Please. Sell your Gold NOW! It's a trap.

Originally posted by sbctinfantry
If it is such a great hedge against inflation, what do you do with it when the money supply is contracted?

We start using it as tradeable currency directly, that's what. It is exactly what used to happen before the current mess.

What do you say to the banking titans getting out of gold and going into water, energy, land and other natural resources?

They already own practically everything else, in case you hadn't noticed.

If we get the gold, and they end up purely with fiat liquidity as a result of someone else having said gold, how exactly is that a trap, again?

You won't be able to sell it for 1/100th of what you bought it for. What once would have been a down payment on a new car will be equated to a loaf of bread.

That's why if you're smart, you don't just buy gold. You buy gold, silver, and copper. The new car gets bought with gold. The loaf of bread gets bought with copper, to use as three seperate denominations. Because it ain't fiat paper, we don't end up with inflation on any of it. Any questions?

The smartest thing to do is to buy land and natural resources.

No, the smart thing to do is to buy gold before fiat currency goes completely down the toilet, and then use said gold to buy land and natural resources.

Gold is currency. It's just better currency than paper, because as long as it isn't diluted, it never depreciates. Gold isn't getting more expensive now because its' value is going up. It's getting more expensive because the dollar is going down.

News Flash :George Soros, the hedge fund investor who called gold the ultimate bubble, has divested his portfolio of nearly its entire investment in the gold, inciting many to fear that the price will very soon plummet, devaluing the specie-heavy portfolios of millions of investors.

I don't care what George does. George probably thinks that if he gets out of gold temporarily, everyone else will do likewise and sell up, in which case he'll not only be able to repurchase his own gold, but also all of theirs.

Think for yourself.

The dollar index is exactly where it was three years ago at 74. Since then it has had THREE runs up to about 90 and seems to be getting ready for the fourth one.

Since the dollar has traded in a range of circa 75 to circa 90 for years (in 2006 it was at 90) how can its supposed fall in value be an excuse for the price of gold? And what about the fact that the price of dollar denominated US govt. debt is close to a 70-year high? Isn´t that in contradiction to the price of gold?

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/ec8569b08023.jpg[/atsimg]

P.S. Both US stocks and commodities bulls rely on a low dollar. About everyone and their dog is short the dollar.

As a result, when the mommy of all short squeezes gets going in the dollar (it seems just a question of time) it´ll totally devastate stocks and commodities bubbles.

Please. Sell your Gold CONTRACTS now, all paper is a trap, BUY PHYSICAL GOLD and keep possession of it. GLD is a trap!

We are getting very close to a paradigm shift in the way currency zones settle their accounts, when this happens average house prices will go from 300 ounces of gold to less than 10 ounces to buy the average house. If you want to know more read some articles at the blog below, ask questions, burn ignorance away with knowledge. It's not too late but the day is getting closer, it will only happen once in our lifetimes. It is inevitable, no-one can stop it, there will be no warning, that day will be unavoidable. Educate yourself, ask questions, find the truth of what is about to happen.

"I'm going to tell you about a secret market that maybe only 100 people in the whole world know exists, because they transact in it. . . . . The point is, these Central Bankers do have a secret "Nuclear Option" at their disposal (other than printing more euros). And they WILL use it if and when they are backed into a corner. They know it's going to blow up on its own soon anyway, so they have no guilt about it. . . . . . Now you might be thinking, "How can this secret help us now if it is so secret and under the control of the Central Bankers?" Well here's the beauty of it: All it will take to deploy this "Nuclear Option" and reset the monetary and financial world back to a sustainable basis is one simple announcement, the revelation of the existence of this market, or even a credible leak will do the trick. . . . . . In case you haven't guessed it yet, this secret market I'm talking about is a gold market. But it is a separate gold market from the LBMA and the COMEX that we all know about. It has a different market-maker and a different price!"

fofoa.blogspot.com...

We´re in a deflationary environment. The world is absolutely drowning in overcapacity and the supply of dirt cheap labor is totally endless. Add the ongoing and mounting balance sheet depression.

In such an environment you have high price of cash obviously since it is favorable to delay purchases to pick things up cheaper later. So, it virtually pays to keep money under the mattress. This is the main reason short term rates are at zero.

It makes no sense at all to accumulate and bid up gold and other commodities in such a deflationary environment. Those are bubbles that will without any doubt at all crash to earth with serious consequences for taxpayers which will yet again bail out irresponsible and reckless financial speculations.

Page 1

First you chastized another poster for comparing today's MAED to yesterday's great depression, and then you proceeded to do the same...only in abysmal fashion.

Originally posted by sbctinfantry
Stop comparing the depression of yesterday to the MAED of today.

In the depression, the majority of citizens were self sufficient. Today, most people live off of less than a week of food stores.
Proportionally, inflation was more devastating then, and now it is part of our financial machine.

Those are facts....

Originally posted by sbctinfantry
Of course, I never said that inflation was the cause for the depression. You make that assumption without any evidence other than my saying that it was more devastating than it is today.

Why of course you didn't. While making your own comparisons, you simply decided to add a random, out of context, generalized observation on inflation

"Proportionally, inflation was more devastating then, and now it is part of our financial machine.".

Do you really think the people reading this thread are stupid ?

The inflation remark was as silly as your erroneous claim that "In the depression, the majority of citizens were self sufficient". My 88 year old mother laughed so hard at that statement this morning...she almost spit-out her dentures.

Mom was born in a railroad section camp on the outskirts of Winnemucca, Nevada. By 1933 she was 10 years old, and living in Reno with her hardworking family. Our family elders have had many open disscussions centered on their remembrances of the GD and it's lingering aftermath. Mom's older brother, my uncle, who passed in 1992 eventually found work in Roosevelt's Civilian Conservation Corp at the age of 17 > free room & board plus $1 a day in wages and he was grateful to have it. He sent the bulk of his $30 a month salary home to help support the remaining family of 6 for whom food and clothing often came courtesy of the WPA. Even citizens with relatively steady private sector jobs had to endure steep wage cuts, and sharp reductions in work hours. In fact the "employed" were often caught in the middle...making too much in wages to qualify for government assistance, but too little to properly feed, clothe, and shelter their families.

Originally posted by sbctinfantry
Today, as a means to combat, and cover up the coming depression, we are inflating our currency to astronomical rates. If these practices were used during the great depression, their effects would be much more noticeable and have greater impact on the wealth of the citizens

Roosevelt had his own set of tools.

When Roosevelt assumed the helm in 1933 the economy was already in the grip of a severe deflationary spiral. Adding pressure to the deflationary impulse, Gold had been fleeing the Treasury as anxious holders of USD lost confidence government paper (Gresham's Law). The countermeasure to deflation is a positive rate of inflation. In a nutshell, this was Roosevelt's' conundrum > halt the bank runs [on Gold], and generate a high rate of inflation. In other words, he was faced with an impossible task as long as dollars were convertible in Gold, and the money supply was shackled to a classical Gold Standard with a 40% Gold Cover Clause.

Ultimately Roosevelt administered the medicine by shifting the country from the confines of a strict Gold Standard to a Gold Exchange Standard. He appropriated privately held bullion, and abandoned dollar convertibility by all private entities including US citizens, commercial banking interests, and private enterprise. He also eliminated gold as payment/collateral for all privately held debt, and he additionally devalued the USD by 41% in January 1934, i.e., revalued US Gold reserves @ $35oz. With Gold trading internationally at an 'official' rate of approx $20.67oz, this price disparity created an irresistible (read profitable) arbitrage opportunity for foreigners. They could buy Gold @ $20.67 USD in their domestic markets and sell it to the US Treasury at a 69% profit. As a result, Gold flooded into the US Treasury from international markets. It was this burgeoning US Gold reserve that allowed for a rapid expansion of the money supply, and provided the liquidity for fiscal programs like The New Deal which eventually turned the tide of the worst deflationary depression in history.

Bernanke has his own unconventional tool kit, and he isn't afraid to use....have you noticed ? Read his seminal oratory on combating deflation from 2002: Deflation: Making Sure "It" Doesn't Happen Here

It's all in there.

On the day following that speech Jim Sinclair called the beginning of the bull market in Gold, and the smart money that was paying attention followed him. See how the puzzle fits together ?

-continues below-

Page 2

Does anyone believe that the Fed is in a position to raise interest rates, end monetization, and begin withdrawing liquidity from a flagging economy ? Do you believe that the debt crisis has been resolved in Europe and that it will not visit US shores within the next 12 - 18 months ? Do you believe that major central banks will become net sellers of Gold in the next week while their domestic currencies continue a race to the bottom ? Do you believe that buyers in Asia just purchased their last ounce, and that global investment demand is about to fall off a cliff as we approach the mother of all currency crises ? The US Treasury continues to mint and sell the most popular investment grade coins on the planet to investors worldwide...do you believe the Gubmn't is about turn around and spend resources taking these coins back from the few Americans that actually own them, while the bulk sold to foreign investors which can never 'confiscated' are gone forever ? Does anyone doubt that Mr. Bernanke will use every policy measure he mentions in his anti-deflation speech, including his reference to a formal devaluation of the dollar against the price of Gold ?

If you answered yes to two or more of these questions then $1900 was probably the top and you might want to think about selling.

I bookmarked this thread and plan to bump it every 3 to 6 months, or until this market runs it's course. Lets see just how many percentage points a theoretical seller would have sacrificed had he cashed-out at $1900.

This will be fun.

GL

Deflation and hyper-inflation are very similar events but with a different numéraire, the political system will not allow 'deflation' and so currency collapse (hyper-inflation) is now inevitable and will be apparent shortly.

To put it another way there is going to be a deflation, everything will deflate when compared to gold, especially currency itself.

If you really think dollars are worth holding during the coming collapse consider this . . .

"Think about this for a minute. The average retiree on Social Security receives about $1,100 per month, or $13,000 per year. This is a dollar denominated promise. If the crash from top to bottom is 90% or more as Prechter predicts, this would give each and every Social Security recipient the equivalent purchasing power of $130,000 per year when purchasing real estate, the stock market or even commodities. Basically everything.

And this will be true not only for Social Security, but for anyone on the receiving end of a dollar denominated promise, including all pensioners, anyone with a tenured job, like teachers and government workers, and including everyone in Congress. Virtually everyone with an income or cash savings will see their purchasing power rise ten-fold!

The problem with this view is that the real economy right now cannot even afford to deliver real economic goods at TODAY'S dollar purchasing power, let alone another 800% rise in purchasing power, with Ben printing new ones the whole way there."

fofoa.blogspot.com...

Originally posted by galdur
The dollar index is exactly where it was three years ago at 74. Since then it has had THREE runs up to about 90 and seems to be getting ready for the fourth one.

Since the dollar has traded in a range of circa 75 to circa 90 for years (in 2006 it was at 90) how can its supposed fall in value be an excuse for the price of gold? And what about the fact that the price of dollar denominated US govt. debt is close to a 70-year high? Isn´t that in contradiction to the price of gold?

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/ec8569b08023.jpg[/atsimg]

edit on 1-9-2011 by galdur because: (no reason given)

Wow... I'm not sure why this is so hard for people to understand. YOU ARE LOOKING AT THE WRONG CHARTS!!!

Check these ones out:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b25dfc30c69f.jpg[/atsimg]
Here is the revised version including the projected gold price.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/925c6853dc31.jpg[/atsimg]

I'm also providing 2 External links below for the 2 charts above. The pictures in the link's below are BIGGER and easier to read:





Now... please tell me what part of these 2 Charts would lead you to believe that Gold will be going down in Value any time soon?

Originally posted by galdur
The dollar index is exactly where it was three years ago at 74. Since then it has had THREE runs up to about 90 and seems to be getting ready for the fourth one.

The operative word in that statement is THREE. That's three 'runs' all of which failed at key resistance. Don't be fooled by interim relief rallies from an oversold condition in an ongoing bear market. The senior trend remains firmly in place....down.

The USDX is a relative index that measures the performance of bucky against a basket of major currencies. In the past three years all the majors have been weakened through excessive liquidity injections with the USD leading the pack...think QEs 1 & 2, and competitive international currency devaluation. If you want to gage the real performance of fiat currencies across the past 3 years just chart their execution against the price of Gold. How's that working out ?

Simply put, the dollar index of 2008 isn't the dollar index of 2011. You might as well comp apples & oranges.

GL

You know OP this thread would have gone a lot smoother if you had only toned down your posts.

No one is disagreeing with you really - if you don't have the money, you shouldn't be buying gold. Take care of the other essentials first (land, food, ammo etc)

The reason you are buying gold is to protect wealth, not to make a profit.

If I wanted to take over the world and I had a dieing world reserve currency, US dollar, I would:

1) Leverage the market to get possession of need based corporate entities via the stock market.

2) Destabilize and tighten the credit markets to cause the drop in relative value of real goods and services

3) Create a virtual market in monetary commodity metals so I could manipulate their price ie "etf"

4) Use these ETF's to collapse the price of real monetary instruments while also buying physical assets.

5) Use various tactics to devalue the currency in a controlled way ie subprime fiasco, QE 1, 2...

6) Lower the credit rating of the owner of the reserve currency creating a flight to safety in "paper gold and commodities"

7) Take advantage of the chaos to buy up at the last minute the stocks and other "soft" assets at a discount, especially those of foreign interests. (we are at this stage now)

8) Collapse gold price using ETF markets by starting a rumor (real or false) that the controlling hedge fund is insolvent causing a panicked flight to the dollar and stock market collapse.

9) Use a convenient third party excuse for the default on the Dollar.

10) Use the real physical gold i own to buy majority stake in every major world corporation I can, and use what gold I have left to back and leverage a strong manufacturing base's local currency to create a supranational world reserve currency.

the only trap is sheep who have been top calling for weeks and months


greatest bull market has commenced in this and 95% of you are not in it yet because of the non stop bubble calls

please learn the difference between a bull move and a bubble about to pop

by your same logic, apple and 100s of other stocks are bubbles too



SHEEPLE, BAHHHHH

gold to 50k. only people who own it are SOME folks involved in high finance/trading...like rich people, and survivalist folks

mainstream america and europe don't own it..and lucky to own 1-2% of their net worth in it

it will be a real parabola when gold doubles in a few months

it will be a real bubble when you know loads of people quitting jobs to be a gold broker or open a gold shop

thats not happening
and by the time gold is 5k an ounce many of you will be priced out forever

all the gold found in the world can fit in 2 olympic sized pools, there is a very real scarcity problem for the top callers i see all over online.


for all you guys know gold will back a future currency at an amazing peg rate that enriches the banksters who are buying it now and loading up the whole way up

reply to post by galdur

EW analysis of the USD chart looks like a big A up and then a flat abc:B (may be complete or close to it) which will probably hold > 72 and then we will get a powerful C wave to take out the top of A in the 90 area. Then, after the completion of a major correction (shaking out the weak dollar bears) we will see a move to new nows. My guess is fr 90-93 down to the 56-60 area (in several years).

Originally posted by XplanetX
Please DO NOT sell your Gold. This thread is a trap!

i agree...posted right before the CME raise/hit job , all planned of course

i see gold going to 2500 soon, and will likely double a few months after that

i will then revisit

gold is the only real investment out there. its sad so many don't get it yet because its been in a nice slow bull run up for 10 years ever since the Rothschild got out of the gold brokerage business and got secretly into the gold buying business for their own accounts of course

once gold hits 5k quickly folks will then have a right to call it parabolic and question why its happened so fast..but not until

a nice uptrend with quick hit jobs is normal and expected.

when I see conspiracy sites/survivalist sites trying to top tick gold i know its not even close to a long term top

its pathetic actually

and I will add something most of you don't get

you are thinking about the us dollar and america TOO MUCH

there is a BIG BIG world out there with their own debt problems and inflation problems as well

brazil lowered rates today by .5% from an amazing 12.5%. there is a whole lotta room to lower and print money

china? well guess what...DEBT FEARS are back. the government admits they are in the hole..
www.marketwatch.com...


and don't get me started on the EU...chronic unemployment is embarrassing and their debt problems could destroy the union

like i said, gold will work in all situations because its in a BULL market and multiple conditions and situations will support the price

its a real investment. that is what you are looking for and thats why its worked real well

and yet, people fight it..and don't get it that most currencies are the BUBBLE. most bond markets ARE the bubble

fiat trash ponzi garbage in the end

Okay, I'll sell my gold right away...oh wait I don't have any.

But even if I did, would I sell it? Probably not. Imagine if you wanted to sell it at 1400 an ounce, you'd be missing out. Even if it goes down it's no big deal, the purpose of gold is to save it, not spend it. It's meant as an safe haven against inflation not so much as a way to make profit.

Originally posted by filosophia
Okay, I'll sell my gold right away...oh wait I don't have any.

But even if I did, would I sell it? Probably not. Imagine if you wanted to sell it at 1400 an ounce, you'd be missing out. Even if it goes down it's no big deal, the purpose of gold is to save it, not spend it. It's meant as an safe haven against inflation not so much as a way to make profit.

The funny thing about gold is that everyone can buy it, but when it drops, no one wants to buy it for any price.

It's silly that all of you see this rampaging bubble, and don't even consider what it will be like when the markets correct and you try to sell before you lose everything. Sure, you might have bought it at $x an ounce, and you're comfortable selling at anything higher than that (like I believe that baloney!) but good luck actually trying to sell it.

Why don't you waltz into any precious metal dealer right now and try to get market value for your metal. I garuntee if you sell a silver dollar, worth around $41, you will be offered around $22.

So when "TSHTF" as you doomers like to say, your gold will not be worth what you think it will be, if you're even allowed to have it and use it, that is. It works both ways people, bubbles that is.

I'll leave the thread at that, good luck getting any value out of your metal when it counts!

reply to post by sbctinfantry


You are either naive or are just having fun fueling this debate. Not sure which one it is yet but I have a hard time believing someone can really be this stupid. Gold will be over $3,000 an ounce next year and before long will be over $5,000. Why? Because the Fed is currently INFLATING our currency! EVERYTHING is going to go up in price because the DOLLAR is losing it's value!

Anyways, it's getting pretty old hearing you say "Gold is a BUBBLE, get out quick!". If you honestly believe this... then you really are naive and there is no getting through to you.

reply to post by sbctinfantry


dude, you're not only rude and misinformed, you are very agenda-based

gold is real money . deal with it

people who buy it are not hyper trading it. thats why its the only real investment out t here other than fertilizer/grains