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Wisconsin shows rest of country the real union thuggery going on in this country

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posted on Feb, 20 2011 @ 01:15 AM
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reply to post by robyn
 


Prove it false.

Around here, you can't get away with bald assertions like that.

Document your claim, back it up with proof, not feelings.

Problem is you can't:


The garment industry around the world is renowned for low wages, excessive overtime and poor working conditions. In many cases, even the legal minimum wages set for workers in the apparel industry fail to provide enough income to maintain a family of four above the nationally defined poverty level.

The consequences of poverty wages are most clearly seen in excessive working hours and disrupted family life. Poverty wages push many workers into debt, lead to malnutrition, cause health problems, and make workers and their dependents extremely vulnerable to unemployment, disability, and faster decline in old age. What is more, growing inequality within a country can reduce social cohesion and result in unrest.

Labour rights’ advocates have always argued that a minimum living wage is a cornerstone of decent working conditions, because sufficient wages are essential to workers’ well-being. Insufficient wages imply that individuals, families and communities who depend upon wage labour for their well-being cannot lead a dignified life. This demand is in line with the United Nations Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Article 23(3) states: “Everyone who works has the right to just and favourable remuneration ensuring for himself and his family an existence worthy of human dignity, and supplemented, if necessary, by other means of social protection.”

The International Labour Organisation (ILO), which is the United Nations’ body that sets labour standards, also endorses a living wage standard. The Preamble to the ILO Constitution notes that peace and harmony in the world require “the provision of an adequate living wage”. The ILO Constitution mentions the need to develop: “policies in regard to wages and earnings, hours and other conditions of work, designed to ensure a just share of the fruits of progress to all and a minimum living wage to all employed and in need of such protection.”


goodelectroni... cs.org/news-en/asian-floor-wage-for-garment-workers-expressed-in-2018purchasing-power-parity-in-us-2019/


In many countries wages are set in two stages, where industry-level collective bargaining is followed by firm-specific arrangements determining actual paid wages as a mark-up on the industry wage floor. What explains the wage set in each of these stages? In this paper we show that both the industry wage floor and the average wage cushion are systematically associated with the degree of firm heterogeneity in the industry: The former (latter) is negatively (positively) associated with the productivity spread. Furthermore, since the response of the wage floor dominates that of the wage cushion, workers in more heterogeneous industries tend to get lower actual paid wages. These conclusions are reached in a model of Cournot oligopoly with firm productivity heterogeneity and a two-tiered wage setting system. They are then confirmed by administrative data covering virtually all workers, firms and collective bargaining agreements of the Portuguese private sector for the period 1991–2000.


www.sciencedirect.com... fmt=high&_orig=search&_origin=search&_sort=d&_docanchor=&view=c&_searchStrId=1648300137&_rerunOrigin=google&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0& _userid=10&md5=cda0d35f5e6989e0409a6e740c9ed2ad&searchtype=a

There's lots more studies that make the connection and prove the fact that unions lift wages for all workers, not just union members.




posted on Feb, 20 2011 @ 09:19 AM
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Please give george 5 min of your time...

This man called it years before it came down the pipe





posted on Feb, 20 2011 @ 01:34 PM
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Originally posted by YouSir
Ummm........waaa...effin....waaa.....your really choking me up here with that "cry me a river" crap. So if you lose your collective bargaining rights and some of your player perks, then you'll be just like.....the herd. Oh my god......not the....herd!!!
Welcome to the real world.....skippy...why don't you try your lil violin solo out on some of the "unemployed", see if they don't rip you a new one. MOF, I'm quite certain that if you can't see beyond your selfishness, and your mad desire to be "the last straw that broke the countries back", that one of those unemployed would...gladly...take your job and quite succinctly...forego...unionism altogether.

YouSir......are an....


What are you talking about? lol...



posted on Feb, 20 2011 @ 03:09 PM
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So now the GOP folks here are damning the teachers for bailing on kids.
Lolz.
Thats right let us take away any of your worker rights and you just stay at work where we Need you.
Republicans WTF is the deal with the high disdain for any worker rights?
I really dont understand why underpaid and underfunded teachers(avg pay $28-$40K btw) and their minor union protection is such a stick in youre craw.
How did so many regular folks become driven too Hate any benefit that elevates a persons(your fellow citizen) living?
Wow.
Go GOP Go!
Crush that pesky Avg income earner and pad the rich. Go Baby!

edit on 20-2-2011 by VType because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 20 2011 @ 06:00 PM
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Originally posted by robyn

Originally posted by Zaanny
People seem to not understand that union wages set the bar for a working wage.
Hence increases non union wages....
If collective barraging goes out the window so does prevailing wages.
and lower wages across the board...

That is a completely false statement. Years ago there may have been some truth to that, but no longer.

How many years ago?

A decade ago, my 'enlightened' employer arbitrarily decided that instead of the two categories of employees getting the same percentage of annual increase, one would get a raise, and the other take a cut.

That's when we got a union.

And as chief steward, my job was to enforce the agreement that the employer had negotiated and signed. I was a busy guy.



posted on Feb, 20 2011 @ 08:59 PM
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reply to post by robyn
 


Whoa Nelly...

The assumption Robyn is that you are informed on the law, regulations, civics and how our system works.

You are suggesting the teachers should show the students how to give up their rights by returning to work? I want my son's teacher to show him how to fight for his rights.



posted on Feb, 20 2011 @ 09:28 PM
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Originally posted by ~Lucidity

Originally posted by HoldTheBeans

So is everybody else's retirement funds. Welcome to reality.

Are you saying that because you and/or other people lost their retirement funds because no one in the corporate world or in the government was willing to help, these people should too?
edit on 2/19/2011 by ~Lucidity because: (no reason given)


No I'm saying exactly what I posted.........welcome to reality.



posted on Feb, 20 2011 @ 09:35 PM
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Originally posted by VType
So now the GOP folks here are damning the teachers for bailing on kids.
Lolz.
Thats right let us take away any of your worker rights and you just stay at work where we Need you.
Republicans WTF is the deal with the high disdain for any worker rights?
I really dont understand why underpaid and underfunded teachers(avg pay $28-$40K btw) and their minor union protection is such a stick in youre craw.
How did so many regular folks become driven too Hate any benefit that elevates a persons(your fellow citizen) living?
Wow.
Go GOP Go!
Crush that pesky Avg income earner and pad the rich. Go Baby!

edit on 20-2-2011 by VType because: (no reason given)


You union lovers are always howling about the low pay that say the teachers are then turn around and spout how wonderful the unions are. If they are so underpaid how is the union helping them?? LOL. Your making no sense.

All these unions do is punish achievers. You go to work and bust your butt and you get the same raise as some joker who works the system and doesn't do diddly and then is protected by the union to keep his/her job. Instead of the achievers moving up you watch as those with seniority keep moving up while you see that busting your butt is gettin you nowhere so you leave or become one of the jokers with seniority. What does everybody do when they drive by and watch one guy working on the road and ten others standing around watching him? Shake their heads and mumble unions.



posted on Feb, 20 2011 @ 09:38 PM
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Originally posted by angelwrangler
reply to post by robyn
 


Whoa Nelly...

The assumption Robyn is that you are informed on the law, regulations, civics and how our system works.

You are suggesting the teachers should show the students how to give up their rights by returning to work? I want my son's teacher to show him how to fight for his rights.


What rights are they giving up? Show me what Constitutional rights these teachers are being infringed upon. You can't because they aren't denying anything other than these children getting their education by these teachers. Fight for rights my arse. That's ridiculous.



posted on Feb, 20 2011 @ 10:02 PM
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reply to post by HoldTheBeans
 


Constitutional rights?

Where did you go to school? How long has it been since you had civics? When did you last read the Bill of Rights? Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness ring a bell...the Liberty Bell perhaps?

What the hell are you talking about! I gave Robyn her do, YES, it should NOT be mandatory to join a union and YES, they must be audited and YES, if there are RICOH issues, they must be aggressively addressed.

What do you do for a living? Because here is how it is...see this in your minds eye...

The minute you step into work tomorrow you are not only, by default, accepting a cut in pay and a cut in your pension, whether agreed to or not by you, you are giving up your right to bargain for your salary, your medical benefits or your pension.

OK with you? Does not matter. Cannot petition, cannot take them to court, have no rights with the EDD or the Industrial Relations Board...SOL.

That is what you want a fellow American to do.

Slave time everybody?

NWO everybody.



posted on Feb, 20 2011 @ 10:12 PM
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Originally posted by angelwrangler
reply to post by HoldTheBeans
 


Constitutional rights?

Where did you go to school? How long has it been since you had civics? When did you last read the Bill of Rights? Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness ring a bell...the Liberty Bell perhaps?

What the hell are you talking about! I gave Robyn her do, YES, it should NOT be mandatory to join a union and YES, they must be audited and YES, if there are RICOH issues, they must be aggressively addressed.

What do you do for a living? Because here is how it is...see this in your minds eye...

The minute you step into work tomorrow you are not only, by default, accepting a cut in pay and a cut in your pension, whether agreed to or not by you, you are giving up your right to bargain for your salary, your medical benefits or your pension.

OK with you? Does not matter. Cannot petition, cannot take them to court, have no rights with the EDD or the Industrial Relations Board...SOL.

That is what you want a fellow American to do.

Slave time everybody?

NWO everybody.


LOL so collective bargaining is akin to pursuit of happiness and now liberty? Your one lost pup. All these cuts your whining about can be simply avoided by getting another job. Nobody is forcing these folks to work where they are. Go into the private sector or are they afraid they won't be able to peddle their craft with the talent out there and won't have a union to protect them from their work performance? Funny how 90% of folks who work get along fine with their rights being violated every day in your eyes anyway. lol



posted on Feb, 20 2011 @ 10:49 PM
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reply to post by HoldTheBeans
 


I have worked in the private sector all my life. I have owned businesses and provided for my employees, sort of a mini-union if you will.

So your answer to everyone in the unions is to go out and get a private sector job... do you provide for your employees? Do you know how much that costs?

... and all you have to say to me is that I am one lost pup... a pup who has worked in the area of/generated hundreds of millions of dollars in our economy.

Has anyone advised you that you put no real substance into your posts, that when people actually do put real thought into posts, you are unable to mirror that.

Insincerity with other peoples lives is shameful.



posted on Feb, 21 2011 @ 07:13 AM
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Originally posted by angelwrangler
reply to post by HoldTheBeans
 


I have worked in the private sector all my life. I have owned businesses and provided for my employees, sort of a mini-union if you will.

So your answer to everyone in the unions is to go out and get a private sector job... do you provide for your employees? Do you know how much that costs?

... and all you have to say to me is that I am one lost pup... a pup who has worked in the area of/generated hundreds of millions of dollars in our economy.

Has anyone advised you that you put no real substance into your posts, that when people actually do put real thought into posts, you are unable to mirror that.

Insincerity with other peoples lives is shameful.


You call substance in a post declaring folks constitutional rights are being violated and then throw the garbage you did up to back it up?? LOL. Now you come back talking about the hundreds of millions of dollars you have generated for the economy.

Me thinks your full of poop.



posted on Feb, 21 2011 @ 07:51 AM
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reply to post by HoldTheBeans
 


I wonder if his Business has Mini-Debt,to go along with his mini-Union.
I jest....... Why not just go out and get a Government Job,and forgo the private sector all together? I would think the benefits and the rewards would out way the struggle he so graciously like to point out....Care to show some figures,on how your business is doing? Sorry,I cant buy into this with out some facts to back it up.

On topic......
The Unions of today,have done nothing for the average taxpayer,except drive Government into more debt. Its funny.Where were all these people when our Government was driving up the cost of debt ? Voting for the very ones that put us in that debt.Voting with Union solidarity,for the candidate that their Union Officials subscribed to. Socialism at its finest. Big Government,with out no checks and balances. Its all a game really,designed to suck us all dry.



edit on 21-2-2011 by sonnny1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 21 2011 @ 08:50 AM
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Collective bargaining is a process of voluntary negotiations between employers and trade unions aimed at reaching agreements which regulate working conditions. Collective agreements usually set out wage scales, working hours, training, health and safety, overtime, grievance mechanisms and rights to participate in workplace or company affairs.

en.wikipedia.org...

Here's the deal, folks. Gov. Walker says public unions have to start paying in, and NO collective bargaining.
Why?
Because if he allowed collective bargaining, they could just "renegotiate" these new mesures and contract renewal. If these new measures are to last, "collective bargaining" has to go.



posted on Feb, 21 2011 @ 09:00 AM
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Originally posted by sonnny1
reply to post by HoldTheBeans
 


I wonder if his Business has Mini-Debt,to go along with his mini-Union.
I jest....... Why not just go out and get a Government Job,and forgo the private sector all together? I would think the benefits and the rewards would out way the struggle he so graciously like to point out....Care to show some figures,on how your business is doing? Sorry,I cant buy into this with out some facts to back it up.

On topic......
The Unions of today,have done nothing for the average taxpayer,except drive Government into more debt. Its funny.Where were all these people when our Government was driving up the cost of debt ? Voting for the very ones that put us in that debt.Voting with Union solidarity,for the candidate that their Union Officials subscribed to. Socialism at its finest. Big Government,with out no checks and balances. Its all a game really,designed to suck us all dry.



edit on 21-2-2011 by sonnny1 because: (no reason given)


Don't these dems have to return and vote or thousands will be laid off?? I doubt they really care as their thug buddies in Illinois put out the red carpet for em.

I also love how these unions hate the evil corporations. If it weren't for the evil corporations employing people to pay taxes the unions can steal then they wouldn't have a job to begin with. I am amazed how some folks can't figure out that public sector unions should neve have started to begin with. Public jobs serve the taxpayers not the other way around. That whole thing got lost somewhere along the way.



posted on Feb, 21 2011 @ 09:22 AM
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reply to post by HoldTheBeans
 


Im not a Dem or a Repub. I am a Taxpayer,unfortunately. The Unions are just another wannabe arm of the Government. They care not of their Union members. They care about the profits,and are willing to do whatever is necessary to keep the profits from coming in. Union officials are like CEO's,at least thats what one member who was pro-Union said on this site. My question is why do they need 24 CEO's making 150k in one Union alone? That in itself should send a red flag to ANY Union member out there. When Union officials are making more money then the Governor,the public has a right to call them out. Collective Bargaining works well,when your on top of the pyramid.



posted on Feb, 21 2011 @ 11:28 AM
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The "union" folks say that they are sacrificing by being in unions because folks in the private sector are making more then in the same breath say the unions are doing such a great job. We'll if they're doing such a great job why aren't they making what folks in the private sector are?

Unions worked for the worker until the mob and politicians got involved. Simple as that.



posted on Feb, 21 2011 @ 11:40 AM
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Why not just protest to reinstate the glass-steagall act? I hear it's coming anyway...



posted on Feb, 21 2011 @ 12:11 PM
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Originally posted by siddisone
Why not just protest to reinstate the glass-steagall act? I hear it's coming anyway...


Protest to get rid of the federal reserve.

Actually a lot of em are just there to protest about anything. I saw some running around looking for soldiers to spit on.



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