14yr Old Rape Victim Beaten to Death by Islamic Court

Originally posted by Illusionsaregrander
reply to post by hp1229

 

My point is that people foaming at the mouth with hate, and venom at Islam, are just the same as the people who whipped that girl to death. Its that same mindset, that little orgasm of hate and judgment, that leads to violence. That extreme judgmentalism, is what leads to little girls being whipped to death. Or wars, or stonings, or burnings at the stake, or abortion clinic bombings, you name it.

Concur. I hate hypocrits. One should look at themselves and their society/religion before pointing fingers at others. Somethings are better left for the folks on the other side to sort it out themselves. I'm sure there are several flaws that the rest of the world will find with the American Culture to which we do not agree and we are defensive about it. Likewise its the same with someone else who feels what they believe or act upon is right and others are wrong.

Originally posted by notsoperfect
reply to post by Illusionsaregrander

 

All religion is barbaric? Where did you get that idea? How can you be barbaric by being killed by his own enemies only after showing mercy and love on them? Mohammed was barbaric because he killed many of the non believers.

You taken a good look at the Old Testament lately? Read some Leviticus.

Originally posted by MavRck
reply to post by HunkaHunka

 

No... that's the whole point. But there have been documentaries, movies, and real life experiences.


Think about your days in high-school. The girl that slept with more than 1 guy (regardless of her feelings or how desperately the guy tried to get into her pants) she is thrown at, spat on, laughed at, ridiculed.

It happens everywhere. It makes very little sense. The boys sleep with whoever they want, whenever they want, in fact in competetion numbers...

Yet the girls... are the "sluts" when the day is done.

(Do not take what I posted previously as suggesting the US courts would allow or go along with it. American people would/do/have... and it is hidden, not publicized. Obviously not in the same fashion, or sense as the islamic case.)

It would take more than simple ignorance to put forth such an idiotic statement. Are you really putting up an American girl being labeled as a slut in high school (through actions of her own choice, no less) as somehow morally equivalent to systematic blaming of and brutally punishing child rape victims?

Talk about a disgusting exaggeration. You must really feel guilty about living in a part of the world where sanity and justice is more than a distant illusion.

Hmmm... Let me try. Your kind of reasoning is as sick and evil as that of the Islamists themselves because yours leads to murder too, but at least you ought to know better.

Originally posted by Illusionsaregrander
reply to post by hp1229

 

Buddhism is clearly designed to be more humane than the Abrahamic religions. But in the wrong hands, who knows what it could devolve to.

Agreed. Precisely my point about amendments and alterations to the belief system can give any religion a bad name. I have not read Quran nor do I know much about it. I'm sure there are similar factors at work with that particular religion as well where it was probably re-written extensively over the course of its birth and history.

Originally posted by notsoperfect

Not all hatred is the same as you again try to ofusticate the point with your callous generalization. You can not become evil by hating evil. You can not become corrupt by hating the corruption.

This "love everything" and "do not judge others" is a very dangerous concept which will make you end up tolerating evil and make you become a part of it.

Jesus, quite obviously, disagreed with you. As do I. You absolutely can become evil hating evil, and corrupt hating corruption. In fact, it is the shortest route.

reply to post by ModernAcademia


This is too awful for words. Why should we not be concerned about a culture of such violence attempting to impose its horrific behavior on the rest of the world? Tired of hearing this isn't all Muslims. Yeah, right, so what?
Where is the outrage in the Muslim world?

reply to post by celimonster


I would rather walk away from the scene if there is no other choice. You don't know what you are talking about.

This same idea can become the justification of the mercy killings of the sick elderly or terminal cancer patients.

Imagine, your mother is suffering with a terminal cancer and there is no hope for her except the excruciating pain and you'd rather kill her with a brick. Is that the way you think is a love for her?

Are you all insane?

I can't believe these sick minded people swarming ATS.

reply to post by notsoperfect


the thing is, sharia law is what should be the focal point, as this is their form of government in the situation. their law givers, agreed to this, and occassionally, their people see the opportunity to use it to their own ends. since some of them are just as likely to have mental problems as any other part of humanity, it's not hard to figure out how this happens. what needs to take place here is for their own people to call for an end to the whole women are not as trustworthy as men, thing, as i think the case is pretty easy to make that men are just as untrustworthy as women.

Originally posted by arollingstone
reply to post by The time lord

 

Talk about selective and biased referencing! There are many ways to interpret the language of the Qur'an, most of what you have posted is not from the Qur'an - Hadith are not based on the Qur'an and why do you write so much [in brackets]? The Qur'an does not have those brackets, where did you source that information? Besides, thats what scholars are for - debate and evolution of religious morality. Muslims do not follow most of what you have just posted.

Take a look at this website, it is the equivalent of what you have just posted.
www.evilbible.com...

Maybe there many ways to interpret the Quran but does not mean people and laws based on what I quoted does not happen, I quoted what some people believe and do according to their actions which can be referenced back to what they read, you don't have to be a genius to know how Middle East societies behave according to how their prophet behaved, it happens all the time and it seems no one really knows how to behave according to the Quran and the balance weighed between being peaceful and extreme is just to risky being caught in between a society that does not even know its own laws let alone people making their own from it.

Originally posted by Honor93

how utterly disgusting of you to view an act of mercy as some warped sense of kindness.
May you soul find peace someday.

Do you even know what the words kindness and mercy mean?
An act of mercy is an act of kindness.

kindness:

1. ability to behave kindly: the practice of being or the tendency to be sympathetic and compassionate

2. compassionate act: an act that shows consideration and caring

mercy:

1. compassion: kindness or forgiveness shown especially to somebody a person has power over

2. compassionate disposition: a disposition to be compassionate or forgiving of others

3. something to be thankful for: a welcome event or situation that provides relief or prevents something unpleasant from happening

4. easing of distress: the easing of distress or pain

If you still don't get the link between kindness and mercy, perhaps this explanation may help:

Human Kindness is All About Having Mercy Toward Others

(2 Samuel 9:3.) Human kindness is closely linked to the concept of mercy. Mercy is defined in the dictionary as “compassionate or kindly forbearance shown toward an offender, an enemy, or other person in one's power; compassion, pity, or benevolence:”. To have mercy on someone is at the heart of human kindness.

Read the story...and just a note to those who look to generalize here...whether it be "Muslims" or those countries...

(1) The Gov. arrested the Cleric and 3 others involved in the flogging. They are looking for 14 others.

A Muslim cleric and three others have been arrested, and today the country's High Court ordered officials in Shariatpur to explain why they did not protect Hena Begum, who died Monday following the fatwa punishment, The Daily Star writes from the capital, Dhaka.

BBC News says police are seeking 14 others in connection with her death, including a teacher from a local madrassa.

The local villagers...who I have to assume are nearly exclusively muslim...rose up and rallied against the elders and clerics....demanding they be prosecuted.

Villagers rallied today in Shariatpur against the village court, which consists of elders and clerics, and demanded that they be prosecuted.

Lastly...these types of punishment were outlawed by the Gov.

The village council decreed the lashing under Islamic s haria law, but the country's High Court outlawed such harsh punishments last year.

www.usatoday.com...

Just wanted to give some context to anyone that takes the intellectually lazy view that all Muslims think the same as the small minority...or that the Government of Bangladesh allows these punishments...and that Muslims themselves are not outraged at this. They filled the streets demanding the clerics to be punished.


As for this poor girl.....may justice be fierce and mercilous for those that tortured her.

Jesus, quite obviously, disagreed with you. As do I. You absolutely can become evil hating evil, and corrupt hating corruption. In fact, it is the shortest route.

reply to post by Illusionsaregrander


Jesus frequently called the Pharisees "sons of serpents" as they are evil doers while preaching morals. I don't think Jesus ever taught his disciples to love evil. Why don't you quote one?

You just got caught lying.

Originally posted by arollingstone
Please do not nitpick, it is a hostile and desperate method of debate. I did not explicitly state what you said I did - I admittedly worded my sentence poorly seeing as I was not specific enough. Generalisability is a term used in statistics and trend analysis, it reflects part of what makes research accurate - that your findings are generalisable over a larger portion of a population (i.e. can your findings accurately represent the trends inherent in a larger scale population). If you had attempted to research it, you would have discovered that it is in fact a real word.

I will post some better links below about Sharia, please read about it for your understanding (as well as that of many other forum members) is very limited. It is not simply the concept of law based on Islamic morality. This subject isn't about Islam, but too many people have chosen to focus on the flaws of extreme forms Sharia Law - claiming that there is only one form. I have no reason to fabricate information to support my argument, I do not intend to deflect and do not have an agenda, merely just to ensure that those who comment on Sharia Law understand the nature of the system - it is extremely tiring ploughing through so much opinion stated as fact. I mentioned that drinking is legal here in order to highlight the wide range of laws that different countries may choose to adopt, under the umbrella form of Sharia Law. I too am non-religious, though I do believe in God my spiritual beliefs are personal and no longer based upon any holy book or religious doctrine but rather a combination of rationality and instinct.

Thanks.

Links:

www.reuters.com...

en.wikipedia.org...

www.opendemocracy.net...

edit on 9-2-2011 by arollingstone because: punctuation

i believe you are missing the point, entirely ... i could give a rats patuti about islam or shari'a except for the fact that both are intertwined in this story. I have -0- interest in either. Learned it, deny it and have made every effort to avoid it, since.

my concern is with the unacceptable behavior of the ppl involved ... the religious aspect only amplifies my disgust with the entire situation. it is not the basis of my dismay. Forced sex between a 40 and 14 yr old (which in my country is illegal) is enough to turn my stomach, thank you. The rest is just plain wrong.

perhaps your word "generalisable" can be common in your country but i'm guessing it kinda resembles 'generality, generalization or perhaps generalizing', in most places ... including all available online dictionaries (i looked). So, if we agree the word is not common to most, please debate in reality rather your imagination.

nitpicking?? i'm a fan of say what you mean and mean what you say ... not change it with each response.
as for quoting you, i didn't, i paraphrased and correctly at that. As your reply clearly indicates.
For the record, before re-stating yourself, your comments were ...

But as a side point, this is NOT common practice in all Muslim countries that practice Shariaa law - Muslim laws differ in temperance, just like they do in every other country.
This sort of punishment is not even dished out in Saudi (i.e. beating to death), the most infamous Shariaa state - it is an example of the uneducated villager mentality.

you stated it, as fact ... not i.

do not accuse me of nitpicking just because i proved you wrong. Grow up.
you have no idea what my level of understanding Shari'a is and i am offended that you assume any such thing.
no link, no BS and no lengthy diatribe is going to change my mind, either.
i am well versed in the concept and i do not agree with it one bit.

yes it is tiring to plough through the perpetual misrepresentations by those supposedly "in the know" ... i agree. and btw, you still haven't mentioned where "here" is ... so, i'm not believing a word of it, yet.

Soooo, if these words are true ...

I too am non-religious, though I do believe in God my spiritual beliefs are personal and no longer based upon any holy book or religious doctrine but rather a combination of rationality and instinct.

please, tell me again why you support the enforcement of Shari'a Law or it's oppressive nature? what rationale, justification or reason for tolerance of this intentional death, of a child, exists?

Dont forgot she apparently caused a big enough sin to be killed over. (worst sin in islam is interest, it is worst than sleeping with your mother on the kabaa)

Poor girl is raped. Her family beat her. Law kills her. Then she burns in eternity of hell.

These people are violent sub-human savages.

No quarter should be given.

whole women are not as trustworthy as men, thing, as i think the case is pretty easy to make that men are just as untrustworthy as women.

reply to post by undo


That is not the issue. Human being are human beings. They are not made to be 100% faithful to their spouses. The DNA of the humans are not made like the sea horses. If God wanted them to be, he/she would have corrected the human DNA long time ago. But obviously it didn't work. It didn't make humans grow in terms of intelligence and population as they were originally designed.

Or God may have wanted to see how humans can handle the issue and grow out of it.

It is the tolerance to grow out of your own selfish ego. That's what needed to be taught to humans in God's point of view.

reply to post by notsoperfect


Do you people not read your Bible? Your little statement on judgment and evil runs directly counter to the teachings of the person whom your religion is named after. You know, that guy you are supposed to be following. Lol.

kingjbible.com...

Matthew 5:38-48

Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth: 39But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also. 40And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloke also. 41And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain. 42Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.

43Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. 44But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; 45That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. 46For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? 47And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? 48Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Who here lives in or near the Shariatpur region of Bangladesh? Anyone? It's none of our buisness really what these folk do. Just as it's none of thiers what we do. If you disagree with what they do, go start a holy war and commit genocide upon the islamists. No one here is stopping you. This whole thread is just emotional baiting.

So certain extremist factions of Islam don't like the ways of the western world, so they participate in terror attacks around the globe, killing innocents, all because they don't approve of how we live.

Then, when they move to other countries in the western world, they want us to adapt to their lifestyle and beleifs, be accepting and cater to them, while they continue to rape, beat, and murder their very own women.

And, on top of all that, never an uproar from the so call "good muslims", who don't approve of the actions or ways of the extremeists.

It's almost more of a mental illness, with zero logic applied, than a religion with good intentions.

reply to post by undo

i agree that it is horrible, and i despise sharia law, but remember your personal world view, needs to be tempered by the reality that there are also people who hold your world view, that have committed crimes against humanity and still do commit such crimes. what we have here is a ready made container to stuff people into, as a means to condemn the whole lot. not saying i agree with it, not at all.

For my world view, read my signature. I did not misunderstand here or ignore you saying you hate Sharia Law. You said that then made an excuse for it. Why? For fear of the PC Police?

Nobody who holds my "world view" has ever commited an act of violence against anyone, except in self-defense. How do you expect me to react to that? If this was done by a Christian, a Buddist or anyone else, my view and outrage would be the same and I'd hope any decent person would speak out loudly and not make excuses for those who are making an appologetic argument.

Culture has nothing to do with right and wrong and culture aside, the world can not tollerate this and bury their heads in the sand about it. We are now a world community like it or not.

A few posts ago someone actually equated this with people in the Deep South in the US. How sad is that. I'm not at all afraid to say any system that allows for this to happen to it's people is inherintly evil or challenging the mostly good people in that society to do something about it.

If somebody had raped my Daughter at that age I don't know what I would have done, but beating her half to death and then siding with the rapist?

If I misunderstood your intent I do appologize, but it read as if you were justifying others making excuses for it.