UFOs over London, 9 July 2010 ..

reply to post by QuestionTheGovernment


I'm not offended. Personally, I see it as a shortcoming to out-of-hand dismiss the obvious explanations and to point out peoples' 'shortcomings', ridiculing them for having an opinion.

Originally posted by Beamish
reply to post by ShadowArcher

 

A UFO wouldn't necessarily mimic a sky lantern.

All I really want is for the OP to give me his opinion as to why he believes the lights in the video are not lanterns. That’s fair, isn’t it?

Hi Beamish, I am the OP of the videos and of the comment quoted by Dave.

I have never ever said I believed the lights were not lanterns, I only raised a doubt that they were, based on my observations (see some of the reasons why I am doubting in my previous posts above).

A video is very different from what you see at naked eye, even in HD.
Some people see flickering in the video, I explained it was due to camera shaking.
I can tell you that there was no flickering at all whatsoever, the lights were steadily very bright and were roughly all of equal intensity.

If you look at the parts where we zoom in on the lights, you can see that there is no flickering and it's of a consistent orange/reddish colour with no part of it brighter than the others (I would imagine that there would have been a brighter wight or yellow spot in the middle if there was any flame like on chinese lanterns).

Also, still when zooming in, look at the shape: it's not round and regular, it looks triangular on one side and curved on the other side, a bit like a diamond.
And some of these shapes, when replaying the video, seemed to rotate in an instant, with the triangle on the left and the curved side on the right, and the next second, the triangular shape is at the bottom and the curvy part is at the top, without seeing any rotational movement.

All of this, and the fact that there were helicopters flying around and airplanes descending to Heathrow or to London City Airport, crossing the path of these lights.
As I said in another post, if someone had obtained the permission to release so many lanterns over London, wouldn't these flights have been diverted?
It may not show well on the video but you can hear its engines, we even saw a commercial airplane turning around from the North to start its descent towards Heathrow, and it passed between two of these orange lights. One was below the plane, the other one was well above it.

Too many questions I know, all I can say today is: UFOs or lanterns, I DON'T KNOW what it was that I saw.

In both cases, something is not right with what happened (if it was lanterns, see my other post above regarding permission to release lanterns and the presence of commercial aircrafts and helicopters in their path).

Regards

Herve

reply to post by harryposter


You do not need permits for sky lanterns (regardless of numbers), and it is why many are lobbying for them to be banned. See here for an example: news.bbc.co.uk...

There are not that many lanterns there, especially considering you can buy them for less than one pound. We let off at least twenty at a party last year, and very pretty it was too. This thread and video is rediculous, including a certain member who is doing their best to encourage the misidentification of these lanterns as UFOs - a real disinformation agent if I've ever seen one and all you suckers are buying it.



[edit on 15-7-2010 by Goathief]

reply to post by ShadowArcher


So lets look at the fact no one knows what is in the footage and are commenting right? I haven't stated anything but to keep an open mind but that seems to be falling through the cracks. Anyways off to work wish I could continue the discussion have a good day guys.

Interesting video, thanks for the post. My personal opinion based on what evidence is presented, and taking into account previous examples that have been documented would suggest the highest probability for identification lies in them being sky lanterns. From what I can see in the video I noticed some flickering of the light, and heard at ground level wind being picked up by the camera's mic that can easily be increased at altitude. I also noticed it appeared that the objects are all at the same relative height plus or minus some deviation and move in a uniform direction/speed. This to me indicates usually a short span of time that the lanterns could have been released together as is common with celebrations. Again this is all personal speculation and everyone is free to interpret the same evidence as they like, but for me my mind unfortunately is made up with the lantern explanation. We should try remember that even if all sightings were lanterns or conventional craft, it only takes one that cannot be definitively explained as such to prove otherwise. Just have to keep looking and never lose diligence.

Chinese lanterns no doubt about it, they were orange and went at the same pace as the wind.

My sister and I saw the exact same type of light not long ago, I made a thread about it and guess what.... CHINESE LANTERNS!. The light I saw traveled straight, it didn't rise or flicker but still people won't expect it as anything other than a lantern. Cool vid thanks for posting, nice to see some more UK footage.

Originally posted by ShadowArcher

Originally posted by harryposter
Exigo saw Chinese lanterns FLOATING on the river, not FLYING...

Are you certain that he meant floating ON the river? Could he have meant that they were floating (ie flying) over, and in the direction of, the Thames?

Well he said "floating DOWN the Thames", I may be French but I am really not convinced he meant "flying".

And the "things" were coming from south-west beyond the river, crossed it and went to the north-east. They were not following the path of the Thames.

Originally posted by ShadowArcher

Originally posted by harryposter
One thing that surprised me though and that I wish to add to my comments: how in the world can someone release so many lanterns over the heart of a major city, especially when they cross the flying paths of helicopters or airplanes preparing to land? There were a lot of these when it happened.

Were they flying across airport flight paths? Aircraft have to give towns/cities a wide berth (if they're low enough), so unless they crossed flight paths to the airport I don't think that would be an issue.

Wouldn't they have needed some sort of special permission?
If they had obtained one, there would have been no helicopter and no airplane flying across their path as they would have been diverted.

I have no idea if they'd need permission - possibly. Are you saying that there were planes and helicopters flying about the objects?

The sighting lasted for about 30 minutes in total and believe me, most of the time it doesn't take more than 10 minutes for the London Metropolitan Police to intervene, especially on such a major event.

Do you know that the police did not intervene? I don't know if they have a way to retrieve lanterns from mid-flight, so would you know if they were around somewhere? Also, wouldn't the police have responded whether it was lanterns OR UFOs?

When you say 'major event', do you mean the objects themselves, or was something happening at the same time?

Thanks

Ok, I will try to make this short as I think I already answered most of your questions with my previous posts:

London airports flying paths are passing bang in the middle of the city at quite a low level, there is no such a thing as a "no-fly" zone over London (as opposed to Paris for example where all air traffic is totally banned over the city). The paths vary depending on winds etc. but 99% of the time they pass over the city center, especially the path to London City Airport which roughly follows the Thames from West to East by passing over Tower Bridge (the "castle" you see in the videos) which is about 5 miles from the airport.

There were indeed helicopters and commercial aircrafts flying in the area at low level and across the path of the lights, that's what I said.

By "major event" I was referring to what we witnessed: either UFOs or major release or lanterns, I wasn't talking about a concert or a demo or whatever.

What I am saying is:

Either it was lanterns WITH permission to be released, if so helicopters and commercial flights would have been diverted from the area because of the hazard implied, which was not the case.
I really doubt anyone, whoever it is, could ever obtain a permission to release dozens of Chinese lanterns over the heart of London considering the economic impact from diverting all air traffic, and also considering the security matters involved.

Or, it was lanterns released WITHOUT permission, in that case the Met Police would have stopped this in less than 10 minutes from receiving the first report, which was not the case either: it lasted for 30 minutes.

Or, it was something else...

Originally posted by harryposter

Or, it was lanterns released WITHOUT permission, in that case the Met Police would have stopped this in less than 10 minutes from receiving the first report, which was not the case either: it lasted for 30 minutes.

Sorry, but when do the met take down sky lanterns from out of the air?

As above, we've released quite a few in the past and no police have turned up. Your logic is fuzzy (and that's being generous).

Originally posted by Goathief
reply to post by harryposter

 

You do not need permits for sky lanterns (regardless of numbers), and it is why many are lobbying for them to be banned. See here for an example: news.bbc.co.uk...

From Sky Lantern Release & Safety Guidelines:

"Do not release lanterns within a five mile radius of an operational airport or landing strip or within two miles of a farmers field, livestock, a major road or motorway."

London City Airport is within 5 miles of where it happened, not mentioning that these lights were on its fly paths.

And I believe there are some "major roads and motorway" all over London...

I really doubt they don't need any permission to be released in London.

In an open area in the countryside, maybe. Certainly not over London.

Best

reply to post by harryposter


Those are guidelines written by the manufacturers, far removed from English law. Even if it were law, do you think that people will adhere to it unconditionally? Of course not.

Your point is totally moot, it appears you really are desperate to prove that these aren't sky lanterns when they clearly are. No amount of evidence will sway your opinion, carry on living the fantasy. I'm done.

Originally posted by Goathief

Originally posted by harryposter

Or, it was lanterns released WITHOUT permission, in that case the Met Police would have stopped this in less than 10 minutes from receiving the first report, which was not the case either: it lasted for 30 minutes.

Sorry, but when do the met take down sky lanterns from out of the air?

As above, we've released quite a few in the past and no police have turned up. Your logic is fuzzy (and that's being generous).

Come on please, don't tell me you think I was talking about stopping the lanters from out of the air!

If lanterns are "released" in the air, someone is obviously "releasing" them from the ground!

The Police would have stopped people on the ground from releasing the lanterns, and the whole thing wouldn't have lasted 30 minutes.

What in the world is fuzzy in my logic? I wonder about yours...
(And I'm being generous too)

Originally posted by DCDAVECLARKE
reply to post by Majestic RNA

 

To tell you the truth
man im sorry i put this post up now, i didn't really care weather they were lanterns or not i just thought its interesting that's all, i know all about ufos man iv seen about 10 ufos 7 different times since 1967, an i might add none of them were orange!

Why do I found this hard to believe?
You showed us pretty much right away that you got very annoyed by the first post proposing this to be lanterns.

You all know about ufo's??
So you've seen 10 unidentified objects in the sky and you know everything about them?
That's great...

I've seen a few myself, and I tell you what....I don't know jack about them.

I AM a believer, but through the years I've learned to filterout some things. And I've also learned that I shouldn't hope and believe so hard that it clouds my judgment and get my spikes pointing towards everyone else automatically when getting questioned.

Try not to take offence next time you post a video. Cause there will never be a video where everyone will gasp of amazement. There will always be people who question it. And then you must have an open mind and consider EVERY aspect and not see peoples doubts as personal attacks.

I will not say for 100% that those are lanterns, however...I can say that I am 99% sure they are. Until proven right or wrong it will remain 99%, cause until proven you can never be sure.



[edit on 15-7-2010 by Akezzon]

Originally posted by Goathief
reply to post by harryposter

 

Those are guidelines written by the manufacturers, far removed from English law. Even if it were law, do you think that people will adhere to it unconditionally? Of course not.

Your point is totally moot, it appears you really are desperate to prove that these aren't sky lanterns when they clearly are. No amount of evidence will sway your opinion, carry on living the fantasy. I'm done.

Holly cow, I can't believe what I am reading... My opinion is NEUTRAL, open, undecided etc. What part of this don't you understand?

Show me one single word, one single line of what I have written that says "these are definitely not sky lanterns"!

Go ahead, show me one!

If you had read me correctly all over this thread, you would easily understand that all I am saying is "I DON'T KNOW" what it was, end of story.

I am only raising questions about how people can release lanterns in such circumstances, if it was lanterns.

Anyway, I am talking into the void, you probably know more about what I am thinking than I do.

Don't change anything, stick to your obtuse etiquette.

OMG. They are chinese lantern..
and the higher you go yhe more wind.
look at the 3rd video. they come Up from the same places.
just more rubish to discredit ufo’s.
I have people near me who send them up at odd times.

Originally posted by Goathief
reply to post by harryposter

 

Those are guidelines written by the manufacturers, far removed from English law. Even if it were law, do you think that people will adhere to it unconditionally? Of course not.

Your point is totally moot, it appears you really are desperate to prove that these aren't sky lanterns when they clearly are. No amount of evidence will sway your opinion, carry on living the fantasy. I'm done.

More safety instructions here...

This is just common sense... And I really doubt there are not any regulations within London (or any other crowded city) regarding Chinese lanterns as there are for fireworks.

What is appauling, if what we saw on Friday night were lanterns, is that the people who did it were clearly out of their mind.

Again, I have never said it was not lanterns, I was just doubting.

But it may well be Chinese lanterns launched by stupid people after all, I can see a lot of these right now...

I'll leave you to your unbreakable certainties.

reply to post by Akezzon

let's put it this way man! i didn't get the serial number of the ufos iv seen, but i know one thing they weren't lanterns, an i changed my mind about the vids maybe they are lanterns maybe not! ill change my mind to what ever suits me , have you got a problem with that?

Originally posted by DCDAVECLARKE
reply to post by Akezzon

 

let's put it this way man! i didn't get the serial number of the ufos iv seen, but i know one thing they weren't lanterns, an i changed my mind about the vids maybe they are lanterns maybe not! ill change my mind to what ever suits me , have you got a problem with that?

Not at all. You can change your mind how often you like. Just keep your mind open.




[edit on 15-7-2010 by Akezzon]

Originally posted by DCDAVECLARKE
This is getting to be a pain in the arse! every time a UFO sighting is put up on ATS all the non believers come on quick to say Chinese lanterns! well iv see a lot of UFOs an they were not Chinese lanterns give me a break!

Spit your dummy out all you like, they look and behave exactly like Chinese lanterns. Move on.