Did the USAF Help pull off 911?

Originally posted by impressme
reply to post by rush969

 

Question: 1 Here is two questions: how many of you think that handful of corrupt military pilots using remote controled airplanes, loyal to Dick Cheney and a handful of corrupt officials in the Bush administration planed and carried out 911 also using demolitions expert in our military to blow up the WTC and covered it up by using the FBI to hide and lie about all the evidences.

How many of us?? Who is us??
I can only speak for myself as I told you already!! (That´s why I asked you if you are keeping count of pros and cons.)
I don´t believe it. (So that´s one NO.)
Also, based on the posts that I have read from other contributors, the sources that have been provided, and the opinions and "evidence" that you have provided, I have become more convinced that this is not a credible theory.

Question: 2 how many of you believe the OS is true and what “conclusive scientific evidences” that has convince you that the OS is true, and please post sources and links to back your claim.

Again, the way you phrase your question.
Again I can only answer for myself.
But I would say IMHO that the evidence in "favor" of the OS is overwhelming versus what I have read as conspiracy theories in favor of an "inside job".
I believe many people in Gov. and intel. have been secretive about things, have given false info. or inaccurate info. to cover their backs.
I believe that much of the intel. is still unknown because it is kept secret because of National Security policies.
And these last two points have served to fuel the countless conspiracy theories about a possible "inside job".
It appears more to be a case of negligence and arrogance (this can´t happen to us) kind of situation IMO.
An "inside job" not by a long stretch.
Too many variables, too many needed to be involved, so many things that would have come out in the clear by now.
So many things have been taken out of context, invented, and made up, just to fix them to the inside job theories, that sometimes it gets ridiculous.
Just a couple of examples to illustrate this point:
The amount of evidence of AA77 having crashed at the Pentagon. This keeps on being denied by "truthers".
And the latest "smoking gun" on the P4T site.
The closed flight deck door.
These two issues have been tossed around by the "truther" movement in total denyal of logic, physical factual evidence and technical information.
But they keep going strong. And I guess they will keep going.

reply to post by dereks

First the USAF would have had to obtained 2 757's and 2 767's, they would have needed a project management team, a budget, a proposal, funding etc etc.

Says whom, you? If a part of our military is going to help our government into pulling off a false flag operation, and they decided to use Boeing 767 & 757 commercial airliners, don’t you think the perpetrators would want to cover up their every move first?
Don’t you think they would buy these planes in secret? They certainly do not want to leave a paper trail would they.

Now your next question should be how do they spend that kind of money without getting caught? Easy!

9/11 Conspiracies » 2.3 trillion dollars missing from the Pentagon budget!

www.abovetopsecret.com...

2.3 Trillion dollars is more than enough to buy four commercial airliners anywhere in the world and no one would be any wiser. In fact 2.3 Trillion dollars would be more than enough to fund this entire false flag operation with plenty of money left over to pocket, and why not? They just murdered three thousand Americans do you think they care. Let’s not forget the real motive here Billions of dollars at stake to be made if they get their war and by golly they did.
What is a few millions of dollars squandered on a false flag operation, compared to the billions in contracts and billions of dollars in oil revenues an more contracts straight from Dick Cheney office. (Can you say Halliburton?) Looks to me the only people making all the dough are people in the at the top in the Bush administration don’t you agree.





With all the corruption in our military and government in the Bush administration that has been proven and yet no one has been held accountable yet.

Then they would have had to have a team of personel qualified to service and fly that type of aircraft.

That is nothing for our military to get corrupt pilots, corruption run very deep in our military and has been for decades. But, I don’t believe these pilots were your average military pilots these men were hand pick carefully these men had to be very loyal to Dick Cheney and no one else.

And they would have had to ensure the planes had the same wheels, tires and engines as the civilian aircraft that were supposed to have crashed

So easy to do.

Then they would have had to painted them to look like American Airlines and United Airlines, with the correct buzz numbers of the aircraft they were meant to represent.

So easy for them to do this in any hidden hanger on any military base anywhere in the world.

So the men and their management in the paintshop are now involved, also they would have had to order the correct type of paint etc, so now more funding and paperwork.

First of all we are not talking about a car paint shop, who said they have to have any management and funding for paper work?
If the funding is already there, then there is no paper work. Why would they want any paper work their goal is to leave no evidences behind don’t you agree? Perhaps the painters are all dead now, remember these people are ruthless killers they murder over three thousand people a few more will not matter just a few accidents to arrange, or perhaps a murder made to look like a suicide, very easy to be done.

Then the remote control gear would have had to be sourced, modified, installed and tested. So more men and their management, plus funding and paperwork.

Remote control gear would not be any problem for any military pilots to source and modified and to install. More men? No, I doubt that again you forgot all the funding is already done and there is not going to be any paper work, none. these people are not stupid they know what will happened if they forget something or leave any paper trail. Why do you think Dick Cheney had an “assignation squad” working only for him and only reporting to him, for.

Already you have hundreds of people knowing about it.

No you don’t, where do you get hundreds of people?? I have already shown you how easy it is to have very few people involved into buying the planes in secret. And still use the same pilots to take care of the rest these people would only need five or six painters. who knows how to tape & spray paint on four air planes. Perhaps they didn’t even need to paint these planes they might have already been bought from an airplane bone yard already painted in the united & AA colors, and if that is the case then no painters would be required would they.

Then the pilots would have had to be trained in flying the jets by remote control, so the jets would all have to made many test flights.

That what commercial flight simulators are for, and our military has flight simulator.
No, the real jets would not need to take any real flight test period. These men are combat professionals they already know how to use the remote controls. BTW our military has been testing and flying aircraft by remote control for “decades” this is old technology.

Now everyone at the airfield would know about it, including air traffic control etc.

Not really, especially if the Tower is informed this is top secret and nothing more, the military men at the air base in the towers or ATS are going to do their jobs and keep their mouth shut these men in the Towers do not know what the mission of these planes are it is only on the need to know bases nothing more. Most military men do follow commands or orders. See this is where I do draw the line and I will say, most of the military men on the base and tower had no clue to what was going on. Sure there was a record of these planes leaving the base but I am sure all communication from tower to pilots have been destroyed just like the Boston Tower destroyed all their information from their tower ATC they destroyed evidences. Evidences that probably would have told us a different story to what the government told.

Now the fun really starts. American Airlines Flight 11, American Airlines Flight 77, United Airlines Flight 175 and United Airlines Flight 93 somehow took off as normal, but then all landed

Well it is to believe that flight 93 did land in Ohio.

Former Cleveland Mayor Reported Flight 93 Landed at Cleveland Airport on 9/11 and Flight 175 in Vicinity. Cincinnati WCPO TV Cover-ups Why Account Removed From Web Site
State sponsored U.S. media ignores story, leaving 'internet hounds' to smell out the truth behind what really happened to the passengers on the doomed flights.

www.thepowerhour.com...

Flt 93 And Flt 175
Landed At Or Near
Cleveland On 911 --
Says Former Cleveland Mayor
Cincinnati WCPO TV Cover-Ups
Why Account Removed From Web Site

www.rense.com...

I remember the broadcast on TV as clear as if it just happened.

but then all landed where the 4 secret "air force" planes were, the passengers and crew were then somehow killed and strapped into the fake "air force" jets, they then took off under remote control and were flown into the WTC towers, the Pentagon and the ground.

Who said they needed passengers anyway? That info came from your OS and wasn’t it funny that none of the passengers relatives ever showed up at any of the arrival airports screaming about their love one’s none. That is why I have a hard time swallowing the OS in the first place. In every major commercial air crash most all of the passengers relatives show up at the arrival airports and it is “ALWAYS” televised and the airports always put the family up in a hotel and pay for their room and food and counseling.

However, on 911 no families showed up at San Francisco, or LA, airports demanding some answers. If my wife and kids were on any of those planes you better believe, I wouldn’t be sitting at home crying over the News media, You couldn’t keep me from going to the airport, I would be racing to the airport and start demanding answers to where is my wife and kids are or have you found their bodies is there any chance they might have survived,. I would be angry, hurt, I would be demanding how could you all let this happened, I want some answers

Then the remote control gear somehow dissapeared, as nothing was found of it. A few hundred more people must have been involved, to quickly kill everyone on the civilian aircraft and move them to the other aircraft.

I never said that people where moved to another aircraft?
Like I said I do not believe there was any real passengers. The only people to “claim” to have found any remains of passengers were the FBI mostly, and they haven’t stop lying yet have they.

Then somehow the 4 civilian aircraft were "dissapeared, and also somehow the Air Force wrote off the 4 fake aircraft - and none of the thousands involved ever questioned any of this, or spoke out against it?

You had better believe the four aircraft were wrote off. There was probably no paper work on those air craft, God forbid I should know the Pilots for Truth 911.org have tried for years to get any information to prove these aircraft where the real United or AA under the FOIA, and the FBI has given every excuses under the sun to evade giving up the information.

Where are you getting thousands of people? I am still talking about a handful of people not thousands. First you say a few hundreds of people, now you have changed your stance without given any reason to “Thousands of people.” do please explain this in the way I have presented you, my theory.

Then we have the demolition experts in another bra

[edit on 21-12-2009 by impressme]

reply to post by impressme

9/11 Conspiracies » 2.3 trillion dollars missing from the Pentagon budget!


Why not tell the truth about the 2.3 trillion dollars, you certainly make up a lot of theories based on false assumptions, why not find some truth and tell the rest of the story?

[edit on 21-12-2009 by iSunTzu]

Then we have the demolition experts in another branch of the military smuggling in tonnes of explosives etc into 3 buildings, installing them, and so we have dozens/hundreds more people knowing about it.

No, I do not believe that! That is your take on the WTC issue. I believe work crews doing either the asbestos abatment removal or the contractors who were suppoesently upgrading the elevators in all three WTC had something to do with it.

After watching several documentaries about nano Thermite and nano Thermate I believe it was painted on the steel garters, beams and the core columns and no one notices anything unusual.

Also no one who worked there ever noticed the piles of explosives installed in their buildings, or the large team smuggling them in?

No that is your theory, not mine. But, since you brought it up I don’t think professionals who are involved in helping to blow up the WTC are going to leave any visual evidences even for maintenances men to find.

and you think this is what happened......

I have explained my part of what I think may have happened but, I don’t believe in some of the events as you put it, no.

reply to post by iSunTzu

9/11 Conspiracies » 2.3 trillion dollars missing from the Pentagon budget!

www.abovetopsecret.com...

9/11 Conspiracies » 2.3 trillion dollars missing from the Pentagon budget!

 

You said no opinions but you freely use false information, and hearsay? Why not tell the truth about the 2.3 trillion dollars, you certainly make up a lot of theories based on false assumptions, why not find some truth and tell the rest of the story? In the OP, you said don't bring opinions but your theory is purely opinion based fantasy supported with reference to false information. At least you can blame the source, but your theory is based on hearsay, saving you from being the false information source. Good strategy used extensively by DRG.

You did not read my sources. BTW your OS is a conspiracy unsupported by any facts or evidences yet you support it why?

I only gave the poster who ask me the question to why, or how part of our military helped pulled off 911 and yes it is my “opinion” because to me, circumstantial evidences sure points to our military. Like they never lied to the 911 commission, the Pentagon officals lied so much that the 911 commission wanted to report the pentagon criminals to the Justice department for a criminal investigation because, they lied to why they did not intervene on any of those hijacked planes. They were covering up their crime of a false flag opertation, in my opinion.

Where are YOUR facts the back up your OS? Why do you support it??

You weave a tall tale; why do you hate the USAF?

That is your opinion but, I did not state anywhere in any of my posts that I hate our military! On the contrary I do support them and I am proud of our military I “NEVER” made any claim that I thought our entire military was involved in to pulling off a false flag did I?





[edit on 21-12-2009 by impressme]

reply to post by impressme


And it has been pointed out on ATS, ad nauseam, that it was not 2.3 trillion dollars in missing cash. It was 2.3 trillion in accounting reconciliations that auditors felt did not have enough paper records for. Only a newcomer to ATS would still think that the Pentagon piggy bank lost that much cash.

How would you secretly buy the aircraft? You'd have to buy them from someone and they at least would know about it.

Some time later they'd see the planes that you'd bought from them on the quiet and put two and two together.

I guess it's another one to add to the list of "people implicated in 9/11".

reply to post by Swampfox46_1999

Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999
reply to post by impressme

And it has been pointed out on ATS, ad nauseam, that it was not 2.3 trillion dollars in missing cash. It was 2.3 trillion in accounting reconciliations that auditors felt did not have enough paper records for. Only a newcomer to ATS would still think that the Pentagon piggy bank lost that much cash.

No, Swampfox, that is disinformation anything to make the government squeaky clean eh Try again, they stole that money and it was never recovered, or investigated do to all the auditors were killed in the Pentagon and that’s a fact.

reconciliations that auditors felt did not have enough paper records for.

LOL Where do you get this stuff??

reply to post by impressme

LOL Where do you get this stuff??

From the Congressional Record of the hearings concerning the matter. And here....(check the date on the link below, your buddy Cheney wasnt even in the government then)

hv.greenspun.com...

Your 'fact' as you like to claim it, has NO basis in reality.


Not to mention...at the time, 2.3 trillion dollars would have represented the entire Federal budget times two. In other words, for your idea of this massive theft of 2.3 trillion dollars in cash to happen....the Federal Government would not have had ANY money for two years.


[edit on 21-12-2009 by Swampfox46_1999]

Originally posted by impressme
reply to post by 22-250

Who ever did it must be laughing there butts off listening to all the arguing between the believers and the truthers.

I agree with you on that.

Regardless, three buildings fell out of the sky in the same way , in the same place, on the same day. What are the odds? 400x400x400....

And the BBC report of wtc 7 before it happend?

Yeah Ok.

The OS believer do not want to discuses those issues because, it blows holes in their OS fairytale. Instead, it is so compfy to believe in a lie than to look at the evil truth starring them in the face.



[edit on 20-12-2009 by impressme]

I would like to add that flight 77 never existed / was never supposed to fly on 911 according to the FAA database.

[edit on 21-12-2009 by 22-250]

reply to post by Swampfox46_1999

Your 'fact' as you like to claim it, has NO basis in reality.

No you are wrong.

Not to mention...at the time, 2.3 trillion dollars would have represented the entire Federal budget times two. In other words, for your idea of this massive theft of 2.3 trillion dollars in cash to happen....the Federal Government would not have had ANY money for two years.

*Fact* the missing 2.3 trillion dollars was never investigated after 911 it was brushed under the carpet, because all the accountants were murder in an explosion at the pentagon and all of their investigation and reports, records were destroyed and that was a proven *Fact*.

Pentagon Victims
Who was Killed in the 9/11/01 Attack on the Pentagon


An office of the Army that had just re-occupied the Pentagon's recently renovated Wedge One, named Resource Services Washington, lost 34 of its 45 employees. Most were civilian accountants, bookkeepers and budget analysts. 3 Defense Secretary Rumsfeld had announced on the eve of the attack that more than $2 trillion was missing from the Pentagon.

911research.wtc7.net...

Missing Trillions
Rumsfeld Buries Admission of Missing 2+ Trillion Dollars in 9/10/01 Press Conference

On September 10, 2001, Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld held a press conference to disclose that over $2,000,000,000,000 in Pentagon funds could not be accounted for. Rumsfeld stated: "According to some estimates we cannot track $2.3 trillion in transactions." According to a report by the Inspector General, the Pentagon cannot account for 25 percent of what it spends. 1 2

Such a disclosure normally might have sparked a huge scandal. However, the commencement of the attack on New York City and Washington in the morning would assure that the story remained buried. To the trillions already missing from the coffers, an obedient Congress terrorized by anthrax attacks would add billions more in appropriations to fight the "War on Terror."

The Comptroller of the Pentagon at the time of the attack was Dov Zakheim, who was appointed in May of 2001. Before becoming the Pentagon's money-manager, he was an executive at System Planning Corporation, a defense contractor specializing in electronic warfare technologies including remote-controlled aircraft systems. 3 4 Zakheim is a member of the Project for a New American Century and participated in the creation of its 2000 position paper Rebuilding America's Defenses which called for "a New Pearl Harbor." 5

Estimates of the sums of money missing vary wildly. A 2003 report put the amount missing at "more than a trillion dollars." 6

911research.wtc7.net...

The War On Waste
Defense Department Cannot Account For 25% Of Funds — $2.3 Trillion


More money for the Pentagon, CBS News Correspondent Vince Gonzales reports, while its own auditors admit the military cannot account for 25 percent of what it spends.

"According to some estimates we cannot track $2.3 trillion in transactions," Rumsfeld admitted.

$2.3 trillion — that's $8,000 for every man, woman and child in America. To understand how the Pentagon can lose track of trillions, consider the case of one military accountant who tried to find out what happened to a mere $300 million.
"We know it's gone. But we don't know what they spent it on," said Jim Minnery, Defense Finance and Accounting Service.

Minnery, a former Marine turned whistle-blower, is risking his job by speaking out for the first time about the millions he noticed were missing from one defense agency's balance sheets. Minnery tried to follow the money trail, even crisscrossing the country looking for records.

"The director looked at me and said 'Why do you care about this stuff?' It took me aback, you know? My supervisor asking me why I care about doing a good job," said Minnery.

He was reassigned and says officials then covered up the problem by just writing it off.

"They have to cover it up," he said. "That's where the corruption comes in. They have to cover up the fact that they can't do the job."

The Pentagon's Inspector General "partially substantiated" several of Minnery's allegations but could not prove officials tried "to manipulate the financial statements."

www.cbsnews.com...
These are facts from creditable sources.



[edit on 21-12-2009 by impressme]

reply to post by impressme
No, Swampfox, that is disinformation anything to make the government squeaky clean eh Try again, they stole that money and it was never recovered, or investigated do to all the auditors were killed in the Pentagon and that’s a fact.


*Fact* the missing 2.3 trillion dollars was never investigated after 911 it was brushed under the carpet, because all the accountants were murder in an explosion at the pentagon and all of their investigation and reports, records were destroyed and that was a proven *Fact*.

There is no 2.3 trillion dollar missing, that is a lie and your sources are making up lies.

All the auditors were killed - why do your sources tell lies?

No all the accountants were not murdered you are posting lies again from a faulty source. Are all your "facts" delusional lies? You need new sources.

If you are sure of your sources this would be Pulitzer Prize material, when are you preparing your Pulitzer Prize Package? When will you break this to the MSM. Oh noes they are in on it too. lol

reply to post by rush969

Again, the way you phrase your question.
Again I can only answer for myself.
But I would say IMHO that the evidence in "favor" of the OS is overwhelming versus what I have read as conspiracy theories in favor of an "inside job".
I believe many people in Gov. and intel. have been secretive about things, have given false info. or inaccurate info. to cover their backs.
I believe that much of the intel. is still unknown because it is kept secret because of National Security policies.
And these last two points have served to fuel the countless conspiracy theories about a possible "inside job".
It appears more to be a case of negligence and arrogance (this can´t happen to us) kind of situation IMO.
An "inside job" not by a long stretch.
Too many variables, too many needed to be involved, so many things that would have come out in the clear by now.
So many things have been taken out of context, invented, and made up, just to fix them to the inside job theories, that sometimes it gets ridiculous.
Just a couple of examples to illustrate this point:
The amount of evidence of AA77 having crashed at the Pentagon. This keeps on being denied by "truthers".
And the latest "smoking gun" on the P4T site.
The closed flight deck door.
These two issues have been tossed around by the "truther" movement in total denyal of logic, physical factual evidence and technical information.
But they keep going strong. And I guess they will keep going.

Nice theories and plenty of unwarranted insults. Hummm, once one gets past reading your ridiculing of the Truth movement and what little effort you did trying to discussed my 911 theory, you never was able to disprove my theory.

So you claimed in an early post to me, that this is your proof that disprove the USAF had nothing to do with 911.
Where is it? I see no sources nothing. Until then no one has disproved my theories, or answered my three OP questions.

reply to post by iSunTzu

There is no 2.3 trillion dollar missing, that is a lie and your sources are making up lies.

Prove it? If everyone is lying then you have to prove it.

Where are your sources that backs up your claim that everyone is lying????

reply to post by impressme


We already have on ATS, many times. THe 2.3 trillion is a red herring used to suck people into believing there was some plot to hide the theft. People will see you post that it was announced on 9/10/01 and then the plane killed everyone and destroyed the evidence the next day. And they will never know that you lied.

The accounting problem was known about long before Sept.11,2001. It was known about long before Bush was President. Those are facts. Your continued use of it to blame Cheney et al, is deception.

reply to post by Swampfox46_1999

The accounting problem was known about long before Sept.11,2001. It was known about long before Bush was President. Those are facts. Your continued use of it to blame Cheney et al, is deception.

No, you are wrong and I have proved the money was missing and I also proved there was no investigating after 911. Now it is up to the causal readers to choose who is being deceptive here, and which one of us has a history of telling lies.

Originally posted by impressme
No, you are wrong

You are the wrong one here once again

and I have proved the money was missing

Where? Certainly not in this thread

and which one of us has a history of telling lies.

that is easy, you! It has been clearly shown that thousands of Air Force personell must have been in on your supposed plot.

[edit on 22/12/09 by dereks]

Here is two questions: how many of you think that handful of corrupt military pilots using remote controled airplanes, loyal to Dick Cheney and a handful of corrupt officials in the Bush administration planed and carried out 911 also using demolitions expert in our military to blow up the WTC and covered it up by using the FBI to hide and lie about all the evidences.

Question: how many of you believe the OS is true and what “conclusive scientific evidences” that has convince you that the OS is true, and please post sources and links to back your claim.

I will be very happy to see someone who really want to have a real discussion in here without flaming, in fact I have decided to not to respond to posters who chooses to continue to post negative rude remarks and personal insults. Having a disagreement is one thing. I do not expect everyone to believe in my theories and that is ok I love a good debate but what some of you are doing is wrong. I am done with this bickering back and forth it serves no purpose in here.

It seems to me that impressme's assertions are corroborated by the evidence he presents.

However, the leap from government corruption and financial incompetence to "9/11 inside job" is based purely on circumstantial evidence. Indeed, why would Rumsfeld have bothered to come clean at all if he wields the ability to pull off something like 9/11 and has no compunction in doing so?

reply to post by TrickoftheShade


Please, go here, read the links that are posted....then get back to us about the accuracy of the other poster's theory.

www.abovetopsecret.com...