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Wisconsin Assembly Passes Anti-Union Bill

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posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 09:05 PM
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The days where unions were good for labor are far, far, long gone.

Unions are the hideouts of those who cannot compete with others on a level playing field in terms of knowledge, production, experience, efficiency.

They quickly price themselves out of the market, creating industry destruction.

Here, we're talking about non-competitive, non-productive (in terms of goods and services), public sector jobs that happen to be overpaid and prohibitively costly.

The alternative is to declare bankruptcy, void all union contracts, and start over with legislation that prohibits public service employees from unionizing. If you don't like the environment - then don't hire on. Find another job.

Unions nationwide should be limited in total to counties. No larger organizations, no larger affiliations, no larger associations.

If a union is needed within a county, let them unionize, and that's it. Of course any canny businessman will just move operations out of that county, but unions are nothing more than a legal criminal organization.

I do hope that Congress passes a National Right to Work law, and that successive states start choking off the unions. After all, the public sector is the last great bastion of unions in America.

That sector is eliminated, and unions will collapse from disinterest.

As it should be.




posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 09:17 PM
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I don't think you can really make the general statement that all unions are evil and must go. Whether a union is effective depends on the circumstances of the workers and the transparency of the union. When it comes to the public sector, unions are usually abusive and ineffective because there money is counted as a sure thing. They have no discrepancies about proposing astronomical wage increases in order to fatten their own wallets when they take their little cut. God forbid any private union should propose 1/4 of the ridiculous impositions brought forth by most of these guys, needless to say employers would let all their employees walk and simply rehire. If it is economical to a private business then why would we, the taxpayers, take that kind of financial abuse?



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 09:20 PM
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Unions = More money, less accountability.

They are there to protect the weakest of the employees. They were completely necessary almost a century ago, but now it's just an organized form of extortion. Good riddance.



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 10:05 PM
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Originally posted by Vitchilo


Better start now then wait for all the country to be bankrupt, or a new false-flag is pulled, or a new war started, or the dollar collapse... let's start it now.

It's not quite over yet, they still need democrats in the senate to pass it.


Our country has been bankrupt for a while now.

And by the way...who voted for these loser democrats that won't even show up? Common...seriously....if republicans did this they would be blasted by the left.



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 10:06 PM
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Agreed. Unions became mostly obsolete long ago when minimum wage was established and equal opportunity laws were put into place. I have been a member of several unions, not by choice mind you, and they did nothing but take my money. They did nothing to prevent hostile work environments or help me or any of my co-workers if supervisors became unreasonable. Of course public employees will be paying more out of pocket for their benefits but compromise is necessary when everyone is broke. I mean, taxes pertain to them too so why would they want to keep unions and pay even higher taxes on top of it all?
edit on 25-2-2011 by XxXAmmoXxX because: Typo



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 10:55 PM
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Originally posted by XxXAmmoXxX
Agreed. Unions became mostly obsolete long ago when minimum wage was established and equal opportunity laws were put into place. I have been a member of several unions, not by choice mind you, and they did nothing but take my money. They did nothing to prevent hostile work environments or help me or any of my co-workers if supervisors became unreasonable.

Then they didn't do their jobs...but plenty of stewards not only take their work seriously, they also take it home with them.



posted on Feb, 26 2011 @ 12:36 AM
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reply to post by WeRpeons
 


You get what you pay for. What intelligent person would want to teach on a salary they couldn't even live on? Average teacher pay in this country is 40 to 43K depending on the grade level. Some states pay more, some less, but that's the average. That is opposed to Switzerland's average of almost 70K. Germany/Denmark (around 50 a hour), South Korea (77), and Japan pay a lot more. The U.S. Average is actually around 35 dollars and hour AND they put in more work hours. No one in their right mind would want to teach in this country. You are treated with intense disrespect and paid crap. If you want to teach do it abroad. Lesson learned.



posted on Feb, 26 2011 @ 01:24 AM
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I don't mean to offend with my opinions but I can only speak for what I have personally experienced. Like I said before, making sweeping generalizations is ridiculous as there are situations in which unions can be really beneficial.



posted on Feb, 26 2011 @ 01:51 AM
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All Right! The race for the bottom continues! Let's strip people of access of the pensions they paid into, because the states mismanaged the funds! And pay teacher's less! It's the BEST way to attract TOP NOTCH educators! Maybe all these jobs that will suposedly be created by the tax incentives to out-of-state companies can replace some of the jobs that the governor just killed.



posted on Feb, 26 2011 @ 01:54 AM
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I have seen a lot of opinions expressed claiming that 'unions' are why certain states are experiencing budget deficits.

Interestingly enough, not one of these opinions has been substantiated by any EVIDENCE.



posted on Feb, 26 2011 @ 02:05 AM
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Hi there! I think what this governor is doing is WRONG however with that said we do need some change within the unions.My biggest gripe is the tenor the teachers get.....We have thousands of good teachers and probably just as many may be more horrible teachers and they CANT get fired.....They get to do what they want and collect big money and THEN a huge pension when they retire and that's DISGUSTING.....I don't know what the answer is to revamp the unions....

The chancellor of schools in Washington DC tried to get the union to give up tenor for teachers in exchange for raising the pay of GOOD teachers and they said NO.....She wanted to be able to fire the bad ones if they didn't change and the union wanted no part in it....So there you go someone tried and it didn't work.She has sense quit her job and is on to bigger better things to HELP the schools in the US.....I hope i didn't get off track in this thread but just wanted to show that the way Scott Walker is going about these budget cuts is WRONG.And i have to say a big YAY!! to the democrats who are not showing up to vote!!!.....Many Kudos to them!!!

Now one way of getting our country out of debt from what i learned from this writer... just raise the taxes on the upper 1-2% of the rich and it can be done.It was done before and there's no reason it cant be done now .Its also a MUST to bring back our factory's to the USA.....Just want to share part of a article that is from a writer from the SF examiner.....Read below


The solution to the huge debt brought about by WWII was not austerity, but exactly that which Republicans have removed from the table — high top marginal tax rates. The 24% rate in effect when the market melted down in 1929 was raised to 63% in the early 1930s and sat at 81% when the nation went to war. It spent many years over 90% and never dropped below 70% until 1982.

The notion in post-war America was that those who benefited most from our society should give back accordingly. It was an ethic based on the premise of unity, of patriotism and the greater good. The wealthy were taxed heavily on their top marginal dollars, but contrary to the scary scenarios of economic ruin predicted by contemporary Republicans, the economy flourished.

Our economy boomed into the mid 1970s, bringing about a sort of golden age of American capitalism. During that period the GDP multiplied many times over, the middle class swelled, unemployment remained low, and prosperity was shared by most Americans. The rich still got richer, but not at a rate significantly faster than the rest of the populace. Massive concentration of wealth was avoided, and the bottom 90% of Americans enjoyed their peak income year in 1973. Through it all, we remained a country united.

But the sense of unity that had thrived for more than 30 yearsThe solution to the huge debt brought about by WWII was not austerity, but exactly that which Republicans have removed from the table — high top marginal tax rates. The 24% rate in effect when the market melted down in 1929 was raised to 63% in the early 1930s and sat at 81% when the nation went to war. It spent many years over 90% and never dropped below 70% until 1982.

The notion in post-war America was that those who benefited most from our society should give back accordingly. It was an ethic based on the premise of unity, of patriotism and the greater good. The wealthy were taxed heavily on their top marginal dollars, but contrary to the scary scenarios of economic ruin predicted by contemporary Republicans, the economy flourished.

Our economy boomed into the mid 1970s, bringing about a sort of golden age of American capitalism. During that period the GDP multiplied many times over, the middle class swelled, unemployment remained low, and prosperity was shared by most Americans. The rich still got richer, but not at a rate significantly faster than the rest of the populace. Massive concentration of wealth was avoided, and the bottom 90% of Americans enjoyed their peak income year in 1973. Through it all, we remained a country united.

But the sense of unity that had thrived for more than 30 years.....If you wish to read more click on link to finish article.

www.examiner.com...


edit on 26-2-2011 by Goldie because: sp



posted on Feb, 26 2011 @ 02:10 AM
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Originally posted by Goldie
Hi there! I think what this governor is doing is WRONG however with that said we do need some change within the unions.My biggest gripe is the tenor the teachers get.....We have thousands of good teachers and probably just as many may be more horrible teachers and they CANT get fired.....They get to do what they want and collect big money and THEN a huge pension when they retire and that's DISGUSTING.....


"Big Money"??

Why SHOULDN'T they get pensions they paid into?


The chancellor of schools in Washington DC tried to get the union to give up tenor for teachers in exchange for raising the pay of GOOD teachers and they said NO.....She wanted to be able to fire the bad ones if they didn't change and the union wanted no part in it....


You don't see the potential subjective judgment involved in deciding who is 'bad'?



posted on Feb, 26 2011 @ 02:11 AM
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Unions are bull snip. Nobody should be guaranteed job security and regular raises just because they belong to a pack of wolves.

Yes, I generalized, but unions are whats wrong with this country.

And, yes...I have union blood in my family.



posted on Feb, 26 2011 @ 03:43 AM
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There is really a lot more corruption in unions than I think people realize. My significant other volunteered as a shop steward for 5 years and he really fought to help people who were targeted unfairly but ultimately the employer does what he/she wants. I would say that 90% of the time the rule book was just thrown out. In all honesty many private sector unions exist to provide corporations with a facetious veil of civility.



posted on Feb, 26 2011 @ 08:42 AM
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Originally posted by Goldie
Hi there! I think what this governor is doing is WRONG however with that said we do need some change within the unions.My biggest gripe is the tenor the teachers get.....We have thousands of good teachers and probably just as many may be more horrible teachers and they CANT get fired.....They get to do what they want and collect big money and THEN a huge pension when they retire and that's DISGUSTING.....I don't know what the answer is to revamp the unions....

The chancellor of schools in Washington DC tried to get the union to give up tenor for teachers in exchange for raising the pay of GOOD teachers and they said NO.....She wanted to be able to fire the bad ones if they didn't change and the union wanted no part in it....So there you go someone tried and it didn't work.She has sense quit her job and is on to bigger better things to HELP the schools in the US.....I hope i didn't get off track in this thread but just wanted to show that the way Scott Walker is going about these budget cuts is WRONG.And i have to say a big YAY!! to the democrats who are not showing up to vote!!!.....Many Kudos to them!!!


TENURE, a Tenor is a singer (Like this). Tenure is a problem, but I feel far too many of you shirk personal responsibility (oooh i just sounded like a Republican there) when it comes to children's education. Study after study have proven that even students in mediocre school systems can have good grades, good test scores and good ACT/SAT scores with plenty of PARENTAL INVOLVEMENT. That's the problem. Too many kids are sitting on their butts watching tv and momma doesn't care. Or she's at work and can't do anything about it. Why in the hell should teacher's care when it's obvious most parents don't care. Then there is the constant abuse from bratty kids. We've always had problems with Anti-Intellectualism in this country though. It is why teacher's are not respected here. If you go to Japan or South Korea, the prevailing attitude is that you cannot do something if you can't teach it someone else. The American saying is "Those that can't do teach". Very different viewpoints there. Perhaps we have problems with education because it is not valued in this country.

At the end of the day, this all union busting crap. If you go to Germany, which has the strongest economy in Europe right now, at least a quarter of the work force is unionized. There are 5 to 6 different teacher's unions. They still manage to educate better than we do. But you know, once we bust all the unions in this country maybe the GOP can turn it's attention directly on the poor and blame them for everything. That's next.



posted on Feb, 26 2011 @ 08:46 AM
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reply to post by amongus
 


Good news. It's over. The GOP wins.
Here is the plan. The bill has already passed the assembly. It has been moved to the Senate.
Wasn't that a wonderful 1 AM wake up call for the sleep deprived liberals.

Now if the fugitives do not return just strip the "collective bargaining" out of the existing bill and
pass that. Gov. Scott Walker will sign it and make it law.
When they eventually return to grab their paychecks pass the "collective bargaining".

- Rights of the Majority -



posted on Feb, 26 2011 @ 09:04 AM
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That explians why Missouri Legislator Jane Cunningham Wants to Increase Child Labor, again another assault on union won landmarks!

Not only that, she's trying to turn the State into a 'right to work' one.

Anti unionism at its finest.

“With an unemployment rate at nearly ten percent, Missouri must consider every obstacle to putting our citizens back to work,” Ridgeway said. “It is clear that job producers and the workers who take those jobs are voting with their feet on the ‘Right to Work’ issue because they are moving to states that have this protection.”



by the way, worker protection laws, also know as “Right to Work” laws are NOT even remotely related to worker protection. they often refer to right-to-work states as "right to work for less" states or "right-to-fire" states... get the clue?



posted on Feb, 26 2011 @ 09:14 AM
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The Libertarian Party opposes "right to work" laws for a very good reason-- they are government interference with private contracts. Libertarians don't like most labor laws but they also support "compulsory unionism" if that's what workers and employers negotiate in a contract.

"we urge repeal of the National Labor Relations Act, and all state Right-to-Work Laws which prohibit employers from making voluntary contracts with unions. We oppose all government back-to-work orders as the imposition of a form of forced labor."

Read up on Unicor idiots..."when the inmate is working, so is the system."

Go non union FEMAbots... read the Patriot Act AGAIN REX 87 lovers... hey DHScepticons... got a TRANSFORMER in your HAARP controlled lives?



posted on Feb, 26 2011 @ 09:14 AM
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There has to be a threat of law or unions to coerce smart employers into stop loss pay schemes
other wise you are just another chinee carrying nitro into the tunnel.

On the other hand you can't have a privileged class like say teachers, with a terrible success rate, where kids are proven to do better at home, expecting pensions and outlandish benefits while the people that are "paying" now are starving, and having to teach their kids at home anyway (statistically, if you want them to be able to read, you better...)...

Only people who can't function in the real world could condone that.
Which means they should NOT be teaching our children because:

Oh, these teachers taught the legislaters and the lawyers and everyone else involved.
GOD HELP US ALL

edit on 26-2-2011 by Danbones because: (no reason given)

edit on 26-2-2011 by Danbones because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 26 2011 @ 11:26 AM
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Originally posted by amongus
Unions are bull snip. Nobody should be guaranteed job security and regular raises just because they belong to a pack of wolves.

Yes, I generalized, but unions are whats wrong with this country.




Wow. I had no idea. UNIONS are what's 'wrong with this country'. Not state legislatures with mis-allocated pension funds for pet projects, not Democrats and Republicans who authorize President's to wage endless wars, not a corrupt former MMS allowing BP to spew millions of gallons of oil all over the gulf coast.... NOPE, it's UNIONS, groups of people organizing to give themselves and equal playing feild on the job market whcih is heavily slanted towards employers..

Yep, America was SO much better becofre unions ruined everything.

Why, I remember when if a shoeless child wanted to work in a factory 18 hours a day, the Big Bad Gubbermint didn't step in and say no! Those were the days!



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