"I have gay friends, but..." Umm... No, you don't...

reply to post by rickyrrr

No, that is not a fact. I said that I was sexually abused. To elaborate, I was sexually abused by numerous men. The nieghborhood I grew up in was a bunch of redneck uneducated cotton mill workers. We had an inordinate amount of sexual predators and words gets around when their is a kid that is an easy target. This happened about the same time that my dad died. It was very confusing to get attention from a man with my dad missing out of my life and then have that attention feel good physically. This is why there is such guilt to be dealt with by a victim of sexual abuse. Nerve endings do not differentiate between good and bad stimulation. So when a young girl or boy is molested or raped there is a small voice in the mind that says "hey, some of that felt good, so it must have been your fault in some sort of way". That really screws with a kid's mind.
Sexual abuse was not talked about in those days.
Having said that, I'm really growing tired of you trying to tangle my words like you're some sort of defense attorney. I don't know you, but somehow it seems beneath you. If you can't add to the discussion with some of your own "original" opinions, why not move on to something more your speed or to your liking?
Respectfully,
Seeashrink

Laqueesha has a friend lafonda, you can have her seashrink....she always smiles to bro.

Who cares honestly.

You people need to keep your sex lives to yourselves.

The fact that people keep trying to parade their sex lives around proves they are hypocrites.

I honestly don't want to know about it.

I don't see any problem with Homosexuality. I have many gay and lesbian friends whom I am very close to. Even one of my gay friends loves me like a lot and my lesbian friend is like a sister to me. I hate when people make a big deal about people loving the same sex I mean God put us on earth to love so why not love the same sex? I mean I think if you truly love someone same sex or not it doesn't matter.

I started reading through the pages of replies and lost count of how many items I wanted to counter. However, one thing came to mind that is a glaring fallacy, and I wanted to point it out. Those who believe in God and in the sanctity of marriage and procreation between a man and a woman, are not allowed (by the gay community) to defend themselves with their beliefs, because the gay community, by and large, do not believe in God and certainly don't ascribe to Biblical texts. They discredit the very thing that the vast majority hold dear, therefore attempting to render everyone else handicapped with no legs to stand on. It's turning more into a Mexican Standoff every day.

I will post an article from a website that is obviously religiously based which seeks to help transition homosexuals into a life that is in line with what God created them to do. I'm sure all gays will discredit it because the information is slanted by religious ideals. I make no apologies for this, because this is how I and many others approach this issue. Sorry, but I haven't found any pro-gay, anti-religious groups who seek to help transition homosexuals, so this will have to do - I'm sure they exist, SOMEWHERE, but are probably just as rare as a Nazi or a Muslim who loves Jews. (The absurdity of having to type that last sentence made me literally laugh out loud! )

So, while gays argue on the basis of political and civil rights, equating themselves equal to women, blacks and any other minority group based on color and/or gender, I will attempt to stand firm and argue the case from a creation standpoint, based on the belief in God. This has nothing to do with any particular religion. Sex, if for nothing else, was designed for procreation and enhancing love between God's original creation....man and woman. God IS creation. To participate in anything else is anti-creation. If God = Creation, and homosexuality = anti-creation, then is it fair to say that homosexuality = anti-God? I will state for the record that far too many gays equate tolerance with acceptance. Religious people world wide can tolerate those who choose different lifestyles, but accepting those ideals as their own or trying to force them into accepting them as their own impedes on their God-given rights. Homosexuality is NOT a God given right. The pursuit of happiness is a right, therefore, homosexuals can pursue their happiness in whatever form they choose.

Furthermore, another poster mentioned that homosexuality has been around for thousands of years, thus it is "proof" that they have no choice. I firmly argue against that on the basis that so has murder, rape, robbery, molestation, and every other sin against ourselves that we've perpetrated since we've been in existence. There is always a choice....always.

What's Good About Sex

Is sex bad? A case could be made for that view.

Midnight. John is trying to explain his way out of calling his wife by another woman's name during their embraces.

One o’clock. Shelly, 16, is in her bedroom, secretly cutting herself with a razor because of what her boyfriend made her do.

Two o’clock. His wife asleep, Steven is busy downloading shameful images from Internet bulletin boards.

Three o’clock. Marjorie, who used to spend each Friday night in bed with a different man, has been bingeing and purging for four hours.

Four o’clock. Pablo stares through the darkness at his ceiling, wondering how he is going to convince his girlfriend to have an abortion.

Five o’clock. After partying all night, Michael takes another man home, not mentioning that he tests positive for HIV.

Six o’clock. Lisa is in the bathroom, crying.

Not quite what my generation expected when it invented the sexual revolution.

Although still not quite willing to give up that enslaving liberation, feminist writers like Naomi Wolf and Katie Roiphe exhibit signs of fatigue and confusion. A few secular people toy with the idea of abstinence—an abstinence not so much of purity as of boredom, fear, and disgust. In Hollywood, of all places, it has even become fashionable to talk up Buddhism, a weary doctrine that finds the cure of suffering in the cessation of desire, and the cure of desire in the cessation of existence.

What’s more, some Christian writers give the impression they hold the same dismal view. Overwhelmed by the sheer number of things to warn about, they have forgotten how to do anything but scold.

Maybe the sexual revolution was an even grimmer joke than we thought. Maybe there is nothing good about sex. Maybe sex is just plain bad.

A gift of God

What’s wrong with this picture? Although there is plenty of bad in the contemporary sexual scene, it’s clear that we’re forgetting something. The only way to get something bad is to take something good and spoil it. Whenever you find a bad thing, look for a good thing somewhere in the ruins.

The idea that sex is inherently bad doesn’t come from the Bible. It comes from ancient gnosticism, which taught that the Creator wasn’t God, but a lesser being who made a botch of things. Gnostics thought spirits good, bodies bad, and sex just a matter of bodies.

But the Bible calls God the Creator. He invented sex; it was His idea. And let’s not forget that after He finished His work, He called the whole creation "good." Dazzled by His handiwork, Christianity espouses a higher view of sex than any other religion. That’s why it also has the strictest rules about it. Anything so important has to be handled carefully.

So what’s good about sex? Sex serves not just one great good but three. However, they need marriage to come into their own.

First among the goods of conjugal sex is procreation. God told Adam and Eve to "be fruitful and multiply." This was part of their dominion of the earth.

Second is union. When Adam was lonely, God didn’t give him a man, an animal, or a crowd of people, but a woman—different than he, yet made with him in God’s image. When Adam first gazed upon his new companion, he was so astonished that he cried, "This at last is bone of my bone and flesh of my flesh."

The third good of conjugal sex becomes real only when the spouses are united to Christ, for that is when they become a living emblem of His sacrificial love for the Church and the Church’s adoring response. Paul is so awed that he calls matrimony one of God’s secrets. "This mystery is a profound one," he says, "and I am saying that it refers to Christ and the Church."

These three goods are the point of sex. They are what sex is for.

What about pleasure? I hear you ask. Has Christianity got something against that? No, pleasure is great. God is for it. But by His design, pleasure is a byproduct—an outgrowth of other things that are more important.

If you pursue pleasure for its own sake, two things happen. First, it disappears. Philosophers call this the "hedonistic paradox." Second, it steers you wrong, because pleasure can result from doing wrong as well as doing right.

Three great goods

Let’s talk about each of the three great goods of conjugal sex in turn.

Procreation. In procreation we cooperate with God, offering our bodies, marriages, and homes as the occasions for His creation of new life. This is an incredible privilege. It is even more mind-boggling to consider that the birth of a child is the birth of an image of God who will live forever, who will one day be older than the sun and stars are now.

Procreation isn’t just about your kids. Once grown, the kids will have kids, remember? How we parent will affect the parenting values of our offspring.

Union. Love isn’t just romantic feelings. Love is a commitment of the will to the true good of the other person. Otherwise, how could a bride and groom promise to love each other? You can’t promise to have a feeling.

If love is a commitment of the will, then what has sex got to do with it? Consider procreation again. Do you see how different—how special—it is? In every other biological function, such as eating, digesting and growing, the man and woman are separate organisms. For procreation, they join to become a single unit, functioning in covenantal harmony. Conjugal union is a true merging. They become a one-flesh unity—and I’m not just talking about their bodies.

When I say that I’m not just talking about their bodies, I mean that at every level, male and female were designed to complete each other. In sexual self-giving, the hearts and minds and spirits of the husband and wife cooperate with their bodies. They are united not just in their bodily dimension, but in every dimension.
This unity also helps prepare them to be parents, and the hope of children joins them in solidarity with every past and future generation.

Casual sex can’t achieve that. It endlessly joins and severs, joins and severs. Imagine what it would be like to repeatedly tear off and reattach your arm. There would come a day when no earthly surgery would suffice; the reparative power of your body would be lost. It is the same when you repeatedly tear off and reattach your various sexual partners. Eventually they will all seem like strangers; you just won’t feel anything. You will have destroyed your capacity for intimacy.

Mystery. Think again of Paul’s words regarding the union of husband and wife: "This mystery is a profound one, and I am saying that it refers to Christ and the Church." What was he talking about? So far in salvation history, we have only hints; we won’t know the whole until it happens.

Think of the Song of Songs, of the Old Testament love poem that begins, "Kiss me with kisses of your mouth." Many readers are mystified as to how it got into the sacred Scriptures, but the ancient rabbis had an explanation. They said it not only portrayed the love between husband and the wife, but symbolized the love between God and His people. Shocking! Yet the New Testament speaks in the same way. The Revelation of John foretells the coming "marriage of the Lamb"—a future union between Christ and His Church, more intimate than anything we have known, not to be consummated until He comes again.

In some way that passes our present understanding, and for all its present flaws, conjugal intimacy is a symbol of that piercing heavenly intimacy. The little humilities and the mutual sacrifices of the husband and wife are a training for heavenly union; the awe of their wedding night and the ecstasy of their embraces, a glimpse of it.

So is there any good in sex? In marriage, yes! God the Giver has made conjugal union the vaulted arch into two great goods, and the mysterious emblem of an even greater good—a good in this life we cannot comprehend. That’s why we dare not uproot sex from marriage, the garden where God has planted it. Too much good is at stake to treat it lightly; too much power and danger to waste it on selfish games.

From the best gifts come the worst miseries, if we are too foolish to follow the Giver’s directions.

J. Budziszewski is an associate professor in the government and philosophy departments of the University of Texas at Austin.

Originally published in the November 1999 Citizen magazine: Citizen.

Source


What I want gays to understand is that MOST hetero folks, including myself, are indifferent to this lifestyle, because ultimately it is a decision that is between that person and God. However, heteros are continually getting backed into a corner, forced to state that they agree with this or that, when in fact, all they agree with is the right to choose, nothing more. Personally, I'm tired of everyone's sex life being in my face. I don't care. But I also don't want my political system demoralized by the ideals set forth here....gays have no substantial proof to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that they are in fact genetically designed this way, (and let me see your personal credentials, please, so you can shut us up once and for all - your "I'm certifiably and genetically gay, it's not in my head" card), and there is more evidence to the contrary.

Lastly, exactly what rights are we discussing here? I keep hearing about "rights". What? The right to visit a loved one in the hospital? I'm sure a simple change can fix that. The right to leave a gay lover your benefits upon your death? I'm sure that can be fixed too. I agree that people should have the right to do with their lives and their money as they choose, so long as their "rights" don't impede on the rights of the vast majority. Like it or not, the belief in God and the sanctity of marriage and procreation is there and will never go away...period.

reply to post by Annee


&

reply to post by Gorman91

Friendship is about acceptance.

That's fake friendship. A real friendship is about accountability and correcting each other. Debate and argument, and still knowing each other to be equal human beings.

I think she is right Gorman and so are you.

Friendship is acceptance of the flaws of another and still respect him so much to tell him where you disagree and see an error in.

However would you try and correct someone a friend for being gay ?

Im gay.

My friends accept me.

The ones that dont stopped being my friends long ago.

I dont miss them.

My friends love me for who I am and Im glad

reply to post by MarineSniper12Kills


Man...you're just wrong for that..........lol

reply to post by Gseven


Before I read any of that.. when you say "transition" do you mean transition into being heterosexual or into sometime of relationship with god. Because if you are saying transition into a heterosexual lifestyle you are ignorant, and a hypocritical christian (as by and large the majority are).

Originally posted by Gseven
. . . . because the gay community, by and large, do not believe in God and certainly don't ascribe to Biblical texts.

What?

Most gays I know are Christian. (sorry if they don't fit your concept of Christian).

You seriously need to experience life outside your bubble.

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by Gseven
. . . . because the gay community, by and large, do not believe in God and certainly don't ascribe to Biblical texts.

What?

Most gays I know are Christian. (sorry if they don't fit your concept of Christian).

You seriously need to experience life outside your bubble.

Right. And Pat Robertson and Westboro Baptist Church are real Christians too!

Anyone can claim that, but 100% of people fail to live up to it.

We have a word for that....Hypocrites.

reply to post by seeashrink


Seashrink im sorry you had to experience that. NOBODY should. Just know that your a hell of a strong person to get through it and anyone who flames you about the particular incident well....probably likes rainbows. Had to bring some enlightenment to you lol

So.. according to some, if I have any views that differ from someone I know well.. it's impossible for me to be their "true" friend? I've never heard such ridiculous rubbish.

Being a friend is being there for someone... regardless of agreeing with their views or not. It's not blindly accepting all they do or are. I've had many gay friends. I had two lesbians are roomies. It doesn't mean I agree with all facets of being gay, nor that I feel gays should have "equal rights" as a man and woman married couple. You have a lot of nerve telling me I wasn't their "true friend" because I didn't blindly accept all they wanted or did or were.

Or does this only pertain to being gay? Not being hypocritical at all eh? I know a guy who hunts. A good friend of mine. I hate hunting personally, and I especially loathe sport hunting, which he does. According to some of you, I cannot be his friend because of this. What a stupid idea... some of you folks are truly twisted in the way you think.

God made adam and eve not adam and steve.....dang people I thought we learned this in sunday school.

27 pages of this? Really? To the OP: this is a 100% pointless and unnecessary topic for ATS, have you forgotten what ABOVE TOP SECRET DOT COM is about? How can you possibly expect a valid debate on this subject here? I haven't read all 27 pages, but I made it through the first 3 and skipped to the last 2...I'm pretty sure everything in between was bickering and flaming... (go ahead and criticize me for not reading the entire thread, boo f**itty hoo).

With that said...

I have gay friends.. BUT, I object both politically and morally with their way of life. Homosexuality has infiltrated American (as many others) culture and is spreading like the plague. It's a disease. Do you ever wonder why the f'n epidemic is growing at an alarming rate? Take a look at the crap kids are being fed these days.. Watch any Fox animation and count how many times a gay comment, remark, physical act of gayness, etc. is made. It's incredible.

Are you offended yet? Well, good news Skippy! I'm not your friend.

Oh, and on politics... Since this thread has become a homosexual/racist complaint corner, I'll give my humble opinion on 1 out of 100,000,000 reasons how this crap is screwing up our society. Remember the nursery rhyme from back in the day? Bah, bah, black sheep, etc..? Brings back memories, doesn't it? Now, will it shock you to hear that this is banned from schools. Apparently it's racist. I didn't realize that I was being taught a hate-chant! of course, this is old news. But I must continue...

Once again, political correctness has destroyed another part of our childhoods. This wouldn't be as bad if a black person saw this as a racist rhyme.. but if it's a white woman from f**king Seattle that's a totally different matter. This is how she saw the rhyme.

"Baa Baa Slave sheep pick my cotton, ni**er yessum master, yessum master then isa make yo dinner"

You know what kids have to sing now? Baa Baa Rainbow sheep. What in the f**king hell is a rainbow sheep? No child in their right mind is going to think this is normal. What were these people smoking when they thought this? Oh wait, is the sheep gay? That's it. The rainbow is because the sheep is proud to be gay. Trust me, no gay man (or sheep) would be seen dead in wool! Isn't that right, JaxonRoberts?

Additionally how are our children going to feel when they're raised with two fathers who share a berry smoothie with their son on an afternoon family outing to pick daisy's to make potpourri with so the room smells good while they're knitting each other sweaters? Or when a daughter has two mothers and the little girl knows 10 ways to kill a bear with a hunting knife? No need for a man to gut this elk when the woman calluses the size of your pinkey finger. This # drives me mad just talking about it.

Go ahead, get pissey.. Enjoy your generation and upcoming generations of femmie men and bull-dyke women.

Originally posted by MarineSniper12Kills
God made adam and eve not adam and steve.....dang people I thought we learned this in sunday school.

Give this poster the same reward given those who insist on bringing pedophilia and animals into the gay discussions.

reply to post by Annee


Lmao this is a discussion right? Man for a minute a guess i thought I was on a forum.

reply to post by Annee


I believe in God

reply to post by Annee


I said my animal got ahold of my blow up doll....which was in reply to a post above it about other ways to have intercourse other than man on man. As for pedophilia I never said a thing about it. As far as im concerned it is disgusting and evil. Now...im going to go drink a beer with laqueesha and watch family guy reruns. As for homosexuality....as long as you do not skip around in a pink miniskirt and throw yourself on me, i am ok with it.

reply to post by NewWorldDisorder


Well I actually came here to post that this belongs on BTS and then I was awestruck by how dumb some of the posters here are and was commenting before I knew it. I think that's what happens to everyone.

This thread really has no reason to be here though (or even bts really).