, your genes must have grown in size. There is no way that we share a common ancestor with apes if they have more genes and chromosomes than us. The numbers imply that they rather evolved from us.
Well I tried to read this jumbled, incoherent mess but gave up. Try again.
Well its not a save all in the idea but I'm sure someone somewhere would be producing a DVD about it. A lot like the idea of peer reviews. I totally dissagree with your assumption that peer reviews are the determination of true and false findings. Granted if others can recreate something, its obviously true, but when they can't it doesn't necessarly mean its false, just suspicious. Not to mention there will always be others that don't agree with the findings and that in itself doesn't not determine truth.
Again what the hell are you on about? Are you replying to my point or a buzzing in your head?
Well that is your observation. It makes no sense that we would have this unilatteral development of other life, in such a way that is unidentifiable.
Except all the examples you have been given, some even supplied by yourself.
Except that our planet is currently not revealing any new emerging species for us to witness at this time.
No, you really do not understand it.
I understand its a slow process,
Confirmation that you don’t understand it.
which I call BS on for excuses.
Agreed. Your answer is again BS.
We also have no bones or fossils that could prove any of this so again I call BS on this.
We all can but only you have written:
Sometimes you can really be ignorant colin.
So your term is not accepted out of ignorance.
You have combined two separate posts again. Very dishonest, what are you trying to hide?
Your examples, and all others considered might account for 2% of the population, and that is stretching it.
Evolution does appear to create. How else could you explain all of the 5 million species we have here. There is no way around understanding that one way or the other, creation is occuring somehow.
You have fallen off track, AGAIN, I wasn't talking about evolution.
I know you were trying to offer one of your ignorance based excuses. Evolution still remains a word. It has no hands, eyes. Cannot make decisions and does not create,
And again if DNA had the ability to change on its own, in nature, then everything we have come to learn and depend on it for, is false. Not that we have never been wrong before. My point is that DNA can't change on its own, there must be a force of some type causing it to happen. Even if its the undisclosed hands of evolution, what ever you want to call it, something has to cause it.
Because there is not other choice for our tampered DNA.
Other than the choice science explains without having to even mention intervention
I believe in what is written in a literal sense, not a faith, redefined sense.
I don't believe in the written word. All religion is false in my understanding.
The bible is 'the written word' so where does that leave your historical document?
I don't know everything about DNA but I understand enough to realize that something is very wrong with ours being tampered with.
You must not know much if your comparing tying your shoelaces to understanding DNA.
You don’t even appear to understand the meaning of this either: That leaves me with very little confidence you know how to tie shoe laces let alone understand DNA. classic.
Last I recall he stated that ADHD making changes to DNA was not considered evolution, therefore I was correct.
The ONLY PERSON that has even commented on this example, told me, no it would not be considered evolution if ADHD caused changes. Since scientists are unable to identify the cause of changes they are looking for in DNA, this means that not all changes are evolution, yet they are being accepted as such. It's a false observation by scientists.
Then you really should refer back to XYZ's reply which you obviously ignored as usual
It's actually quite simple. If this planet were evolving, we would have a hell of a lot more species that are closer to each other, rather than seeing mostly very distinctive differences struggling to place association with them. The fact is we have some associations with many species, probably most, but there are very large differences between them. If changes happen in small amounts over long periods of time, we should have a hell of a lot of association, with little difference, and thats not what we have.
Look its real simple ok, in order for us to have evolved from primordeal slime, your genes must have grown in size. There is no way that we share a common ancestor with apes if they have more genes and chromosomes than us. The numbers imply that they rather evolved from us.
414 pages and that is the best piffle you can muster. Oh dear what a disgrace
Originally posted by itsthetooth
I'll never be convinced that all evolution changes are by a mutation. If that were true, we would see a hell of a lot of species that have 4 heads and 10 limbs, but we don't, in fact most if not all are in order.
Well seeing how they can't identify or lable the changes, makes it impossible to even know if they are from evolution.
If this were true, you wouldn't see humans going through the daily grind of adapting, or excuse me, redundant adapting.
I wasn't aware that gears and sprockets could evolve, I would love to see more on that.
We now have proof that flagellum's pump was evolved. We now understand how the eye came to be. Science, it's freaking beautiful.
Well intervention proves evolution wrong, as there is no way we could have evolved here if we aren't from here to being with, and we have proof of this as well.
Except that our planet is currently not revealing any new emerging species for us to witness at this time. I understand its a slow process, which I call BS on for excuses. We also have no bones or fossils that could prove any of this so again I call BS on this.
Well now I do, after I have looked at everything that has been presented to me.
I'll never be convinced that all evolution changes are by a mutation. If that were true, we would see a hell of a lot of species that have 4 heads and 10 limbs, but we don't, in fact most if not all are in order.
AAAAND THAT is what separates you from someone with a scientific perspective. You are a denier, not a skeptic. A skeptic would be happy to be proven wrong. A denier won't believe anything if it doesn't fit into his/her little opinion.
Except that my friend that has ADHD from his mother smoking while pregnant with him, he passed it on to his son, but both him and his wife werent smokers. So what started out as an induced disease, is now able to spread to each generation. And that would appear to be evolution. Of course its not. So I stand on my argument that not all changes are evolution, and since they can't be identified, its possible that none of them are evolution.
Well seeing how they can't identify or lable the changes, makes it impossible to even know if they are from evolution.
If it's a genetic change that continues throughout the species, then you can bet your bottom dollar that it was because of natural selection. Especially with what I said earlier. Those drug resistant strains of bacteria/diseases didn't die out after one generation. It continued. They still exist.
It's more like redundant adaptation disproves evolution.
If this were true, you wouldn't see humans going through the daily grind of adapting, or excuse me, redundant adapting.
Adapting is what you're trying to disprove, right?
Well this was a very nice video and thank you for that. Unfortunatly it's all speculation. It would be nice if they have proof. It's almost as though your presenting this to say that since it's possible that flagellum evolved in these steps, then it must be true. This seems to be the mindset for everything with evolution. Nothing is ever, this is how things are because we witnessed it, but that it appears to be possible therefore it must be how it happened. I think anybody can make anything possible in the mind. I was looking more for facts, or historical documentation saying these gears evolved.
Here's more info in a format even you can understand. Don't worry about reading and researching, though. It might make your head hurt.
Well there are several authors that believe in intervention. Pye is one of them Von daniken, The bible appears to be a missunderstood book on the topic, and Sitchen also looks in this direction.
Your response is based on belief and conjecture. Please prove your words. If you want to go scientific with it, we did evolve, but also are from another planet, since when this galaxy was formed by the biggidy bang bang, what eventually came to be all life on planet earth is made of particles from stars and bits not of this planet.
What is this intervention of which you speak. Just one scholarly peer reviewed article is all I ask for.
In conclusion: It's pointless arguing with someone who, as Tooth himself puts it, will never be convinced. Not even with evidence.
Assumptions were made that extinctions are a natural part of the earths process, and that is incorrect. It defies logic in any belief. If you belive in creation, how could you agree that the simple extinction of life is natural. If you believe in evoltuion going through the motions of creating new life, its the same thing. It's like creating a car but saying that its only natural that it will crash and burn.
Even from the angle of evolution, the goal is to make new species. Either way you slice it, the goal is the same. It would appear that evolution was nothing more than a speculative way to describe creation while elimanating the creator.
But it does, as we have over 5 million species here on earth. I understand you think we are all the same species, but even slight differences make us different, thats why we have gametic isolation.
It's not the same thing. Evolution by natural selection doesn't create new anything. It changed what already exists.
In part true, some of these things become coextinctions, which is species falling due to other species falling. It is also one thing that has to be considered when your looking at target food not existing.
Extinctions have occurred all throughout the earth's history and are still happening everyday. They are a natural process and are not always caused by the earth itself.
The planet has no will or motive. The planet is a friggin ecosystem that simply exists and is being exploited by life on it. The climate is a natural occurrence that is being exploited by life on the planet. The earth doesn't "fight back." It's a cause and effect relationship.
Evolution is nothing like creating a car, for evolution by natural selection isn't creating.
There is no way that all of the life could have happened on this planet, without direction of some type. We were not all formed from mutations, its just not possible, and if it were, the life on this planet would look a hell of a lot different than it does right now.
Evolution by natural selection has no goal. There is no sentience about it. It doesn't have a mission, a will, or anything. It's a process and a very natural one at that. There's nothing supernatural about it, unless you think swimming and lightening are supernatural.
I understand it, I just don't believe it. There is a difference between understanding and believing.
Tooth, I think it's fair to say that after over 400 pages of explaining, it's unlikely you're ever going to grasp the nuances of evolution.
signature:
Does anyone on here who believes in "over unity" devices...
For those who wish to play the science game...
I understand it, I just don't believe it.
So my alien theory in your opinion has been left in the dust. What exactly does that mean? That few people believe in it, therefore it can't be true, or are you claiming that others on this thread have discredited it.
Evolution is not something you believe in, it's somthing you accept as a scientific fact. It's testable, it's falsifiable and it makes predictions. It is the unifying theory of biology, it unites every independent discipline of biology. Advances in any one can be applied to all others using the unified theory of evolution. Almost nothing in biology makes sense without the theory of evolution.
Evolution requires zero faith unlike your alien fantasy world that has been left in the dust of scientific advancement
Well thats a good point. Just because my alien theory cant be proven, doesn't mean it isn't real. But since you brought it up, there allready is proof, the bible clearly states that this is how we were brought to earth.
No one needs to discredit your alien theory it can't be proven.
This thread is not about proving your delusions wrong anyway.
Evolution is falsifiable, testable and predictable nothing you say is going to change that.
End of story get over it
Well sure there is credit.
We don't have to discredit something to which no credit has ever been given.
Over hunting in general no, but as in humans, yes because we don't belong here to begin with. We are aware of it because we run into it to often. In a balance eco system, this would not happen. You would not have to worry about the collapse of a species from eating. A balanced system is a lot more stable than that. Sure you could weaken the numbers but 15 other things would kick in to bring those numbers back up. Its very complicated.
Also extinction can occur by over-hunting, or simply the destruction of natural habitats. Usually by humans.
I'm not sure what you meant here, if your talking about something I said in regards to all of us having to be from the same species.
I don't think we are all the same species...that would be most unscientific. I think we may have similar roots. All creatures have come a long way since one of the 5 major extinction events that have occurred over the earth's history.